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NEW 4MP Elphs - What do you all think?
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im_noahselby
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Sep 13, 2003, 08:24 AM
 


To see how truly small this camera really is you should go here: I didn't think much of this tiny beauty until I saw these hands on pictures and I must say that they sure look pretty cool. I can't wait to see them hit stores.

The only flaw I've seen so far is the lack of optical zoom, but I can't really blame Canon when I look at how small this camera really is!

What does everyone else think?

Noah
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nbnz
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Sep 13, 2003, 08:35 AM
 
They are awesome cameras. If I didn't already have a Sony DSC-U20 I'd definately pick one of those up. It's surprising how many snaps I take with the Sony just cause I carry it virtually everywhere.
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milhaus
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Sep 13, 2003, 08:36 AM
 
Originally posted by im_noahselby:


To see how truly small this camera really is you should go here: I didn't think much of this tiny beauty until I saw these hands on pictures and I must say that they sure look pretty cool. I can't wait to see them hit stores.

The only flaw I've seen so far is the lack of optical zoom, but I can't really blame Canon when I look at how small this camera really is!

What does everyone else think?

Noah
No optical zoom. And did you see the price? Unacceptable. Go buy an S400, or wait until they come out with one which takes SD cards. These aren't worth it.

If you want really small and full featured, try the Pentax Optio S or the Casio cameras. But read the reviews from www.dpreview.com first.
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im_noahselby  (op)
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Sep 13, 2003, 11:53 PM
 
For those who have small cameras of this sort, such as the Sony U, do you find yourself missing optical zoom? There is a $100 price difference between the s400 and the new sd10, with the s400 being the more expensive of the two. This is going to be a difficult decision...

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aaanorton
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Sep 14, 2003, 12:53 AM
 
Zoom is utter nonsense, to me. I just wish the lens were wider. If this thing had a 28mm equiv, I'd get one in a heartbeat. But 39? Eh, so-so. I really don't know why people go so gaga over zoom stats. Who cares? I own a Nikon 5000, which I bought specifically because it was the only one available with a 28mm equiv on it. It still is, I'm pretty sure.
I REALLY like these little units, but I'd be uncomfortable getting any point-n-shoot type camera with anything longer than a 35mm equiv.
     
ZildjianKX
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Sep 14, 2003, 01:28 AM
 
http://www.powershot.com/powershot2/sd10/press.html

The price is $450... not $350... I was going to pick one up at the former cost... but too rich for my blood at the moment.
     
im_noahselby  (op)
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Sep 14, 2003, 01:32 AM
 
Originally posted by ZildjianKX:
http://www.powershot.com/powershot2/sd10/press.html

The price is $450... not $350... I was going to pick one up at the former cost... but too rich for my blood at the moment.
Keep in mind, that I'm refferring to the Canadian difference in price.

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Athens
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Sep 14, 2003, 02:39 AM
 
I like them lots, personally I rather have a 2MP with a GOOD CCD and good optics over a 4MP and bad optics. Optics makes a hudge difference. Based on Canons record I wouldnt doubt these cameras. I do have my heart set on a Rebel though
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Sep 14, 2003, 05:10 AM
 
I have bought few months ago Canon Powershot S45, with 4.5 million pixel (am I right?) and the quality of pictures is unbelievable. Do u want to see one of mine amazing shots?
     
WJMoore
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Sep 14, 2003, 09:23 AM
 
Originally posted by milhaus:
No optical zoom. And did you see the price? Unacceptable. Go buy an S400, or wait until they come out with one which takes SD cards.
Why SD cards?
     
Athens
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Sep 15, 2003, 04:09 AM
 
SD (Secure Digital) is one of the fastest Memory card out there with 10MB/Sec transfer rate, includes a sliding switch on it to protect the content (read only) like floppies have, and the biggest and mostly unknown feature which is useless on cameras but useful on other devices is SDMI compliance which prevents copyrighted music from being copied from the media. Fact is lots of other devices use or will be using SD such as MP3 Players, PDAs, so there prices will be good and for consumers its easier to use a format that is being accepted by so many companies and usable on more then just one thing. Personally I rather have a SD Camera, Printer, PDA, MP3 player so I dont have to worry about 6 different card formats.

