[hcorf]

errrm.........no

[osxpinot]

What's the point of having a mac if you boot into a Windows virtual machine to run your apps?

I admit, Wine is different, but even with Wine, it kills the touted OS X user experience.

[starwxrwx]

Originally Posted by hcorf

errrm.........no

wow, thats so wierd.

i SWEAR I read somewhere that the next ver would be 10.6 but after a quick search I can't find anything.

I just remember thinking it was a dumb decision... maybe I gotta stop reading zany rumors sites

[mishakim]

Originally Posted by krove

NetBooting provides this functionality, but I think it is an all-or-none solution. All Apple would need to do it add on support for serving Applications off a server similar to netbooting without serving the whole operating system. Right?

Not really - netbooting uses the resources of the remote/client computer to run the OS and Apps. Just serving the apps is already possible with appleshare or any other remote volume protocol (mount volume, run app), but again , uses the client's CPU, memory, etc. A citrix-like functionality would run the program on the remote server, with only the GUI appearing on the client.

NeXT had this, but my understanding it that it was part of DisplayPostscript and no equivilant was included when they switched to Quartz.

[zioncity]

Originally Posted by mac15

It would also make developer's lazy, why spend money porting a Mac OS X application if you could use the Windows version through WINE?

People will port to OS X for the OS X experience... Plus... would you ignore a growing market share... More and more folks buy a mac for it being a OS X operating system. Who cares what chip it runs as long as it is fast...

[dweebert]

Originally Posted by juanvaldes

RSOD = Hardware failure that is VERY VERY bad and as I recall is/has been in the NT line since inception.

I understand the RSOD indicates that the video card has failed.

[ShotgunEd]

If the video card has failed how can it display a RSOD?

[Big Mac]

Originally Posted by starwxrwx

wow, thats so wierd.

i SWEAR I read somewhere that the next ver would be 10.6 but after a quick search I can't find anything.

I just remember thinking it was a dumb decision... maybe I gotta stop reading zany rumors sites

Yeah, you must have read it on CARs. Apple skipping a tenth to 10.6 after four consistent releases would be even crazier than Mactels sounded before this month.

[radii_22]

Originally Posted by krove

Maybe we'll actually see a Cocoa-based finder, or at least an implementation that doesn't suck so much.

My guesses :

1. A completely new Finder, with a cool name like Finder Extreme... I imagine something very creative like an almost 3d interface, preferences for every window in their back (like widgets), real 3d Z axis and shadows. For the functionality, I hope they improve the side bar, the contextual help, and the overall speed. And no more brushed metal, a new theme (Winduwi is going to rip the brushed metal theme, anyway)

2. Exposé 2 : Similarly, an exposé 3D, where you can navigate and rearrange windows in a simulated 3D space.

[ltmajgensgtsir]

Originally Posted by krove

This is 100% wrong! (emphasis mine) Without emulation of the Windows API (from WINE, for example) no windows application will "just run" under Mac OS X on intel.

Just because an application is compiled to run on x86, it still contains OS-specific APIs that tie it to a particular platform. This is why we will still have Mac-specific versions of Adobe and M$ software.

That is not to say that all the dumb sales people at stores like Circuit city, best buy, etc will not confuse this to death and run their customers away with MS Windows for their Mac on Intel box.

what does W.I.N.E. stand for

Wine is not an emulator. no emulation is done. it uses the intel processor along with a windows like tool box to run the apps.

[madmanXwater]

It's interesting to read this thread. I think as developers and "high-end" users, it's very easy to forget how emerged we are in the nut's and bolts of the industry. We tend to over-analyze everything, and I think we are worrying way too much about this topic. Apple and the Mac have been able to survive big transitions before and I don’t see this as any different, it’s likely less of a hurdle. Having “Intel Inside” may even ad credibility for first time users and “switchers”.

How many of the 16-million iPod customers do you think know or care what kind of CPU is in their iPod? How many people, outside of developers and techno-geeks even know what WINE is? People purchase and like Macs because they are Macs! Not Windows boxes! You can’t just say, “use the Windows version and be happy”, it’s not that simple.

