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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > iPhone, iPad & iPod > iPod Shuffle and USB 1.1

iPod Shuffle and USB 1.1
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xmacintosh
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Jan 12, 2005, 06:59 PM
 
Hi

I have an eMac without USB 2 port... Will iPod Shuffle work with USB 1.1 port?

Thanks in advance!
     
PurpleGiant
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Jan 12, 2005, 07:10 PM
 
Originally posted by xmacintosh:
Hi

I have an eMac without USB 2 port... Will iPod Shuffle work with USB 1.1 port?

Thanks in advance!
Sure will, only difference is that transfers will be slower. WIll work fine other than that.
     
sixer
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Jan 12, 2005, 08:13 PM
 
I have a TiBook 667 DVI and am thinking about getting an iPod shuffle. I'm also thinking about picking up a PCMCIA (cardbus) USB2 adapter for about $25.

If possible, could someone post how long it takes to fill up either the 512 Mb or 1 Gb over both USB 1.1 vs 2.0. I assume the adapter wouldn't affect throughput.

Basically I'm trying to decide if the adapter is worth it.

Thanks.
     
jesset
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Jan 12, 2005, 09:59 PM
 
Does anyone know if there are USB 2.0 hubs that connect to your computer via Firewire. I have USB 1.1 as well and I've just ordered a 1gig shuffle. I'm thinking it's gonna take forever to transfer that stuff, but a firewire->usb2.0 hub/adapter would be awesome.
     
tooki
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Jan 12, 2005, 10:46 PM
 
No, no such thing exists. And if someone made it, the drivers would probably be a nightmare.

If you have a Power Mac, at least you can add a PCI USB 2 card for cheap.

tooki
     
maxintosh
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Jan 12, 2005, 11:51 PM
 
USB 1.1 is relatively snappy. I use it to put files on my flash drive all the time and it doesn't keep you waiting TOO long.
     
discotronic
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Jan 13, 2005, 01:23 AM
 
I don't know if this would be a true test of the transfer speed but here is what I came up with:

I used a PNY 256MB flash drive and filled it up with MP3s by drag and drop. It took 10 minutes to transfer all the songs. I used a Clamshell 300MHz iBook which has USB 1.1. The hard drive is a 4200RPM but I don't think that matters much.

512MB iPod shuffle 20 minutes to fill
1GB iPod shuffle 40 minutes to fill

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maxintosh
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Jan 13, 2005, 01:40 AM
 
Originally posted by discotronic:
I don't know if this would be a true test of the transfer speed but here is what I came up with:

I used a PNY 256MB flash drive and filled it up with MP3s by drag and drop. It took 10 minutes to transfer all the songs. I used a Clamshell 300MHz iBook which has USB 1.1. The hard drive is a 4200RPM but I don't think that matters much.

512MB iPod shuffle 20 minutes to fill
1GB iPod shuffle 40 minutes to fill

Just start before you go to bed and it will be done when you leave for work the next day
Wow, my flash drive is much quicker then.

Either way, iTunes only updates the songs on the device; chances are, not every song is going to be replaced.
     
spacefreak
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Jan 13, 2005, 01:49 AM
 
I'd like to know if the Shuffle can charge from an Apple Keyboard USB port.
     
maxintosh
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Jan 13, 2005, 02:01 AM
 
Originally posted by spacefreak:
I'd like to know if the Shuffle can charge from an Apple Keyboard USB port.
Doubtfully, Apple's USB keyboard isn't a powered hub.
     
Forbodium
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Jan 13, 2005, 02:29 AM
 
I am contending with this exact issue. SInce USB1 is only 12Mbps transfer rate, it would take something like 11minutes, 22seconds to fill up the 1-gig iPod Shuffler via the USB connection of my iBook 600. The iPod is not that important to me anymore, so Im just gonna go without (like I have been the whole time).

Thanks anyway, Apple. Wake me when you have a firewire flash-based player to offer.
     
maxintosh
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Jan 13, 2005, 02:42 AM
 
Originally posted by Forbodium:
I am contending with this exact issue. SInce USB1 is only 12Mbps transfer rate, it would take something like 11minutes, 22seconds to fill up the 1-gig iPod Shuffler via the USB connection of my iBook 600. The iPod is not that important to me anymore, so Im just gonna go without (like I have been the whole time).

Thanks anyway, Apple. Wake me when you have a firewire flash-based player to offer.
11 minutes to fill up a gigabyte is hardly outrageous. And again, a lot of the songs would be on there after the first load-up, so iTunes wouldn't have to replace all of them (unless your library is gargantuan). And it has to be plugged in at *some point* for a few hours to charge up.

