[Oneota]

See this:

http://www.videolan.org/patents.html

If you live in an EU member nation, you should absolutely take time out of your day to contact your representative and do something about this!

Text from the site:

The end draws near...


VideoLAN is seriously threatened by software patents due to the numerous patented techniques it implements and uses. Also threatened are the many libraries and projects which VLC is built upon, like FFmpeg, and the other fellow Free And Open Source software multimedia players, which include MPlayer, xine, Freevo, MythTV, gstreamer.


Multimedia is a patent minefield. All important techniques and formats are covered by broad and trivial patents that are harming progress and alternative implementations, such as free software multimedia players.


The European commission has just passed its directive on software patents, violating democratic rules and procedures to the sole benefit of big non-European corporation and Ireland and to the detriment of small and medium sized businesses (which comprise 99% of the European software industry) and free software.


The European parliament will now be taking the last stand against software patents in a voting for which an absolute majority is needed. Such a majority is hard to come by in a parliament with a low attendance level.


But not all is lost yet as long as you decide it is time to make a difference and take action. This is our last opportunity to fend off software patents worldwide, there will be no second chance for the foreseeable future.


Signing petitions will not suffice. Contact your local EU representatives and educate them why software patents are a bad idea in the first place and why they must attend that parliament session to vote against them. Make it clear that they need to stop the machinations of the EU council and reaffirm the power of the EU parliament, the only democratically elected EU institution. For in-depth information and starting points to get active visit the software patent page of the FFII (Foundation for a Free Information Infrastructure) and NoSoftwarePatents.com.


Wish us luck, we will need it.

[starman]

This is the ONE reason why I stopped working on myPSP. I knew this patent stuff would bite someone in the ass sooner or later.

Mike

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally posted by starman:


This is the ONE reason why I stopped working on myPSP. I knew this patent stuff would bite someone in the ass sooner or later.

Mike

Did you ever finish it?

[starman]

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
Did you ever finish it?

Yes. The problem is that there's no point in releasing it since other competitors are pretty much selling something that's now seen as illegal (in EU). How can I compete with that?

Mike

[The DJ]

It's not illegal YET.
What we are warning about is that if people don't take action soon, it will be illegal very soon.

[ambush]

Nice to see the right wing capitalist politicians **** it up again.

[Xeo]

Too bad they can't stop it from being hosted on US servers and too bad they can't stop EU citizens from accessing said servers. Even if this BS goes through, it won't hurt the projects (although I have a feeling a large number of EU people work on said projects and will have to then go into hiding to keep working, which is stupid).

I hope /. has something running about this as it'd get more people to do something about it than our community can provide (and again, I have a feeling it is already on /., I just don't read it).

[Zimphire]

Originally Posted by ambush

Nice to see the right wing capitalist politicians **** it up again.

Where did you get that they were right wing?

And guess what ambush, Capitalism is the reason you can bitch about it on the internet.

[mitchell_pgh]

Originally Posted by ambush

Nice to see the right wing capitalist politicians **** it up again.

Funny, there isn't an issue in Capitalist America. And are you calling the EU a right wing organization???

Why not throw in a Halliburton while you are at it.

[badidea]

Contact your local EU representatives

Who are my local EU representatives?? I think I want to visit them personally!!!!

[Kerrigan]

What does this mean for the average VLC user, like myself? It is the only useful alternative to Quicktime on the Mac, I would hate for development to stop on it.

[ambush]

Originally Posted by mitchell_pgh

Funny, there isn't an issue in Capitalist America. And are you calling the EU a right wing organization???

Why not throw in a Halliburton while you are at it.

Yes, right wing, private property taken to the extreme. Where open source is endangered.
This is NOT the whole EU. It's about lobbies and idiotic politician who probably got paid under the table to endorse such STUPIDITY.

[Zimphire]

At least that is what he read on tehsocialismistehcool.com

[ambush]

Originally Posted by Zimphire

At least that is what he read on tehsocialismistehcool.com

I think you totally discredited me, there!

That'll teach me!

