[BZ]

Ok, so all this talk of Apple stealing ideas (etc... etc.... etc...) I thought I would start a thread to help out individual Mac developers by showing what we (the software buying public) would want and or buy in the way of Gadgets/Widgets for Tiger's Dashboard.


- WeatherPop Gadget. They should build one and bundle it with WeatherPop Advanced so the user can use one or the other. It would help sell both.

- NetMonitor Gadget. Same idea. Great a Gadget that ships with NetMonitor to help sell it.

- OmniWeb Bookmarks Gadget. A no brainer. Again, ship it with the paid version.

- NetFlix Freak Gadget. (see where I am going with this)? Show the last three out, etc.

- Ebay Gadget. Done right, people would buy this.

- Sports Gadgets. NFL scores, teams. They guy who build the pluggin for Watson could make this in a second.

- Package Tracking Gadget.

- VersionTrackerPro Gadget.

- Movie Gadget. Just shows movies in a few theaters you pick.

Over all Gadgets fall in the $3-7 range. Anything over $10 and I don't think I would pay for it (and I buy a lot of software).

Any other ideas?

BZ

[spauldingg]

I'd like a real nice dictionary/thesaurus gadget, and this one that I designed and mention in this thread.

[Rev-O]

Originally posted by spauldingg:
I'd like a real nice dictionary/thesaurus gadget, and this one that I designed and mention in this thread.

A dictionary/thesaurus/spell checker would be nice. I was thinking of that one too.
An image grabber (a little camera for taking screenshots)

No games.

[jokell82]

I dunno about anyone else, but I wont be paying for any gadgets.

[Rev-O]

Originally posted by jokell82:
I dunno about anyone else, but I wont be paying for any gadgets.

Gah! I didn't read the topic!

We're s'posed to pay for these?

...

nevermind.

[moki]

Originally posted by Rev-O:
An image grabber (a little camera for taking screenshots)

No games.

Given the way Dashboard gadget work, I'm not so sure a screen capture program would work very well. There is this, though .

As for games, actually, I think it'd be pretty cool to have a few "5 minute" games like Tetris or other such idle time games available. You've got a 3D image rendering; hit a key, your game pops up, and you can play it while the image finishes rendering. Hit a key again, and it's gone.

I'd tend to agree that paying for the widgets is likely out, unless it provided some kind of significant and specialized functionality that was worth the money. I think there will be lots of gadgets available; most of them will suck, but there will be a bounty of useful (and free) ones available.

Another interesting use for them would be simplified front-ends to system level functionality. It'd be cool on a geek-factor level to have a Terminal gadget, for instance.

[Rickster]

What would you be looking for in a bookmarks gadget?

[BZ]

- Quick find, add, edit bookmarks from other applications.

- Drag and drop from any browser onto Gadget.

- Updated bookmarks, with summaries.

- Preferences for auto-checking, etc.

Basically a lot of the little things in OW 5.0 but in one little app that you could get to quickly (one key - button) as opposed to switching to OmniWeb, clicking on bookmarks, to unviewed.. etc.

BZ

Originally posted by Rickster:
What would you be looking for in a bookmarks gadget?

[BZ]

I think there are two ways that developers can charge for a Gadget.

1) Make it a stand alone gadget ($4-$6)

2) Bundle useful gadgets as add-ons to popular programs thus increasing the value of the program (weatherpop, netmonitor, OmniApps).

BZ

Originally posted by jokell82:
I dunno about anyone else, but I wont be paying for any gadgets.

[ratlater]

One problem you will run into with selling Gadgets is the source is just sitting there. If you open up the package all of the code is fully readable, so nothing would stop someone from stealing a cool Gadget and changing the look/feel a bit and put it out for free. I guess they could be donationware of some sort though. I do like the app bundling idea as well.

-matt

[jokell82]

Originally posted by BZ:
I think there are two ways that developers can charge for a Gadget.

1) Make it a stand alone gadget ($4-$6)

2) Bundle useful gadgets as add-ons to popular programs thus increasing the value of the program (weatherpop, netmonitor, OmniApps).

BZ

2 is cool, but I have a feeling scenario 1 will get very few sales. As already pointed out, the source is in plain site for anyone to see. Plus, the reaction to Dashboard hasn't exactly been spectacular. I for one can't see myself ever using it (or at least, using it often). Those in my position (and from what I've read, there are many people in my position) will not be paying for something they'd use very little...

[mdc]

i think a gadget that would help me would be one that would upload files to my webserver. edit them, save them, dashboard, upload. and they are gone.

would be pretty cool.

[:dragonflypro:]

Gadgets, because of the obviously open nature of the source would pretty much be PintWare.

Much the same as Themes. Donations of appreciation. I often end up with >5 in my paypal account and make it a point to pass it on to someone who has created something I use daily.