PS when I say SD is the fastest thats before XD from Fujifilm, I dont know how fast that is.
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WJMoore
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Sep 15, 2003, 06:09 AM
 
Originally posted by Athens:
SD (Secure Digital) is one of the fastest Memory card out there with 10MB/Sec transfer rate, includes a sliding switch on it to protect the content (read only) like floppies have, and the biggest and mostly unknown feature which is useless on cameras but useful on other devices is SDMI compliance which prevents copyrighted music from being copied from the media. Fact is lots of other devices use or will be using SD such as MP3 Players, PDAs, so there prices will be good and for consumers its easier to use a format that is being accepted by so many companies and usable on more then just one thing. Personally I rather have a SD Camera, Printer, PDA, MP3 player so I dont have to worry about 6 different card formats.

PS when I say SD is the fastest thats before XD from Fujifilm, I dont know how fast that is.
Fair enough, thanks for the reply. My experience lies with Compact Flash. I'm using it in a hardware project I am developing. It was selected for a number of reasons, one of which being that it has an open specification. I'm not sure about speed but I would have expected CF to be faster since it uses a parallel data interface (as in low level interface, nothing to do with serial/parallel ports etc.) as opposed to SD's serial one.

I also like CF because it is directly compatible (without additional electronics) with PCMCIA and is also able to run in True IDE mode meaning it can be directly connected to an IDE bus and appear and operate as a hard drive. It's main drawback as I see it is size in relation to the other formats. As for SDMI compliance I don't consider that a feature and that is not because I want to steal music, I just don't agree with it, only my opinion though.
     
milhaus
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Sep 15, 2003, 09:10 AM
 
Originally posted by im_noahselby:
Keep in mind, that I'm refferring to the Canadian difference in price.

Noah
Noah:
Because it's been out a long time, you can get the S400 for pretty cheap. I got mine for the equivalent of $600 CDN through a Quebec mail order company which doesn't charge provincial tax for out of province. So that's an automatic 8% savings (depending on province).

You can get better deals at eBay as well. $450US for the cameras you mentioned, as yet untested and sans optical zoom (I think this is pretty important actually, when you're trying to capture pics at say, a concert or your kid's recital, is a bit much, small as they are.

If you're looking for size and weight, I'd recommend the Pentax Optio S or the Casio series, though they have their problems as well.

You should read here: http://www.dpreview.com
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LeeG
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Sep 15, 2003, 12:22 PM
 
I am looking for a small camera now myself, and I looked at those on the cannon website - they're beautiful, but no optical zoom at all? I used a coolpix this past weekend, and I used the zoom more than I thought - its nice to frame people closer, knowing that if you want to clow it up in the future, the resolution is there. I think an s400 may be in my future...

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im_noahselby  (op)
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Sep 16, 2003, 05:24 AM
 
Originally posted by LeeG:
I am looking for a small camera now myself, and I looked at those on the cannon website - they're beautiful, but no optical zoom at all? I used a coolpix this past weekend, and I used the zoom more than I thought - its nice to frame people closer, knowing that if you want to clow it up in the future, the resolution is there. I think an s400 may be in my future...

Lee
Good point, Lee! This is the biggest advantage in my oppinion of having optical zoom. Both models have their pros and cons, I guess it's just a matter of deciding how I intend to use the camera most of the time.

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cpac
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Aug 23, 2004, 05:28 PM
 
BUMP - so my trusty Canon S110 was stolen/lost a week or two ago and I'm looking to replace it. Size is a huge factor for me (as I believe it was the size of the S110 in it's case, w/ extra batteries that kept it out of my pocket and subject to loss). These look very promising as they're about the size of my cell phone and the reviews say a single battery should get me through pretty much anything (and they have twice the MP of my old S110 anyway!).

Question: Now that you've had yours for a while, still as happy with it?

Question: Amazon's got it for about $300 (varies +/- $10), worth it?

Question: Now that these have been out a while, are they about to be refreshed?" (thus dropping prices on these models, while also offering more features for the money in a new, similarly sized model)

Any thoughts appreciated.

Thanks
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subego
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Aug 23, 2004, 06:24 PM
 
One heckuva bump there pardner

Sorry about the loss.

My GF has had one for 3 or 4 months now. We've got a new puppy so she's using it a lot. At the same time I'm using the Sony DSC-T1, so I have something (theoretically better) to compare it too.