PS: I'm citizen of Italy, so yes, it does concern me.

[REB3L]

Originally Posted by ambush

PS: I'm citizen of Italy, so yes, it does concern me.

Perhaps you should sort out that identity crisis before you get caught up in politics.

[Goldfinger]

Originally Posted by Oneota

If you live in an EU member nation, you should absolutely take time out of your day to contact your representative and do something about this!

I don't think you even can do this in Europe, you can't even contact "your representative" of your country's government since we don't have a "representative".

[Angus_D]

Originally Posted by mitchell_pgh

Funny, there isn't an issue in Capitalist America. And are you calling the EU a right wing organization???

Uh, software patents already exist in the USA.

[Zimphire]

Actually, they are most everywhere.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by Zimphire

Where did you get that they were right wing?

And guess what ambush, Capitalism is the reason you can bitch about it on the internet.

Actually, Democracy is the reason you can bitch about things on the Internet. There is nothing about Capitalism that allows or even promotes free speech. Democracy and Capitalism are not even intrinsically linked.

[cpt kangarooski]

Too bad they can't stop it from being hosted on US servers and too bad they can't stop EU citizens from accessing said servers. Even if this BS goes through, it won't hurt the projects (although I have a feeling a large number of EU people work on said projects and will have to then go into hiding to keep working, which is stupid).

As noted, the US is infamous for having software patents. Which are actually AFAIK unique, or nearly so, to the US. Most places don't have them.

Of course, this means that not only could VLC be hosted in the US, if doing so would infringe on a US software patent, but it cannot be developed here, and cannot be used here by ordinary individuals.

Of course, software patents as a whole are a dumb idea. Patents are solely justifiable as an incentive to inventors, to get them to invent useful, novel, nonobvious inventions which are disclosed and rapidly enter the public domain. It is plainly obvious that software developers need no incentive from patents in order to make their inventions, and for their inventions to become disclosed in the public domain. They do it anyway.

If the public can get the benefit of their work for free, it's utterly stupid to pay for it by granting patents.

[starman]

This is the reason why I don't dabble in crap like this. Let other people deal with it.

Mike

[Oneota]

Originally Posted by Goldfinger

I don't think you even can do this in Europe, you can't even contact "your representative" of your country's government since we don't have a "representative".

There has to be someone that the populace can contact who's acting on their behalf, though, isn't there? If the general population has no control over the EU whatsoever (even if it's just talking to an elected official of their own government, who then passes concerns on to whoever's acting on the country's behalf within the EU), it seems like a pretty shoddy institution. IMO.

[ambush]

Originally Posted by REB3L

Perhaps you should sort out that identity crisis before you get caught up in politics.

No, I won't show you my Italian passport.

Sheesh. PMS, man... PMS.

[Kilbey]

Originally Posted by ambush

Yes, right wing, private property taken to the extreme. Where open source is endangered.
This is NOT the whole EU. It's about lobbies and idiotic politician who probably got paid under the table to endorse such STUPIDITY.

Tell me ambush, why are you charging $14.95 for Burnout then? Why isn't it open source?

[Kilbey]

Originally Posted by ambush

No, I won't show you my Italian passport.

Sheesh. PMS, man... PMS.

Maybe because you don't have one?

I thought you were Quebecois.

[cruciarius]

MPlayer > Quicktime > VLC

VLC is slow and doesn't play half the videos i try with it and ones it does play, it doesn't sync the audio and video. even Quicktime is better than VLC. MPlayer is the best 3rd party player out right now.

hopefully the new Quicktime will be able to be worth using though. it's kind of sad that Apple can't make a video player thats better than a free 3rd party developer.

[Oisín]

Originally Posted by Kilbey

Maybe because you don't have one?

I thought you were Quebecois.

How would being Qu�b�cois prevent him from having an Italian passport?

[ambush]

Originally Posted by Kilbey

Tell me ambush, why are you charging $14.95 for Burnout then? Why isn't it open source?