Lets not let this thread degrade into a "all stuff on the net should be free" sorta thread. It's a tired topic.

For me, I'd like to see (and these surely are not 'original')

A no frills Stopwatch!!!!

IMDB

Websters/Roget

Google Seach

Ebay Search

iCal ToDo's

Many others.

One thing I hope for with DashBoard items is a higher level of visual development. Many of the Konfab widgets are frankly quite nasty.

T

[:haripu:]

a gadget that would display to-do lists and interface with iCal. There was something like this for Konfabulator, which I tried to use for some weeks, but it was always where I could not see it. Dashboard should make this better.

[mdc]

i was under the impression that the calendar gadget currently in dashboard could display ical stuff.

image of appointments thing. (too wide to post)

[:haripu:]

Originally posted by mdc:
i was under the impression that the calendar gadget currently in dashboard could display ical stuff.

image of appointments thing. (too wide to post)

to me it just seems to be a plain calendar. Anyway, I'd like an interface not for the events but just for the To-Do Lists, where items can not only be shown but also edited and deleted.

[thePurpleGiant]

Originally posted by :dragonflypro::
A no frills Stopwatch!!!!

While very basic right now, there is one available at The Dashboarder Gadget Archive.

I too would most love a dictionary gadget, and some small games.

[Gavin]

What exactly can you do with a gadget?

Obviously it's talking to ical, etc. so it's not limited in the same way a javascript running in a web page is. So how does it work, does it have apple script integration? Can you run a shell script? Do you have access to files and system resources? Can it save a cache or write to a log file? Can you adjust a system setting?

The stock tracker shows a graph - is that a gif from a website or can this thing make graphics on the fly?

These things will make a big difference in exactly how cool and useful a gadget can be.

I can see gadgets doing all sorts of secondary reporting things, stuff you check on every once in a while as opposed to things you want faster reporting on like the status indicators on the menu bar. I'll bet several of those will be better as gadgets.

In the way that icons in the dock can give your some status feedback, a gadget could give you much more without pulling the whole app to the front. So the Mail Dock icon can show you there are 15 messages in your inbox but the gadget could tell you who they are from.

Again, without knowing just what a gadget is capable of it's hard to say what I want it to do.

[Chris O'Brien]

Originally posted by thePurpleGiant:
While very basic right now, there is one available at The Dashboarder Gadget Archive.

I too would most love a dictionary gadget, and some small games.

More games? I'm hacking up minesweeper and noughts and crosses gadgets as we speak.

I'm also in the middle of doing a dictionary one (which'll then allow for thesaurus stuff too), but I'm basically scraping dictionary.com and their HTML is piss poor. Also, when they change their site the gadget'll stop working. I'll keep plugging away though.

I should note that all the gadgets I'm making aren't being tested as gadgets, just as web pages in safari, so gawd knows what they'll be like... Oh, and I'm not artist, so they look like shite too (see my snake one at thePurpleGiant's site).

[moki]

Originally posted by :dragonflypro::
Gadgets, because of the obviously open nature of the source would pretty much be PintWare.

Well, gadgets can include a Cocoa plugin too, so they aren't necessarily open.

[Chris O'Brien]

Um, so I have the dictionary gadget working (using dictionary.com). I took an easy way out, but meh. It works
There's a couple of problems though - should I leave the pronunciation bit in, or is there no need for that? Also, it only shows the first match. SO, where it says boat has 7 matches, the gadget only shows one.
Another thing is that I was going to make the gadget small, but the text that I'm getting can sometimes be a lot and so a small gadget wouldn't really cut it...

This would be sooooooooo much easier if I had Tiger

Oh, PS: I wouldn't charge for a gadget...

[BZ]

Originally posted by moki:
Well, gadgets can include a Cocoa plugin too, so they aren't necessarily open.

You know.. that came to mind. Thanks for settling it.

So, if you can include all the Cocoa goodness, these Gadgets can be pretty intense little applications.

BTW: Moki... you excitement about CoreImage and CoreVideo in the other thread (I think you referred to it as the most exciting thing to come from Apple in ages) has me excited as well. Hell, if you are excited, we are in for some awesome apps.

BZ

[thePurpleGiant]

Originally posted by Black Book:
Um, so I have the dictionary gadget working (using dictionary.com). I took an easy way out, but meh. It works
There's a couple of problems though - should I leave the pronunciation bit in, or is there no need for that? Also, it only shows the first match. SO, where it says boat has 7 matches, the gadget only shows one.
Another thing is that I was going to make the gadget small, but the text that I'm getting can sometimes be a lot and so a small gadget wouldn't really cut it...

This would be sooooooooo much easier if I had Tiger

Oh, PS: I wouldn't charge for a gadget...

