[cube3]

I have been following a few threads in the forums, and quite often they get onto the subject of iTunes remotes. There are so many variations of the iTunes remote around at the moment, ranging from hard coded players like sofa, widgets on konfabultor and menu players like synergy.

If we were to make the perfect player, from a themers perspective, what would you require the player to do? I saw BBX mentioning animation support, for me I would like to be able to change the size, from making tiny ones, to massive industrial ones.

Once it's done, we can go on a quest to find the right people to do it.

[ender2002]

with a touch of an programmable button, a small metallic hemisphere drops from underneath the menubar and projects tracklisting etc in front of all windows, hologram style. think: the movie "aliens" when they open the escape pod and use a lazer to scan the ship. a blue lazer hologram projected from the menubar.

yeah.

[Dave-o�]

One thing I would like to see happen, is not having to use iTunes.. Don't get me wrong here, I really like the app, but when using a 3rd party controller, iTunes will show it's ugly face sooner or later. It would be nice if the remote/player could 'read' the iTunes play list/library file and run smoothly from that. Then there wouldn't be a need to have iTunes open, only when you wanted to manage your music collection.

[TheIceMan]

EXACTLY. I love iTunes, but I hate how it's always popping up even when using a remote. If future widgets/remotes can do this with all the pizzazz that would be SWEET!

[miloszwl]

while talking about iTunes and remotes
check my image from Apple 2006 series

http://www.spymac.com/gallery/show_p...17279&size=big

[justinp]

If a remote goes so far as to no longer need iTunes, then it has made the jump to player, and that's a whole new set of problems.

I don't mind having an extra icon in my Dock.

[Frisbee]

Originally posted by justinp:
If a remote goes so far as to no longer need iTunes, then it has made the jump to player, and that's a whole new set of problems.

I don't mind having an extra icon in my Dock.

Not necessarily. What I think Dave-o is imagining is that you could use the "controller" to play your tunes, browse your library and playlists, maybe adjust the EQ, and look really cool. You would still use iTunes, however, to rip CDs, download stuff from the itunes music store, convert songs to different formats, add playlists... I think you can get it.

I really like the idea. Some of the very complex skins, such as those Alienware ones BBX/TheSkinsFactory made could get really bloated if they had to incorporate all of iTunes' features, but if it only needed a few basic buttons, a browser, and an EQ window, these skins could achieve that WiMP-esque coolness that so many of us crave. Now all we need are some really talented programmers who aren't busy.

[Dave-o�]

Originally posted by Frisbee:
Not necessarily. What I think Dave-o is imagining is that you could use the "controller" to play your tunes, browse your library and playlists, maybe adjust the EQ, and look really cool. You would still use iTunes, however, to rip CDs, download stuff from the itunes music store, convert songs to different formats, add playlists... I think you can get it.

I really like the idea. Some of the very complex skins, such as those Alienware ones BBX/TheSkinsFactory made could get really bloated if they had to incorporate all of iTunes' features, but if it only needed a few basic buttons, a browser, and an EQ window, these skins could achieve that WiMP-esque coolness that so many of us crave. Now all we need are some really talented programmers who aren't busy.

Quit using your telepathic mind powers on me... Ouch, i said stop it!!! Fris nailed it.. That's what i'm thinking.. Just a high end remote that can work without iTunes running in the background.

[justinp]

Originally posted by Dave-o�:
Quit using your telepathic mind powers on me... Ouch, i said stop it!!! Fris nailed it.. That's what i'm thinking.. Just a high end remote that can work without iTunes running in the background.

That's like trying to change the channel on a TV that isn't on. If iTunes isn't running (i.e. playing the songs) then you've created a player, not a remote.

[MacDog]

I'm confused... what does any of this have to do with the release date of BBX Omega???

[Dave-o�]

Originally posted by justinp:
That's like trying to change the channel on a TV that isn't on. If iTunes isn't running (i.e. playing the songs) then you've created a player, not a remote.

Okay Mr. Fancy Pants.. It a Player and not a Remote... But that doesn't mean that I still wouldn't want it.. With some tweeked out skins.