Because I already contribute (minimally, maybe) to the open source movement. PodNews was open source realbasic (yeah, I was 14 back then so...) Then there was ThemeChanger, open source too (although Finlay Dobbie coded the final versions), I released some open source classes, and more recently GrowlClock which probably contributed to give the open source Growl Framework some visibility (with more than 100000 downloads.) I also donate to open source causes.

I charge 14.95 for this app because I put a lot effort into it and unfortunately I have to pay for my education and food. Oh and 20$ of pot every other month too. But yeah it gives me a small salary to survive. That's why I charge 14.95 for it.

Regarding my Italian citizenship. Well I'm Italian and Qu�b�cois. My mom worked hard so my twin and I could be Italian citizens. She went to the ambassy, etc. So yes I'm citizen of Italy. But I'm not planning to visit it (because I don't want to go in the Army.)

Of course, Kilbey, I don't give a **** if you don't believe me. Thanks.

By the way, your logic is so poor you might want to go back to class. I mean. Even if I charge 14.95 for an app, I can be pro-opensource. I mean this is my only source of money.... I think all the pro-opensource people are not on wellfare... they have income... they work at companies... it's not like you have to be on welfare, poor and anti-capitalist to be pro-open source. You might want to learn about multiple citizenship too. But we can't ask too much from you, can we?

[Person Man]

Originally Posted by ambush

Regarding my Italian citizenship. Well I'm Italian and Qu�b�cois. My mom worked hard so my twin and I could be Italian citizens. She went to the ambassy, etc. So yes I'm citizen of Italy. But I'm not planning to visit it (because I don't want to go in the Army.)

Better make sure that there isn't some law that they can use against you to make you serve in the Italian Military when you come of military age anyway, regardless of whether you visit Italy or not... (I'm not Canadian or Italian, so I don't know the relevant laws).

I'm half Greek, half American, and grew up in the US. My father retains his Greek citizenship. When I was born my parents looked into getting me dual US/Greek citizenship, but as soon as they found out I would have to serve in the Greek Military (and I think at that time, you had to, whether you ever planned on visiting the country or not), my father decided against it, because he absolutely HATED his 26 months in the Greek Army and refused to subject his children to it. Even though he loves his home country very much and keeps his citizenship (yes, he has a Green Card, though they're not green anymore), he drew the line on this one.

Also, make sure that Canada won't make you choose between one citizenship or the other, because I believe that in the US, when a person with dual citizenship gets to be an adult, they have to choose one. (I think. I'm not sure, because neither I or my brother had dual citizenship and I don't know anyone else who does).

[Zimphire]

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak

Actually, Democracy is the reason you can bitch about things on the Internet. There is nothing about Capitalism that allows or even promotes free speech. Democracy and Capitalism are not even intrinsically linked.

You totally didn't get where I was going.

The very computer, and internet he is on and the technology it came from, can be traced back to Capitolism.

[Zimphire]

Originally Posted by Kilbey

Tell me ambush, why are you charging $14.95 for Burnout then? Why isn't it open source?

PPPWWWWWWWWWNEED!

I charge 14.95 for this app because I put a lot effort into it and unfortunately I have to pay for my education and food. Oh and 20$ of pot every other month too. But yeah it gives me a small salary to survive. That's why I charge 14.95 for it.

See you DO understand how capitolism works.

And you obviously approve.

[Angus_D]

Originally Posted by Zimphire

Actually, they are most everywhere.

Please elaborate.

[Zimphire]

Originally Posted by Angus_D

Please elaborate.

Saying, Software pantents are all over the place, not just in the US.

[ambush]

So the Internet and the computers would not have been invented if capitalism had not existed? What you are saying might be true, as long as you don't imply that they could not have been possible in a non-capitalist democracy... anyway...

I do approve of capitalism where every human right is respected, but that goes against capitalism anyway, since capitalism puts profits before human. But I'd like to see a more human capitalism and less of a gap between the rich and the poor. Market IS good, don't get me wrong.

Your logic is very poor, go back to midwest school!

[Zimphire]

Originally Posted by ambush

So the Internet and the computers would not have been invented if capitalism had not existed?

What I am saying is, the reason why you are on it NOW is because of capitalism.

