[bergy]

I am totally bummed out ....

I have always been a loyal Apple user .... I've gone through hell with the poor manufacturing practices of Apple in order to support their OS for years ...

Bad displays ... hard drives ... logic boards ... 3 ipods returned ... the list goes on and on.

And yet after all that I'm still hoping they will get their act together and OSX can take its rightful place in the world ...


But ... I really need a new laptop and here I go again ... On top of wondering if I am going to get stuck with another lemon like my previous one .... right off the bat I have to wonder if the thing will run too hot considering the things I've read about the new MacBooks

I don't want a laptop that's too hot ... and I don't want one that makes all kinds of noise ..

My old 500mhz iMac (new non apple drive) is totally silent ... My old iBook G3 is cool and totally silent ...

Until Apple gets this heat issue and other problems ironed out ... no laptop for me ....

[Ouhei]

I think your going a bit overboard here, my macbook runs completely silent 80% of the time, with any laptop with new chipsets, the fans will have to come on at some point, no way around that.

I personally don't understand the heat issues since I am not experiencing any. I've used my macbook on a bed, on a pillow over my lap, on a desk, and never has the bottom been"burning hot" it has been warm but no warmer than I have felt any other laptop (windows machines included). My macbook idles at around 46-48C and gets up to maybe 54-55C under serious usage.

I also have no moo, creeks, or discolorations. This computer has exceeded my expectations i everyway since I bought it 2 weeks ago.

[harrisjamieh]

Originally Posted by bergy

I
If it can't be done ... No laptop for me and I can't recommend one to anybody else I know either.

I don't care.




Also, you are contradicting yourself- you say you have had to put up with years of poor product quality, and then say that your iBook & iMacs are great. Right..

[nJm]

Originally Posted by Ouhei

My macbook idles at around 46-48C and gets up to maybe 54-55C under serious usage.

That's what I get from my iBook G4 1ghz. It will hit 59c when decrypting a DVD in the background while running a BT client, iTunes and Safari.

It gets warm, and if on my bed while doing such things, quite warm/hot and the fans run for a while, and it has been doing this without any issues for over 2 years now flawlessly. It is by far the best made, most dependable computer I've used.

[harrisjamieh]

Originally Posted by nJm

It is by far the best made

I always found the G4 iBooks a bit shoddy in terms of build quality

[bergy]

Originally Posted by Ouhei

I think your going a bit overboard here, my macbook runs completely silent 80% of the time, with any laptop with new chipsets, the fans will have to come on at some point, no way around that.

I personally don't understand the heat issues since I am not experiencing any. I've used my macbook on a bed, on a pillow over my lap, on a desk, and never has the bottom been"burning hot" it has been warm but no warmer than I have felt any other laptop (windows machines included). My macbook idles at around 46-48C and gets up to maybe 54-55C under serious usage.

I also have no moo, creeks, or discolorations. This computer has exceeded my expectations i everyway since I bought it 2 weeks ago.

I'm glad to here that you are not having any problems ... but it seems to be a real hit or miss scenario .

Just type "macbook runs hot" into google and read away .... or check this out .. one of hundreds of comparable review ...

http://www.randyrants.com/2006/05/mac_mini_20.html

[R0CK3TM4NN]

If you're hoping for this issue to be "solved" then you won't be buying a laptop....ever. If you find any Core Duo laptop that runs cool to the touch, well...then that company should be awarded a Nobel Prize cause they figured out how to break the laws of thermodynamics. Core Duos, while better than some chips (cough, AMD Thunderbird, cough) still isn't the coolest chip ever made, needless to say. I'm sure Apple decided to go with a smaller heatsink so they could keep their laptop within 1 inch thick, and decided to have the fan run slower to keep the system quiet. And even though Lenovo's and Dells have these bigger heatsinks and louder fans, their temps are still in the 50's and 60's. I doubt anyone on here would want their macbook to be clunkier so they could run a few degrees cooler. Apple has on the other hand done some things that annoy me, so I'm not trying to defend their actions. Asus laptops give you the ability to manually control fan speed, and since Asus builds the macbook, I don't know why Apple hasn't made that a feature. Anyway, my Macbook is running at 58 degrees, and I just typed this on my lap, on the couch...not a huge deal for me.

