[renn]

On my weekly trip to Sascha's website for my Sunday dosage of MINIUM previews, I sadly saw all the teasers were removed. RAD.E8 has been copied before, but this really caught my attention. As Sascha mentions on his website, MINIUM got copied by some kid on a wintel forum, and the same goes for his whole site... click to see the damage . I know. Extremely weak. Express your anger at RAD.E8. I know you guys want MINIUM. And I know you're pissed too...

Cheers

[badidea]

Actually a compliment for Sascha's work as long as those copy-idiots don't sell it as their own!

And who needs previews? I actually hate previews that give you this "I want that, NOW!" feeling......and after some month you are still waiting or you find out that it will never come (and I don't even mean this O.... thread that started about a year ago )!

[kwyjiboy]

The son of a bitch has the balls to put this at the bottom of that ripped site:

"� Copyright 2004 cmiVFX. All rights reserved. Copying of images is prohibited."

[renn]

i quote:

� Copyright 2004 cmiVFX. All rights reserved. Copying of images is prohibited.

[fireside]

so uh, what was minium sunday?

[badidea]

Originally posted by fireside:
so uh, what was minium sunday?

Every sunday Sascha showed a new preview of an icon out of his upcoming MINIUM set.

[COBRAHQ]

Sucks that this is happening so often these days, seems like anything you create is up for grabs by children who don't know the law.

Luckily, the offending website is taking their site down that was "created" by the so-called designer "L.M.". Even L.M.'s personal website has a little boo-hoo story about how he's being wrongly accused of 'ripping'. I didn't see his original site, but he's put up a temporary site in it's place... and it even looks similar to www.pixelhuset.com... this boy never learns lol.

Oh well, the day he gets slapped by a lawsuit (hopefully from this company he made the duplicate website for) he'll learn something about copyright law and the DMCA.

fun stuff this week.

[Dave Brasgalla]

Originally posted by badidea:
Actually a compliment for Sascha's work as long as those copy-idiots don't sell it as their own!

Disagree.

[fireside]

Originally posted by badidea:
Every sunday Sascha showed a new preview of an icon out of his upcoming MINIUM set.

oh. anyone save some of the previews for us unlucky people who didn't know about this?

atleast he didn't turn into Hein.

[Dave Brasgalla]

Originally posted by fireside:
...atleast he didn't turn into Hein.

I sympathise more with Hein every day.

[Rafiki]

I wrote an email to cmiVFX about their site and how it was clearly a rip-off of RAD.E8 -- here's the response I got back:

You're right,_we were notified yesterday.
Paid a kid $3k to do it for us and we got screwed. _Re-doing the whole thing this week.

It sucks.

Seems that cmiVFX is among those accusing L.M. of copying RAD.E8 and "humiliating" him.

- Dave

[Makki]

Well what can i say since i not have all the facts cept i hope this wont delay the icons from release.

Makki

[Randman]

Originally posted by Rafiki:
Seems that cmiVFX is among those accusing L.M. of copying RAD.E8.

If that is indeed the case, good for them being upfront about it and making changes.

I haven't created icons or anything like that for distro, but I have had some of my designs copied before and so I know, sort of, what it feels like.
But I'm still of the mindset that pulling the toys and refusing to let people play with them (and enjoy them) is just letting the rippers win.
Making a stand, getting the word out (in both Mac and Windows gui communities) and letting people know the work you did and how you were ripped off is far better than closing shop (as Hein did).

[Randman]

Sorry ot pull a lancer, but just saw this from lm's site...

Site Redesign... and other stuff.
Well it happened, I have been publicly humiliated for "ripping". No, I really didn't rip someone's icons, but I am not going to get into that, because I can't stand that the actual author didn't even respond to any attempts of mine to contact him.
I am getting a redesign of this website sometime this week. It will be a bright orange, black, and two shades of blue.
I'm not exactly in a good mood, and I think I'm going to take a break for a little while, get back on track, you know?
I'll see you sometime guys...

// Lou

[Photo678]

I dont want to get into a long heated discussion about copyright etc.

I have been following lou creating these icons for a few weeks. This is a very very tricky situation. In lous defense, he never did release the icons. However, he mentioned once or twice that he would release them.

This brought an onslaught of discussions regarding intellectual property discussion. The best way that I can explain it to anyone here, is that lou believed that if he created these icons from scratch then therefore they couldn't be a rip.

What he was failing to understand is that if this is thought of in terms of an automobile, you can't buy a buick, study it, figure out how works and build a replica, that although looks slightly different in terms of color and call it your own. Not without purchasing rights to use the buicks design or without persmission. Another way to think of it is with remakes of songs, new artists need permission of the old artists even if the final result is drastically different.