What you are saying might be true, as long as you don't imply that they could not have been possible in a non-capitalist democracy... anyway...

Never said that.. but it didn't so we will never know unless something like this happens.
Most socialist countries aren't booming with innovation.

I do approve of capitalism where every human right is respected, but that goes against capitalism anyway, since capitalism puts profits before human. But I'd like to see a more human capitalism and less of a gap between the rich and the poor. Market IS good, don't get me wrong.

Your logic is very poor, go back to midwest school!

my logic is poor? You didn't disprove anything I said, you are just verbally masturabating now ambush.

[ambush]

Originally Posted by Zimphire

What I am saying is, the reason why you are on it NOW is because of capitalism.


Never said that.. but it didn't so we will never know unless something like this happens.
Most socialist countries aren't booming with innovation.


my logic is poor? You didn't disprove anything I said, you are just verbally masturabating now ambush.

Yes, the reason I'm on it NOW is because of Capitalism, because it rules the world. Now IF it didn't rule the world, I would probably still be on the internet or somekind of online community. The difference would be: legal P2P, no patents, etc.

Most socialist countries.... you mean China? you mean like Sweden? Jeez.

Altho China blocks parts of the net (I see you coming... you're making noise) China isn't a democracy... I'm talking about social-democracy here.

You need formal logic... maybe evening courses.

[Oisín]

Originally Posted by ambush

Most socialist countries.... you mean China? you mean like Sweden? Jeez.

China isn't a socialist country, or at least, it's more capitalist than socialist.

[dcmacdaddy]

Originally Posted by Zimphire

You totally didn't get where I was going.

The very computer, and internet he is on and the technology it came from, can be traced back to Capitolism.

Actually, the technology this is all based on comes courtesy of the US miltary-industrial complex. Ever hear of something called ARPA? The fact our economic system is capitalist is really irrelevant to the implementation of a wide-area computer network desgined to survive a nuclear war. Military preparedness was a much more important factor than commercial gain for the development of the Internet.

[SVass]

Originally Posted by Zimphire

The very computer, and internet he is on and the technology it came from, can be traced back to Capitalism.

Correction: The computer and the internet (originally called ARPANET) can be traced back to the military, space program, universities, and government spending on basic research. The military needed an artillery calculator. NASA needed fast, lightweight calculators, universities wanted to exchange data and mail, and (D)ARPA was established to fund both basic and applied research from the US defense budget. As an aside, Bush is now proposing to eliminate future funding for basic research to fund his tax cuts and personal travel. sam

[Weyland-Yutani]

FreeBSD circumvents the software patents of UNIX, no? I don't like these proposals of software patent legislation in the EU one bit, I'm just trying to figure out how damageing they will be. The source code is of most things in VLC is already openly available and if it is patented perhaps some sort of reverse engineering is possible no?

Just thinking.

[SVass]

Originally Posted by Weyland-Yutani

FreeBSD circumvents the software patents of UNIX, no? I don't like these proposals of software patent legislation in the EU one bit, I'm just trying to figure out how damageing they will be. The source code is of most things in VLC is already openly available and if it is patented perhaps some sort of reverse engineering is possible no?

Just thinking.

Europe isn't the only stupid place. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/04...rgency_patent/
as MSoft is patenting 911. Last month, they patented the concept of a floating point number. sam

[Angus_D]

Originally Posted by Zimphire

Saying, Software pantents are all over the place, not just in the US.

Where "all over the place"?

[Kilbey]

Originally Posted by dcmacdaddy

Actually, the technology this is all based on comes courtesy of the US miltary-industrial complex. Ever hear of something called ARPA? The fact our economic system is capitalist is really irrelevant to the implementation of a wide-area computer network desgined to survive a nuclear war. Military preparedness was a much more important factor than commercial gain for the development of the Internet.

Q: What was it protecting?

A: Our capitalistic society.

Q: Where do you thing the government got the money?

A: Taxes from capitalistic gains.

So, kids, what you have learned here is that the internet sprouted from capitalistic gains and not Mother Government giving it to us to view pron on.

