[pliny]

What city will you be protesting in?

[Logic]

If the weather allows I'm going to protest in Reykjav�k.

I suggest everyone who goes post some pics tomorrow, OK?

[Dex13]

Do you actually think anyone is actually listening? Like Bush?
Didn't think So

[climber]

No but Saddam is I think...

[pliny]

Originally posted by Dex13:
Do you actually think anyone is actually listening? Like Bush?

Yes. Millions of people saying hold on a minute is something to listen to.

[Logic]

We can at least hope so.

Or should we just shut up and follow the lead of the B&B coalition?

[Hugi]

I am preparing for a typical Icelandic protest - if we're lucky, there'll be three of us.

See you tomorrow Logic.

[Dex13]

Originally posted by pliny:
Yes. Millions of people saying hold on a minute is something to listen to.

I hope so

[Logic]

Originally posted by hugi:
I am preparing for a typical Icelandic protest - if we're lucky, there'll be three of us.

See you tomorrow Logic.

If the wether gets better, maybe we will be four What is it, you, me, Voodoo and I think one more Icelander here

Byrjar �etta ekki annars kl 14?

[el lindo]

Originally posted by Dex13:
Do you actually think anyone is actually listening?

He'd be a failure of a President not to, seeing as how he represents us, not controls us.

[Hugi]

Originally posted by Logic:
If the wether gets better, maybe we will be four What is it, you, me, Voodoo and I think one more Icelander here

Excellent. We're only missing J�n and Siggi and then we will have the entire population .

Byrjar �etta ekki annars kl 14?

J�, Ing�lfstorg kl. 14 held �g.

[Logic]

Originally posted by hugi:
Excellent. We're only missing J�n and Siggi and then we will have the entire population .

But I can bring at least one girl to the march You have to do your part

[Nicko]

Some people are estimating there will be 5 million protesters world wide
I hope that many show up.

[Cooter]

Maybe you'd do more good if you marched into Bagdad and asked Saddam to leave office, for the sake of peace.

Its just one guy. And there would be no war. If Saddam left, no war. Easy. So go protest that Saddam leave office peacefully so his people can prosper again.

[cheerios]

would, but workin'

[voodoo]

I'll try and drop by. I am working 'till 14, but maybe I'll get off a bit early.

[Logic]

Be there! I'll bring the camera and you bring the mj��ur!!

[Cooter]

...I'll bring the sand.....

[macvillage.net]

PRO WAR MARCH, same day, same time, same route, just in the opposite direction. Bring baseball bats.


Damn Hippies.

[Logic]

Hmmmm....

And now the big question....

Is it better to be called a war monger or a tree hugging hippie?

[Cooter]

...well. I'd say war monger. Tree hugging hippies are usually on the wrong end of the gun.

[Logic]

Originally posted by Cooter:
...well. I'd say war monger. Tree hugging hippies are usually on the wrong end of the gun.

It always ends up with who has the biggest ..... hrm

[AKcrab]

Originally posted by macvillage.net:
Damn Hippies.

Don't you mean pacifists, like that Jesus dude?

[simonjames]

Sydney's march is Sunday Feb 16 - as is San Fran's.

And yes, I'll be there

[Cooter]

...yep, if only the whole world lived to Jesus' standards. Are you gonna go over there and convert them?


Infidel?


60 million people died the last time we tried isolationism.

[Cipher13]

Originally posted by simonjames:
Sydney's march is Sunday Feb 16 - as is San Fran's.

And yes, I'll be there

Oh, it's tomorrow? Yeah, why not. Hyde Park, right?

[simonjames]

Not sure Cipher - I tried to find the info on the web and nothing turned up. I'll message you as soon as I find out

[AKcrab]

Originally posted by Cooter:
...yep, if only the whole world lived to Jesus' standards. Are you gonna go over there and convert them?

Ghandi? MLK? Mother Theresa? You can find pacifists of all persuasions.

Infidel?

Yep. Your point?

60 million people died the last time we tried isolationism.

Give the world what they apparently want.

[Cooter]

Originally posted by AKcrab:
Ghandi? MLK? Mother Theresa? You can find pacifists of all persuasions.

Yep. Your point?

Give the world what they apparently want.

Uhm...no. People wanted to believe that Hitler was just a rabble rouser. People wanted to believe that WWI really was the last great war. People wanted there to be peace.

Unfortunately, sometimes, evil people abound, and, though, I will gladly accept whatever fate God provides for me, the love of my wife and family will drive me to NOT have evil brought to them.

And the fact that men walked away from the people and lives they loved so that the world could be rid of a maniacal racist bent on genocide and world domination....well, I admire their courage and conviction and am thankful for the freedom it won me.

Its easy to be a pacifist when they aren't marching your family into a death camp. Cherish your freedoms. Many across the world don't share in your wealth. Its a shame you choose to be greedy with it.

