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Radioflyer · Oct 18, 2009, 01:18 PM

Hi:

Our Macbook battery is dead. We've ordered a replacement but was wondering if anyone can shed some light on possible causes. The last time I checked "About My Mac" everything appeared to be OK. I might have left the Macbook asleep and put it away but then I would expect the computer would recognize it was running out of power and shutdown thereby preserving the battery.

Thanks in advance for your advise.

Cold Warrior · Oct 18, 2009, 01:23 PM

How old is your battery? How many charge cycles did it have? These things only have a certain lifespan. Some are just defective, too.

Radioflyer · Oct 18, 2009, 03:14 PM

The computer is a couple of years old and this is the original battery, from the Battery Information ....

Charge information:
- Charge remaining: 0
- Fully Charged: NO
- Charging: NO
Health Information:
- Cycle count: 170
- Condition: Replace Now
Battery Installed: Yes

Did I cause this to happen?

EndlessMac · Oct 18, 2009, 03:37 PM

Originally Posted by Radioflyer

I might have left the Macbook asleep and put it away but then I would expect the computer would recognize it was running out of power and shutdown thereby preserving the battery.

How long did you let it sleep for and how much battery power did you have left when doing so? Sleeping shouldn't cause your battery to die but batteries don't like being left at low charge for long periods of time. Actually I've been told that if you store a battery at empty charge then it can lose it's ability to recharge ever again no matter how new the battery is. The recommendation for storing a battery is to have it at half charge but even a full charge is better than low battery charge.

My PowerBook is roughly 5 years old and it still has the original battery. It doesn't last as many hours as when it was new but it still holds a charge and it works perfectly fine so it might come down to how a person takes care of their battery. Here is what Apple says about battery care.

turtle777 · Oct 18, 2009, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by Radioflyer

The computer is a couple of years old and this is the original battery, from the Battery Information ....

Charge information:
- Charge remaining: 0
- Fully Charged: NO
- Charging: NO
Health Information:
- Cycle count: 170
- Condition: Replace Now
Battery Installed: Yes

Did I cause this to happen?

That's actually not too high of a charge cycle count.

According to Apple:

Battery Lifespan
For Apple notebooks with removable batteries — such as previous generation MacBook and MacBook Pro computers — a properly maintained battery is designed to retain up to 80% of its original capacity at 300 full charge and discharge cycles. You may choose to replace your battery when it no longer holds sufficient charge to meet your needs.

So, from that I'd take your battery has a problem.

-t

Radioflyer · Oct 19, 2009, 10:32 AM

Originally Posted by EndlessMac

How long did you let it sleep for and how much battery power did you have left when doing so?

Maybe three weeks, maybe a month, not sure. The battery might have had a full to 3/4 charge. Thanks for the link to Apple's battery care, a lot of good information there.

acoustix · Oct 19, 2009, 10:25 PM

There were a bunch of defective batteries from around that time. I ran mine flat once and that was it, the computer showed an "X" like there was no battery in it, got it replaced free of charge on a battery replacement program.

Eriamjh · Oct 22, 2009, 05:03 PM

Download XBattery and you can see some battery info.

EndlessMac · Oct 22, 2009, 05:40 PM

Originally Posted by Radioflyer

Maybe three weeks, maybe a month, not sure. The battery might have had a full to 3/4 charge. Thanks for the link to Apple's battery care, a lot of good information there.

If you left it in sleep mode then that would have drained the battery and then leaving the battery drained for days probably was what killed it. It's either that or your battery was bad from the start. Rechargeable batteries seem to like being used so if you are not using them for an extended period of time be sure to store them properly at 50% charge and the right temperatures. It's also recommended that you take out the batteries too. That's why I've heard that you should check how long a new battery has been sitting on the shelf before buying.

AnnoyedWithApple · Nov 7, 2009, 10:52 AM

Hi
I've got the exact same problem. I closed the lid on my MacBook and left it for about a week and a few days, and now it won't charge at all. Mine's done 177 cycles.
I phone apple and they said it was a "duff battery" and to go to and apple store - so I did.
I've been to see an apple "genius" at the apple store in blue water (UK). He told me the battery was dead (thanks genius) and that I could buy a new battery for £97 or go away. It's not really what I'd call great customer support considering how much I paid for the computer. My friend left his dell in standby for over a month and his works fine. Why does an apple battery fail when a dell is fine? (plus they're the same kind of battery - lithium ion)

It's obviously not just me - if you google around, loads of people have the exact same problem it's even posted as a review on apple's website... What I'm most annoyed about is that apple concluded it was my fault and got rid of me, without even really listening to what caused the problem.