Many have tried to explain this to him and he had many people telling him that what he was doing was ok, the same people telling him it was ok, did not really have any idea what they were talking about, so lou continued on the path.

He is not being "Accused of ripping" He did in fact steal an idea. He was influenced by the minimum icons, he wanted to create a set that was better, using what he saw as a base. This is typically fine, but without the permission of the original author, this is a rip.

He can whine till he is blue in the face that sascha did not respond to his emails, but that is no excuse. The fact that he took his site down, and has basically hidden himself away, is a good indicator that he knows he was wrong and he tested peoples patience and got burned.

Lou my man, you need to have respect for fellow artists.

[Randman]

Well said.

[Makki]

Edited my post above

[fireside]

Originally posted by Dave Brasgalla:
I sympathise more with Hein every day.

while i can kinda see where he's coming from, closing the site forever is not the way to solve the problem. its kinda like setting your house on fire to get rid of termites. sure, you're gonna get rid of the termites, but you're also going to get rid of everything else. lots of people enjoy/enjoyed his icons, he shouldn't have let the company stop him from making his icons which people enjoy. its just dumb, and, frankly, it makes him look like a whiny brat who can't get over something.

[grand mufti]

aa no disrespect to anyone but i dont see anything that was ripped.... i mean i see the black and blue graphic but its not like sascha is blowin our minds with puting the 2 colors together. now hes way better then i will ever be but i 2 have put the colors/glow in my work before and after his previews. it just looks like a quick trigger finger.

[OwlBoy]

Originally posted by grand mufti:
aa no disrespect to anyone but i dont see anything that was ripped.... i mean i see the black and blue graphic but its not like sascha is blowin our minds with puting the 2 colors together. now hes way better then i will ever be but i 2 have put the colors/glow in my work before and after his previews. it just looks like a quick trigger finger.

Hmm, I think at this point they may be changing the site so it ain't the same.

-Owl

[Photo678]

thats because it has been changed already. It was a spitting image of Saschas site earlier today

[dfiller]

Originally posted by Photo678:
thats because it has been changed already. It was a spitting image of Saschas site earlier today

Ok, was just about to say I didn't see any problems with the site . But that still sucks. I personally thought this might happen (not the site, but the icons). By placing your work out there before it's done with programs like Pic2Icon, icons can be ripped off. Previews aren't needed IMO, they increase "is it out yet?" emails and increases your chance of someone copying your work.

I still feel bad, but maybe it will be a lesson to other GUI enhancers to possibly stop releasing previews.

[Komisar]

I just want to say thanks sascha for taking it like a man. This people are rude to copy your icons and i completely agree with what you said over at rad-e8. Thank you for continuing developing your icons under the circumstances.

-Komisar

[Gerrit Vanoppen]

As much as I love and respect the RAD.E8 design, I gave up visiting his page long time ago. The MINIUM project looks like having been in teaser phase forever. Perhaps Sacha should have kept it hidden alltogether, untill he found the time to finish-and-release it.
The previews were bound to be stolen someday by someone, perhaps tired of waiting.

This is of course in no way an excuse for thieving and ripping off, IN NO WAY.

Also, I often thought : what if the metal GUI evolves in something new ? What if people suddenly change their mind about GUI - we've seen it happen before with Apple's Aqua design. I'd hate to see a great design like MINIUM miss the boat because of a new fashion wave. I'd say Come on Sasha - dig into it. Amaze us even more.

[NetworkShadow]

Originally posted by Komisar:
I just want to say thanks sascha for taking it like a man. This people are rude to copy your icons and i completely agree with what you said over at rad-e8. Thank you for continuing developing your icons under the circumstances.

-Komisar

I have to agree. I know some icon artists have stopped making icons altogether after this kinda thing happens. Very glad we'll still be getting some great new icons.

[cube3]

I think this illustrates the reals problems with copying, there are so many varied opinions of what's "ok" and what isn't, that it seems like people are in a constant state of treading on someone else's toes.

I look at some of the stuff people copyright, and I think "How the f**k they get that copyright" ... We've copyrighted the sound a button makes when you click it, and now I can charge everyone and their uncle bob cash for it.

It's hardcore for sascha, and it's another "see i told you so" in BBX's cap.

[badidea]

Originally posted by Dave Brasgalla:
Disagree.

That's ok!
(but with which part?)

[Randman]

Well, I did email this dude and did get a response. I have the feeling he's pretty young and learning a harsh lesson about taking someone's idea is still theft

That said, I do agree with those who said kill the previews and just release it when it's down. Asking for feedback is one thing (as in the star trek icons recently released), but just teasing people for ego massages is something else.

[bastion]

Ha ha.

I posted a comment to LM's website and it was pulled a few hours later. It was nothing incriminating or harsh - I just think I hit close to home.