[bergy]

Originally Posted by R0CK3TM4NN

If you're hoping for this issue to be "solved" then you won't be buying a laptop....ever. If you find any Core Duo laptop that runs cool to the touch, well...then that company should be awarded a Nobel Prize cause they figured out how to break the laws of thermodynamics.or me.

It's just a matter of better engineering and design ... they really haven't thought about it enough and think the average consumer will put up with it.

Apple wanted the new chip in now and production going and will worry about the heat thing later ... until then I am holding off on living with a hot noisy laptop for the next 4 years .. especially when I know that some smart guy has a solution down the road ...

Like this ... or something like it ...

http://news.zdnet.co.uk/hardware/chi...2129192,00.htm

https://engineering.purdue.edu/Engr/...ingComputersCo

NEC to launch water cooled notebooks ..
http://news.zdnet.co.uk/business/0,3...2136823,00.htm

[pheonixash]

Originally Posted by bergy

It's just a matter of better engineering and design ... they really haven't thought about it enough and think the average consumer will put up with it.

Apple wanted the new chip in now and production going and will worry about the heat thing later ... until then I am holding off on living with a hot noisy laptop for the next 4 years .. especially when I know that some smart guy has a solution down the road ...

Like this ... or something like it ...

http://news.zdnet.co.uk/hardware/chi...2129192,00.htm

https://engineering.purdue.edu/Engr/...ingComputersCo

NEC to launch water cooled notebooks ..
http://news.zdnet.co.uk/business/0,3...2136823,00.htm

You know, you really aren't sure what you're talking about yourself. First you say you really need a laptop, now you say you're holding off for the next 4 years. I think you're basically either trolling here or ranting for no good reason. If you're going to hold off a purchase reading a forum where people come with problems, I don't know know what to say to you.

Those links you pasted, none of those systems have YET been even tried in a notebook casing. It's just a development with no testing behind it. If you're gonna wait for that, good luck with it.

If you don't want to buy the MacBook, don't. Quit ranting.

[bergy]

Originally Posted by pheonixash

You know, you really aren't sure what you're talking about yourself. First you say you really need a laptop, now you say you're holding off for the next 4 years. I think you're basically either trolling here or ranting for no good reason. If you're going to hold off a purchase reading a forum where people come with problems, I don't know know what to say to you.

Those links you pasted, none of those systems have YET been even tried in a notebook casing. It's just a development with no testing behind it. If you're gonna wait for that, good luck with it.

If you don't want to buy the MacBook, don't. Quit ranting.

Well, I don't want a lot of people to buy one not knowing what they're in for either .... which happens a lot ...

There might be something coming in as soon as a year ..
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/Fut...d=97785&page=1


Or maybe we'll have a choice of a cooler chip ....

[Ouhei]

Originally Posted by bergy

It's just a matter of better engineering and design ... they really haven't thought about it enough and think the average consumer will put up with it.

Apple wanted the new chip in now and production going and will worry about the heat thing later ... until then I am holding off on living with a hot noisy laptop for the next 4 years .. especially when I know that some smart guy has a solution down the road ...

Like this ... or something like it ...

http://news.zdnet.co.uk/hardware/chi...2129192,00.htm

https://engineering.purdue.edu/Engr/...ingComputersCo

NEC to launch water cooled notebooks ..
http://news.zdnet.co.uk/business/0,3...2136823,00.htm

But, all the horror stories mean nothing to me. MINE is doing perfect, I have the 3 year protection plan, if anything happens, guess what? It'll get fixed. I've owned a few laptops and have plenty of friends with them...they all get hot on the bottom after a while. My GF's 3 year old dell gets unbearable after its on for an hour or so, so its not like the macbooks being hot on the bottom is a totally new thing.

