[Gee-Man]

Ok, this is kind of funny:

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/11/24/pow...ine/index.html

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell on Wednesday said the United States does not accept the results of Ukraine's presidential elections as legitimate, citing "credible reports of fraud and abuse."

There are several reasons why fraud is suspected, but one of those is... that the exit polls didn't match the official results!

http://www.dw-world.de/dw/article/0,...403660,00.html

The outcome of a bitter election in Ukraine on Sunday was anything but clear Monday, with exit polls showing the pro-Western challenger as the winner, but official results indicating otherwise.

Ironic that over there, this discrepancy is sufficient cause to doubt the outcome of the election, but over here, exit polls are considered unreliable and should be ignored if they don't match the outcome. It's like a mirror, but not...

[voodoo]

I agree with the US.

If the exit polls and the results are different then the matter should be looked into. Should not apply less (of course) to Bush being re-elected (fishy fishy) than some guy in Ukraine though.

[slow moe]

A lot of countries feel the same, not just the US.

As far as our exit polls being wrong, when have they ever been right?

[Zimphire]

Liberals are just louder and more willing to shout out.

They tried to use the exit polls to undermine the election this time around.

"Kerry is winning by a landslide, might as well stay home"

Didn't work.

[TETENAL]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Liberals are just louder and more willing to shout out.

They tried to use the exit polls to undermine the election this time around.

Colin Powell is now considered a liberal?

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by TETENAL:
Colin Powell is now considered a liberal?

Wah? I am speaking about the exit polls.

Since when did Colin Powell have anything to do with exit polls?

[TETENAL]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Wah? I am speaking about the exit polls.

Since when did Colin Powell have anything to do with exit polls?

WASHINGTON (CNN) -- U.S. Secretary of State Colin Powell on Wednesday said the United States does not accept the results of Ukraine's presidential elections as legitimate, citing "credible reports of fraud and abuse."

There are several reasons why fraud is suspected, but one of those is... that the exit polls didn't match the official results!

[slow moe]

Since there are tens of thousands of non-professional protesters (who don't appear to be associated with ANSWER, MoveOn.org, etc.) in the Ukrainian streets, I'm more inclined to believe the exit polls there were correct. Their demonstration appears to have happened spontaneously, not preplanned like a anti-Bush rally here in the States.

[eklipse]

Pro-West guy loses. West is upset. Big surprise.

The US complaining about another country's failure to adhere to international standards is amusing too.

[Abu Bakr]

The US worrying about elections? What about their puppet states here in the ME? Or is the US only worried about states that are not directly under their thumb?

[Shaddim]

Originally posted by voodoo:
I agree with the US.

If the exit polls and the results are different then the matter should be looked into. Should not apply less (of course) to Bush being re-elected (fishy fishy) than some guy in Ukraine though.

You, of course, realize that the difference in the US exit polls and reality was only a few % (within the margin of error) in the most hotly contested races, namely in Fla and Ohio. Further, the US final results almost perfectly matched the pre-election polls, which historically are a more accurate indicator of election trends. The exit polls and pre-election polls in the Ukraine were apparently off by a much greater margin.

This doesn't automatically mean that there was cheating in the Ukrainian elections, I don't know the polling formula they used and it could have been extremely flawed. This just means that an investigation is a good idea.

[OreoCookie]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Wah? I am speaking about the exit polls.

Since when did Colin Powell have anything to do with exit polls?

Zimphire, wrong country. They're talking about Ukraine.

[deedar]

Originally posted by slow moe:
A lot of countries feel the same, not just the US.

As far as our exit polls being wrong, when have they ever been right?

Oh, how about 2000 - all states except Florida; 2004 - all states except Florida and Ohio.

[paully dub]

Originally posted by OreoCookie:
Zimphire, wrong country. They're talking about Ukraine.

Anyway, about the Ukraine. A collegue of mine is Ukrainian. He's on the phone home all the time these days, and all I can understand is curse words he's taught me and "Mafia".

You can overlook Viktor Yanukovich's ties to Russian mafia, oil barons. But Putin was campaigning for him in the Ukraine. He controlls all of the Ukraine's media outlets, and Yushchenko's campaign was strictly grassroots (zero favorable coverage in any of the media), and therefore shouldn't have even stood a chance. Yushchenko even survived two assassination attempts.

People in the Ukraine really believe those exit polls, and they showed a rather decisive victory for Yushchenko, yet the Yanukovich government show a slim victory for...guess who?

This wasn't so much a democratic election as two forces clashing: A multinational political/industrial pro-Russian alliance against a strictly popular democratic movement. It's not over yet. The election was just part of it.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by TETENAL:

Let me rephrase that Since when did he have to do with the exit polls I WAS TALKING ABOUT.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by OreoCookie:
Zimphire, wrong country. They're talking about Ukraine.

I was responding to sloe moe

[paully dub]

If this goes bad, as in the US continues to question the elections results, Yanukovich manages to hold on and the Ukraine and Russia form a kind of neo-soviet alliance, it'll be interesting to see how our new Secretary of State and Soviet expert handle the situation.

I think we may just toughen our stance on Russia and Putin, personally.

[paully dub]

Now the media's protesting

"Even the sign-language presenter said that in an earlier bulletin, she had rejected the pro-government script and informed her viewers instead of the allegations of vote-rigging."

I saw a clip of this. While the announcer is talking about the voitn result, the woman signing is saying, "Don't believe this information, it's been falsified".

Wow.

[slow moe]

Whoa!



What the hell happened to Yushchenko?

[TETENAL]

The elections have been annulled by the Ukrainian supreme court. They will be repeated.

[Dave Brasgalla]

Originally posted by slow moe:
Whoa!

What the hell happened to Yushchenko?

That's Chornobyl country, don't forget.... that, or he went "grup"...