Cherish the fact that you CAN protest. Funny how you are protesting a POSSIBLE event rather than ones that take place every day across the globe. Why not protest the human rights violations in Iraq? Why not protest the gulags in North Korea?

I guess that doesn't sound good on a bumper sticker.

[AKcrab]

Sorry. I thought we were talking about Iraq.

[Cipher13]

Originally posted by Cooter:

Its easy to be a pacifist when they aren't marching your family into a death camp. Cherish your freedoms. Many across the world don't share in your wealth. Its a shame you choose to be greedy with it.

Oh, really? Page me when they have your family marching into a death camp

As far as I know, they haven't DONE anything yet. Or are we talking about "pre-emptive defense" again?

[putamare]

Ahhhh... the trafic jam as medium of social change.

[juanvaldes]

Originally posted by Cipher13:
As far as I know, they haven't DONE anything yet. Or are we talking about "pre-emptive defense" again?

That's how the Romans justified taking over most the known world.

[Cooter]

Originally posted by Cipher13:
Oh, really? Page me when they have your family marching into a death camp

As far as I know, they haven't DONE anything yet. Or are we talking about "pre-emptive defense" again?

...are you on crack? Haven't done anything to whom? You? I guess if a person hasn't murdered you, you don't give a **** if any murderer is ever brought to justice? Doesn;t affect you immediately, right?

Just don't rock your boat, right? Let all of those people in the ME suffer at the hands of Saddam. Just so long as we keep the murdering, raping, and pillaging confined to Iraq, then you'll be able to sleep better at night, hunh?

Just keep it confined so it doesn't upset your whitebread world. Good 'nuff?

Man, so damn easy to sit in front of your 'puter while people across the globe suffer needlessly because you're too intellectually lazy to figure out there isn't such a thing as black and white answers.

War bad, peace good!

[Cooter]

Originally posted by juanvaldes:
That's how the Romans justified taking over most the known world.

..oh, yeah, I forgot the The People's Republic of Cali renamed us the Imperialist States of America!!!!

Glory to the demagogues!!!

[Cipher13]

Originally posted by Cooter:
...are you on crack? Haven't done anything to whom? You? I guess if a person hasn't murdered you, you don't give a **** if any murderer is ever brought to justice? Doesn;t affect you immediately, right?

Just don't rock your boat, right? Let all of those people in the ME suffer at the hands of Saddam. Just so long as we keep the murdering, raping, and pillaging confined to Iraq, then you'll be able to sleep better at night, hunh?

Just keep it confined so it doesn't upset your whitebread world. Good 'nuff?

Man, so damn easy to sit in front of your 'puter while people across the globe suffer needlessly because you're too intellectually lazy to figure out there isn't such a thing as black and white answers.

War bad, peace good!

Oh shut your mouth. You only know what you've heard on CNN. You're regurgitating propaganda.

You have NO idea what I stand for, but it isn't the murder of INNOCENT CIVILIANS in an attempt at "peace!". My god, how ignorant are you?

I don't even know where you GOT that crap from.

I'm TOTALLY against Sadaam, but I'm not for the idea of a WAR to remove one man and his regime.

You mentioned walking your family into a death camp, and they haven't DONE that, mooting your point. They have not attacked your country, nor showed aggression.

Get over yourself, please.

[Cipher13]

Originally posted by juanvaldes:
That's how the Romans justified taking over most the known world.

I don't think the Romans were so preoccupied with justification, though. They conquered to conquer, largely; of course, defense was a motivation.

But this is a different world. Back then... you couldn't destroy your own planet.

[Roxie]

Nope, I will be going to the nearest base and showing FULL support for our troops instead of supporting the nonsense espoused here, which if ever taken seriously, will surely GET US KILLED .

Remember what Churchill said...

" Appeasement reflects the hope the crocodile will eat you last."

[theolein]

Cooter: All these talks about equating Hitler and Saddam have a small problem. The problem is similar to the one often found on these boards of trying to make an analogy between a Mac and a car: They're different.

Talking about liberating Iraqis is VERY premature, IMO, and given the current US post-war plan of imposing a US-military govenor in Iraq and maintaining the Iraqi administration, institutions and balance of power with respect to Kurds, Sunnis and Shi'ites (i.e. the Sunnis remain in power and the rest get shafted ONCE AGAIN, just like they were after the last war) apart from Saddam and friends is NOT going to free anyone if I see the situation correctly. What it very likely will do is inflame even more Muslims to do things like on 9/11 because they will simply believe they have no other way out.

Saddam is an evil, murdering, megalomaniac bastard and doesn't deserve the oxygen he breathes. The problem is that a large amount of the rhetoric in this whole crisis ignores many aspects of what happened in the middle east in recent history. The indications are that Saddam attacked Iran in 1980 due to his fear of Iran's Khomeini. Khomeini was incredibly popular in the muslim world and doubly so in the Shi'ite part of that world. Iraq has a Shi'ite majority population. He attacked Iran with the express consent and bidding of the US and almost every other Arab nation in the region and was supported through the whole war by these powers, including the US who expressly enabled him to obtain and manufacture WMD.