As Macintosh users, I think we should take pride in our choice and try to promote a positive attitude towards this transition instead of doom and gloom. The more we can do to uplift the Mac to all we have contact with, the better our platform will be and the stronger the user-base will become. Think Different!

Mike

[krove]

Originally Posted by ltmajgensgtsir

what does W.I.N.E. stand for

Wine is not an emulator. no emulation is done. it uses the intel processor along with a windows like tool box to run the apps.

Yeah, I mispoke.... What do you call WINE then when it is running on a different OS under the same processor architecture? Comaptibility Layer?

Still, my point was that many people (here and elsewhere) assume that just because OS X will now run on Intel, we automatically get compatibility with tens of thousands of applications compiled using Windows APIs. Someone should start a website that dispels this misnomers.

[ltmajgensgtsir]

Originally Posted by krove

Yeah, I mispoke.... What do you call WINE then when it is running on a different OS under the same processor architecture? Comaptibility Layer?

Still, my point was that many people (here and elsewhere) assume that just because OS X will now run on Intel, we automatically get compatibility with tens of thousands of applications compiled using Windows APIs. Someone should start a website that dispels this misnomers.

what if...

wine for the mac

maybe then?
-"MINE" for windows?
-"LINE" for windows? (which of course we would have no need for thanks to X11

applications would just be written then in the API of the programmers choice without much thought of who would be using them.

the question then, is, "what platform do developers want to write programs in?"

Apple should sell to developers, because if they do users will follow... I hope.

[furrylogic]

Here is my feature wishlist for 10.5:

1. Cluster computing for the masses
I would like to have the power of cluster computing be something that every single person who sits on a network can take advantage of. New Macs come with Gigabit Ethernet standard, so networking is becoming less of a bottleneck. Instead of tossing out an old computer, you just add another CPU to the network to increase your overall power. The average office work uses so little of the processing power that they should lend that out to the other colleagues. A G5 iMac being used for word processing is hardly going to tap out the computer power that it can offer.

2. Microsoft Exchange killer (10.5 Server)
The most important application that I have had to live with is Exchange/Outlook. I have usually had an extra PC at my desk just to deal with email and calendaring. Apple could and should develop a better enterprise application and give the client apps out for free. With OS X we already get Mail, Calendar and Address Book. They just need to make pro versions and port them to Windows.

3. Buy Adobe and integrate like MS
MS has a killer combination of MS Windows and MS Office. Apple could do the same with OS X and Adobe CS. Additionally, the OS level integration of PostScript (not a reversed engineered version) and Flash, along with CoreVideo, CoreGraphics and CoreAudio would mean that all of the applications from Adobe would now be uniquely fast on OS X.

4. Transparent FTP
Apple started to integrate FTP functionality and never really got it right. any FTP server should be able to be mounted like any other server on a LAN.

5. Teamwork-centric features for file sharing
I would love to be able to "check-out" a directory from a server and work on it while I am travelling. However, I want it to be shown on my computer as "checked-out", rather than having to have it appear as a copy. What I mean is that my computer would automatically recognize when I am back in the office and then synchronise my changes and remove any data from my computer. While I am travelling I should be able to find everything on a virtualised network directory. Really killer would be to have my computer in 2-way communication with my server while I am travelling and mark anything that I edit as checked out and inaccessible. Similarly, I could see when a colleagues edits something. This would be done through a sending very small data back and forth. The old technolgy in pagers would have been ideal for this. But, without that my computer could try all other network every time it senses a physical or wireless network. Maybe even by SMS.

6. Killer Screensavers (Dashboard + OpenGL + Flash)
Whatever happened to all of the fun screensavers that started with flying toasters? If it were easy to develop screensavers (a la Dashboard), then I think that we could see some more creativity here. Of course I would like to have some 3D and Flash capabilities added.

that's it for now.

