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Pizza: The Good, The Bad, and the Deep Dish
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Clinically Insane
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[Split from the Overrated thread: ]
Deep dish casserole pizza
-t
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Last edited by andi*pandi; Jan 26, 2020 at 07:21 PM.
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Clinically Insane
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Originally Posted by turtle777
Deep dish casserole pizza
-t
Yes.
I hate this shit gets associated with my city. New York, or even Detroit style is vastly superior.
The only okay deep dish I’ve had is Lou Malnati’s. Bacino’s makes a okay stuffed pizza. Neither are as good as my nearby New York place.
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Deep dish pizza is great bad. It's threatened to make me buy new belts. Gotta avoid it most of the time.
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Originally Posted by reader50
Deep dish pizza is great bad. It's threatened to make me buy new belts. Gotta avoid it most of the time.
What state do you live in?
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That info is well hidden.
<---------- hint
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Clinically Insane
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That’s a problem.
I don’t know why, but pizza is very sensitive to longitude.
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ps. Stuffed crust Pizza!
f**k OFF!!!
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Originally Posted by subego
Yes.
I hate this shit gets associated with my city. New York, or even Detroit style is vastly superior.
The only okay deep dish I’ve had is Lou Malnati’s. Bacino’s makes a okay stuffed pizza. Neither are as good as my nearby New York place.
Conans Pizza, Austin, TX. Deep Pan Pizza baked in a magical oven... They don't call it "Chicago Style" or anything like that. Excellent (thick) crust, great ingredients, a sauce that makes other sauces envious. It's wonderful stuff.
But I see that a lot of people just don't care for "deep dish pizza." Why?
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I never understood it, either. I’ve had great deep-dish pizza, and I’ve had utter rubbish NY pizza, and vice-versa. It doesn’t matter how it’s made as long as it’s tasty. I have little patience for declarations that X-food must be done exactly one way.
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Originally Posted by ghporter
But I see that a lot of people just don't care for "deep dish pizza." Why?
They get offended by calling it pizza. But it is just an entirely different dish, that has a common ancestor with the pizza
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I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
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Clinically Insane
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Originally Posted by ghporter
Conans Pizza, Austin, TX. Deep Pan Pizza baked in a magical oven... They don't call it "Chicago Style" or anything like that. Excellent (thick) crust, great ingredients, a sauce that makes other sauces envious. It's wonderful stuff.
But I see that a lot of people just don't care for "deep dish pizza." Why?
“There’s really good pan pizza if I drive 80 miles for it.”
Q.E.D.
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Clinically Insane
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Originally Posted by Thorzdad
I never understood it, either. I’ve had great deep-dish pizza, and I’ve had utter rubbish NY pizza, and vice-versa. It doesn’t matter how it’s made as long as it’s tasty. I have little patience for declarations that X-food must be done exactly one way.
Pie is better than cake.
Fite me.
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Clinically Insane
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Originally Posted by OreoCookie
They get offended by calling it pizza. But it is just an entirely different dish, that has a common ancestor with the pizza
It's like how a burger and a sandwich are the same thing, just prepared differently.
Well, yeah — different dishes get different names. That’s how it works.
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Clinically Insane
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Extra ingredients on pizza are overrated.
If you can’t shoot it straight cheese, it’s a bad pizza. Same goes for burgers.
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Originally Posted by subego
Extra ingredients on pizza are overrated.
If you can’t shoot it straight cheese, it’s a bad pizza.
This
And, while we're on the pizza thing, the most overrated chain...Pizza King. God, what horrible, over-priced crap.
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I’ve also found, when ordering pizza for large groups, despite everyone saying they like all kinds of shit on their pizza, the cheese ends up the most popular. Of course, I only order good pizza.
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Clinically Insane
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Originally Posted by subego
I’ve also found, when ordering pizza for large groups, despite everyone saying they like all kinds of shit on their pizza, the cheese ends up the most popular. Of course, I only order good pizza.
I ordered pizza for a group of dudes a couple of times last month. In both cases, the meat lover's was gone first, and the rest of the stuff kind of languished. It wasn't super out there, but I guess when people say, "I like anything," they mean, "I like any of the three common pizza toppings, on their own."
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My family will eat all kinds of pizza toppings, we like variety and are not vegetable-averse. Sausage/eggplant, pepperoni/pepper, chicken/spinach, are common. But if we have a party for kids, yeah, have to have basic cheese. I'm always surprised how many kids these days are still squeamish about vegetables or food with color even when they are 12.
Agreed that if the base sauce, cheese, and crust are not good, no amount of toppings will fix it. Our usual pizza/sub place got new owners and the quality of the crust/toppings went way down. Now we are shopping for a new place.
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Is T. Anthony’s still around? They weren’t bad for a New York style.
I assume Jimmy’s is gone. I’m pretty sure they hated making pizza.
