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Shaktai · Mar 2, 2004, 03:28 AM

Originally posted by Scotttheking:
Finally got it working in linux CLI.
Never mind.

D2OL tends to like Linux. My linux box has been rock solid for quite some time. I think you'll like the results.

Scotttheking · 02:53 PM

The client sure takes a while to download work units. It's been going for around 45 mins and is only half way done. I've got a 150KB/sec net connection. Is it really that bandwidth intensive, or is their data server just on a slow link?

Another question: Will the client auto update itself if there's a new version out, and on that line, if it won't, will it need updates to be installed in order to keep crunching?

And another: How many tasks per day should I be expecting out of an xp2200? It's been going for 11 hours now and has done 37 tasks.

Shaktai · Mar 2, 2004, 09:39 PM

Originally posted by Scotttheking:
The client sure takes a while to download work units. It's been going for around 45 mins and is only half way done. I've got a 150KB/sec net connection. Is it really that bandwidth intensive, or is their data server just on a slow link?

Another question: Will the client auto update itself if there's a new version out, and on that line, if it won't, will it need updates to be installed in order to keep crunching?

And another: How many tasks per day should I be expecting out of an xp2200? It's been going for 11 hours now and has done 37 tasks.

It shouldn't take that long to download. Something must be amiss. Unless of course you specified the Max of 2000 work units to cache......

I don't think the Linux Client auto updates, but they just released 2.x recently with a whole new backend, and are just now taking suggestions on the forums for 2.5. Updates aren't needed very often, except to add features. If work units change, that is all handled on the server side, it doesn't impact the client. If a new client is released, it will probably not be a mandatory immediated update.

My Athlon 2400 (DDRam) averages aroung 110-120 a day, but it can vary dramatically, depending on the work units you get. I have gotten as few as 75 and as many as 224. You have to run about a week to really get a good average of what to expect.

A lot can depend on the mobo too. One 1900 averages around 55 to 65 and the other around 65 to 80, and may hit 90 or 100 on a good day. The slow one is SDRam with a cheap mobo, and the other is DDram with a much better mobo. My Celeron 1300 seems to be averaging 40-50 and my PowerMac 800 from 26-35.

Scotttheking · Mar 2, 2004, 09:46 PM

Originally posted by Shaktai:
It shouldn't take that long to download. Something must be amiss. Unless of course you specified the Max of 2000 work units to cache......

I don't think the Linux Client auto updates, but they just released 2.x recently with a whole new backend, and are just now taking suggestions on the forums for 2.5. Updates aren't needed very often, except to add features. If work units change, that is all handled on the server side, it doesn't impact the client. If a new client is released, it will probably not be a mandatory immediated update.

Ok. I'm just thinking of my secondary farm, where I can't just walk in and change the clients whenever I want.

My Athlon 2400 (DDRam) averages aroung 110-120 a day, but it can vary dramatically, depending on the work units you get. I have gotten as few as 75 and as many as 224. You have to run about a week to really get a good average of what to expect.

A lot can depend on the mobo too. One 1900 averages around 55 to 65 and the other around 65 to 80, and may hit 90 or 100 on a good day. The slow one is SDRam with a cheap mobo, and the other is DDram with a much better mobo. My Celeron 1300 seems to be averaging 40-50 and my PowerMac 800 from 26-35.

The motherboard is the proud recipient of the "It only cost me $29 award," so it's clearly not spectacular. It's got a decent, if older, chipset though. It uses DDR though. I'll be patient and give it a few days.

Another question: Can I run multiple instances on a linux box without any client changes?
And why does this darn thing launch 22 java threads?!?!?!?

Shaktai · Mar 3, 2004, 01:52 AM

Originally posted by Scotttheking:

Ok. I'm just thinking of my secondary farm, where I can't just walk in and change the clients whenever I want.

I wouldn't anticipate any major problems at this point. The change to v2.x was major, because they completely redesigned the back end, and the client from the ground up, to eliminate a lot of the problems, and to specifically allow smoother future transtitions.

The motherboard is the proud recipient of the "It only cost me $29 award," so it's clearly not spectacular. It's got a decent, if older, chipset though. It uses DDR though. I'll be patient and give it a few days.

My cheap one, is a "PC Chips" mobo and while stable it has less then stellar performance wise. My good one is an Asus.