[Jason]

Come on people cheer up! Sure the Macbook and MBP's run a tad hot, sure some of them make a bit of noise, but that’s the nature of the beast, and fortunately we have nice apple store folk that are usually (in my case anyway) happy to go through any problems you're having and will help you out the best they possibly can. I can’t say that for any other laptop manufacturer. A friend of mine recently brought a HP laptop and he paid around AU$2300 for it, and within couple of days the track pad stated playing up and the escape key wasn't working. When he took it back to the shop (3 days after buying it) they refused to replace it and said they can only offer to repair it.

I had problems with my MBP (the noisy screen whine) and the guys had a listen to it, said it was unusual, and offered to get me a replacement machine in right away. Very good service.

Now about the machine, I can only speak for myself, here both machines are great (only problem with the last was that infernal whine) they both run a warm but would they burn me? Well to be frank I’ve never left the think on bare skin for any time to really test it, obviously if it was getting uncomfortable i surely enough would take it off my lap and put it on a desk!

I'm not going to debate the original poster, if he doesn't want a new laptop that runs warm, or that possibly whines, then i guess he might be out of luck. However I can't see how he can give advice to others to not buy the machine, when he doesn’t own one or hasn't even given one a try! So just to even it up, I would recommend a purchase of either the MB or the MBP for anyone in need of a new laptop.

Feel free to call me an apple fan boy!

[pheonixash]

Originally Posted by bergy

Well, I don't want a lot of people to buy one not knowing what they're in for either .... which happens a lot ...

There might be something coming in as soon as a year ..
http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/Fut...d=97785&page=1


Or maybe we'll have a choice of a cooler chip ....

Dude, this is the same technology described in the first link you posted. It just took a different turn, from a methanol pipe system, they developed the tiny tubes structure. Do you even read these articles?

Oh, and frankly, I don't think you can go around advising people whether to buy a MB or not w/o owning one, or even using one. Seriously.

[bergy]

Like I said ... my old iBook G3 runs cold and quiet ... that's after two logic boards and two displays .. the latest having just developed vertical white lines running from top to bottom ...oh yeah .. Apple .. they sure know how to write an OS .. they just haven't learned how to manufacture yet Look good on the outside but the insides are something else... How about that dead pixel policy" ... which one you ask .. I rest my case.

Noisy, extremely hot laptops are not progress .. it's amazing what Apple customers will put up with .. and I am one of them ..

But this heat issue is really unacceptable and there's got to be an Apple solution ... if people complain enough about this substandard technology maybe something will be done sooner rather than later ...

[beaster725]

Originally Posted by bergy

Noisy, extremely hot laptops are not progress .. it's amazing what Apple customers will put up with .. and I am one of them ..
...

I'm not "putting up" with anything. My MacBook works great. I haven't had any heat or noise issues myself. It runs a lot cooler and quieter (silent) than my old PC laptop.


Never had a problem with any of my iPods either.

[Ouhei]

Originally Posted by beaster725

I'm not "putting up" with anything. My MacBook works great. I haven't had any heat or noise issues myself. It runs a lot cooler and quieter (silent) than my old PC laptop.


Never had a problem with any of my iPods either.

Same here, well my iPod mini died on me, but I just took it in and they replaced it that day, even loaded all my songs from the old one on it for me.

[pheonixash]

Originally Posted by bergy

Like I said ... my old iBook G3 runs cold and quiet ... that's after two logic boards and two displays .. the latest having just developed vertical white lines running from top to bottom ...oh yeah .. Apple .. they sure know how to write an OS .. they just haven't learned how to manufacture yet Look good on the outside but the insides are something else... How about that dead pixel policy" ... which one you ask .. I rest my case.

Noisy, extremely hot laptops are not progress .. it's amazing what Apple customers will put up with .. and I am one of them ..

But this heat issue is really unacceptable and there's got to be an Apple solution ... if people complain enough about this substandard technology maybe something will be done sooner rather than later ...

