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Anarchist "Scavenger Hunt" at DC Conference
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Millennium
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Sep 22, 2002, 02:01 PM
 
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp...otests_game_dc

Yeah, yeah, the guy said it was a joke, but you know some people are going to take it seriously.

Peaceful protest is a Good Thing, and well within a person's basic rights. But why do people complain about being arrested when they start disrupting traffic, destroying property, and attacking officers? These things are hardly peaceful. Yet some people seem to think it's a basic right.

[EDIT: UBBCode again. Actually, wait, isn't it called vBCode now?]
You are in Soviet Russia. It is dark. Grue is likely to be eaten by YOU!
     
Bushleaguer
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Sep 22, 2002, 02:10 PM
 
I suppose the exploitation of people in thirdworld countries is a basic right in your eyes.. Or the financing of warlords in the middle east and Africa, this is a basic right? Your modern capitalist seems to think so. So does the government.
He's not a leader, he's a Texas leaguer..
Swingin' for the fence, got lucky with a strike..
Drilling for fear, makes the job simple..
Born on third, thinks he got a triple..
     
finboy
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Sep 22, 2002, 03:06 PM
 
I won't recognize the last comment as a legitimate post.

I think the worst part of the anarchist movement is the involvement of folks who wouldn't know a political movement if it slapped them in the head. It's one thing to be an "Anarchist" or revolutionary after years of toil and agonizing self-study, but it's something else entirely to be one because it's fashionable and your parents can afford to support you. I don't count as "serious" anarchists anyone who would let themselves attend something like this.

The thought of ORGANIZED ANARCHISTS kinda sums up the whole thing. When their parents turn the money off, they'll get a job and sell out. Either that or they'll eventually start taking their meds again, and anarchy won't seem like so much fun.

From what I've heard, though, these protests are great places to pick up girls (or guys, I guess).
     
L'enfanTerrible
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Sep 22, 2002, 03:15 PM
 
Originally posted by finboy:
I won't recognize the last comment as a legitimate post.

I think the worst part of the anarchist movement is the involvement of folks who wouldn't know a political movement if it slapped them in the head. It's one thing to be an "Anarchist" or revolutionary after years of toil and agonizing self-study, but it's something else entirely to be one because it's fashionable and your parents can afford to support you. I don't count as "serious" anarchists anyone who would let themselves attend something like this.

The thought of ORGANIZED ANARCHISTS kinda sums up the whole thing. When their parents turn the money off, they'll get a job and sell out. Either that or they'll eventually start taking their meds again, and anarchy won't seem like so much fun.

From what I've heard, though, these protests are great places to pick up girls (or guys, I guess).
My bullsh!t meter is off the charts. I can't find one single thoughtful argument in this whole waste of 30 seconds. Try keeping the personal attacks to a minimum, if you want people to take you seriously. That is if you really consider calling a person mentally ill or homosexual is an insult.. I don't, but judging by the tone of your post I think you do.
     
SimeyTheLimey
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Sep 22, 2002, 03:26 PM
 
Originally posted by L'enfanTerrible:
That is if you really consider calling a person mentally ill or homosexual is an insult.. I don't, but judging by the tone of your post I think you do.
L'enfantTerrible: for what it is worth, I wouldn't consider what finboy said to be homophobic or an insult. Quite the opposite. He avoided a heterosexist assumption that everyone wants to pick up girls. Pretending that everyone is straight is an insult. Acknowledging our existence is not.

I'd imagine that there are plenty of gays among the protesters. I know for a fact that there are in the DC police force that will be preventing these people from tearing up our city.
     
Millennium  (op)
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Sep 22, 2002, 03:35 PM
 
Originally posted by Bushleaguer:
I suppose the exploitation of people in thirdworld countries is a basic right in your eyes.
No. But it doesn't excuse violence against noncombatants.
You are in Soviet Russia. It is dark. Grue is likely to be eaten by YOU!
     
deekay1
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Sep 22, 2002, 03:35 PM
 
Originally posted by Millennium:
Yet some people seem to think it's a basic right.
hrmmm, where does it say that?

hedonist, anarchist, agnostic, mac enthusiast and a strong believer in evolution and the yellow m&m conspiracy
     
L'enfanTerrible
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Sep 22, 2002, 04:26 PM
 
Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
L'enfantTerrible: for what it is worth, I wouldn't consider what finboy said to be homophobic or an insult. Quite the opposite. He avoided a heterosexist assumption that everyone wants to pick up girls. Pretending that everyone is straight is an insult. Acknowledging our existence is not.