Hmm. Any possibility of simply including all of those as an option on the back? Checkbox 'show pronunciation', and a box for how many results are shown. Of course this would make it hard to design, allowing for a wide range of text. Scroll bar then? Same amount of space, and you scroll through the text to read more?

Can't wait till you finish it!

[Rickster]

Dude, they totally need to make the Inspector be a Gadget.

[P]

The most important thing use for a "web" Gadget would be particular search that you do often, but is a bit tricky to get to because everyone is different. A weather popop is a good example - you want to know what the wather is like in your town today and tomorrow. Finding it on the web takes time: make a gadget for it. A Versiontracker/Macupdate thing? As a watch for a few apps: sure. To show everything? No way. Too much info - try RSS instead.

There's going to be a period when everyone makes plugins for everything - like it was for Contextual Menus in OS 8.whatever - and then it will calm down in to things that it's suited for. Things I can see working:

Watch, with stopwatch, alarms, date. Link it to iCal.
Calculator
A weather thing, like above.
Traffic checker - I can get info on the traffic situation around here from the web, and I think I'll write a gadget that alerts me when there's a jam on the to work or home.
Bus stop check - time left til next bus gets there
Tickers: news, sports, stocks... Scroll everything, or just watch your own stock/your favorite team. Have them show updates on running games.
To do list. Link to a full To do app or to iCal.
Notes, stickies. Maybe just hide/show the stickies.
System status: CPU load, memory, etc.
Web page watcher - have it show up when updated. Can gadgets bring themselves forward?
iTunes remote.

One thing I can't see working are all those things where you just get a search field, be it Google, the Address book, or whatever. You might as well have a shortcut to jump to the program.

Rickster: ROTFL!

[absmiths]

Originally posted by BZ:
- Drag and drop from any browser onto Gadget.

Would drag-and-drop work with a gadget? you would have to grab the object, press F12 while still holding the mouse button down, then drop it. I can't see Apple going for that.

It would be nice if Apple created some one-way packaging for gadgets so that they didn't have to be shipped as source (Sort of like compiling AppleScripts).

[headbirth]

Gadgets seem like bloatware that the MacOS does not need. A lot of what I see in the above threads are covered via the services menu and 3rd party items.

I would rather see Apples efforts go toward fixing the mirriad of bugs and beefing up the anemic apps they already have like the Finder and Dock.

The R&D should be spent on persuing a better interface model ... the desktop, menu bar, scroll bar interface, model is damn inefficient and out-of-date.

My short rant ... my apologies!

[BZ]

Oh and the most obvious Gadget of all:

A second DOCK!!! Yes, a dock-like launcher that you can store all your 'other' apps and games on to quick launch them. Maybe have it sit cling to another side of the screen.

That one is worth $5.

BZ

[austinjackson]

It seems that these gadgets are perfect for drawing your attention to things on the web (especially data-driven, dynamic pages) without having a web page open and refreshing all the time.

We (www.educatorshandbook.com) are going to use this in an upcoming release to our database software. One of your students has a referral? Switch to dashboard to see all the students with new referrals. Click on one and safari takes you to the details. This will also allow us to prompt Administrators when action needs to be taken somewhere in the system.

We are very excited about this technology and the possibilities.

[spauldingg]

Originally posted by thePurpleGiant:
Hmm. Any possibility of simply including all of those as an option on the back? Checkbox 'show pronunciation', and a box for how many results are shown. Of course this would make it hard to design, allowing for a wide range of text. Scroll bar then? Same amount of space, and you scroll through the text to read more?

Can't wait till you finish it!

Have you seen the link I posted at the dashboarder and on other threads here where I designed (but didn't code) a dictionary UI? I would love some opinions, preferably at dashboarder.



linkdinky

[southtdi]

I actually wounldn't be surprised if Sherlock became a gadget application in the future. I know that way I would get more use out of it.

The eBay gadgets wold be a godsend if done right. It needs to enable me to insert my username and password and then go and get all the auctions I am watching, bidding on, or selling display them in and easy to show format. Column view would be fine and I don't mind it showing only two or three and have a small scroll arrow in it. Sorry, but run and eBay business and it would be very helpful.

The dictionay/ spellchecker/ thesaurus would be great too. You can type in a word and it would display the correct spelling, varations on that word, and any related words. Click on any of those and get an instant definition of that word. Could be intergrated into Sherlock as entioned above but needs to be improved if it is.

Other than that those are the only ones I can think of right now I would use. I hate ones since there is one in the menu bar already. Weather and calander are fine but not the ugly red they showed. No circus looking stuff on my computer please.

[Synotic]

Originally posted by absmiths:
Would drag-and-drop work with a gadget? you would have to grab the object, press F12 while still holding the mouse button down, then drop it. I can't see Apple going for that.