The Canon is fantastic.

Assuming this is going to be a "snapshot" camera, don't let the lack of digital zoom bother you. 3x zoom is way less zoom than you think. Not having all that extra glass contributes to it being sharp as a tack. Works well in low light and with a flash, something which chokes the T1 (and its zoom, for that matter). We've never missed having an optical viewfiner. Excellent battery life. Comes with a charger, something Sony screws you on with the T1.

If I had to do it again, I'd get the Canon. The Sony only trumps it in bright daylight conditions. Bronze is the way to go if you want to draw attention to yourself.

I think I ordered mine from J&R through Amazon. No worries there. If you can, get the one with the case. It's an odd sized camera so I think it would be tough to find something aftermarket which fits it well. Canon's case is secure, has a hole for the lanyard, is thin-walled, so it adds little bulk, but is made out of some type of fake pigskin stuff, Tough as nails.

P.S.: FWIW, I do photography for a living.
     
cpac
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Aug 23, 2004, 10:37 PM
 
Thanks for the advice subego - it will indeed be a snapshot camera - to be carried in pockets to weddings and the like (where bulk is unwelcome and prone to loss)

couple of follow-ups:

(1) any way to tell if the case is included? (it's not listed in the "in the box" contents even on Canon's site - but I know there were "delux" editions or something that included the case....)

(2) having not seen anything but the silver in person, I was tempted to go towards the black (silver being too common, white being fugly), but those that have them love the bronze - from your recommendation, safe bet your girlfriend has the bronze? Really bizarre looking? Looks like a big lump of copper? I wouldn't ordinarily be asking people's opinions on the aesthetic issues - but since Buy.com offers lower prices depending on the color - I thought it was worth asking.

thanks.

[edit:]

(3) any idea on the likelihood of a product update soon (next month or so?) I'm not sure what such an update would include (or whether i'd want/need it), but at the very least it'd probably mean a price drop on the current version....
( Last edited by cpac; Aug 23, 2004 at 11:57 PM. )
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Lancer409
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Aug 24, 2004, 03:04 AM
 
i recently purchased a new digital camera. i recommend butterflyphoto.com. they are in new york, so outside of that, there is NO tax, and free 2 day air shipping.

the prices are also great. compare prices on cnet.com you will find them to be among the cheapest, plus they have great review scores.

anyways .. my problem with the canon is NO Optical zoom ... that will bug the hell out of you really quick .... i think .. as i always use the zoom on my new camera... it's 3X optical zoom .. and i often find myself wishing i had one of those huge 10x optical zoom camera's but size meant alot to me. I have a Nikon Coolpix 3700 ... unlike the previous nikon coolpix's .. it doesnt have a ergonomic .. yet (imho) unsightly handgrip. this one is rectangular and much sleeker than previous coolpix camera's. feel free to google it... it has good reviews, small size, and good photo quality. it uses sd and is nice and small..

now .. the price .. what you've all been waiting for ...

it is gonna cost me 180 after rebate. it will cost you guys 160 after rebate.
butterflyphoto dropped price to 260 .. down from 280. the rebate is 100 bux. this is alot cheaper than retail, and at that price .. the camera is a STEAL.

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wuzup101
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Aug 24, 2004, 04:07 AM
 
I personally have a canon digital elph (and a APS film elph now that I think about it). I own an S230 which I love to death; however, I'd like the 3x optical zoom that somes on the new higher end elphs (IE: S400 and S500). I think the camera has a great form factor and is super easy to carry around. Like one of the posters above, I have so many pictures because I can just carry it around all the time at school and such. I always have it when other people are saying "I wish I brought my camera for this." Anyway, I would definitely go with the S400 over the SD10; however, both are nice cameras... just depends on what you want feature wise.
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subego
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Aug 24, 2004, 04:53 AM
 
Originally posted by cpac:
Thanks for the advice subego - it will indeed be a snapshot camera - to be carried in pockets to weddings and the like (where bulk is unwelcome and prone to loss)

couple of follow-ups:

(1) any way to tell if the case is included? (it's not listed in the "in the box" contents even on Canon's site - but I know there were "delux" editions or something that included the case....)