I'd imagine that there are plenty of gays among the protesters. I know for a fact that there are in the DC police force that will be preventing these people from tearing up our city.
I see your point. I didn't look at it that way when I first read the post. I think I was biased by the negative tone that it took right from the beginning. I can see that he was trying to PC his post with "(or guys, I guess)".. But his post was insulting. He was taking shots at a group of people by stereotyping them into one class. And finboy did take a pot-shot at the mentally ill.

I think the worst part of the anarchist movement is the involvement of folks who wouldn't know a political movement if it slapped them in the head.
When their parents turn the money off, they'll get a job and sell out. Either that or they'll eventually start taking their meds again, and anarchy won't seem like so much fun.
I for one believe that anything can be achieved peacefully. I would not be proud to attend a violent riot, however I resent the hypocrisy displayed here. It's okay to go to war over politics and money, but it's not okay to disrupt traffic?

"Violence against non-combatants" ?? Don't even start down that road.
     
Zimphire
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Sep 22, 2002, 04:37 PM
 
     
Face Ache
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Sep 22, 2002, 09:14 PM
 
I'm all for the "custard pie to the face" approach to protesting.
     
finboy
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Sep 23, 2002, 01:33 AM
 
Originally posted by SimeyTheLimey:
L'enfantTerrible: for what it is worth, I wouldn't consider what finboy said to be homophobic or an insult. Quite the opposite. He avoided a heterosexist assumption that everyone wants to pick up girls. Pretending that everyone is straight is an insult. Acknowledging our existence is not.

I'd imagine that there are plenty of gays among the protesters. I know for a fact that there are in the DC police force that will be preventing these people from tearing up our city.
I wasn't limiting "pickups" to breeders, so thanks for defending me. The LAST thing you'll get from me is a slap at the folks on the other team (although I do like to use the term "rump ranger" occasionally, not in a mean way).
     
finboy
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Sep 23, 2002, 01:37 AM
 
Originally posted by L'enfanTerrible:


My bullsh!t meter is off the charts. I can't find one single thoughtful argument in this whole waste of 30 seconds. Try keeping the personal attacks to a minimum, if you want people to take you seriously. That is if you really consider calling a person mentally ill or homosexual is an insult.. I don't, but judging by the tone of your post I think you do.
Bless your heart for writing in on this.

I was merely stating my opinion, based on my experience over the past twenty years or so with anarchist types. Nothing more, nothing less. I wasn't insulting the mentally ill, unless they profess to be anarchists, and then I was attacking their choice of organizational behavior.

I think my last post should have cleared up the gay issue (homosexual really isn't a polite term, 'kay?)
     
finboy
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Sep 23, 2002, 01:46 AM
 
Originally posted by L'enfanTerrible:

I can see that he was trying to PC his post with "(or guys, I guess)".. But his post was insulting. He was taking shots at a group of people by stereotyping them into one class. And finboy did take a pot-shot at the mentally ill.
No, I didn't. Your projecting, or some other psychobabble-type word. Sounds like YOU might be up for rebooting your blood levels. It's Monday -- pharmacists recommend the start of the week as a good time to get prescription(s) refilled. Take a few breaths.


I for one believe that anything can be achieved peacefully. I would not be proud to attend a violent riot, however I resent the hypocrisy displayed here. It's okay to go to war over politics and money, but it's not okay to disrupt traffic?

"Violence against non-combatants" ?? Don't even start down that road.
Howz about a group hug? That might do it! You talk about achieving something peacefully and blocking traffic in the same paragraph?
     
