[OwlBoy]

Originally posted by mrtew:
I wouldnt' close the window. If I ever close the VLC window I can never get it opened again. I have to quit the app and restart it. Am I missing something?

It opens right back up when I hit play, or open a new movie.

-Owl

[Synotic]

Originally posted by udecker:
I like synotic's as well, but if you're going to go the iTunes look, why don't you just get rid of the stop button? (pause works to "stop" the movie in VLC, and you can close the window to really STOP it).

or, three buttons to the left, rw, play/pause, ff (like iTunes) and below that, volume control (just like iTunes again) - then below the status pane, "back" "stop" and "forward" buttons to the left of the "list" "prefs" buttons (with a small gap between them, but all centered below the status).

Just an idea.
-uD

Something like this?



I also made the light at the bottom of the status well a smaller. If anyone likes this idea over the other then I'll resize the well.

Although I also think that the skip to end and skip to beginning are really that useful, if you need it you can just command-left, or use the slider. Closing the window works to stop. Prefs... never seen a prefs button on a window. As for the list thing, I suppose that can be useful but how many people really use it?... Perhaps the entire bottom can be cut off.

At that point we can finally account for what most of these mockups haven't (ok well mine and owlboy's)... Close, minimize, maximize. It would be small enough so that we could pull of iTunes' method of showing them:



Then we introduce custom elements... But most of the elements in this idea are custom elements. Any thoughts on any of this?

[TheIceMan]

Nice!

[Mike S.]

I'm guessing that the time slider will be in the usual place appropriate to that style?

I only ask since it's missing from the new mock-up.

[Synotic]

Originally posted by Mike S.:
I'm guessing that the time slider will be in the usual place appropriate to that style?

I only ask since it's missing from the new mock-up.

Yeah, I was originally anticipating buttons which were just under the 3 buttons on the left. Then I would have to make the yellow status well much larger to account for the missing space on the right... That never happened. It'll probably look like what it used to. I am still waiting to see what TheDJ's progress is with the iTunes like slider.

I may post some new mockups later.

[SenderoLuminoso]

Originally posted by Synotic:
Something like this?



I also made the light at the bottom of the status well a smaller. If anyone likes this idea over the other then I'll resize the well.

Although I also think that the skip to end and skip to beginning are really that useful, if you need it you can just command-left, or use the slider. Closing the window works to stop. Prefs... never seen a prefs button on a window. As for the list thing, I suppose that can be useful but how many people really use it?... Perhaps the entire bottom can be cut off.

At that point we can finally account for what most of these mockups haven't (ok well mine and owlboy's)... Close, minimize, maximize. It would be small enough so that we could pull of iTunes' method of showing them:



Then we introduce custom elements... But most of the elements in this idea are custom elements. Any thoughts on any of this?

Yes, we are definitely getting there. I think you should go even more iTunes style and include the display for progress, title, time etc. in the minimized version and mock up the large version with a playlist like iTunes has it. You could then have the prog start up minimized or normal or even better make it an option for the user how he wants to have VLC startup. A playlist menu like in iTunes would be nice too btw.
Cheers,

Sendero

[fireside]

Originally posted by Synotic:
Yeah, I was originally anticipating buttons which were just under the 3 buttons on the left. Then I would have to make the yellow status well much larger to account for the missing space on the right... That never happened. It'll probably look like what it used to. I am still waiting to see what TheDJ's progress is with the iTunes like slider.

I may post some new mockups later.

maybe you could move all of the buttons under the well to the left more so they're more under the RR, Play, FF buttons and then under the well a slider?

edit:

maybe something like this?

[Synotic]

Originally posted by fireside:
maybe you could move all of the buttons under the well to the left more so they're more under the RR, Play, FF buttons and then under the well a slider?

edit:

maybe something like this?

I think I'll stick with the iTunes-like slider... makes it more like the real thing (speaking of sliders will they fix that bg where sliding is nearly impossible? move forward.. jump a minute back... heh). Does nobody agree with my idea that most of the buttons on the bottom are pretty useless?

As for making a full out iTunes type thing with playlists for VLC... well talk to them, I'd be glad to help with anything interface-wise though

[bOOzo]

Synotic (and others) -
I made a Gloss template that I used when i created buttons for iFixes and the Brushed Plastic variation, and I though you could use it for VLC. It has the same style plastic buttons as iTunes does.
Get it here

Just resize the file to appropriate size.