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Originally Posted by Laminar
I ordered pizza for a group of dudes a couple of times last month. In both cases, the meat lover's was gone first, and the rest of the stuff kind of languished. It wasn't super out there, but I guess when people say, "I like anything," they mean, "I like any of the three common pizza toppings, on their own."
If I was having Iowa pizza, I’d try and bury it under stuff, too.
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Clinically Insane
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Well, it was Pizza Hut, so I don't know that anything about it was Iowa-specific.
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Originally Posted by Laminar
Pizza Hut
Ironically, I actually like Pizza Hut, though individual franchises vary in quality. I’d call it “Philly style”, where the crust is a little thicker than normal, but not yet an actual thick crust.
The thicker the crust, the more oily it needs to be, and Pizza Hut benefits from the extra oil the meat gives it. Plain cheese Pizza Hut is dry.
A true first-class outfit with thicker crust will have an option to oil that sucker up, which brings the cheese to it’s rightful place. For example, the one deep dish place that’s any good around here has “buttercrust”.
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I grew up eating Pizza Hut, it's definitely a comfort food for me. Except that their traditional (perfectly oily) pan crust is now a $1 adder, which I go for every time. Whatever cardboard they've chosen as the standard crust is chewy garbage.
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I had one a couple blocks away, which was great. Then the supermarket next store burned down, and they dozed the entire property, which included the Pizza Hut, even though it was still standing.
A new one opened a half-mile away, and it is not good.
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Aside from the occasional Bertucci's, we do local shops. In town I think there's a Dominos but never ordered there. Our Uno's got demolished and is now a self-storage facility. There's a Papa Gino's that's not bad, surviving I think because it is close to the high school and convenient for after-school gatherings. Bertucci's is good if you like that brick oven crispy thing.
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As I’ve mentioned before, it’s a crime that Uno’s is my city’s primary pizza export.
Much better is Lou Malnati’s. Lou started out at Uno’s, and then left to make it right.
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Our local grocery chain, H-E-B, has Italian made frozen pizzas. We get the 4-cheese variety and add a few things: pepperoni, black olives and mushrooms, and a TON of "pizza cheese blend". It bakes in less than half an hour, and turns out great. "Classic?" Nope. Not even "Chicago style-like". But it's good.
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Hot take: pineapple on pizza is incredible.
I’m out on cheese-only pizza. I prefer funky stuff, better yet if spicy. Rapini with spicy italiano sausage or sopressata and hot peppers in oil? Goat cheese, crackly prosciutto and caramelized pears with balsamic reduction? These are things worth fighting for.
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pears plus goat cheese in any combo is good.
We might just need a pizza thread. Vote to split?
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Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton
Hot take: pineapple on pizza is incredible.
I’m out on cheese-only pizza. I prefer funky stuff, better yet if spicy. Rapini with spicy italiano sausage or sopressata and hot peppers in oil? Goat cheese, crackly prosciutto and caramelized pears with balsamic reduction? These are things worth fighting for.
-t
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Clinically Insane
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If you have to put a mountain of shit on it, you don’t like pizza, you like the mountain of shit. The “pizza” is just a vehicle for your shit.
I like a Hawaiian, with real goddamn bacon, please... but I also like a pizza.
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Anything involving hot cheese and I'm generally onboard with enthusiasm.
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I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
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Originally Posted by subego
If you have to put a mountain of shit on it, you don’t like pizza, you like the mountain of shit. The “pizza” is just a vehicle for your shit.
I like a Hawaiian, with real goddamn bacon, please... but I also like a pizza.
I think there is a difference between “not a cheese pizza” and a “meat lovers + kitchen sink, pilled 2 inch high” pizza.
I prefer the middle ground - two carefully selected toppings.
Btw, Subego, since you also reside in Chicago: if you get a chance, try Forno Rosso on W Randolph.
http://www.fornorossopizzeria.com/
Most ingredients are freshly imported from Italy, including the flour. This is the real Neopolitan pizza deal. Probably the best in Chicagoland.
-t
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Originally Posted by subego
If you have to put a mountain of shit on it, you don’t like pizza, you like the mountain of shit. The “pizza” is just a vehicle for your shit.
I like a Hawaiian, with real goddamn bacon, please... but I also like a pizza.
That’s just a super weird and arbitrary way to define pizza.
Pizza is flattened dough with a base (I’d say tomato but I’ve eaten some other great variants), cheese and stuff on it. Limiting the toppings to a base and cheese isn’t authentic; it’s just spartan. I like a plain Neapolitan pizza as much as the next guy, but sprinkle me some hot peppers in oil and maybe some rapini and spicy sausage and now we’re talking.
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Well, at least you didn’t smother prosciutto to death this time around.
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Originally Posted by turtle777
I think there is a difference between “not a cheese pizza” and a “meat lovers + kitchen sink, pilled 2 inch high” pizza.