Apple chose USB wisely. The iPod Shuffle doubles as a flash drive, which is very appealing to many. Almost every computer nowadays has a USB port but Firewire ports, espcially on PCs and those that are accessible on public computers, are much rarer.
     
bOOzo
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Jan 13, 2005, 07:35 AM
 
Originally posted by maxintosh:
Doubtfully, Apple's USB keyboard isn't a powered hub.
From Apple's support page:

iPod shuffle: How to charge the battery

To charge a iPod shuffle battery, connect the device to a high-power USB port. Please be aware that USB keyboards and non-powered USB hubs generally do not have high-power USB ports. If you connect to a low or non-powered port, iPod shuffle will not charge.

Once it's plugged in, it'll take about 2 hours to charge the battery to 80% capacity and about 4 hours to charge it to 100%. Find out how to check the battery charge here.
     
chabig
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Jan 14, 2005, 03:13 AM
 
Originally posted by Forbodium:
I am contending with this exact issue. SInce USB1 is only 12Mbps transfer rate, it would take something like 11minutes, 22seconds to fill up the 1-gig iPod Shuffler via the USB connection of my iBook 600.
Even with a USB 2.0 port it will take about 10 minutes to fill the 1GB iPod shuffle. It took me nearly 5 minutes to fill the 512MB one. The USB interface is not the bottleneck and a firewire interface would be no faster. The limit is the speed at which the flash memory can be written.

Chris
     
andretan
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Jan 14, 2005, 03:31 AM
 
What happens if I have a 1GB iPod shuffle and I set half of that space for music and the other half for data, and I find out that I am going to need more than 500MB of storage for data?

Do I need to plug it into a computer (PC or Mac) with iTunes to change that?

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chabig
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Jan 14, 2005, 10:36 AM
 
I would assume so. If you set the data partition to 500MB, then that's what you've got--a 500 MB USB keychain drive (with a 500MB iPod built-in).

Chris
     
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Jan 14, 2005, 01:56 PM
 
Originally posted by discotronic:
Just start before you go to bed and it will be done when you leave for work the next day
You sleep for 40 minutes a night?

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discotronic
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Jan 14, 2005, 03:15 PM
 
Originally posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker:
You sleep for 40 minutes a night?
Can you believe that! Sometimes I even get up to an hour
     
vmarks
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Jan 18, 2005, 04:08 AM
 
Originally posted by maxintosh:

Apple chose USB wisely. The iPod Shuffle doubles as a flash drive, which is very appealing to many. Almost every computer nowadays has a USB port but Firewire ports, espcially on PCs and those that are accessible on public computers, are much rarer.
Imagine a flashdrive / shuffle like a double-tipped highlighter, caps at both ends:
Firewire under one cap, usb2 under the other.
Course, that has it's own problems for where to place the lanyard tiedown and the headphone port.
If this post is in the Lounge forum, it is likely to be my own opinion, and not representative of the position of MacNN.com.
     
mskblackbelt
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Jan 23, 2005, 02:45 PM
 
Apple chose exactly right for the shuffle. I used to work at Circuit City when the 3G ipod got big, and I used to have to explain on a daily basis to people that, "no you cant convert from firewire to USB because they arent compatible like that." USB is a burst data transfer method, much better for small amounts of data like a keyboard, mouse, or normal printer would give, whereas firewire is much better at streaming, which is why it is still the standard for video transfer, and firewire hard drives work better. But the shuffle is small enough that the burst method of USB 2.0 works just fine, and makes the unit much more compatible with the larger PC world, and the majority of public computers. Most PC laptops have USB 2.0, but if they have firewire, it is the silly little 4-pin non-powered type, which isn't feasible for this type of application. Honestly, if you can't wait the 10-15 minutes it takes to fully fill a 512 MB shuffle with transcoded 128 Kbps AAC files, less if you don't transcode, and even less time if you are just updating the unit, then a shuffle is not the device for you right now, because external flash based media is not instantaneous. If that amount of time is too long, then you may need to be looking at whether or not you need a music player. I'm sorry if I come off badly on this post, but the shuffle was designed to be versatile, and made to please a completely different marked than either the iPod, or the iPod mini, and you need to understand that.
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maxintosh
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Jan 23, 2005, 04:20 PM
 
Originally posted by vmarks:
Imagine a flashdrive / shuffle like a double-tipped highlighter, caps at both ends:
Firewire under one cap, usb2 under the other.
Course, that has it's own problems for where to place the lanyard tiedown and the headphone port.
It's interesting but there really isn't any good place for the headphone port in that case.
     