Another question: Can I run multiple instances on a linux box without any client changes?
And why does this darn thing launch 22 java threads?!?!?!?

I've read about that (the multiple threads, but really don't know why. Might check the D2OL Linux forum. As far as I understand, you should be able to run multiple instances under. Worse thing that can happen is it would require you to register a new node.

Scotttheking · 02:38 AM

Free DC was getting a little boring, so I stopped by their forum

Looks like Chihlee@TAIWAN is a team you need to watch out for.

Shaktai · Mar 3, 2004, 11:58 PM

Originally posted by Scotttheking:
Free DC was getting a little boring, so I stopped by their forum

Looks like Chihlee@TAIWAN is a team you need to watch out for.

Yep, Chihlee@Taiwan is a definite threat along with Free DC, though it will take them both a little longer now.

2440 conformers on your first day huh? I'm gonna have to keep my eye on you.

Scotttheking · Mar 4, 2004, 12:11 AM

Originally posted by Shaktai:
2440 conformers on your first day huh? I'm gonna have to keep my eye on you.

Is that a lot?

Shaktai · 01:49 AM

Originally posted by Scotttheking:
Is that a lot?

For 2 boxes (what your profile shows) that is fairly good, for one it would be excellent. Not sure what you are running other then the 2200 you mentioned.

EDIT: uh oh! just noticed you dumped a bunch more, you are over 3700 for the first 24 hours. You must be running 2 boxes (that is good for the team).

Over the past week, we nearly matched Free DC on the average, so that is enough to take us over the top. Looks like hardCOREware has moved most if not all of their power over to Distributed Folding. We should be able to pass them for the #6 slot, before Chihlee@TAIWAN passes us if we can keep up the pace, and neither Chihlee@TAIWAN or FreeDC has a serious power-up.

I still hope to have a 3.0 ghz P4 online next week sometime. Not sure how well it will do on this project, but it ought to give us a little breathing room. Wish it could be a dual G5, but no way that is going to happen any time soon for me.

Scotttheking · Mar 4, 2004, 02:06 AM

I'll do my best not to threaten you in production

It's really just one box. Don't mind the other, it doesn't really do anything.

Shaktai · Mar 4, 2004, 02:14 AM

Originally posted by Scotttheking:
I'll do my best not to threaten you in production
It's really just one box. Don't mind the other, it doesn't really do anything.

If that is one box, you are making my 2400, look like a slug.

Scotttheking · Mar 4, 2004, 02:49 AM

Originally posted by Shaktai:
If that is one box, you are making my 2400, look like a slug.

The other is a Ti550, and it's only crunching a few hours a day, if that. I turned off the client on it, the fan was getting way too annoying for me. It's about time to put the 2200 back on fah *gestures at that pesky OneMacGuy a bit ahead of him*.

Shaktai · Mar 8, 2004, 08:55 AM

Our production is up to a point where Free DC and Riva station are no longer serious threats. However Chihlee@TAIWAN is still outproducing us by about 2700 candidates/56,000 conformers per week. (almost 380/7600 a day). It will still take them a while, but at that rate they will eventually catch us. We should take the #6 spot before that happens.

Scotttheking · Mar 9, 2004, 04:35 AM

Originally posted by Shaktai:
However Chihlee@TAIWAN is still outproducing us by about 2700 candidates/56,000 conformers per week. (almost 380/7600 a day). It will still take them a while, but at that rate they will eventually catch us.

Note to self: go to work.

How far out are they? If it's over 5 months...

Shaktai · Mar 9, 2004, 10:22 PM

Originally posted by Scotttheking:
Note to self: go to work.

How far out are they? If it's over 5 months...

Based upon current production, I estimate it is over 5 months, considering the difference in current totals. Of course if our production slides or theirs increases substantially, then anything could happen.