[Big Mac]

Originally Posted by furrylogic

Here is my feature wishlist for 10.5:

1. Cluster computing for the masses
I would like to have the power of cluster computing be something that every single person who sits on a network can take advantage of. New Macs come with Gigabit Ethernet standard, so networking is becoming less of a bottleneck. Instead of tossing out an old computer, you just add another CPU to the network to increase your overall power. The average office work uses so little of the processing power that they should lend that out to the other colleagues. A G5 iMac being used for word processing is hardly going to tap out the computer power that it can offer.

2. Microsoft Exchange killer (10.5 Server)
The most important application that I have had to live with is Exchange/Outlook. I have usually had an extra PC at my desk just to deal with email and calendaring. Apple could and should develop a better enterprise application and give the client apps out for free. With OS X we already get Mail, Calendar and Address Book. They just need to make pro versions and port them to Windows.

3. Buy Adobe and integrate like MS
MS has a killer combination of MS Windows and MS Office. Apple could do the same with OS X and Adobe CS. Additionally, the OS level integration of PostScript (not a reversed engineered version) and Flash, along with CoreVideo, CoreGraphics and CoreAudio would mean that all of the applications from Adobe would now be uniquely fast on OS X.

4. Transparent FTP
Apple started to integrate FTP functionality and never really got it right. any FTP server should be able to be mounted like any other server on a LAN.

5. Teamwork-centric features for file sharing
I would love to be able to "check-out" a directory from a server and work on it while I am travelling. However, I want it to be shown on my computer as "checked-out", rather than having to have it appear as a copy. What I mean is that my computer would automatically recognize when I am back in the office and then synchronise my changes and remove any data from my computer. While I am travelling I should be able to find everything on a virtualised network directory. Really killer would be to have my computer in 2-way communication with my server while I am travelling and mark anything that I edit as checked out and inaccessible. Similarly, I could see when a colleagues edits something. This would be done through a sending very small data back and forth. The old technolgy in pagers would have been ideal for this. But, without that my computer could try all other network every time it senses a physical or wireless network. Maybe even by SMS.

6. Killer Screensavers (Dashboard + OpenGL + Flash)
Whatever happened to all of the fun screensavers that started with flying toasters? If it were easy to develop screensavers (a la Dashboard), then I think that we could see some more creativity here. Of course I would like to have some 3D and Flash capabilities added.

that's it for now.

Terrific first post! And I especially like your fifth idea.

[technohedz]

Analyst, "Apple is dying"
Apple, "Check out OS 9"
Analyst, "Apple is dying"
Developer, 'All these people keep buying my Mac applications. Might as well keep making them"
Analyst, "Apple is dying"
Apple, "We're switching to OS X"
Anal...
Developer, 'Hmnn... So, ALL of the people who switched from OS 9 to Mac OS X COULD HAVE switched to windows and didn't. They even switched at 10.1 or the beta. I wonder why...let's ask the user?"
Fanatic, "Steve Jobs is GOD, Apple rules, Bill Gates is the devil"
User, "Mac OS X allows me to be more productive, is more secure, and stable. My grandmother can use it, bioinformatics and statisticians can use it, DTP and multimedia professionals can use it; and they all do."
Developer, "Well what if we just drop our apps for Mac OS X, then will you use an inferior product'
Apple, "You know we like make that thing called Final Cut..and some audio stuff you might have heard about. We do acquire companies and make products we don't release...*cough* unless we need to. People actually use things like..oh let me think.. keynote instead of that other presentation software..and of course we have a lot of other things we could throw out...
Developer, (interupting), 'well if you're going to be like that, then why don't we just drop all our products so you have to put everything out and then we'll see that you can't compete'
Apple, '...as we were saying...a lot of other things we could throw out..just like Microsoft'
Developer, 'ok so is that a threat'
Apple, 'no, people want to buy your Applications. Mac users pay for software and you make a lot of money from them. They didn't switch before and now there are more of them. We just have the resources to make the entire Macintosh experience *cringe at the xperience thing* the best possible thing on any computer (regardless of processor)'
Developer, 'cool.. I think I'll check the 'just in case box' and make a grip of money'
Trolls, 'but since it's on intel why not run windows binaries'
Users, Apple, and Developer, 'Because windows SUCKS'
Trolls, 'well then how about porting the API's'
Apple, 'Have you heard of intellectual property? How about we just give microsoft the source code to Mac OS X on Intel and an agreement to license it for free?'
Trolls, 'But that's monopolistic'
Apple, 'No, we hold back a lot of competing technology unless the competition is worse. They hold back better products and have a stranglehold on the market. People buy macs because they WANT TO.'
Trolls, 'but the windows API's ported to Mac OS X would be cool...but they would run slower because of the security trade offs, or make the mac less secure'
Developer, 'no you idiot, that's just how windows is coded. The security initiative was a nice smokescreen to pretend that progress was happening with longhorn; while m$ was waiting to add all the features from Mac OS X in a poorly implemented manner. If Apple was to port the API's they would limit then and make sure anything that was ported worked w/o a security risk.'
Apple, '...well..if...we did that..we'd do it faster as well.'
Bridge collapses on troll.