It would be nice if Apple created some one-way packaging for gadgets so that they didn't have to be shipped as source (Sort of like compiling AppleScripts).

Well Hyatt mentioned implementing drag and drop within webkit so it seems like it is possible. And drag and drop + exposé is a great combination... i.e. drag an image from a web page into a hot corner.. exposé pops up.. drag onto a mail window.. release. But this could also mean drag and drop interaction within widgets, which could be cool

[Chuckit]

Originally posted by BZ:
Oh and the most obvious Gadget of all:

A second DOCK!!! Yes, a dock-like launcher that you can store all your 'other' apps and games on to quick launch them. Maybe have it sit cling to another side of the screen.

That one is worth $5.

Why would this be better than DragThing?

[BZ]

DragThing looks very cool (just tried it).

But, there are a few things about it that I think a Gadget would do better at (and the Author of Dragthing should build the Gadget)

1) Cost. A gadget should not be $29
2) Hiding. Gadgets show up on Expose which is a bit cleaner (although a preference)
3) A gadget would work within the OSX framework.

BZ

Originally posted by Chuckit:
Why would this be better than DragThing?

[jfinete]

Originally posted by southtdi:
I actually wounldn't be surprised if Sherlock became a gadget application in the future. I know that way I would get more use out of it.

Dashboard completely obsoletes Sherlock and Watson. Instead of having web applications appear as a webpage in a browser, or as a module in Sherlock/Watson, Dashboard puts web apps on your desktop. It's the next logical step. I won't be surprised if Sun Microsystems turns Watson into a Dashboard clone.

[lngtones]

Originally posted by spauldingg:
Have you seen the link I posted at the dashboarder and on other threads here where I designed (but didn't code) a dictionary UI? I would love some opinions, preferably at dashboarder.



linkdinky

OK, if Dashboard is going to bring us 1000 widgets that look like that, maybe I should burn my eyes out with a hot poker right now and save some time.

[lngtones]

Originally posted by headbirth:
The R&D should be spent on persuing a better interface model ... the desktop, menu bar, scroll bar interface, model is damn inefficient and out-of-date.

How are they inefficient and out-of-date? It would be just as easy for me to say: "the desktop, menu bar, scroll bar interface, model is damned perfect and will last forever."

Both are just opinions without some reasons.

[spauldingg]

Originally posted by lngtones:
OK, if Dashboard is going to bring us 1000 widgets that look like that, maybe I should burn my eyes out with a hot poker right now and save some time.

Hmmm, I guess you don't like them. I'm just trying to have fun, and I'm totally open to criticism and ideas. I've been getting good ideas from folks at dashboarder, and have learned a lot. It is a new concept to me, (never tried Konfabulator) and there isn't a lot of information out there to go by. And I don't have Tigerdev, so I don't know any technology restrictions, ie: size, shapes, colors. I have been working to make them smaller and less textured, and less busy. (see this reduction of dictionary )

Part of my design concepts are to counter what I have heard of peoples opinions of most konfabulator widgets, I stick with simple shapes and monochromatic tones for the people who don't want the shiny plastic look. I'm sure with honest input from people I'll hone them to something some people will like.

Like I said, just having fun.

[phillryu]

Personally I would like to see a design based more on a dave brasgalla art style semi photo realistic open book.

[spauldingg]

Originally posted by phillryu:
Personally I would like to see a design based more on a dave brasgalla art style semi photo realistic open book.

Someday I hope to reach his level.

[grahamb]

Originally posted by Synotic:
Well Hyatt mentioned implementing drag and drop within webkit so it seems like it is possible. And drag and drop + exposé is a great combination... i.e. drag an image from a web page into a hot corner.. exposé pops up.. drag onto a mail window.. release. But this could also mean drag and drop interaction within widgets, which could be cool

That's exactly how it works. Click & hold/drag the icon, hit F12, drop the icon onto the gadget. Presto!

[iOliverC]

Originally posted by spauldingg:
Hmmm, I guess you don't like them. I'm just trying to have fun, and I'm totally open to criticism and ideas. I've been getting good ideas from folks at dashboarder, and have learned a lot. It is a new concept to me, (never tried Konfabulator) and there isn't a lot of information out there to go by. And I don't have Tigerdev, so I don't know any technology restrictions, ie: size, shapes, colors. I have been working to make them smaller and less textured, and less busy. (see this reduction of dictionary )

Part of my design concepts are to counter what I have heard of peoples opinions of most konfabulator widgets, I stick with simple shapes and monochromatic tones for the people who don't want the shiny plastic look. I'm sure with honest input from people I'll hone them to something some people will like.

Like I said, just having fun.

I like the style you have going here.

In my opinion, most people want small gadgets. Maybe shrink it down a bit?

The search field would go nice with your dictionary design.