Scotttheking · Mar 10, 2004, 06:38 AM

Originally posted by Shaktai:
Of course if our production slides

Looks like you can't allow that to happen

I'm 4-5 months away from 250K in FAH. After that, no plans have yet been made.
*Hangs sign on door, "wake in 5 months"*

mikkyo · Mar 17, 2004, 04:54 PM

With some mild experimenting I've determined you can eek a little more out of D2OL if you have gobs of RAM by editing the Info.plist located in
SengentD2OL.app/Contents
which you can get to by Control Clicking on the app and choosing Show Package Contents.
You can drop the plist on TextEdit or use the Plist Editor if you have Developer Tools installed.
When you open the plist, down near the bottom are the java VMOptions.
What you care about looks like this:

Code:
&lt;string&gt;-Xms2M&lt;/string&gt;
&lt;string&gt;-Xmx128M&lt;/string&gt;

The Xms is the minimum RAM for Java, the Xmx is maximum RAM for Java.
If you remember our tweaks for Ubero, these were significant as Ubero was all Java.
D2OL is not all Java, but it seems to be faster so far after bumping these settings.
If you have a single processor machine and a Gig of RAM, try setting -Xms256M and -Xmx512M (you want to leave room for the OS and other apps to avoid VM paging which will slow everything down.
If you have a Dual Processor with 1 Gb RAM, use half those numbers (128/256).
If you have more RAM you can go higher, so a dual processor with 2Gb can have 512/768 and still have RAM left over for other stuff.
If you have a dedicated cruncher, you can probably get within about 128Mb free as long as you aren't using the machine at all.

As for results, only time will tell.
My stats have gone up over the last couple of days and I have only tweaked 3 machines (the others don't have enough RAM) and I haven't done anything else to the farm.
I have not tried bumping the minimum by a small amount on the machines that have little RAM, but I think the max is the big factor.
This may also work well on other platforms.

One of the other nice things is that when you click in the Dock to bring up the D2OL client, it is much snappier with the JVM getting more RAM.

Scotttheking · Mar 17, 2004, 06:49 PM

I'm not doing too well. I left one machine on it, and it's an xp2500. Even with that, I'm only doing 2000 points per day? Isn't that not much?

mikkyo · Mar 17, 2004, 07:41 PM

Sounds fine to me.
If you had ten of those machines, you'd be doing 20K a day, which is more than I do now, and I have more than 10 machines.

Shaktai · 10:25 PM

Originally posted by Scotttheking:
I'm not doing too well. I left one machine on it, and it's an xp2500. Even with that, I'm only doing 2000 points per day? Isn't that not much?

That is a pretty good average for a single machine, and you have a couple of days in there that are unusually low. Give it a few more days to even out. Is that machine being used for anything else over the past week?

Mikkyo, thanks for the tip. I'm going to give it a try on my PM 800 which has 512 mb ram and is fully dedicated right now. My current daily average is 27.3/546 on that box for seven days running, so I should be able to get an idea if it has any real impact in a few short days.

Scotttheking · Mar 18, 2004, 01:09 AM

Originally posted by Shaktai:
That is a pretty good average for a single machine, and you have a couple of days in there that are unusually low. Give it a few more days to even out. Is that machine being used for anything else over the past week?

It's just a file server, so it shouldn't be doing anything much. If that's all it can do, that's all it can do. Just wondering.

Shaktai · Mar 22, 2004, 03:37 AM

Originally posted by Scotttheking:
It's just a file server, so it shouldn't be doing anything much. If that's all it can do, that's all it can do. Just wondering.

My stock Athlon XP 2400 seems to average around 105-110 candidates or 2100-2200 conformers a day under Win XP.

I just upgraded my better 1900 box to a 2500+. I haven't had it running long enough to get a good average. It jumped from about 60 a day to 85 on the first day. However it takes about a week to get a good average due to the difference in the various work units. It is kind of like SETI that way. There is a lot of variance in how long a work unit can take, so you need an average over several days.

Tonight I tried something I don't normally do. The XP 2500+ is on an Asus A7V333 mobo, and I knew it could be overclocked. Didn't want to push it too much, but have it running at about 2.002 ghz. I replaced the stock AMD fan with a Thermaltake Volcano, and it appears to be stable (and cooler). Don't know too much about over-clocking so wanted to play it safe. In straight gigahertz both the 2400 & 2500 will be about the same, but the 2500 will have the larger L2 cache. That should give a pretty good idea about what to expect.

Scotttheking · Mar 22, 2004, 04:17 AM

I overclock my play systems.

I took one of my 2500s, and it's now running at 2200MHz instead of 1833MHz. Another 2500 is limited by the motherboard, but it's somewhere over 2000MHz. I have a 2200 that will run at over 2200MHz, but it's back at stock speed for now since it's being used for a development system.