Also:

This one is quite nice, but it's a little cluttered with all the small buttons. I think the "pref" button can go, but I use the playlist button quite often. And it make sense to have it there since it opens a drawer. The small stop and skip buttons are essential, but I think they should be in the same style as the rew and ff buttons. Not sure how to place them though.
And I think it would be better to have the slider use the regular slider track, for consistency's sake.

[SenderoLuminoso]

Originally posted by Synotic:
I think I'll stick with the iTunes-like slider... makes it more like the real thing (speaking of sliders will they fix that bg where sliding is nearly impossible? move forward.. jump a minute back... heh). Does nobody agree with my idea that most of the buttons on the bottom are pretty useless?

Well if you make it with a maximised and minimized version where the maximized version contains the playlist at the bottom the "list" button is useless. The "prefs" button is if the preferences are listed in the File dropdown menu as with any other mac application. The "stop" is useless as well since you can completely stop the movie by closing the VLC program, for everything else the pause/play button is sufficient. Skip forward and backward are kind of useless as well, it would be better if they were combined with fast forward and backward button as in iTunes where simply clicking the button does skip while holding the button pressed does fast forward and backward.
Cheers,

Sendero

[SenderoLuminoso]

Originally posted by SenderoLuminoso:
Well if you make it with a maximised and minimized version where the maximized version contains the playlist at the bottom the "list" button is useless. The "prefs" button is if the preferences are listed in the File dropdown menu as with any other mac application. The "stop" is useless as well since you can completely stop the movie by closing the VLC program, for everything else the pause/play button is sufficient. Skip forward and backward are kind of useless as well, it would be better if they were combined with fast forward and backward button as in iTunes where simply clicking the button does skip while holding the button pressed does fast forward and backward.

What we need though I think is a progressbar in the LCD.
Cheers,

Sendero

[Synotic]

Originally posted by bOOzo:
Synotic (and others) -
I made a Gloss template that I used when i created buttons for iFixes and the Brushed Plastic variation, and I though you could use it for VLC. It has the same style plastic buttons as iTunes does.
Get it here

Just resize the file to appropriate size.

Thanks for the file, I'm sure it'll be useful in the future. For now though, I just recreated it with some gradients and a path.

Also:

This one is quite nice, but it's a little cluttered with all the small buttons. I think the "pref" button can go, but I use the playlist button quite often. And it make sense to have it there since it opens a drawer. The small stop and skip buttons are essential, but I think they should be in the same style as the rew and ff buttons. Not sure how to place them though.
And I think it would be better to have the slider use the regular slider track, for consistency's sake.

OK I've messed around with it and I think it's look pretty good:



I wasn't able to to squeeze the list button in there unfortunately The way it is now, it would be the ONLY button in that style... Like Sendero has been mentioning, if the VLC team ever planned on updating VLC to have more advanced playlist features and integrate it into the main window then it would no longer be needed... and it would open up a lot more possibilities for the app. But again I have no control over that.

In this mockup hopefully they can recreate the feature where when you make it small enough, the status well disappears and then it appears when you resize. I am also thinking of creating a mockup where the volume is under the controls and then the status well is to the right but vertically centered to make up the lost space... don't hold your breath though. Any more comments are appreciated

edit: fixed link

[udecker]

Sorry for the terrible, "frankenstein" image here (yeah, I'm tired)...

But this is what I meant -



with this, the volume slider is positioned middle to the 5 buttons, directly under the controls (which themselves line up perfectly with the status pane) and the 5 buttons are centered relative to the status pane (not the entire window). So, if the window were elongated, the status pane would stretch to fit (including the progress slider) and the 5 buttons would stay centered relative to the status pane.

using the itunes progress/slider widget also means you don't have to click and drag like VNC currently wants you to do (or at least wants ME to do) but you can click anywhere in there to skip to that spot.

-uD

[bOOzo]

Since I like and use VLC, I thought I too should make some mockups. The problem I see with the current is that they would require a custom Metal window. It makes them slimmer, but I think it's important that it looks good with themes.

First I tried something completely new:


It's very slim, but the problems is that it would require a custom metal appearance and would look the same even with a theme applied. Also, the position slider is too short.

Secondly I tried evolving the current layout, with inspiration from the DVD player in Panther:


This one I think would work great. It's similar to the current VLC and it would be able to theme it, although all the buttons would still be plastic. It has the same functionality, except for the preference button which I find unnecessary.

Any thoughts?