Well I'm not exactly aware of their policy, but I'm sure it's pretty much upto industry standards. IBM (now Lenovo) doesn't replace an LCD unless it has ATLEAST 9 dead pixels, same with HP. If Apple's policy is any better than that, their better than the industry. I've seen various posts on this forum where people have replaced MacBooks with one dead pixel, so I'm guessing Apple is pretty liberal.

Oh and I'm sure people have been "putting up" with "bad Apple products" for the past 26 years that the company's been manufacturing. That's why their still profitable today. Sure.

And really, without even touching a MacBook, you can't comment on heat or noise issues. Troll.

[bergy]

Well I can read ...

I don't want to spend thousands of dollars on something that I won't be happy with ... that's why you investigate purchases before making them ...

Have you Googled "MacBook runs hot"? You might be in for a surprise ...

Oh I forgot ... you're supposed to spend all the money first blindly like a good consumer should...
If that makes me a troll .. fine ...

For those of you with more open eyes there is some good consumer awareness info at
appledefects.com

Before i take my next Apple computer home I am unboxing it at the store ... running a dead pixel check on it and looking for any other issues right off the bat rather than having to argue with them on the phone or at the store afterwards ...

If its not up to spec I'm refusing to accept it ..

Caveat Emptor ...

[zerock]

not everyone has the same issue, all new laptops (any laptop at all) get warm, my laptop gets warm, my old titanium got way hotter when in use.
i have had an iMac g4, imac g5, powerbook titanium, and ipod(2g, 3g, photo, 5g) never had a problem with a single mac product. I had a problem with the 5g ipod, but it was my fault, but it got replaced with a new one so yeah, not everyone is going to run into problems like discoloration, etc.

[itguy05]

No issues here with the MB heat. Bought one for the wife to replace her G3/800 iBook. Let it thrash away for an entire day (playing with Parallels, BootCamp, etc) and it did get warm, but not hot. I'd say no warmer than my 15" PB gets. She uses it on her lap and has not complained.

That being said, most modern laptops will run warm - it's the nature off the beast. Gone are the days of cold, quiet laptops. Get used to it or buy a desktop. And it's not just Apple - IBM, Toshiba, Gateway, Dell, etc all are about the same WRT heat and noise.

Don't worry about the heat - these things are designed to tolerate it.

Have you Googled "MacBook runs hot"? You might be in for a surprise ...

So? Just because someone wrote about it does not mean it happens. Heck, google just about anything and you're in for quite a surprise!

[MiniMoe]

My MacBook is a week 26 and it just gets warm with normal use. I use it on my lap for hours at a time in my La-Z-Boy reclined with the foot rest up. It's no warmer than my Dell 8600, but definitely thinner and lighter. As with the Dell, I occasionally put it up on the chair arm.

It's also dead silent most of the time. The only time I've heard the fan was when I imported 30,000 email messages and reorganzied them. The cpu was running 70-90% on both cores the whole time.

No stains so far either, but I heard Apple started using new plastic from week 25 on.

I love this little computer! It's everything I'd hoped for and more.

[stuffedmonkey]

Originally Posted by bergy

I don't want to spend thousands of dollars on something that I won't be happy with ... that's why you investigate purchases before making them ...

Ok - you don't want to buy a Macbook because you feel they run too hot - we get that. Why do you feel the need to tell people over and over and over? Are you that hard up for attention that you have to reply to each and every post?

-1 troll

[bergy]

Originally Posted by stuffedmonkey

Ok - you don't want to buy a Macbook because you feel they run too hot - we get that. Why do you feel the need to tell people over and over and over? Are you that hard up for attention that you have to reply to each and every post?

-1 troll

No ... but I like to reply to the rude ones especially ....

This is not a made up issue and people should be warned ... plus we should get some improvements in manufacturing ..

The "that's just the way it is" is not good enough in this day and age with all the technology at our disposal .... we just have to insist for better standards.
I am willing to forego some speed for a cooler chip for example ... especially if chips are just going to get hotter and hotter ...