It can kill a CPU if you don't know what you are doing, but it's a good way to get an extra boost, especially with current AMD CPUs that all go up a fair bit higher then what they are sold as.

Maybe in a few weeks a fair amount of the farm will do a 1-2 week d2ol visit, just to see what it can do. And I want to see mikkyo's reaction

--Scott, who plans on replacing a Tbird 1.2 with a xp 2600 on Tuesday.

mikkyo · Mar 23, 2004, 04:51 AM

I'll be very happy to be on a team rising up in the top ten ranks.

Shaktai · Mar 25, 2004, 12:19 AM

Originally posted by mikkyo:
I'll be very happy to be on a team rising up in the top ten ranks.

Hmmm! Me thinks that mikkyo has been sandbagging. 33,120 in one day? Definitely sandbagging.

[Dream mode]
...briefly I saw myself with a dozen or more G5's soaring past mikkyo in D2OL to recapture the #1 spot....then I woke up.
[/Dream mode]

Scotttheking · Apr 23, 2004, 01:58 AM

I'm finished with DF now.
I said I'd help with d2ol, and here I am.
How much do you need, and has anyone managed to run it as a win2k service yet?
My 2500@2200MHz is giving me some trouble, but I'll be moving the 4 athlons over in the short term.

[FDC]Fozzie · Apr 23, 2004, 01:18 PM

By the end of May MacNN will be eating Free DC dust.

Thanks Scott for helping me get the guys motivated.

Scotttheking · Apr 23, 2004, 02:43 PM

Originally posted by [FDC]Fozzie:
By the end of May MacNN will be eating Free DC dust.

Thanks Scott for helping me get the guys motivated.

How do you run d2ol as a win2k service?

mikkyo · Apr 23, 2004, 05:28 PM

Originally posted by [FDC]Fozzie:
By the end of May MacNN will be eating Free DC dust.

Thanks Scott for helping me get the guys motivated.

Hah! Falling for our ploy as we pretend to direct resources at D2OL when really everyone is jumping on FAH!

Chinasaur · Apr 24, 2004, 11:36 AM

Mikkyo,

I think Fozzie was talking about motivating "Free-DC" guys..not MacNN d00ds

Anyway, if we hadn't gotten a large influx of transplants from another team..we wouldn't be getting near you...that says alot about the strength of the MacNN team.

Shaktai · Apr 24, 2004, 11:50 PM

Originally posted by Chinasaur:
Mikkyo,

I think Fozzie was talking about motivating "Free-DC" guys..not MacNN d00ds

Anyway, if we hadn't gotten a large influx of transplants from another team..we wouldn't be getting near you...that says alot about the strength of the MacNN team.

Strong and getting stronger. Free-DC hasn't passed us yet.

mikkyo · Apr 27, 2004, 06:06 PM

I don't supposed anyone noticed we are in 6th now?

druber · Apr 28, 2004, 03:11 PM

nope, too busy pushing for a brief moment of glory in 5th place before scott casts me into obscurity (err, 6th place). yes of course i'm that shallow.

Scotttheking · 02:22 AM

<snip>

druber · May 12, 2004, 11:38 AM

Team MacNN's glory is fading, yet mine remains. This is very clearly backwards. FreeDC bumped us back to 7th place. Take a look at our monthly Ghz stats and you'll see we're on quite a slide. Myself, I only have two machines returning units, and it doesn't look like anyone's even gaining on me, at the moment. Shaktai, it's a matter of only a couple years before I set you back a spot. D2OL sleepers, awake! I want to get bumped out of the top 10, and not because I've stopped crunching!

mikkyo · May 12, 2004, 04:13 PM

Yea, for some odd reason, trying to rank 31 in F@H is more important to the team than being in the top ten in any other project, which has always seemed a bit odd to me.
Sure people have their favorite projects, but as far as I know, none of the DC projects have actually produced anything with their results, except RC5 but that was a given and they had nearly exhausted the keyset when it was cracked.
The home farm is mostly offline in preparation for a move, so other team members will have to hold us up in the top ten in D2OL.
So down we slide.
So sad we could have been 5th.

Shaktai · May 12, 2004, 09:55 PM

Well, I have been back on BOINC beta testing, and expect I will probably there until the client goes public. Can't do much to help out right now.