---> MacDog.. err... oh yeah...

[justinp]

Originally posted by Dave-o�:
Okay Mr. Fancy Pants.. It a Player and not a Remote... But that doesn't mean that I still wouldn't want it.. With some tweeked out skins.

Yeah, me too.

[Frisbee]

Originally posted by MacDog:
I'm confused... what does any of this have to do with the release date of BBX Omega???

It doesn't... and no one said it did.

Originally posted by justinp:
That's like trying to change the channel on a TV that isn't on. If iTunes isn't running (i.e. playing the songs) then you've created a player, not a remote.

If you've never changed the channel when the TV isn't on, you aren't thinking different.

[MacDog]

Originally posted by Frisbee:
It doesn't... and no one said it did.

Um, yeah. I know that. It was a joke!

[fireside]

Originally posted by MacDog:
Um, yeah. I know that. It was a joke!

your sig is too big

[NetworkShadow]

Built-in QuickTime player replacement with full screen playback, (Windows Media player type all in one idea that would make it more functional than just a remote.) and skinnable as Windows Media Player 9.

[fireside]

Originally posted by fireside:
your sig is too big

perhaps you didn't read the link clearly enough: NO ANIMATED SIGS EITHER.

[Keifer]

Ok people, we've all decided what our dream itunes remote/player would be like, now lets get out there and code it!


Ok, really though, if the mac platform is going to have a good skinable frontend for itunes, it's because the users are going to have to develope it. The odds of apple doing this is nill. If we want this to happen, we're going to have to get a company to develope it, or we're going to have to have to venture out into the opensource community, and form the app that way.

whatdoya think?

[NetworkShadow]

If we actively look for a software dev to make this, I'm sure we could find one... I really doubt they'll come to us.

[cube3]

I've been discussing it with some already, and they're interested, hence this thread. Which is about ideas, and not a thread to complain about peoples sig's.

[NetworkShadow]

Nice. You should get him and BBX to talk.

Originally posted by bbxstudio:
I've asked - but nobody sees a market for it, if can you believe that. The minute somebody builds a full-blown robust skinnable iTunes remote app that supports full alpha blending and open-ended event-triggered animations, I'll be all over it. And if a capable code-demon/company wants a partner on such an app (I'd handle the identity/marketing materials and design a handful of default skins for a piece of the pie) you know where to find me

[cube3]

ok for me, what I would like to see.

Practical Application
1. Access all the itunes playlists and be able to scroll through songs etc in those playlists(Some players stop short here).
2. Search field
3. Keep Itunes hidden while I use it.
4. Eject/configure iPod
5. Display/Download Album art

Effects
1. Support full skinning(obviously)
2. Support for animation
3. SDK which will allows us(themers) to image map functions.
4. Preference selection of having a small version in your menu bar, which whilst controlling the remote on it's own through baby functions also is a quick access feature to hide/unhide the bigger remote.

[Anubis IV]

Hmm...kinda like #4 in the second part of that list, I guess, the biggest thing I'd like to see is an X-Tunes like application...not as simple as X-Tunes, and certainly much more refined, but just something that you could opt to keep COMPLETELY hidden until the moment that you wanted it to come to the front of all your applications. My menubar is already crowded enough (2 displays for MenuMeters, 1 for Meteorologist, 1 for Proteus, 4 for Desktop Manager, 1 for gCount, 1 for Airport signal, another for the Battery, 1 for Monitor Resolution, and then the clock as well) as it is, so I'd like to still have this remote/player available at the touch of a button (or configurable keystroke) but I'd like to keep it out of the menu, or at least have that available as an option. Oh, and transparency/alpha channels and all that...I like it.

Oh, and yeah, those other features sounds very very nice...

[fireside]

i'd rather have Quicktime skinnable rather than iTunes, because i don't want this huge honkin' "remote" sitting on my desktop 24/7.