[mrtew]

I think that VLC should be like other programs and take it's elements from the extras.rsrc so it will match everything on the screen. Synotic's mockup looks great, but won't help people that hate brushed metal (and it sure seems like there are a lot of them judging by the reaction to the new Finder). If it could just be a regular metal app then it would take on the appearance of whatever theme is installed like everything else on the computer except for iTunes and QT of course. Why can't it just do that? Why do apps have to go their own way?

[OwlBoy]

Originally posted by mrtew:
I think that VLC should be like other programs and take it's elements from the extras.rsrc so it will match everything on the screen. Synotic's mockup looks great, but won't help people that hate brushed metal (and it sure seems like there are a lot of them judging by the reaction to the new Finder). If it could just be a regular metal app then it would take on the appearance of whatever theme is installed like everything else on the computer except for iTunes and QT of course. Why can't it just do that? Why do apps have to go their own way?

I think this is one place where an option is not necessary, its just a small controller... I feel that brushed is perfect for this, but may be overboard for, say, the finder.

-Owl

[SenderoLuminoso]

Originally posted by bOOzo:
Since I like and use VLC, I thought I too should make some mockups. The problem I see with the current is that they would require a custom Metal window. It makes them slimmer, but I think it's important that it looks good with themes.

First I tried something completely new:


It's very slim, but the problems is that it would require a custom metal appearance and would look the same even with a theme applied. Also, the position slider is too short.

Secondly I tried evolving the current layout, with inspiration from the DVD player in Panther:


This one I think would work great. It's similar to the current VLC and it would be able to theme it, although all the buttons would still be plastic. It has the same functionality, except for the preference button which I find unnecessary.

Any thoughts?

Max, as for the second one, go for it, we don't know how long it will take until the next version of VLC comes out and the current UI is just too damn fugly. ;-).
Cheers,

Sendero

[Adam Betts]

Originally posted by udecker:

This make more sense to me. We could lose the close,min,max widgets though.

[OwlBoy]

hmm, I dunno, going for something that would not just be an Apple rip-off would be cool too .

In reference to that last "frankenstien-like-mockup"

-Owl

[dialo]

Originally posted by SenderoLuminoso:
Max, as for the second one, go for it, we don't know how long it will take until the next version of VLC comes out and the current UI is just too damn fugly. ;-).
Cheers,

Sendero

I agree. I like the second one.

[bOOzo]

Well, I can't make nib files, but if any one wants to make a controller out of my mockup, contact me and I can provide you with the graphics.

[NetworkShadow]

Originally posted by bOOzo:
Since I like and use VLC, I thought I too should make some mockups. The problem I see with the current is that they would require a custom Metal window. It makes them slimmer, but I think it's important that it looks good with themes.

First I tried something completely new:


It's very slim, but the problems is that it would require a custom metal appearance and would look the same even with a theme applied. Also, the position slider is too short.

Secondly I tried evolving the current layout, with inspiration from the DVD player in Panther:


This one I think would work great. It's similar to the current VLC and it would be able to theme it, although all the buttons would still be plastic. It has the same functionality, except for the preference button which I find unnecessary.

Any thoughts?

Cool I like this one. VLC looks really bad if you've got a non-aqua theme installed, this should be good.

[udecker]

Originally posted by OwlBoy:
hmm, I dunno, going for something that would not just be an Apple rip-off would be cool too .

In reference to that last "frankenstien-like-mockup"

-Owl

Owl, it's less about being an Apple rip-off, and more about interface consistency. If system wide consistency with regards to audio and video presentation and control can be implemented, it's proper re-use, not ripping off. You shouldn't have to re-invent the wheel when there are already working examples of the functionality we're looking for.

Familiarity is just as important when it comes to using these widgets. Especially if you can't come up with something substantially better than what's already out there (with regards to the Apple widgets).

-uD

[Zimphire]

These two are the top so far IMHO

[NetworkShadow]

I think smaller the better, screen space should be for the video your playing, not the controller.

[mikelauder]

I think the second of the two above is probably the more usable. The first has the problem of the volume slider and the video slider being one above the other. IMHO this looks rather awkward and due to the length seems to give a very high priority to the volume.

I also like the idea of being able to resize the controller just like the iTunes one so that You get to see more info and get a better resolution on the video slider.

MIke Lauder

[bOOzo]

Seems like most people prefer the Frankenstein mockup by Synotic and udecker. I do too I think, so I made a refined mockup of it.