[leperkuhn]

Originally Posted by furrylogic

Here is my feature wishlist for 10.5:

3. Buy Adobe and integrate like MS
MS has a killer combination of MS Windows and MS Office. Apple could do the same with OS X and Adobe CS. Additionally, the OS level integration of PostScript (not a reversed engineered version) and Flash, along with CoreVideo, CoreGraphics and CoreAudio would mean that all of the applications from Adobe would now be uniquely fast on OS X.

yeah, that would be pretty ridiculous. of course, adobe does a lot more than creative suite. check out their full portfolio, they make like 30 apps.

5. Teamwork-centric features for file sharing
I would love to be able to "check-out" a directory from a server and work on it while I am travelling. However, I want it to be shown on my computer as "checked-out", rather than having to have it appear as a copy. What I mean is that my computer would automatically recognize when I am back in the office and then synchronise my changes and remove any data from my computer. While I am travelling I should be able to find everything on a virtualised network directory. Really killer would be to have my computer in 2-way communication with my server while I am travelling and mark anything that I edit as checked out and inaccessible. Similarly, I could see when a colleagues edits something. This would be done through a sending very small data back and forth. The old technolgy in pagers would have been ideal for this. But, without that my computer could try all other network every time it senses a physical or wireless network. Maybe even by SMS.

integrated SVN/CVS is what you want. but you can install it and make it accessible over webdav.. so it's pretty much available to you, for free. and by putting it in the OS you have to rely on apple to push out the updates. you can also have it work over SSH, and use the existing security of OS X to regulate the users. I just set up SVN a few weeks ago, and i love it. It also keeps track of changes and lets you compare changes made by different people. (not sure how well it would work in a word file, that has all sorts of weird stuff going on inside it)

http://subversion.tigris.org/

[VoicesInMyHead]

How about a version of iChat that doesn't have ten thousand glitches and just works??? Seriously, what's wrong with iChat AV 3? It plain sucks. I switched to tiger, and now I long for iChat 2......

[vsurfer]

Originally Posted by martman

Tiger works flawlessly in my world, which was a bit of a surprise since I run a gamut of test beds rtanging from a 400 Mhz iMac, to a 700 Mhz iBook, an 800 Mhz Cube, and a 1.66 Ghz Powerbook. The window redraws on the 400 Mhz iMac are in particular, suprisingly quick.

Ditto, I have a G5 and G4 and G3 400 iMac with extra RAM all running Panther (I'm in no hurry to shift to Tiger) and the performance on the G3 is startling, considering conventional wisdom says it should be nearing the scrap heap by now. So much for conventional wisdom I guess.

The G5 badly needs a RAM upgrade, the G4 has a gig, and the G3 only 320, but that seems to do it. The G3 also has a 7200 WD caviar drive which helps somewhat when the HD is involved.

[cc_foo]

I’d like FileVault to not encrypt the entire Home folder. Rather encrypt individual user-selected folders only.

[Big Mac]

Originally Posted by cc_foo

I’d like FileVault to not encrypt the entire Home folder. Rather encrypt individual user-selected folders only.

Then turn off FileVault and make your own encrypted disk images to hold specific folders.