[ambush]

Originally Posted by Kilbey

Q: What was it protecting?

A: Our capitalistic society.

Q: Where do you thing the government got the money?

A: Taxes from capitalistic gains.

So, kids, what you have learned here is that the internet sprouted from capitalistic gains and not Mother Government giving it to us to view pron on.

It's OK if you don't understand, Kilbey

[Kilbey]

Originally Posted by ambush

It's OK if you don't understand, Kilbey

[img]http://www.scarletrocks.com/big%20smiley.jpg[img]

[img]http://www.dan-dare.net/Dan%20GIFs/Smiley%20Big%20GIF.gif[mg]

Good, cause you totally lost me here.

Are you high again?

[dcmacdaddy]

Originally Posted by Kilbey

Q: What was it protecting?

A: Our capitalistic society.

Q: Where do you thing the government got the money?

A: Taxes from capitalistic gains.

So, kids, what you have learned here is that the internet sprouted from capitalistic gains and not Mother Government giving it to us to view pron on.

Yes, all true. But we are talking about causality here, and that was the point Zimphy was making: namely that the Internet exists because of our capitalistic economic system. Whereas I am arguing that that there is no causal relationship to be found there. Got it?

Like I said, military preparedness was much more important as an influence in the development of the Internet than economic advancement. We could have had an economic system like a Socialist European country and still have invented the Internet. There is NO intrinsic relationship between Capitalism as an economic policy of the United States and the invention of the Internet. Correlation? maybe; Causation? no!

Correlation != Causation

Got it?

[Zimphire]

Originally Posted by ambush

Yes, the reason I'm on it NOW is because of Capitalism, because it rules the world.

Um, it doesn't rule where you live. Face it bush, you just like doing something, then making money off your talents.

Now IF it didn't rule the world, I would probably still be on the internet or somekind of online community. The difference would be: legal P2P, no patents, etc.

Most socialist countries.... you mean China? you mean like Sweden? Jeez.

Altho China blocks parts of the net (I see you coming... you're making noise) China isn't a democracy... I'm talking about social-democracy here.

You need formal logic... maybe evening courses.

You are just rambling on again ambush. That isn't something someone taught you. It's your age showing.

You cannot sit there and bitch about Capitalism, and it's evils, while supporting capitalism and making money from capitalism.

I mean you can, but people like me will make fun of you for it.

Either poop, or get off the pot fence sitter.

[Zimphire]

Originally Posted by dcmacdaddy

Actually, the technology this is all based on comes courtesy of the US miltary-industrial complex. Ever hear of something called ARPA? The fact our economic system is capitalist is really irrelevant to the implementation of a wide-area computer network desgined to survive a nuclear war. Military preparedness was a much more important factor than commercial gain for the development of the Internet.

Uh dc, ARPA came up with the tech, bit it was Capitalism that let companies PROFIT from it, and make it SO HUGE that everyone could use it.

I certainly know who started the interweb and why.

[Zimphire]

Originally Posted by dcmacdaddy

Yes, all true. But we are talking about causality here, and that was the point Zimphy was making: namely that the Internet exists because of our capitalistic economic system.

No, I said ambush was able to come on here and bitch about capitalism because of capitalism. And it's true.

The internet got big because there was money to make. Not because "It was for the good of the people"

In other words, while yes Arpnet and the internet would have been invented MAYBE without capitalism, it WAS Capitalism that made it possible for EVERYONE to use it, including Ambush.

You are trying to switching arguments mid-stream.

[ambush]

Originally Posted by Zimphire

Um, it doesn't rule where you live. Face it bush, you just like doing something, then making money off your talents.

You are just rambling on again ambush. That isn't something someone taught you. It's your age showing.

You cannot sit there and bitch about Capitalism, and it's evils, while supporting capitalism and making money from capitalism.

I mean you can, but people like me will make fun of you for it.

Either poop, or get off the pot fence sitter.

methinks it's really time you take politic courses and look at the definition of capitalism. heck, you can even learn online, it's NOT that tough.