[pheonixash]

Originally Posted by bergy

No ... but I like to reply to the rude ones especially ....

This is not a made up issue and people should be warned ... plus we should get some improvements in manufacturing ..

The "that's just the way it is" is not good enough in this day and age with all the technology at our disposal .... we just have to insist for better standards.
I am willing to forego some speed for a cooler chip for example ... especially if chips are just going to get hotter and hotter ...

Well then just stick to your current iBook and shut up about it already, if you want a new machine which is like ATLEAST 3 times faster (ignoring Steve's claim of 5 times) to run at the same temperature as the slower one coming, you have another thing coming.

If you as much as READ the thread, you'll see plenty of posts of people who are not having any issues with their MacBook (me included). If you still want to stick with opinions of the few people who have had issues, and go that way, good for you. Don't keep ranting about it, cause frankly everyone is sick of random people posting how bummed they are about the "issues" with the MacBook without ever looking at one.

[mduell]

Apple could use the (Ultra) Low Voltage Core Duos and make the coolest laptop ever... but it would be slower or cost more, and that's not what customers are looking for.

[bergy]

Originally Posted by pheonixash

Well then just stick to your current iBook and shut up about it already, if you want a new machine which is like ATLEAST 3 times faster (ignoring Steve's claim of 5 times) to run at the same temperature as the slower one coming, you have another thing coming.

If you as much as READ the thread, you'll see plenty of posts of people who are not having any issues with their MacBook (me included). If you still want to stick with opinions of the few people who have had issues, and go that way, good for you. Don't keep ranting about it, cause frankly everyone is sick of random people posting how bummed they are about the "issues" with the MacBook without ever looking at one.

Well I'm not going to make the same mistake I made when purchasing my other Apple products which was not to investigate their reliability ....

Every ,,, and I repeat every Apple product I have bought has turned out to be defective in some way that warranted a long and frustrating repair or outright return ...

Like i said earlier ... great OS ... their manufacturing sucks ....

Here's my list ... so far ...

1 defective shuffle
3 defective iPods ...
2 defective hard drives ...
2 defective displays ...
3 defective logic boards ...

Don't forget those extended warranties folks or you are SOL after 1 lousy year!

[nickw311]

I think you are going way off the deep end, I love my MacBook. The only time I have really ever heard it was when I was ripping a movie and the processor and fan were running at 100%. As far as it being too hot, it is sitting on my lap right now with only thin atheltic shorts between my skin. It has never been too hot to use on my lap and I let it touch my skin with no discomfort. The case is really no hotter than my previous Apple and Non-Apple laptops.

Furthermore the processor, albeit runs hot, but is within specs. It is just something you get used to. If you look at cars, some redline up at 8 or 9000 rpms where as a diesel engine will redline at about 2500 - 3500 RPMs, there isnt anything wrong with one or the other, they are just different.

People that worry about the cases melting make me chuckle....

[itguy05]

Originally Posted by bergy

3 defective iPods ...

0 out of 3 in my family here, probably will be 0 out of 4 when I get a Nano.

2 defective hard drives ...

Only 1 in 3 Macs here - my iMac G4 blew it while in waranty. My Powerbook and the wife's iBook (4 years) are running fine.

2 defective displays ...

0 out of 4 here.

3 defective logic boards ...

1 out of 4 here - the wife's iBook G3 went through 2 and 2 display cables. All under warranty and handled quickly.

Don't forget those extended warranties folks or you are SOL after 1 lousy year!

That's the standard practice in the industry (Dell is 90 days). We wanted cheaper stuff and the warranty was the first way to get that cheaper....

[nickw311]

Actually a correction, all of my Dells have had one year service and I found it to be better than Apples.

[itguy05]

Originally Posted by nickw311

Actually a correction, all of my Dells have had one year service and I found it to be better than Apples.

That's a surprise - my experience with Dell's support has, like their computers, been very very bad. However, Apple has been great the few times I called them. Answered questions right away and had no problems dispatching a tech for the iMac or a box for the iBook. And I always had them back within 3 days of me dropping them off at DHL.