(2) having not seen anything but the silver in person, I was tempted to go towards the black (silver being too common, white being fugly), but those that have them love the bronze - from your recommendation, safe bet your girlfriend has the bronze? Really bizarre looking? Looks like a big lump of copper? I wouldn't ordinarily be asking people's opinions on the aesthetic issues - but since Buy.com offers lower prices depending on the color - I thought it was worth asking.

thanks.

[edit:]

(3) any idea on the likelihood of a product update soon (next month or so?) I'm not sure what such an update would include (or whether i'd want/need it), but at the very least it'd probably mean a price drop on the current version....
1) The one with the case is the deluxe version. It looks like it's no longer on Amazon. They have it at PC connection but that looks to be on the high end price-wise.

2) The bronze is unusual looking, but very cool. More muted than the pictures would indicate. It's certainly not shiny like a penny. I've seen the black one at Best Buy, that's pretty cool too.

3) No idea about the next update. Check out Digital Photography Review. It looks like they talk about a whole passel of new Canons, though I didn't see an obvious successor to the SD10.

4) Referring to Lancer409's post, I could certainly see the lack of zoom being irritating. It's a personal kind of thing. For me, I want some real (8 or 10x) zoom. I always end up finding my 3x lacking. My GF (who I just asked again to make sure), said she rarely misses having a zoom. Her old camera had a 3x.
     
cpac
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Aug 24, 2004, 08:15 AM
 
thanks again!

with the 4MP resolution I don't think I'll miss a zoom...
cpac
     
gorickey
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Aug 24, 2004, 08:08 PM
 
I still have a PowerShot S100 Digital Elph (which is working flawless still)...but damn, I need to upgrade!
     
cpac
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Aug 24, 2004, 09:24 PM
 
Originally posted by gorickey:
I still have a PowerShot S100 Digital Elph (which is working flawless still)...but damn, I need to upgrade!
just get it lost/stolen - perfect reason to upgrade. Extra bonus if you're smarter than me and have an insurance policy that covers it...
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gorickey
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Aug 24, 2004, 09:31 PM
 
Originally posted by cpac:
just get it lost/stolen - perfect reason to upgrade. Extra bonus if you're smarter than me and have an insurance policy that covers it...
     
aaanorton
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Aug 24, 2004, 09:49 PM
 
I like these lil' cams and I really like Canon cams in general, but I don't love the image quality from the SD10s. A friend has one and he always asks how he can get his pics to look as good as mine. I just bought a Canon S60 (plus I'm a fabulously talented photographer...), which I REALLY love. Build is excellent and image quality is superb for a digicam. It is considerably larger than the SD10, however. So how about a S500 as a compromise? I've seen some fine pics from these cams.
     
cpac
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Aug 24, 2004, 10:00 PM
 
Originally posted by aaanorton:
I like these lil' cams and I really like Canon cams in general, but I don't love the image quality from the SD10s. A friend has one and he always asks how he can get his pics to look as good as mine. I just bought a Canon S60 (plus I'm a fabulously talented photographer...), which I REALLY love. Build is excellent and image quality is superb for a digicam. It is considerably larger than the SD10, however. So how about a S500 as a compromise? I've seen some fine pics from these cams.
true - S500 is probably going to give better picks - but for me the S110 was too big (and it's the same size as the S500) so the SD10 is the way to go.... but yep - if you have issues with the picture quality you'll have to go with something else, (which will be something larger)
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CambAngst
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Aug 25, 2004, 03:52 PM
 
I have one of the S230 Digital Elph's. My only complaint is that the lag time between when you press the button and the camera actually fires is pretty long. The lag time between pictures is also pretty long. Has this been improved in subsequent models?
     
cpac
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Aug 25, 2004, 05:05 PM
 
yes - but there are lots of different models all with different specs. Canon, and presumably the other camera makers have had one of their largest complaints be the shutter lag on digital cameras and so they've improved what they can and set up ways to avoid the problem (by turning off auto-flash, by holding the "shutter" button down halfway in advance of when you want the picture to go, &c.)
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cpac
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Aug 26, 2004, 03:26 PM
 
FWIW - ordered my from Amazon and got it today - it came with the "deluxe" set - with the case included, even though Amazon didn't specify that's what would come, and I'm loving it so far. The camera's about the same size *and weight* as my cell phone (a Siemens S56) - VERY easy to pocket and care around.
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