[vmpaul]

The Angels may very well win this Series but this is bullsh*t.

They won't even pitch to Barry Bonds unless he starts an inning or nobody's on.

[Plaides]

Smart baseball champ...

[Mark Tungston]

thats what line-up protection is for.

oh thats right....only person that can protect him is ted williams or babe ruth.

oh well...be thankful you have one of the best ever players ever.

[philzilla]

i thought this was about throwing doughnuts to Fat Barry...

[Brien]

I've seen them walk Barry here you normally wouldnt walk a player intentionally.

[Mark Tungston]

ALSO:

How does Ripken's streak get the Best Moment award?

http://msn.espn.go.com/mlb/news/2002/1023/1450142.html

that's BS! it should be aaron's hr mark or atleast a game situation like mcguire and sosa's home run derby...

anyway....i think it won because it was the last thing the fans remember as it happened in the 90s.

[G4ME]

McQuire was a one time has been, Sosa is where its at, how many times has he broken 45 HR in a season?

[Justin W. Williams]

Originally posted by Mark Tungston:
ALSO:

How does Ripken's streak get the Best Moment award?

http://msn.espn.go.com/mlb/news/2002/1023/1450142.html

that's BS! it should be aaron's hr mark or atleast a game situation like mcguire and sosa's home run derby...

anyway....i think it won because it was the last thing the fans remember as it happened in the 90s.

McGwire happened after Ripkin. Ripkin's streak was the right thing. He went out there every day and did his job. Most players today take days off: not Cal. He was everything a baseball player should aspire to be.

Homerun records will be shattered, but no one will ever touch Ripkin's record. At least not by anyone in MLB today. They don't have the work ethic.

[Mark Tungston]

Originally posted by G4ME:
McQuire was a one time has been, Sosa is where its at, how many times has he broken 45 HR in a season?

did he hit anything past 70? nope.

but yes, i would rather have sosa in his prime rather than any player almost.

[G4ME]

consistency thats all

i am not saying that Sosa is the best, I just think that McQuire is a washed up has been.

I have complete and utter respect for Bonds he is the man he has also been consistent

[vmpaul]

Originally posted by Plaides:
Smart baseball champ...

Yeah, I know it is but there's something not kosher about not ever pitching to him.

If you want to be the best you have the to BEAT the best...

[ink]

Originally posted by vmpaul:
Yeah, I know it is but there's something not kosher about not ever pitching to him.

If you want to be the best you have the to BEAT the best...

They pitched to him TWICE last night. Stop yer whining; if SF could follow with an RBI every time, nobody would walk him.

[Mark Tungston]

mcguire deserves respect

he has a pretty injury plagued career and has still put up big numbers when healthy. he had many years left on his contract and still retired even though people in his own organization still wanted him around. yes he would have been washed up if he stayed but he retired.

mcguire's numbers:
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/player...s?statsId=3866

dont talk trash about somebody who had a great career. he was horrible that last season, so i think we should praise him for retiring,

sosa's numbers
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/player...s?statsId=4344

sosa has had a consistant career but what makes him so much better than mcguire in terms of consistany? sosa is a lot yonger, sosa may perform worse than mcguire in his old age.

[vmpaul]

Originally posted by ink:

They pitched to him TWICE last night. Stop yer whining; if SF could follow with an RBI every time, nobody would walk him.

My team is in the Series and our best player can't get a decent at bat. It's my God given right to whine...

These games are killing me.

[RGB]

Originally posted by Mark Tungston:



did he hit anything past 70? nope.

but yes, i would rather have sosa in his prime rather than any player almost.

There are countless outfielders I'd take over Sosa, any day of the week. His home runs rarely come in crucial situations, he strikes out way too much, he's whiney, he celebrates a home run when his team is down by 10 runs, he can't hit a cut-off man; the list goes on. Yes the man has power, but he's a one trick pony these days.

[Plaides]

Originally posted by vmpaul:


Yeah, I know it is but there's something not kosher about not ever pitching to him.

If you want to be the best you have the to BEAT the best...

Thats true, but would you really wanna be cocky about that? Or you wanna prove to YOURSELF that you are a good pitcher while sacrafising a win for your team; expecially a World Series game?

[Agasthya]

Originally posted by Mark Tungston:
ALSO:

How does Ripken's streak get the Best Moment award?

http://msn.espn.go.com/mlb/news/2002/1023/1450142.html

that's BS! it should be aaron's hr mark or atleast a game situation like mcguire and sosa's home run derby...

anyway....i think it won because it was the last thing the fans remember as it happened in the 90s.

I was VERY disappointed that two events were missing from the 10 most "memorable" events in baseball history. First of all, Don Larsen's perfect game in the World Series. Could someone please explain to me how this didn't make the list? Perfection when it matters most, Gibson's homerun made it, but they omitted a perfect game? WTF!

Also, Joe Carter's WORLD SERIES winning homerun against the Phillies in the 93 series. Only one of two people to ever hit a walk off shot to win the World Series.

And I was pissed off that Pete Rose allowed MLB to use his name/moment. I hope they paid him a lot of royalties, afterall, the man is BANNED from baseball. Retarded Bud Selig.