Type A


Type B



I prefer the Type A display, it goes very well with the shape of the window.
As someone said, it might be cool if it could be resized to only display the << > >> buttons and the volume slider.. But then I think that the best solution would be to add the vertical x-+ and have the + act as a resize button. Then we could skip the growbox.

[darkcore]

Wow, Type A looks great. That's my favorite mockup so far, all the controls flow really nicely.

[Synotic]

Originally posted by bOOzo:
Seems like most people prefer the Frankenstein mockup by Synotic and udecker. I do too I think, so I made a refined mockup of it.

Type A


Type B



I prefer the Type A display, it goes very well with the shape of the window.
As someone said, it might be cool if it could be resized to only display the << > >> buttons and the volume slider.. But then I think that the best solution would be to add the vertical x-+ and have the + act as a resize button. Then we could skip the growbox.

Type B is looking pretty good. Only suggestion would be to normalize some of those margins. Like there's more space to the right of the status well and "prefs" button than to the left of the Rewind button. Since I haven't gotten any more info on the updated slider I shoot an e-mail to thedj and see if he can check out this thread.

[Mediaman_12]

I think that the square "LCD" on version A fits better. It fits in the top right corner better and it's shape mirrors the shape of the rectangular buttons along the bottom.
On version B the round 'Forward' button next to the LCD on left is also has a different center line, and it makes it look uncomfortable on this side. there is also an issue with the 'squarenes' of the corner of the brushed window where it buts against the curve of the "LCD".

[bOOzo]

Good suggestion Synotic! I moved things around a little:





I also added a darker line to the bottom of the slide track which makes it look somewhat sunken.

[Adam Betts]

Type A is looking good. I like it

[OwlBoy]

Looking good.

I wish theDJ would say something about how this will be implemented, or when, or what one.........

Though I guess it is just me being a bit sad (selfish) that mine won't be used, sorry

-Owl

[udecker]

Originally posted by bOOzo:
Type A:


Type B:

Hey, both of these are looking great. I'm partial to Type B, but only because of the similarity to iTunes, and the rounded edges compliment the rounded buttons. When used in such a tight window though, the edges are a bit ... discordant.

Did we decide against allowing for the resize of the window? I can appreciate that with these mockups, there is no space left for the resize widget. However, to get better slider resolution, being able to stretch this thing wider may come in handy.

Also - we haven't heard much on actual implementability of these designs. From what I can tell, the slider control isn't a standard nib object that can just be popped in.

But great job on making the idea pretty, bOOzo. :-) Everything lines up as it should.

-uD

[bOOzo]

Glad you like udecker, it's your concept after all.

As I said, if it should be resizable, I think it should have the vertical x-+ and when you press the + it switches to a smaller size.

Should I make a new mockup with either vertical x-+ buttons or with a growbox?

[The DJ]

I'm really sorry I haven't been able to do anything with your suggestions yet people.

I took up some more responsibilities these last three weeks. Therefore i haven't had much time to work on VLC. The time i did have i spent on making the osx version work again after some low level changes to vlc and on updating some elements (implemented a repeat function, next to the loop and shuffle ones, added save playlist), and on making our support for subtitle files more sophisticated.

See also this: http://www.via.ecp.fr/via/ml/vlc/200309/msg00207.html
my call for more help on osx.

You have to see that even though it looks simple to update the interface, doing it right still requires quite some programming. Especially the minicontroller switch to a larger controller needs work which isn't easy to do. Also, the buttons and drag and drop behaviour is custom work, which simply takes some time.

[udecker]

Originally posted by The DJ:
I'm really sorry I haven't been able to do anything with your suggestions yet people.

I took up some more responsibilities these last three weeks. Therefore i haven't had much time to work on VLC.

Hey man - just curious how things have been going with the new UI implementation. Also - let me know if you have any needs for testers.

Cheers,
uD

[The DJ]

Originally posted by udecker:
Hey man - just curious how things have been going with the new UI implementation. Also - let me know if you have any needs for testers.

Cheers,
uD

No need for testers, just a need for developers

[gdiddy]

Wow! Looking nice! I'd have to go with the rounded Type B. Great work.

[booboo]

Originally posted by bOOzo:
Good suggestion Synotic! I moved things around a little:

I would like - for what it's worth - to see all the transport buttons grouped together, as they were with the other contender. It seems nonsensical to split them . . .

This would mean swapping the positions of the volume slider and the start/stop/end buttons . . .

Very rough - I'm no image editor . . .