Forbodium
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Jan 23, 2005, 07:08 PM
 
Originally posted by maxintosh:
It's interesting but there really isn't any good place for the headphone port in that case.
How about moving the USB connector to the top, have the firewire on the bottom and have the headphone port right next to it? That also solves the problem of having to turn the Shuffle around before putting it in your pocket and when pulling it out.
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iMacfan
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Jan 23, 2005, 07:29 PM
 
Firewire is also thicker than USB, so the shuffle would have to be bigger - anyhow any computer with Firewire is bound to have some version of USB, so all it does is detract from the simplicity of the device.
     
maxintosh
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Jan 23, 2005, 08:08 PM
 
Originally posted by Forbodium:
How about moving the USB connector to the top, have the firewire on the bottom and have the headphone port right next to it? That also solves the problem of having to turn the Shuffle around before putting it in your pocket and when pulling it out.
I can't see how that would work. You would want a cap to protect it and I'm not sure there would be any room for a FW port all the same.

Besides this is sort of a moot point, since pretty much every computer that has come out in the last year or so has USB 2.0.
     
andretan
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Jan 24, 2005, 09:26 PM
 
I sync my 1gb shuffle on my G3 iBook which has USB 1.1

Took me about 20minutes to fill up 180 songs or so (first sync).
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Ricky
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Jan 26, 2005, 03:49 PM
 
It's taking quite an amount of time to send songs to my 512MB shuffle. I'm thinking it's because I told iTunes to autoconvert songs to a lower bit rate just for the shuffle though.
     
Michael1980
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Jan 26, 2005, 04:45 PM
 
Ouch, that is one way to slow things down lol.
     
Ricky
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Jan 26, 2005, 05:06 PM
 
Originally posted by Michael1980:
Ouch, that is one way to slow things down lol.
You're right, but I don't want to take the time to re-rip my some of my CDs to 128kbps AAC. This way I can have the most about of songs the shuffle can hold. It's worth the wait I guess.
     
shreddog
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Mar 2, 2005, 09:35 AM
 
I know this is a Mac forum, but I have a question about charging the shuffle on a pc. My brother-in-law has a P3-something (it's old), so I'm sure it has USB 1.1, however, I don't know if it is "high" powered or "low" powered. Is there a way to tell? He's been able to sync the shuffle and transfer songs, but he hasn't had to charge it yet. I don't think he knew about this before he bought it.
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cpac
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Mar 2, 2005, 10:45 AM
 
Originally posted by shreddog:
I know this is a Mac forum, but I have a question about charging the shuffle on a pc. My brother-in-law has a P3-something (it's old), so I'm sure it has USB 1.1, however, I don't know if it is "high" powered or "low" powered. Is there a way to tell? He's been able to sync the shuffle and transfer songs, but he hasn't had to charge it yet. I don't think he knew about this before he bought it.
The USB ports on the machine itself are almost certainly "high powered."

If he's trying to plug it into a non-powered hub and/or a keyboard or other peripheral, rather than directly into the computer, he's likely to have problems.
cpac
     
shreddog
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Mar 2, 2005, 04:02 PM
 
OK, cool. The ports are on the machine. So I guess he has a good chance that it is high-powered. Was just curious if "high powered" USB ports were a newer creation i.e. (post 2000 or so).

Thanks!
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bgotori
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Mar 2, 2005, 04:13 PM
 
Hey xmacintosh

I use my 1gb Shuffle on my Old Pismo(USB 1.1)charges fine and loads OK never timed it though... If I'm in a Rush I plug-in the USB 2.0 PCMICA card and downloads as fast as my FireWire connector. Funny FireWire connector is the same speed as the USB 2.0. yet USB 2.0 is 80mbs Faster??? Anybody else see this???


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BoulderDash
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Jun 22, 2005, 08:15 AM
 
Hey there,
I was told by an employee at an Apple store that an iPod Shuffle won't work with my stock B&W G3 (OS X 10.2.8)... is that true? By reading this, I get the feeling it will. Can anyone get me a definitive answer?

I don't mind buying any extra peripherals to have it work; but what would they be? Thanks,
BD
     
andretan
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Jun 22, 2005, 10:34 AM
 
Originally Posted by BoulderDash
Hey there,
I was told by an employee at an Apple store that an iPod Shuffle won't work with my stock B&W G3 (OS X 10.2.8)... is that true? By reading this, I get the feeling it will. Can anyone get me a definitive answer?

I don't mind buying any extra peripherals to have it work; but what would they be? Thanks,
BD
From www.apple.com/ipodshuffle

Mac system requirements:
-Macintosh computer with USB port(5)
-Mac OS X v10.2.8 or Mac OS X 10.3.4 and later (Mac OS X 10.3.6 or later recommended for use with low-power USB ports)
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