[Monique]

This is what happens when you do not watch who you invite to stay in your country. The French know it and now we know it.

[nonhuman]

Background? It sounds like it's immigrants who are rioting, is that the case? Where are they from? Are they first generation? Second? What are they rioting about?

[subego]

http://www.canada.com/calgaryherald/...1-dd569f0c50bd

"MONTREAL - People in the Montreal neighbourhood where 18-year-old Fredy Villenueva was fatally wounded weren't waiting for explanations Sunday night. Their fury erupted into a riot in Montreal North, with knots of protesters roaming the streets and setting fire to cars and garbage barricades."

[nonhuman]

Thanks for the link.

So it would appear that this has little to nothing to do with immigration policy. Rather it has to do with police brutality (perceived or real, I don't know, but it doesn't really matter), and a general tendency for police forces to **** on minorities. The fact that most of the people rioting over the death of a kid with a Spanish name are black sort of dispels the idea that this was caused by Canada's immigration policies letting in those undesirable brown people.

[subego]

So the lesson Canada has learned is that they, like the French, are big racists.

[nonhuman]

Well, the Quebecois anyway...

[subego]

I'm being silly for the most part of course, but I'm always struck when one of these overtly racist threads about immigration comes from a Canadian. Non-French Canadians too, this isn't the first.

I (probably misguidedly) expect more from them.

Edit: there is however, a much larger contingent of Canadians that usually comes by and points out how the racist is a hoser.

[Atheist]

It doesn't sound bad.... it sounds ignorant.

[jaykay33]

Why is that when an immigrant gets shot by the police they always seem to riot. When its a white person....nothing happen. Montreal in my opinion seems to be more like a U.S city in terms of its Black citizens. We are letting to many of them in and now we are seeing the results of that process.

[jaykay33]

They are, and have good reason to be.

[Eug]

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/servl.../National/home

Patricia Villanueva, Danny Valenzuela's elder sister, and witness Samuel Medeiros said an officer wanted to talk to Danny, but he refused to go to the officer, protesting that he had no't done anything wrong.

When the officer arrested Danny, harsh words were exchanged and a scuffle ensued, Mr. Medeiros, 18, said in an interview.

“You can see where the glass was smashed [on the police car],” he said, showing the cellphone video he captured of the aftermath.

By several witness accounts, Freddy Villanueva was approaching the scuffle and yelling insults at the officer when the female officer opened fire.



Video of looting

Montreal police say the officers were trying to arrest an individual during a routine intervention in Henri Bourassa Park when they were surrounded by a group of about 20 youths.

A few individuals allegedly broke away from the group and rushed the officers.

According to police, one of the officers then opened fire.

---

Some of the rioters were shooting guns too. A policeman got shot.

[subego]

Originally Posted by jaykay33 

Why is that when an immigrant gets shot by the police they always seem to riot.

Anyone else smell sockpuppet?

[Helmling]

Originally Posted by jaykay33 

Why is that when an immigrant gets shot by the police they always seem to riot. When its a white person....nothing happen. Montreal in my opinion seems to be more like a U.S city in terms of its Black citizens. We are letting to many of them in and now we are seeing the results of that process.

Maybe because white people don't get gunned down for no good reason like that?

[Monique]

I do not excuse some police brutality, but in this case it seems the police was provoked.

I can see the benefits of immigration but there are a part of immigrants that refused to assimilate to the West; those people should stay home.

When I immigrated to Alberta (even though I am a Canadian) I tried to assimilate to their customs.

It is a big deal to move to another country but certain part of immigrants and refugees do not want to be a part of that new society; they prefer to bring the problems of their country of origin in the West.

Why weren't these young men volunteering or working?

[nonhuman]

Originally Posted by Monique 

I do not excuse some police brutality, but in this case it seems the police was provoked.

The police are always provoked. According to them anyway.

I can see the benefits of immigration but there are a part of immigrants that refused to assimilate to the West; those people should stay home.

Huh? These people were all Westerners to begin with.

It is a big deal to move to another country but certain part of immigrants and refugees do not want to be a part of that new society; they prefer to bring the problems of their country of origin in the West.

It is always the case that first generation immigrants aren't going to integrate well unless they come over as young children. The second generation will do much better, and the third will be completely assimilated. This is the way it has always worked and probably always will work.

Why weren't these young men volunteering or working?

Volunteering? What? Maybe because they want to actually make a living?

As for why they weren't working: this happened on Sunday night.

[Kerrigan]

Do you guys remember that very influential French film La Haine? I remember how years ago people were saying that this was the new problem of Europe, and that soon it would be on the doorstep of Canada and the US. Of course, the film was intended to make you sympathize with the plight of the restive urban immigrants, but frankly I have no sympathy for people who endlessly and needlessly taunt police, and refuse to allow law and order to take hold in their communities.

Some more food for thought: why does the UK never seem to have these problems with its immigrant communities (notably in the East End)?