I prefer the middle ground - two carefully selected toppings.
Btw, Subego, since you also reside in Chicago: if you get a chance, try Forno Rosso on W Randolph.
http://www.fornorossopizzeria.com/
Most ingredients are freshly imported from Italy, including the flour. This is the real Neopolitan pizza deal. Probably the best in Chicagoland.
-t
I will check it out!
I think I’ve given my recommendation for probably the best New York style in the city, which is Cafe Luigi on Clark, near Wrightwood, but the place itself has the ambiance of a hot dog joint, so more for if you’re ever stuck needing delivery in Lincoln Park/Lake View.
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Originally Posted by Laminar
Aye
The Aye's have it.
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I did once hear Domino's described as not so much food as an ongoing experiment to see if there's anything human beings won't eat.
Seems fair enough. Basically it tastes like a disk of salt and chemicals, whatever toppings you choose.
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Last edited by Doc HM; Jan 28, 2020 at 04:19 AM.
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Clinically Insane
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Ironically, Domino’s makes edible pasta. Not great, but edible.
Likewise, their dough is juuuust good enough for the cinnamon sticks to be edible.
Little Caesar’s > Dominos
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I tried Dominos once. It seemed fair. Pizza Hut is closer, and I like them more. No other pizza places nearby, so no other data.
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We had our granddaughter overnight last Friday, and did cheap pizza. Went with Marco’s. Actually not a bad pizza for the price.
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Dominos in the UK got a fair bit better a couple of years ago. Its still very mass-produced and horrifyingly overpriced unless there are lots of you. They don't do pasta here.
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I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
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Domino’s started in Ann Arbor, Michigan, the home of the University of Michigan. College students and “food” is a complex subject, and I think it’s important to understand Domino’s roots vis-à-vis the “pizza” content of their offerings.
Little Caesars started in Garden City, MI, a suburb of Detroit. With a less collegiate clientele, they probably had to up their game into “actual pizza”.
These are the first, and third largest chains in the US, with Pizza Hut at #2. Pizza Hut started in Wichita, Kansas, and served Wichita State University, as their founders, Dan and Frank Carney, were students there. I don’t know how they managed to evade the “students will eat anything” trap that Domino’s fell into, but they also have more variety - salad bars, dining in, etc.
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Pizza hut always seemed to be #1 back in the 80s and 90s. Was that the case in the US?
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I have plenty of more important things to do, if only I could bring myself to do them....
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It was popular, sure... but also I think there was fewer options/less competition both among pizza places, and fast food. This was before Chipotle Moes etc and we didn't have a taco bell, so fast food was burgers, chicken, or pizza.
Where I grew up, we had in order of closeness to us:
5-10 min - neighborhood gas station/convenience store/sub shop/post office
30 min - Pizza Hut, Papa Gino's (at the mall!) and Little Caesars. Pat's Pizza, local maine chain, much beloved. These were mostly for eating in, since if you drove it home it would get cold.
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I didn't live in a town with fast food until college. We had gas station pizza, but that was it.
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Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep
Pizza hut always seemed to be #1 back in the 80s and 90s. Was that the case in the US?
Pizza Hut, by being an actual dine-in restaurant, kind of sat apart from the delivery-only chains. Dad could take the family out somewhere that actually looked like a restaurant, get a reasonably-priced pizza and a beer and look like a champ. And, back in the day, it actually was better quality pizza. But, the chains improved their offerings while PH went through a period where they seemed to lose their way...quality slipped, prices went up. I'm not even sure PH builds eat-in stores anymore. Anything new with a PH logo around here are their Wing Street carry-out stores.
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For whatever reason, Pizza Hut never had great market penetration in my area of Chicago. One could assume it’s competition from local joints, but Domino’s and Little Caesar’s are all over. The closest Domino’s to me used to be a Little Caesar’s.
I’ve only had two Domino’s phases. The first was when they originally opened, and did the “delivered in 30 minutes or it’s free”. Late pizzas penalized the driver, so they started getting into accidents trying to make the time, and Domino’s ended it. The second phase was they had online ordering before GrubHub was a thing. Not needing to talk to people was worth bad pizza.
Edit: upon reflection, the lack of Pizza Hut was probably due to the sit-down aspect. Dominos and LC don’t have the overhead. The (bad) Pizza Hut here now is all takeaway.
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Clinically Insane
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Originally Posted by Thorzdad
Pizza Hut, by being an actual dine-in restaurant, kind of sat apart from the delivery-only chains. Dad could take the family out somewhere that actually looked like a restaurant, get a reasonably-priced pizza and a beer and look like a champ.
I never considered that Pizza Hut would have beer, my parents only ever got Diet Coke. Now I'm getting all nostalgic thinking of sitting in the non-smoking section, staring at the one or two arcade games sitting there, and leaving stinking of greasy crust and cigarette smoke.
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