BOINC is more then just SETI, and may be a major milestone in Distributed Computing. It is important that it gets done right, and that Macs are well represented in the development phase. BOINC is so close to prime time I can almost taste it. By the time BOINC goes public, it may be time for beta testing on the new D2OL client.

Druber, don't get your hopes up too much. It won't take me that long to get things geared back up.

druber · May 13, 2004, 03:27 PM

I dunno Shaktai, 2 million back isn't that far, assuming they let me use the VA Supercomputer for a few weeks (I sent them cookies, and not the browser kind).
Is D2OL going BOINC or to a new client entirely?

Shaktai · May 13, 2004, 10:33 PM

Originally posted by druber:
I dunno Shaktai, 2 million back isn't that far, assuming they let me use the VA Supercomputer for a few weeks (I sent them cookies, and not the browser kind).
Is D2OL going BOINC or to a new client entirely?

No D2OL will not be going BOINC any time soon if ever. It will just be an update to a new version of the client. I anticipate it will be a pretty short beta, as it is more refinements and some feature additions then a rewrite.

Projects currently lined up for BOINC are SETI, Astropulse, a version of Folding@Home (but not necessarily a replacement for the current F@H client), Climate Prediction and possibly Lifemapper (uncertain).

druber · May 14, 2004, 09:27 AM

Tell us the truth, Shaktai. LifeMapper is really a program to develop maps for home D&D games, isn't it. Harness the power of the Internet and millions of computers worldwide to create brand new missions! Endangered leopards my butt. That's an arc-troll platoon in disguise.

Shaktai · May 14, 2004, 09:29 PM

Originally posted by druber:
Tell us the truth, Shaktai. LifeMapper is really a program to develop maps for home D&D games, isn't it. Harness the power of the Internet and millions of computers worldwide to create brand new missions! Endangered leopards my butt. That's an arc-troll platoon in disguise.

All right, now you done it. Let the cat out of the bag. You'd best run, the MIBs are on their way to your house right now. And any rumors that SETI is really just translating alien versions of our D&D games to be sold in other systems is completely untrue. There is no conspiracy here. I repeat there is no conspiracy. Move along now.

druber · May 15, 2004, 07:01 PM

Must...control panic....act normal....must reach television remote...
Ahhhhh, and all the rest fades away. I'll just keep crunching, Sir, no need to use the memory control device.

mikkyo · May 25, 2004, 07:29 PM

Well Team MacNN is on the way out of the Top Ten at D2OL.
All those immediately below us are out-producing us except hardCOREware, which isn't producing at all, and China SARS but they fluctuate between less and lots more.
China SARS Team can make up the slack easy - when they turn on the steam they do a lot more than us.
So MacNN will fall to 10th place and hang there for awhile, not in the next week or month but eventually.
I tell you now because there is still time to do something about it.
I doubt anyone will, but at least you know.
My big machines are down for a month, at least, and by then it may be too late.<table>
<tr><td>Rank</td><td>Team</td><td>Conformers</td><td>Daily</td></tr>
<tr><td>1</td><td>Dutch Power Cows</td><td>4,514,181</td><td>17,077</td></tr>
<tr><td>2</td><td>Team AnandTech</td><td>4,396,052</td><td>17,569</td></tr>
<tr><td>3</td><td>Team Norway</td><td>2,879,357</td><td>10,015</td></tr>
<tr><td>4</td><td>Ars Technica Team Fr...</td><td>1,600,725</td><td>3,170</td></tr>
<tr><td>5</td><td>Team Storagereview.c...</td><td>1,039,425</td><td>3,230</td></tr>
<tr><td>6</td><td>Free-DC</td><td>816,733</td><td>14,862</td></tr>
<tr><td>7</td><td>Team MacNN</td><td>668,457</td><td>1,616</td></tr>
<tr><td>8</td><td>Denmark</td><td>604,345</td><td>3,186</td></tr>
<tr><td>9</td><td>hardCOREware</td><td>597,416</td><td>0</td></tr>
<tr><td>10</td><td>Chihlee@TAIWAN</td><td>525,255</td><td>1,763</td></tr>
<tr><td>11</td><td>China SARS team</td><td>508,251</td><td>994</td></tr>
</table>