[Guy Kuo]

Despite need its logic board exchanged, my MacBook is a great replacement for my 12 inch PB Al. The MacBook is quieter during operation, faster responding, lets me run Windows when needed, has much better Airport range and was far easier to install a bigger hard drive. It can run hot depending on what you are doing, but I can use it on my laptop. It's just a matter of positioning it so the middle of the bottom isn't sitting upon my legs. Supported by the left and right ends, it is comfortably cooled.

Overall, I like the MacBook more than my PB Al.

[masugu]

Well...the recent rash of QC issues might be related to the 16-20 year old Chinese factory workers putting some serious overtime with Apple's contractor - Foxconn. Maybe the training is not as good as it was or who knows...

[24klogos]

blame it on Intel

PowerPC forever!!

[SpaceMonkey]

Originally Posted by bergy

2 defective hard drives ...

Apple doesn't design or manufacture hard drives. Not their fault.

2 defective displays ...

AFAIK, Apple only designs the cosmetic housing, and not any of the LCD components, nor does it have any part in LCD component design. Not their fault.

[nickw311]

Yeah Apple doesnt make the LCD part of the display. In fact the pannel is the same as what Dell and other manuacturers use...

[unixfool]

Originally Posted by bergy

I'm glad to here that you are not having any problems ... but it seems to be a real hit or miss scenario .

Just type "macbook runs hot" into google and read away .... or check this out .. one of hundreds of comparable review ...

http://www.randyrants.com/2006/05/mac_mini_20.html

Your first mistake is relying on those key words in your search. If I'm looking for any 'net articles on "spawning goldfish", I'll use the key words "spawning goldfish". You specifically looked for "macbook runs hot"...what'd you expect to see???

Your second mistake is wanting the mac book to act like an ibook. The mac book is a totally different beast with more advanced hardware. You might want to compare apples to apples instead of apples to oranges. From what I understand, anything that contains a dual core cpu is going to run hot.

You aren't going to find too many laptops nowadays that don't get hot. That's the thing about pushing the envelope in the hardware arena nowadays...anything that's running relatively quickly is going to run hot -- CPUs, GPUs...

If you love the ibook that much, stick with it and be happy. Eventually, maybe 3-4 yrs from now, you'll change your mind.

Oh, and BTW, my mac book doesn't run hot. It gets warm but I'm never uncomfortable with it in my lap. It's only noisy when I insert a CD, but I can accept that. I've owned it almost a month and its moo'd maybe 3 times in the first week...haven't heard a moo since. I've no issue with the white casing turning brown. I've no issues with anything that people report here or on any other mac-related boards...most of it is sensationalism. Don't be so gullible with what you read...experience things for yourself before you dive off the deep end.

[Jason]

I really don't think this thread is going anywhere. Bergy has expressed his opinions, declairing that he will not be be buying a Macbook, and thats fair enough. However I don't think that people should go around creating threads just to complain about the hardware unless they actually have the hardware and they are having a difficult time using it.

These threads aren't doing any justice for apple or the people considering switching from a Wintel platform to a Mac.

Also i have found that for every 10 negative opinions you find these days on the internet, you'll be lucky to find three positive!

Do we really need a thread on a Mac dedicated forum expressing all the faults in Macs? However the other posters in this thread have proven that is usually isn't Apples fault it something goes wrong, and that just because someone has a 'whining' machine or one that supposedly 'burnt' them, that doesn't mean it happens to everyone.

Just my opinion...

[analogika]

Originally Posted by bergy

Like I said ... my old iBook G3 runs cold and quiet ... that's after two logic boards and two displays ..

I find a laptop that runs six or seven times as fast, but gets warm (not unacceptably so) FAR more tolerable than a book that needs a new logic board and display every fourteen months, if you ask me.

BTW, there's a few MacBooks that run extremely hot - they're under warranty.