I don't think I'll buy another apple product again - it's not worth the money... Really I expected better.

RevEvs · Nov 7, 2009, 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by AnnoyedWithApple

Hi
I've got the exact same problem. I closed the lid on my MacBook and left it for about a week and a few days, and now it won't charge at all. Mine's done 177 cycles.
I phone apple and they said it was a "duff battery" and to go to and apple store - so I did.
I've been to see an apple "genius" at the apple store in blue water (UK). He told me the battery was dead (thanks genius) and that I could buy a new battery for £97 or go away. It's not really what I'd call great customer support considering how much I paid for the computer. My friend left his dell in standby for over a month and his works fine. Why does an apple battery fail when a dell is fine? (plus they're the same kind of battery - lithium ion)

It's obviously not just me - if you google around, loads of people have the exact same problem it's even posted as a review on apple's website... What I'm most annoyed about is that apple concluded it was my fault and got rid of me, without even really listening to what caused the problem.

I don't think I'll buy another apple product again - it's not worth the money... Really I expected better.

If you have under 300 cycles Apple usually just give you a new battery for free. I'd try giving apple care a ring or trying a different 'genius'. They are usually pretty good - for me they swapped my battery with no questions asked, i was on around 200+ cycles. for my brother they have given him 2 new iPhones no questions asked, even out of warranty. so i'm voting for a bad 'genius'.

AKcrab · Nov 7, 2009, 03:12 PM

There is a test that service providers run that gives one of 3 results:
Good
Consumed
Failed

If your battery is "consumed" you will be asked to buy a new one, regardless of warranty status.
If your battery is "failed", it will be replaced if under warranty, or you will be asked to buy a new one if out of warranty.

amazing · Nov 7, 2009, 08:33 PM

Yes, that seems like a low cycle count.

So, if you're close to an Apple Store, or if you're going on vacation over the upcoming holidays to a city that has an Apple Store, take the laptop in, with the defective battery, and see what the Genius says--it may well be that you'll get a replacement battery. Also, did you buy the additional Applecare? If so, you could try calling the 800-number...

It's worth a try!

Simon · Nov 8, 2009, 04:09 AM

Batteries are explicitly exempt from Apple Care.

However, with that low cycle count it's evident your battery has failed. Within the original 12-month warranty Apple will replace it for free. Call them or go to an Apple Store and give them your date of purchase, the cycle count, and the remaining full charge capacity (can be found in System Profiler).

turtle777 · Nov 8, 2009, 05:26 AM

Originally Posted by AnnoyedWithApple

Hi
I've got the exact same problem. I closed the lid on my MacBook and left it for about a week and a few days, and now it won't charge at all. Mine's done 177 cycles.

How did you pay for the MB ? I hope you used a credit card.

If so, call them. Most cards have a free purchase protection plan that would cover these kind of items.

-t

AnnoyedWithApple · Nov 8, 2009, 08:56 AM

I think I did pay by card.

The trouble seems to be that it's out of warranty and I didn't get apple care. I'm going to try emailing customer support or visiting a different apple store. Maybe I'll get some where ...

other than that I'll try the credit card idea or if that fails I'll just buy a new battery. Thanks for the advice.

I you think of anything else... I'm listening

Thanks. Appreciated

JoshuaZ · Nov 11, 2009, 01:15 AM

Originally Posted by AKcrab

There is a test that service providers run that gives one of 3 results:
Good
Consumed
Failed

If your battery is "consumed" you will be asked to buy a new one, regardless of warranty status.
If your battery is "failed", it will be replaced if under warranty, or you will be asked to buy a new one if out of warranty.

I had that happen to me twice, battery failed.

I went to the Apple Store in my city. Twice. Got new batteries and the second time I got a new charger.

Very nice.

amazing · Nov 11, 2009, 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by JoshuaZ

I had that happen to me twice, battery failed.

I went to the Apple Store in my city. Twice. Got new batteries and the second time I got a new charger.

