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Hope For Future of Firewire (Page 2)
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Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2000
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I thought it was royalty free now, but you're probably right.
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"The natural progress of things is for liberty to yield and government to gain ground." TJ
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Professional Poster
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Originally Posted by Lateralus
The reason Apple went USB on the iPods is that USB controllers are available in much smaller sizes that consume less power than FireWire controllers. And the moment they decided that they would be putting effort into making the iPod as small as possible, FireWire was one of the first things that had to go.
True enough but Apple should have spent all the money they were making into making firewire smaller and cheaper then.
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Addicted to MacNN
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But why would they want to? USB works great for the iPod.
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Sep 2001
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Because settling for something lesser isn't always the the best option?
Some people do actually care about such things.
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I like chicken
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Meow Mix, Meow Mix
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Addicted to MacNN
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But it isn't a question of less or more, it's a question of what is the best trade-off for that application. Larger form factor and more power use as well as higher cost for a bit faster transfer and much less compatibility just isn't a good trade off.
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Posting Junkie
Join Date: Nov 1999
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All I know is that my Firewire equipped iPod updates much faster than both my roomate's USB 2.0 iPods.
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Fine, but how much faster, really? I mean how many people have updates of more than a few meg at any time? Given that your ipod is not usable with the vast majority of the computers that iPod owners use, there would still have to be a USB version. The benefit of slight time savings in updates just isn't worth the cost.
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Moderator Emeritus
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Originally Posted by peeb
But it isn't a question of less or more, it's a question of what is the best trade-off for that application. Larger form factor and more power use as well as higher cost for a bit faster transfer and much less compatibility just isn't a good trade off.
I know, those are all points that I made.
But I think the larger point of the thread is that Apple could have done much better in making FireWire (their technology) that cheaper, smaller, less power hungry, compatible option.
And that, in essence, is a symptom of Apple's much larger issue. Apple was once a true technology company; pushing new and superior technologies on the market. SCSI, NuBus, FireWire, ADB, 68k, PowerPC, the Newton... the list goes on.
FireWire is one of the last of those technologies that Apple hasn't completely turned it back on yet.
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I like chicken
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Well, the cost, size and power consumption are a result of the processor on board. That is what gives it it's performance advantage - I just don't really think it could ever compete with the stripped down, cheaper and slower USB. It's for different applications, primarily where performance matters most - that's why it dominates in high end video, but not consumer cameras. I think that's ok really, I mean, they are different products, for different things.
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Professional Poster
Join Date: Feb 2007
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Originally Posted by peeb
But why would they want to? USB works great for the iPod.
Here is one tiny reason.... IT DOESN'T ****ING CHARGE THE IPOD WHEN THE COMPUTER IS OFF!
God I loved that about firewire.
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Not only that but charging my iPhone over USB takes about 5-6 hours... even through a hub. AC adapter takes 2 hours.
I am not sure if Firewire would be any better but I still hate that about USB charging.
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Posting Junkie
Join Date: Oct 2005
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From reading around the web (since I won't pay the 1394TA for the spec), it appears that S3200 keeps the same power insanity we've come to know and love with Firewire: unregulated voltage and no guaranteed power level. USB is low powered (0.5A@5V), but at least it's a known quantity.
Originally Posted by Kevin
Oh yeah the USB 2.0 iPods work. But not as fast as the FIreWire versions did at the time when they came out.
IIRC the final iPod revision that supported USB and FW was three times faster over USB (~7.5MBps) than FW (2.5MBps). This is a result of the small chipsets being slow with Firewire and size is Apple's priority for iPods rather than speed.
Originally Posted by Lateralus
And the fact that Apple still charges a 25 cent royalty for the inclusion of FireWire on any device certainly isn't helping adoption of it on the PC side. Even now, only higher-end PC motherboards come standard with it.
Didn't Apple drop that charge a few years back? First from $1 to 0.25, then to 0?
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Moderator Emeritus
Join Date: Sep 2001
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I'm under the impression that if the royalty was dropped at all (which I've had trouble finding confirmation on) it was only dropped on 400 and not 800.
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I like chicken
I like liver
Meow Mix, Meow Mix
Please de-liv-er
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Posting Junkie
Join Date: Mar 2001
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Originally Posted by mduell
From reading around the web (since I won't pay the 1394TA for the spec), it appears that S3200 keeps the same power insanity we've come to know and love with Firewire: unregulated voltage and no guaranteed power level. USB is low powered (0.5A@5V), but at least it's a known quantity.
Source please.
Originally Posted by mduell
IIRC the final iPod revision that supported USB and FW was three times faster over USB (~7.5MBps) than FW (2.5MBps). This is a result of the small chipsets being slow with Firewire and size is Apple's priority for iPods rather than speed.
Source please.
Originally Posted by mduell
Didn't Apple drop that charge a few years back? First from $1 to 0.25, then to 0?
Of all the things you pretend not to know...
V
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I could take Sean Connery in a fight... I could definitely take him.
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Posting Junkie
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Originally Posted by voodoo
Source please.
That Firewire doesn't require regulated voltage? Or has no minimum power requirement? That S3200 doesn't change this? Or that USB provides 0.5A@5V?
Originally Posted by voodoo
Source please.
CNet's review of the final USB+FW iPod revision.
Originally Posted by voodoo
Of all the things you pretend not to know...
I really don't know, and the Google results are too crowded with "zomgApplewants$1perport" from 2001.
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