He had huge debts with Kuwait and Saudi Arabia after that war. Iraq has claimed Kuwait as part of it's territoy for almost as long as Iraq has been a nation and the 1990 invasion of Kuwait was NOT the first attempt to do so, just the first successful attempt to do so. Saddam is not an idiot. He is as evil as Satan himself, but he is by no means stupid. Someone who manages to remain in power for 30 years in the middle east is not stupid. His reasoning for attacking Kuwait would have definitely been based on avoiding the payment of the debt to Kuwait, Iraq's long held dream of posessing Kuwait, it's riches and above all it's ports, the lack of which was one of the reaons Saddam attacked Iran in 1980. Iraq has almost no coastline and is dependant on a small port as compared to Iran and Kuwait which is susceptible to being closed down in any crisis. Iraq would almost certainly NOT have invaded Kuwait if he had any idea that the UN and above all the US would react as quickly and as strongly as it did. There is no proof but evidence does exist to indicate that the US was consulted in some form as to it's reaction in the event of such an invasion. The evidence also indicates that he was not warned of the consequences.

His gassing of thousands of the Kurds and his brutal suppression of the Shi'ites in the south are the basis for the creation of the no-fly zones. No one however ever suggested or even seemed to care much about treatment of those people more than that at the time. His use of massive quantities of nerve gas on Iranians in the Iran-Iraq war has never been condemned by the US. Perhaps this was because the victims were Iranians and as everyone knows, the US has no like of anything Iranian. This sort of double standard, including the behaviour towards Moslems as opposed to Israel are reasons for Moslem anger towards the US. It is NOT a justification for 9/11 but it part of the cause.

Osama bin Laden, trained and equiped in Afghanistan by the CIA, started his Jihad against the west because, his religious mania caused him to believe that the presence of foreign soldiers on Saudi soil was sacriligious. He wanted to form a force of Mujahedin to go and fight the Iraqi invaders in Kuawit, and was pissed because no one listed to him.

Given the social and political fallout after the last Gulf War, I believe there are VERY GOOD reasons for not going to war in Iraq without incredibly solid evidence.

This war is not about freeing anyone.

This war is not about WMD.

This war is only partly because of oil.

This war is about control.

[Cipher13]

::applause::

[Nicko]

...you could even argue that this war is a foolhardy attempt to gain an illusion of control.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by AKcrab:
Don't you mean pacifists, like that Jesus dude?

Tell that to the merchants he forcably kicked out of the temple.

[wdlove]

I support President Bush, know that he will do the correct thing. Prefer to live in the America that I grew up into, that my Dad, Mother, & father-in-law fought for. That country is slipping away if we don't fight for her! I'm referring the pacifists/liberals/socialist that would prefer the UN control the world!

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by wdlove:
I support President Bush, know that he will do the correct thing. Prefer to live in the America that I grew up into, that my Dad, Mother, & father-in-law fought for. That country is slipping away if we don't fight for her! I'm referring the pacifists/liberals/socialist that would prefer the UN control the world!

There will be a NWO soon enough. The pacifists/liberals/socialist will have their socialistic Gov that controls all things. There will be peace and prosperity.

Then the **** will hit the fan.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by Zimphire:
There will be a NWO soon enough. The pacifists/liberals/socialist will have their socialistic Gov that controls all things. There will be peace and prosperity.

But of course.

[Mastrap]

Originally posted by wdlove:
I'm referring the pacifists/liberals/socialist that would prefer the UN control the world!

Wow. Ignorant stement of the week. Witch hunt anyone?

[theolein]

Originally posted by wdlove:
I support President Bush, know that he will do the correct thing. Prefer to live in the America that I grew up into, that my Dad, Mother, & father-in-law fought for. That country is slipping away if we don't fight for her! I'm referring the pacifists/liberals/socialist that would prefer the UN control the world!

Wow, how convenient to bunch em up into one compact package like that. Perhaps they're even available in family packs at the mall.

[wulf]

Just got back from the London (UK) protest. The estimates of numbers attending range from 750,000 (police estimate) to over 1,500,000 (organisers' estimate). Bearing in mind that the former will usually be conservative and the latter an exaggeration, that could mean ~1.2 million people. That's about 2% of the total UK population.

If you think about it, that's quite a significant proportion to actually congregate in one place to make their views heard (polls suggest that fewer than one out of every ten Britons believe it would be right for the country to take part in a war against Iraq without the UN passing a new resolution in favour of it).

People here are are not convinced of the case for war. If a more compelling case were made, perhaps more people would support it.

Oh and theolin, .

[Zimphire]

Too bad the war is going to happen anyhow.

I hope you guys didn't get TOO cold for nothing.

[Zimphire]

Originally posted by Mastrap:
But of course.

No This is the only crystal ball I need.