Very nice.

Yes, batteries are consumables and not covered by Applecare, but WOW! isn't it wonderful when some compassionate Genius replaces a battery for free! Not once, but twice, plus a new charger!

Hurrah, Apple Geniuses!

JoshuaZ · Nov 11, 2009, 09:04 PM

Well my story goes like so.

Just shy of one year after I got my computer it dies. It doesn't lose a bit of charge, it dies. When it got down to 70% power the computer would shut off. This with only 30 cycles. So while back in Milwaukee I went to one of the apple stores. The first guy gave me the run around and told me to come back in a week. So I did, and the second guy took all of 30 seconds to decide to give me a new battery. Awesome.

Well... one year later the EXACT same thing was happening. Again, with under 40 cycles. So I go to the Apple Store in Milwaukee (a different one from before). They run a test on the battery and it comes up "BAD" in the red. So they give me a new battery and a new charger, just to be on the safe side.

Good old Applecare combined with a one year warranty on batteries. Just remember, if your battery is under a year old and is actually "bad" then have it checked at Apple. The worst they could say is "no" and the best that could happen is you get a new battery. Always a bonus.

macfix · Nov 14, 2009, 05:04 PM

If you aren't able to get yours replaced like JoshuaZ, I have a brand new Apple macbook white battery still in sealed packaging. It's Model A1185.
Compatible with 13" white or black macbook. (but it's white in color)
From Apple, it's $129.
This is genuine Apple product, not a knock-off.
$95 shipped

Eriamjh · Nov 14, 2009, 05:08 PM

When a battery has some high percentage of charge and then suddenly dies, that means one internal cell or more is dead. The voltage drop is instantaneous and so the computer shuts down. No amount of calibration can account for this problem. The battery is defective and should be replaced.

It's always a good idea to use your batteries as much as you can because you never know when they will die. No one has been able to tell me if dead cells occur because of too much use, age, or both.

JoshuaZ · Nov 25, 2009, 10:09 PM

Apple just replaced the battery on my wife's computer. For free.

She replaced her original two year old battery with a new one last winter, and now that one is having all sorts of problems just shy of 1 year of usage. It keeps going from 40% to 2% instantly.

So Apple Japan is sending her a new one. Beats buying a new battery.

Simon · Nov 26, 2009, 04:41 AM

Great news. Kudos to Apple for doing the right thing.

AnnoyedWithApple · Nov 28, 2009, 10:58 AM

I dunno what countries you guys are in – but it sounds like your doing ok with Apple. I’m in the UK and Apple still can’t help me – it’s £100 for a new battery and really that’s £100 I don’t need to spend. (Plus why is it more expensive here than in the USA?)

Since its Christmas I figured people would be looking for presents so I’ve sold my macBook second hand and washed my hands of the whole affair – getting a dell to replace it.

Thanks for your help (it’s more than Apple gave me) I hope you have better luck with your Apple products than I did. I won’t be buying any of their products again…

Andy8 · Nov 28, 2009, 11:05 AM

Originally Posted by AnnoyedWithApple

(Plus why is it more expensive here than in the USA?)

Taxes.

Wiskedjak · Nov 28, 2009, 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by JoshuaZ

Just shy of one year after I got my computer it dies. It doesn't lose a bit of charge, it dies. When it got down to 70% power the computer would shut off. This with only 30 cycles.

How do you go a year with only 30 cycles? Seems like, for me, I'm chewing up 150 cycles within a year.

Simon · 12:40 PM

Originally Posted by AnnoyedWithApple

(Plus why is it more expensive here than in the USA?)

Complain to your politicians rather than to Apple. You could have joined Euro-land long ago. Now your economy and currency are in such a state of crap you'll be playing catch-up for years to come. Weak currency and high VAT are what's causing the disparity. Nothing Apple can do for you there. Good luck with the Dell. It's also more expensive than in the US. For the very same reason I might add.

AnnoyedWithApple · Nov 28, 2009, 09:26 PM

I don’t want to sound too rude or stroppy in this post and please do not take this to be directed at you (you guys have been really helpful) – I merely want to express my frustration with Apple.