And finally, why the hell should the Angels pitch to Barry Bonds? You always circle one mans name in the lineup and mark him down as the one guy you don't want to beat you, and obviously the Angels (and the rest of the league) circled Barry Bonds name because he is by far the most potent hitter in the game. And the didn't pitch to him today (Except for K-Rod) and they resulted in exactly 0 runs, in fact, it setup Benito Santiago to hit into TWO double plays I do believe (I didn't watch the entire game). Until Jeff Kent gets more than 3RBI and that awful postseason batting average, theres no reason to pitch to Barry Bonds.

Go Halos.

[PowerMatt]

Originally posted by Justin W. Williams:


He went out there every day and did his job.

NO HE DIDN'T. Remember 1994? August 12th. The strike. He walked out just like almost every other major leaguer did. Could he have showed up for work the next day, YES. A few players did. In my opinion, he missed work and should not have received that record. He isn't better than any other player who walked out on August 12, 1994.

EDIT: Unfamiliar computer lab keyboards.

[PowerMatt]

Originally posted by ink:

They pitched to him TWICE last night. Stop yer whining; if SF could follow with an RBI every time, nobody would walk him.

Which begs the question: why doesn't Barry hit third? He would still have lofton and kent to get on before him, he would be guaranteed an AB in the first inning and he would be protected by Aurillia (sp?). Also, I think that Snow and Santiago should be flopped in the lineup. Santiago is not a contact hitter. Snow might at least provide a better chance of moving Bonds to second and into scoring position. Then if Santiago does get a hit, Bonds will score 3 times out of 4.

But that is my uneducated opinion after watching only about 10 SF games throughout the year, and then the postseason. Dusty Baker probably has it right.

I think Bonds should make it his goal in the off season to learn to hit the ball to left. So maybe his power numbers drop by a few home runs but think of the damage that would be created if there was guys on first and second and he pulled his hands in and hit it to the left field corner.

[Korv]

Originally posted by PowerMatt:


NO HE DIDN'T. Remember 1994? August 12th. The strike. He walked out just like almost every other major leaguer did. Could he have showed up for work the next day, YES. A few players did. In my opinion, he missed work and should not have received that record. He isn't better than any other player who walked out on August 12, 1994.

EDIT: Unfamiliar computer lab keyboards.

THANK YOU! SWEET LORD ALMIGHTY, THANK YOU!

I've long espoused this point to anyone who would listen, but I'm always the only peson who believes so. Ripken went on strike. Ripken refused to work. The streak ended THAT day. The man refused to play baseball and sat out and gets a consexcutive games played record? And not even an asteisk?

Its BS. Ripken's record is a lie.

[Korv]

Originally posted by PowerMatt:


Which begs the question: why doesn't Barry hit third? He would still have lofton and kent to get on before him, he would be guaranteed an AB in the first inning and he would be protected by Aurillia (sp?). Also, I think that Snow and Santiago should be flopped in the lineup. Santiago is not a contact hitter. Snow might at least provide a better chance of moving Bonds to second and into scoring position. Then if Santiago does get a hit, Bonds will score 3 times out of 4.

But that is my uneducated opinion after watching only about 10 SF games throughout the year, and then the postseason. Dusty Baker probably has it right.

I think Bonds should make it his goal in the off season to learn to hit the ball to left. So maybe his power numbers drop by a few home runs but think of the damage that would be created if there was guys on first and second and he pulled his hands in and hit it to the left field corner.

You're right on some points and wrong on others.

Moving Bonds to the #3 spot in the lineup would be a good idea: more plate appearances = more base runners = more runs.

Putting Kent behind Bonds would make more sense than Aurilia usually, as he's a better hitter than Aurilia. The problem is Kent is cold right now. Maybe having Aurulia and Santiago behind Bonds in the 3 slot would be a good idea.

However...

Santiago is a contact hitter. He swings freely, early, and often. He's not the greatest hitter in the world, but he makes contact doesn't get walked... he's up there to hit.

Also, Barry can hit to left field. That's one of the misconceptions about Barry: he's just a slugger. No one hits .370 without being an all-round hitter. Yes his power is to pull, but the man can hit anything anywhere. Precisly why the Angels fear him so much and won't pitch to him.

Actually... I think Barry's first at bat in the series is telling. Jarrod Washburn, the Angels ace vs. Barry Bonds. The Angels and Washbrun said "We're not affraid, we're going to pitch to barry and beat him!" Washburn pitched to Barry, and Barry cranked one out. It seems to me that the Angels didn't understand why everyone was so afraid, but they learned. Barry hasn't gotten a decent AB bat since (but that hasn't stopped him from hitting 2 more homers).

And if they're going to walk him every time, why not put him in the #2 slot, with all your big bats backing him up and bringing him in? Maybe put a good hitter in the 9 slot after the pitcher so Barry has more baserunners in late innings? Just wacky baseball talk. Maybe its why I'm not a manager?