[ender2002]

I just had a cool idea. The problem with a remote is that it either takes up menubar space or desktop space. Desktop space is a bigger problem especially if you have a small moniter. What if a smaller hardware moniter, about the size of a postcard, vertically oriented, were invented. You could have the full-system-wide remote (itunes/ quicktime/ vlc) and quick stats (weather, stocks, etc). It could also double as a digital picturefram and could display anything you want; completely customizable. It would act in an extended desktop mode, so you can drag whatever you want over there. Konfabulator widgets, remotes, anything could be stored there.

[NetworkShadow]

Originally posted by fireside:
i'd rather have Quicktime skinnable rather than iTunes, because i don't want this huge honkin' "remote" sitting on my desktop 24/7.

Do the mini version like WindowsMedia player. The thing is that a cool skin can be used as an interactive desktop image... so it doesn't matter if it's large.

[Frisbee]

Originally posted by Anubis IV:
...something that you could opt to keep COMPLETELY hidden until the moment that you wanted it to come to the front of all your applications.

I couldn't stand Konfabulator until Konspos� for this reason. I have safari windows as big as I can get them, and I HATE it when ANYTHING covers them up. The problem is that Konspos� is such an ugly color.

Anyway, back on topic... I'd want the ability to check/uncheck songs in the controller. In iTunes, I leave all of my songs unchecked, and the only thing I don't like about iPods is how they just play through playlists, albums, etc. I don't like to try and predict what I'm going to want to listen to in the future .

Originally posted by fireside:
i'd rather have Quicktime skinnable rather than iTunes, because i don't want this huge honkin' "remote" sitting on my desktop 24/7.

Yeah, because then you have access to your iTunes library, and you can adjust the EQ, and you don't have to browse an "Open..." dialog every time you want to play a song. Good idea

[Keifer]

Ok, here's my ideas to go along with what cube adn the rest of you have got...


�runs itunes hidden in the background ( all itunes windows are closed) until the actual itunes interface is needed (eq, playlists, etc), prehaps an "advanced features" button that would bring up the itunes interface?
�full animation / theming support ( all major file formats, .png, .tiff, .jpeg, .gif, .mng, etc)
�quicktime intregation ( so it could play movie formats aswell; optional feature if cpu intensive?)
�when it's inative for X minutes, it quites the itunes/quicktime applications, and would restart them when needed (lets save those cpu cycles! )


Is there anyway I could help get this thing coded? It's something thats needed for mac.

[Frisbee]

Originally posted by Keifer:
�quicktime intregation ( so it could play movie formats aswell; optional feature if cpu intensive?)

I don't know about all of you, but for me it's pretty rare to download a non .mov file and have it play correctly on Quicktime (Pro.) I think integration with MPlayer or VLC would be a much better option.

Here are my requests...

� Able to be skinned as much as WiMP, plus support for full alpha transparency so that we don't have jaggies like WiMP...

� Library and Playlists just as easily accessible as they are in iTunes, but not necessarily always showing to save space.

� Video playback... preferably NOT quicktime.

� Skin Creator/Editor that doesn't require any (or very little) coding knowledge. If possible, we want to (try to) make it so anyone who can make a mockup can also make a skin. Think Kaleidoscope....

� I wouldn't care because I don't use this feature in iTunes, but being able to change the rating of the current song might be popular.

I feel pretty silly writing this though... I've been reading all these posts, all along thinking "Where are we going to find someone to code this monster..."

Microsoft has tons of developers they can throw at WiMP to make it what it is. We don't exactly have that to my knowledge. It's nice to dream, though....

[Keifer]

Actualy, compaired to what m$ did, this will be easyer to make. M$ had to code a complete player, this is just a frontend. Getting the program to actualy interface with itunes shouldn't be all that hard, the hard part will be the theming capabilites.

As for not having enough developers, the opensource comunities are fairly large, not to mention busniesses that might be interested in this. If there's enough support for something to happen, you never know what will turn up.

[fireside]

Originally posted by Frisbee:
Yeah, because then you have access to your iTunes library, and you can adjust the EQ, and you don't have to browse an "Open..." dialog every time you want to play a song. Good idea

i've never had to browse an "Open..." dialog when i use iTunes.