My complaint to Apple is not that of cost, but of quality and respect for customers. It’s about what you get for your money and I don’t feel I got anything near £800 worth from my MacBook. I don’t expect what was frankly a very expensive laptop just to die on me because I let it go flat. (I wouldn’t say it’s unreasonable to let a rechargeable battery go flat)
Equally I don’t expect to go to an Apple store with my laptop and be told that it’s somehow my fault the battery died. The battery failed – the genius in the shop said so himself. Now I don’t see how anything I could have done would cause the battery to ‘fail’. Apple have no interest in trying to solve my problem all they wanted to do was sell me a new battery and Apple Care (which wouldn’t have covered the fault anyway) – and I’m sorry I’ve never had this problem with any other company.

When my xbox got the red rings – Microsoft fixed it without question (plus it was well out of warranty) - they even paid to ship it to Germany where the repair shop is

I have a Samsung monitor – that randomly stopped working and Samsung replaced that without question twice.

Why should I turn out another £100 to Apple to replace something that shouldn’t have failed in the first place? I can’t say that dell will be any better, but Apple has destroyed the glossy shiny image I had of their company for good with their lack of customer support and poor product quality. I still don’t even know why my battery has died - my best guess is an electrical fault. I really expected more...

I don’t think I’ve been majorly unreasonable to Apple?

AKcrab · Nov 28, 2009, 09:44 PM

Originally Posted by AnnoyedWithApple

The battery failed – the genius in the shop said so himself. Now I don’t see how anything I could have done would cause the battery to ‘fail’. Apple have no interest in trying to solve my problem all they wanted to do was sell me a new battery and Apple Care (which wouldn’t have covered the fault anyway) – and I’m sorry I’ve never had this problem with any other company.

Something is not adding up. If you were still able to buy Apple Care, then you were still within your one-year warranty and the battery would have been covered if it was defective. The only explanation that fits your scenario is that the battery had been consumed. All batteries have a lifespan, there is nothing Apple can do about that.

AnnoyedWithApple · 10:17 AM

Ok… That’s news to me I was under the impression I could still buy Apple Care – obviously not then. – ignore me (that would be the part that doesn't add up)
The genius in the store said there was no way Apple could replace my battery because it would be ‘unfair to Apple Care customers’ – how? If Apple Care wouldn’t have replaced it anyway. I took that to mean if I had bought Apple Care he’d be prepared to talk to me. Even then why should it matter? I didn't have insurance on my xbox or monitor...

The laptop is out of warranty (near on two years old now) with very little use and the battery is defective. Before I let the battery go flat it had a very good run time. There was absolutely nothing wrong with it before.

I really wouldn’t be so sore about it if Apple would at least explain why it happened… I don’t like complaining to them – but I feel as if I’ve just been ignored. I dunno. I'm really tired of this whole problem now - I wish it had never happened.

JoshuaZ · Nov 29, 2009, 10:37 PM

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak

How do you go a year with only 30 cycles? Seems like, for me, I'm chewing up 150 cycles within a year.

Easy. I either use it at my desk at home, or use it at my desk at the office, or use it at a desk at one of my schools. I always plug in. The 30 cycles was also because I regularly let it run down once a month as well....

As for what country I'm in, my batteries were both replaced in the US. My wife just had her battery replaced by Apple Japan. They were even super nice to send it to her in the mail. Called Monday night, new battery Wednesday night.

EndlessMac · Nov 30, 2009, 02:57 AM

Originally Posted by JoshuaZ

I always plug in. The 30 cycles was also because I regularly let it run down once a month as well....

Maybe the constant plugging in is causing your problems and with only 30 cycles in a year it sounds like you leave it plugged in for long periods of time. Apple doesn't recommend leaving your laptop plugged in all the time.

My PowerBook is about 6 years old now and I still have the original battery and it still holds a charge. I never leave it plugged in all the time.

Battery care instructions from Apple: Apple - Batteries - Notebooks

Originally Posted by Apple website

For proper maintenance of a lithium-based battery, it’s important to keep the electrons in it moving occasionally. Apple does not recommend leaving your portable plugged in all the time. An ideal use would be a commuter who uses her MacBook Pro on the train, then plugs it in at the office to charge. This keeps the battery juices flowing. If on the other hand, you use a desktop computer at work, and save a notebook for infrequent travel, Apple recommends charging and discharging its battery at least once per month.