All the others I've seen so far are a lot cooler than my 1.5 GHz Powerbook G4 - and that gets hot, but it's totally okay.

[Heebs]

Sucks that you are so turned off from the MB or Pros. I got mine several days ago. Runs dead silent. I've had it running for a couple hours sitting against my bare leg and it's not too hot. Sure its a little warm but what do you expect from something that's only 1 inch thick?

You also have to understand this is coming from someone who used to own a AMD Tbird with a 5000 RPM fan (or whatever was really loud) and currently has a Alienware desktop with extra fans. So to me this is very very quiet.

Edit: I agree with Unixfool. It's like saying the FX chips are retarded because they require water cooling. Its just the nature of the tech.

[buddy1065]

I dropped into an Apple Store yesterday and felt the bottoms of two Macbooks. The first was very warm but not excrutiatingly hot. The second one was cool. I have done this before and have yet to come across a Macbook that is too hot for me to hold. My only issue is the graphics chip, but it is too great of a design for me not to at least wait for the next version. At least there will probably be a better GPU and I can always flip it over and fry my own Egg "Mac" Muffins, hold the cheese please.

[lambyfish]

In my foolish carefree ways over the years I've purchased for a small business and personal use 4 imacs (1 original bondi blue, 2 candy colored, 1 half basketball type), 1 mini, and 1 G3 ibook, 1 airport bs....none of them with any sort of extended Applecare plan. None of them ever gave me a bit of trouble until I experienced hard drive failure on one of the candy imacs after five years of daily use. I'm thinking that I might invest in the Applecare coverage on the next one...just to feel more responsible. But in the scheme of things I continue to be impressed every day with how much use and abuse those machines can tolerate. The ease of network setup is for me invaluable. I look forward to shopping for a new mac post MacWorld...those early imacs are seeming a little sluggish now, but I'll hate to see them put out to pasture.
I'm very happy with the Apple hardware I own.

[freakboy2]

somewhere i read that intel is coming out with an ultra low voltage dual core chip (soon).. this chip will not generate much heat at all.

that's what this guy can buy. I'm doubtful that apple will use it in a laptop though, but maybe.

i'm with the original poster though.. not being in a big rush, I'd like to wait to see if apple can get the heat issues sorted out a little. Maybe the next gen chip will run cooler, maybe they'll figure out how to get around the 2nd law of thermodynamics.

[mduell]

Originally Posted by freakboy2

somewhere i read that intel is coming out with an ultra low voltage dual core chip (soon).. this chip will not generate much heat at all.

V2400 and V2500 are already available. I doubt Apple will use either in a cheap consumer laptop.

[King Bob On The Cob]

Water cooling is not going to make it any cooler on your lap...
It'll keep the chip cooler, but that heat has to go somewhere (which in the case of computers, is the surrounding air, which then transfers to the case, then into your lap).

All water cooling does it give the chip a faux-much larger area to spread out the heat so it's not as concentrated on the chip

[buddy1065]

I dropped into an Apple store today and noticed they even had the glossy 15" MBP's on sale. Personally after comparing I sided with the glossy screens but that's just me. I wondered why the last time I was at this store I was told the glossy screens had to be ordered like there was no other way. I guess you can't believe everything you hear...

I felt the bottoms of many MBP's and Macbooks there. Yes, some were very warm, but none were hot enough to make me put them down. I mean, I've had some really hot laptops, Powerbooks (Titanium 400/500 Mhz) as well as PC laptops and these seemed quite tame.