Sven G
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Sep 23, 2002, 03:51 AM
 
While Chuck - the webmaster of one of the most important "anarchist portals" on the web - is certainly a very competent and intelligent person, I must say that I don't agree with these "Black Bloc"-like tactics: not only do they not have any substancial effects against the financial bosses' world-domination policies (as we are not talking about mass movements, as in the '60s, here), but they also contribute to distort the (often already quite precarious) view of anarchism that "ordinary" people get from the mainstream media - not a Good Thing™, really!

Anarchism is a pluralist theory and practice: the "anti-capitalist" demonstrations (peaceful or not so peaceful) are only a very limited aspect of it - but of course they attract the media's attention for the "show" they make (see also the "antiglobalization" movement). Being pluralist, anarchism has a wide range of internal currents, often quite different from each other: for example, as for the sexual preferences, there may certainly be some gays and lesbians in the movements - but that doesn't certainly mean that anarchism favors homosexuality! It's simply against heterosexism and homophobia, besides being, above all, for freedom of expression from the sexual and human relations point of view. Myself I'm not gay, for example (even if I don't exclude that I could be bisexual in certain circumstances); it's people that are "afraid" of gays/lesbians that might have some problems, as sexuality by its very nature is also "pluralistic", if free to develop.

P.S.: For our Italian reading (or Babelfish using) "forumers", there's a very interesting article, written by an anarchist, against the Black Bloc-like "show philosophy" on http://www.anarca-bolo.ch/a-rivista/280/37.htm - a very well-balanced and "modern" view of things, IMHO...
     
L'enfanTerrible
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Sep 23, 2002, 04:25 AM
 
Originally posted by finboy:


No, I didn't. Your projecting, or some other psychobabble-type word. Sounds like YOU might be up for rebooting your blood levels. It's Monday -- pharmacists recommend the start of the week as a good time to get prescription(s) refilled. Take a few breaths.



Howz about a group hug? That might do it! You talk about achieving something peacefully and blocking traffic in the same paragraph?
I'm only going to dignify this post with a response because I want to clear this up.

Don't deny that you stereotyped "anarchists" and also took a pot-shot at the mentally ill.. the proof is in the pudding:

Originally posted by finboy:
When their parents turn the money off, they'll get a job and sell out. Either that or they'll eventually start taking their meds again, and anarchy won't seem like so much fun.
You again insulted me by saying I need to take medication:

Sounds like YOU might be up for rebooting your blood levels. It's Monday -- pharmacists recommend the start of the week as a good time to get prescription(s) refilled. Take a few breaths.
Thats two times. And yet you still deny taking a hostile attitude. You're a very bad liar.

To finish, yes I did "talk about achieving something peacefully and blocking traffic in the same paragraph".. but if you had read my statement:

I for one believe that anything can be achieved peacefully. I would not be proud to attend a violent riot, however I resent the hypocrisy displayed here. It's okay to go to war over politics and money, but it's not okay to disrupt traffic?
...correctly, you would note that I did not say that I would disrupt traffic. I stand by my statement that anything can be achieved peacefully. Also I stand by my statement that it is hypocritical to endorse war, and also show contempt for demonstrators who disrupt traffic.

dismissed
     
The Jackalope
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Sep 23, 2002, 09:03 AM
 
Actually, what gets me is that these collectivists bastards call themselves anarchists, then demand their communistic idiocy to be made into enforceable laws, under threat of violence. Call the communists for what they are and leave the anarchism to people who don't believe in the initiation of force, thank you very much.

Oh yeah, and I don't like the WTO either, because it intends to regulate trade.

For a look into non-collectivism thought, I suggest checking out The Libertarian Enterprise instead of the tantrums of the red diaper crowd.
     
ringo
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Sep 23, 2002, 10:40 AM
 
Originally posted by L'enfanTerrible:
I for one believe that anything can be achieved peacefully. I would not be proud to attend a violent riot, however I resent the hypocrisy displayed here. It's okay to go to war over politics and money, but it's not okay to disrupt traffic?
Heh, if the media would cover non-violent protests, then groups wouldn't be tempted to cause destruction just so they can make the news. The only reason any of the WTO protests received press coverage is because of violence and property damage. If one of the goals of protest is to increase visibility about a certain issue, the media has forced groups to cause a disturbance to achieve that goal. Non-violent protests are ignored.
     
   
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