[nonhuman]

Originally Posted by Kerrigan 

Some more food for thought: why does the UK never seem to have these problems with its immigrant communities (notably in the East End)?

The UK doesn't have problems with its immigrant population? 7/7 much?

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by jaykay33 

Why is that when an immigrant gets shot by the police they always seem to riot. When its a white person....nothing happen.

So true. Whites just riot over sports.

[Kerrigan]

Originally Posted by nonhuman 

The UK doesn't have problems with its immigrant population? 7/7 much?

I see your point, but I don't think that a terror cell in London reflects problems at large with the immigrant population, as I am not aware of there ever having been riots or mass unrest in London, as there so often is in Paris.

[nonhuman]

Originally Posted by Kerrigan 

I see your point, but I don't think that a terror cell in London reflects problems at large with the immigrant population, as I am not aware of there ever having been riots or mass unrest in London, as there so often is in Paris.

I'd definitely agree with that. The problems that the UK has had with its immigrant population are more akin to those we've had in the US: i.e. primarily to do with competition for low-wage jobs, and a bit of institutional racism on the part of the former Empire. And I think this is for similar reasons: both the US and UK generally take the approach that anyone who meets certain minimal qualifications is free to immigrate and live their lives as they see fit while in France as well as French Canada there is a strong and pronounced idea that it essential that French/French Canadian culture be preserved, honored, and even elevated above others.

[Monique]

Volunteering? What? Maybe because they want to actually make a living?

As for why they weren't working: this happened on Sunday night.[/QUOTE]

Instead of sitting on you bum and do nothing, you can volunteer in your community.

If they cannot find work it is because there is something wrong with you.

You work until you find better jobs; I know this from a personal view.

When I did not work I used to volunteer at my church, I took less appealing work and now I earn a descent wage and live in a very nice apartment.

They could have gone to church and volunteer there even on a Sunday night, help people in their community, carry groceries or heavy things for older people.

You say they were not working because it was Sunday night, well do something else than destroying and stealing people's properties might be a good place to start.

Go to a community centre and do sports with young people.

You do not have one start one in a non-expensive building or outside; ask for donations and buy a basketball, a bat and ball and play baseball, get a ball and play soccer; there are plenty of fields people can play on, etc.

[nonhuman]

So you're saying that no one should ever have any idle time? If they're not at work or sleeping they should be volunteering?

No thanks, I like my idle time. Perhaps that makes me a horrible, selfish person.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by nonhuman 

So you're saying that no one should ever have any idle time? If they're not at work or sleeping they should be volunteering?

That's not what she's say at all. She's saying immigrants should never have any idle time.

[Monique]

Actually, what I am saying is that instead of complaining and rioting and destroying things around them, they should do something constructive with their time in the communities or eslsewhere like volunteering, helping others.

So nonhuman in your idle time do you riot, steal, and destroy properties; probably not?

These people always complain that they do not get the best paying jobs, and everything else for free. They prefer to stick around and do nothing.

I remember my trip in Paris when I visited the Arènes de Lutèce and all those young people in the middle of the day, sitting around and doing nothing; the following October they decided just for the fun of it to destroy anything around them.

Volunteering is great because it makes you meet people and open doors do interesting paying jobs.

Why wouldn't you want to work instead of doing nothing 24/7.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by Monique 

Why wouldn't you want to work instead of doing nothing 24/7.

24/7? Stretching things a bit, aren't you?

First, you imply that only immigrants riot. Clearly not true.
Then, you imply that immigrants have too much idle time on their hands. Probably true for some, but certainly not true for all.
Then, you imply that immigrants are filling their (implied) vast idle time with rioting. Also, clearly not true, otherwise we'd have riots 24/7.

Clearly, this riot is disappointing. As are the riots after a favored hockey team loses (or even wins) a significant game. But, personally, if people are going to riot, I have more respect (slight as it is) for people who riot over a perceived injustice, real or imagined, than for those who take the opportunity to riot over a sporting event.

[nonhuman]

If, in my idle time, I witnessed what I perceived to be unjustified police brutality I absolutely would cause hell over it. Would that involve rioting and looting? Probably not, but mob mentality has little to nothing to do with the intentions of the people who's actions result in the mob.

Also, because I'm a lazy, slothful American who expects everything to be handed to me on a silver platter carried on the back of an illegal immigrant whom I essentially keep as a slave while simultaneously decrying the audacity of those damned Mexicans for violating our borders and steeling the jobs away from the poor slobs I want to do them while I lounge about doing nothing.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Kerrigan 

Some more food for thought: why does the UK never seem to have these problems with its immigrant communities (notably in the East End)?

Because the UK hasn't actually got a police force with which to annoy our new citizens.

[subego]

Monique, I just wanted to say I love your location. You're not just home, you're back home. The potential meanings are endless. It's poetry.

(100% honest, no sarcasm, )