[MacMan4000]

Originally posted by fireside:
i've never had to browse an "Open..." dialog when i use iTunes.

What is this "open dialog" you speak of? I'v never heard of such a thing! Preposterous!

[Anubis IV]

Originally posted by fireside:
i've never had to browse an "Open..." dialog when i use iTunes.

Pretty sure there was some sarcasm in his post...he was commenting on the fact that to open any file in Quicktime from within the application you have to go through the Open dialog window, whereas you can manage a library much more easily using iTunes' interface.

[MacDog]

Originally posted by fireside:
perhaps you didn't read the link clearly enough: NO ANIMATED SIGS EITHER.

perhaps you could go pour yourself a nice tall glass of GoF#ckYourself!

[NetworkShadow]

Originally posted by MacDog:
perhaps you could go pour yourself a nice tall glass of GoF#ckYourself!

Maybe this thread could stay on topic?

[Frisbee]

fireside: You're right, you don't have to browse an open dialog in iTunes. But you said you'd rather have QT Player skinnable, which means you're either browsing the finder and using "Open with..." or browsing an "Open..." dialog in QT Player. When I said "Yeah, because then you have access to your iTunes library, and you can adjust the EQ, and you don't have to browse an 'Open...' dialog every time you want to play a song," I was naming all the things that you COULDN'T do if we made a quicktime frontend/controller/whatever. Hence the ''.

[Dave-o�]

Originally posted by cube3:
ok for me, what I would like to see.

Practical Application
1. Access all the itunes playlists and be able to scroll through songs etc in those playlists(Some players stop short here).
2. Search field
3. Keep Itunes hidden while I use it.
4. Eject/configure iPod
5. Display/Download Album art

Effects
1. Support full skinning(obviously)
2. Support for animation
3. SDK which will allows us(themers) to image map functions.
4. Preference selection of having a small version in your menu bar, which whilst controlling the remote on it's own through baby functions also is a quick access feature to hide/unhide the bigger remote.

I like your thoughts Cube, and i think the list is complete and detailed enough for feedback from a programmer. The thought about adding video to the remote is nice, though i don't think it's needed off the bat, could be a future version update. [xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx] So what have you found out about this coming to the light of day? Have programmers been open to the idea? Please keep us updated.

[Frisbee]

Originally posted by Dave-o�:
upgrade fee

Don't suck the cash out of people who have already been nice enough to buy your product. Unsanity knows this, and whoever programs this front-end should know it. Hey, don't listen to me, but I'm not going to shell out cash every month or so to have a flashy object on my desktop. I don't know how to say it less harsh...

I hope I don't start another string of mass whining...

[Dave-o�]

Originally posted by Frisbee:
hope I don't start another string of mass whining...

Crap-o-la... i forgot where i was posting, disregard that portion of the post. In fact it's going to get 'x'.

[fireside]

Originally posted by Frisbee:
fireside: You're right, you don't have to browse an open dialog in iTunes. But you said you'd rather have QT Player skinnable, which means you're either browsing the finder and using "Open with..." or browsing an "Open..." dialog in QT Player. When I said "Yeah, because then you have access to your iTunes library, and you can adjust the EQ, and you don't have to browse an 'Open...' dialog every time you want to play a song," I was naming all the things that you COULDN'T do if we made a quicktime frontend/controller/whatever. Hence the ''.

yeah, i have no idea what you're trying to tell me.

for quicktime, most file formats open defaultly in quicktime. but you're right, there wouldn't be too much to skin (is that what you're trying to say?).

[Frisbee]

Originally posted by fireside:
yeah, i have no idea what you're trying to tell me.

for quicktime, most file formats open defaultly in quicktime. but you're right, there wouldn't be too much to skin (is that what you're trying to say?).

No, I'm trying to say that Quicktime cannot browse your iTunes playlists/Library.

Originally posted by Dave-o�:
Crap-o-la... i forgot where i was posting, disregard that portion of the post. In fact it's going to get 'x'.

What?