[vmpaul]

Originally posted by PowerMatt:


Which begs the question: why doesn't Barry hit third? He would still have lofton and kent to get on before him, he would be guaranteed an AB in the first inning and he would be protected by Aurillia (sp?). Also, I think that Snow and Santiago should be flopped in the lineup. Santiago is not a contact hitter. Snow might at least provide a better chance of moving Bonds to second and into scoring position. Then if Santiago does get a hit, Bonds will score 3 times out of 4.

But that is my uneducated opinion after watching only about 10 SF games throughout the year, and then the postseason. Dusty Baker probably has it right.

I think Bonds should make it his goal in the off season to learn to hit the ball to left. So maybe his power numbers drop by a few home runs but think of the damage that would be created if there was guys on first and second and he pulled his hands in and hit it to the left field corner.

Snow was actually in the doghouse most of the season. He's really only come on strong the last part of the season and the postseason. The Giants were trying to bring up somebody who could hit with power comparable to Bonds in a desparate attempt to find Barry some protection in the lineup.

Of course it didn't work and Dusty settled on the current lineup after the Giants went on a very good winning streak to make the playoffs. I think Snow brings a veteran prescence to the lineup.

[RGB]

Originally posted by Korv:


THANK YOU! SWEET LORD ALMIGHTY, THANK YOU!

I've long espoused this point to anyone who would listen, but I'm always the only peson who believes so. Ripken went on strike. Ripken refused to work. The streak ended THAT day. The man refused to play baseball and sat out and gets a consexcutive games played record? And not even an asteisk?

Its BS. Ripken's record is a lie.

Every game that his team played, he played. He missed nothing because there was no game for him to play during the strike.

[RGB]

Also, for those who say pitch to Bonds:

In the World Series so far, he is 3 for 8 with 3 homeruns. So he's batting .375, and every one of his hits has gone over the fence. As much as I think it would be better to see the Angels pitch to him, pitching to him has proven to be bad baseball thusfar. And you do what you have to do in order to win.

[boardsurfer]

I agree with moving Bonds to the third spot. If nothing else, Santiago needs to drop a spot. He hasnt done much behind Bonds as far as I have seen . Now, keep in mind I dont watch Giants baseball every day. It just seems as though they could do better with a better hitter behind Bonds. Hey, he's a slugger, he has to bat 4th. I hate that crap. I realise that the World Series is not the place to expirement with these things. And yeah, they should pitch to him

[Mark Tungston]

kent was slumping fiercely until they moved him 3rd. he got comfortable and had a great year. baseball folks dont like to mess with sucess.

THE LOGIC BEHIND IT IS:

Bonds will get you numbers regardless. He has proven that as Bonds has a monster year hitting in front of Santiago.

Let Kent hit in front of him so he has a great year as well.

it's a product of Bonds behind so good. i agree with this idea.

[vmpaul]

Originally posted by Mark Tungston:
kent was slumping fiercely until they moved him 3rd. he got comfortable and had a great year. baseball folks dont like to mess with sucess.

THE LOGIC BEHIND IT IS:

Bonds will get you numbers regardless. He has proven that as Bonds has a monster year hitting in front of Santiago.

Let Kent hit in front of him so he has a great year as well.

it's a product of Bonds behind so good. i agree with this idea.

Yeah, it's a tough position for anybody. Kent didn't take off till he was moved to 3rd. Santiago has been the only guy to produce on a consistant basis irregardless of last night.

[Eugene]

Moving Barry to the 3 hole doesn't change much...if they intentionally walk him with men on 1st and 3rd with only 1 out...they might just walk him with men on 1st and 2nd, even though it is very risky. You hedge your bets. Do you take a big risk pitching to Bonds with a great chance of him hitting it yard, or do you go with bases loaded againts a free swing who stands at the very far edge of the batter's box?

The Giants seemed to do quite well without moving Barry today, didn't they? They won the day before too, didn't they? Why change a successful formula?

Next year though, with Jeff and Dusty all but gone, things will be much different. Barry may well be hitting in the 3 hole...I don't know if the Giants are going to keep Lofton or Shinjo or Goodwin...so the lead-off spot is a big question. Livan Hernandez may be getting the boot, but the other 3 starting pitchers are solid. The Giants need one more Jason Schmidt caliber prospect, because Ortiz and Rueter aren't power pitchers...They send at-bats into deep counts.

The Giants defense next year looks like this:
1st base: J.T. Snow
2nd base: David Bell
3rd base: Bill Mueller
left field: Barry Bonds

Not so sure about the following:
Reggie Sanders will probably have his option picked up and stay in right field.
Benito Santiago is old, but he's playing his best baseball ever.
Damon Minor will be back as a pinch hitter and back-up 1st baseman.
Yorvit Torrealba will be back as the back-up catcher.

Dave Righetti might be promoted from pitching coach to manager because Dusty is going to be in Seattle next season.

[Eugene]

Originally posted by vmpaul:


Yeah, it's a tough position for anybody. Kent didn't take off till he was moved to 3rd. Santiago has been the only guy to produce on a consistant basis irregardless of last night.

And in contrast, the person who hits in front of Barry usually has a career year. Look at Aurilia last year, and Kent this year. If you know you're going to walk Barry, you've got to make sure you don't walk the guy before him...so you give him something to hit...