Anyway I was beginning to consider actually buying one when a female salesperson inquired if I needed some help. I asked if they had more glossy screen models and she said yes; like a whole shipment. I don't know why, perhaps I just wanted to be sure, so I asked how Parallels compared with Boot Camp. She sided with Parallels immediately, warning me of the perils of unliscensed Boot Camp, and when I asked if Parallels was as good at gaming as Boot Camp she said yes. I asked again if she was sure and she confirmed her reply. I did not argue, but thanked her for her reply and drifted over from the MBP's to the Macbook section and finally asked a younger female salesperson. She said she was not sure but could get the answer and return. Fearing she would go straight to the first saleslady I said no thanks. She said it would be no trouble, but not wanting any conflicts I repeated no thanks. She went to the saleslady anyway and asked, but not pointing me out, although the saleslady noticed I was there. She said that in the first place the Macbook was not a serious gaming machine (which I knew, and Macbook was not even mentioned in the girl's question) and then back went into the virtues of Parallels, while I again walked away, back to the MBP's and got the attention of a young male sales rep. I asked him how Parallels compared to Boot Camp and his reply made me laugh incredulously; he did not know what Parallels was. I thanked him politely and continued my investigation, asking another male sales Rep, who finally gave the right answer, that Boot Camp was the one to have as far as gaming and graphics was concerned.

So although I personally could find no real fault with the MBP's or the Macbooks I decided not to buy. Sure they were very warm, some of them, but a possible sale was lost that day, not so much because of the product. I may just stick with my 17" Powerbook a while longer and avoid having my blood pressure raised. Perhaps in the long run she did me a favor since I have a perfectly good 17" Powerbook anyway. Thanks for reading.

[Elektrix]

So if I understand you correctly, you base your purchase decisions on how knowledgeable the people in the store are? I can understand that it's irritating that the salespeople weren't giving you the right answers (and that would be especially bad for someone who genuinely didn't know, rather than someone like you who seems to enjoy testing salespeople), but I'm not sure why that would affect your buying decision.

[Ouhei]

Originally Posted by Elektrix

So if I understand you correctly, you base your purchase decisions on how knowledgeable the people in the store are? I can understand that it's irritating that the salespeople weren't giving you the right answers (and that would be especially bad for someone who genuinely didn't know, rather than someone like you who seems to enjoy testing salespeople), but I'm not sure why that would affect your buying decision.

Yeah, I don't think whether or not the sales people knew the differences between parallels and bootcamp really should effect buying a computer. If your inquiring about the actual hardware and they give the wrong answers, maybe I could understand if you already didn't know. But, you seem to know about that stuff so it doesn't make much sense.

[buddy1065]

I am not into quizzing folks everytime I walk into a place; it's just that I found it unusual. I would have expected such responses from Kmart employees, but certainly not Apple employees. I guess I was wrong, and that being so, and myself not being actually sure of the answer until I actually googled "Parallels vs Boot Camp" while in the store on one of their MBP's, I continued to ask. So I really did not fully know the answer but something in the back of my head made me doubt her, and so started the investigation.

Then again there was the salesman who assured me that the hood scoop on the new '93 Mustang GT was actually functional, yet I challenged him on it and had him question his superiors about it, who explained of course that the hood scoop on the black Mustang GT was merely for decoration. Incidently, I bought that Mustang.
In the car salesmans case I really felt he was misinformed; not so with the Apple saleslady. There was just something in her tone. In any case, after a while, I really based my final decision on what I already had; a perfectly functional and new looking 17" 1.5 Ghz Powerbook and a very mobile 10.6" Sony Vaio laptop. So in the end she did a good thing for me; she gave me time to think and reconsider. It's more logical for me to wait.

[Tarcat]

To the touch my MacBook doesn't feel warmer than my old iBook. I'm using it on a bed and the temp never budges 65 and the fan never comes on. On a better surface it almost never gets above the 50's and the fan never comes on. I don't doubt that some people are having issues but I think they are somewhat overblown.

[harrisjamieh]

As I posted in another thread:

Over the past 2 weeks I have been using a range of G4 PowerBooks... from old TiBooks to the newest AlBooks.. and I can honestly say that my MacBook gets no hotter than any of those do. Infact, my MacBook is pretty cool at the front of the palm rest, whereas all the powerbooks were hot all over.

I really don't see the heat as a problem... its only really been brought up because it is being compared to the iBooks seeing as the MBs replaced the iBooks. Compared to the G4 PBs, there really is little difference..