Welcome to the MacNN Forums.

If this is your first visit, be sure to check out the FAQ by clicking the link above. You may have to register before you can post: click the register link above to proceed. To start viewing messages, select the forum that you want to visit from the selection below.

You are here: MacNN Forums > Community > MacNN Lounge > "Apple ‘falsified’ files on Jobs’ options"

"Apple ‘falsified’ files on Jobs’ options"
Thread Tools
C.A.T.S. CEO
Professional Poster
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: eating kernel
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 01:55 AM
 
FT.com / Companies / IT - Apple ‘falsified’ files on Jobs’ options

On a scale of "Its ok" to Enron how bad is this?
Signature depreciated.
     
Ghoser777
Professional Poster
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Chicago, Illinois
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 02:16 AM
 
Hmmmm... not good =/
     
kobi
Mac Enthusiast
Join Date: Jun 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 02:31 AM
 
Not good at all. AAPL is down $2.47 to $79.05 in after hours trading.

Steve's hands aren't as clean as we thought they were.

Between the Steve Jobs news and the stock restatement due on Friday, AAPL is going to take a huge hit.

It's about to get ugly.
     
Kerrigan
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Apr 2005
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 02:35 AM
 
Ya, this is certainly not Enron or insider trading or anything like that, but if he knew about the falsification, then there could be pressure on him to resign.
     
effgee
Caffeinated Theme Master
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: hell (says dakar)
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 02:46 AM
 
Originally Posted by kobi View Post
... Steve's hands aren't as clean as we thought they were ...
I demand to remain excluded from this "we" thing. Who ever believed that a company is handing out literally tens of millions of Dollars in stock options and the CEO wouldn't happen to know about this?
     
Kerrigan
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Apr 2005
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:20 AM
 
Lying to boardmembers, faking minutes, getting shares which are now worth the better part of $1bn... this could get Jobs fired.

Imagine that: Jobs getting greedy and getting fired again.
     
mitchell_pgh
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Washington, DC
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:26 AM
 
Funny how some are jumping to conclusions. I'll hold my opinions until the facts are out.
     
Chuckit
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Diego, CA, USA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:27 AM
 
I find it hard to believe Steve knew about this. Not because I think he's an upstanding guy, but just because it would be so unnecessary for him to do this. Like, yeah, there's no way Steve could have gotten a couple million without breaking the law.
Chuck
___
"Instead of either 'multi-talented' or 'multitalented' use 'bisexual'."
     
kobi
Mac Enthusiast
Join Date: Jun 2006
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:39 AM
 
For Apples sake I hope Steve comes out clean. It's the stock that is going to take the 1st beating.

If the Feds file charges against Steve, I don't know what will happen to Apple.

I'm hoping for the best.
     
voodoo
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Salamanca, España
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:53 AM
 
Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
Ya, this is certainly not Enron or insider trading or anything like that, but if he knew about the falsification, then there could be pressure on him to resign.
Steve resign? Ehehehehehehehehe

That would be bad /Egon

V
I could take Sean Connery in a fight... I could definitely take him.
     
Kevin
Baninated
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: In yer threads
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 08:36 AM
 
Originally Posted by voodoo View Post
Steve resign? Ehehehehehehehehe

That would be bad /Egon

V
Very. Can anyone say 1996-7?
     
Oneota
Professional Poster
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Urbandale, IA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 01:09 PM
 
If nothing else, it should make for an interesting MacWorld keynote, neh?
"Yields a falsehood when preceded by its quotation" yields a falsehood when preceded by its quotation.
     
::maroma::
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: PDX
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 01:29 PM
 
I think this will eventually blow over. There will be discrepancies found, and people will be punished, but Jobs and Apple will be fine. This is an issue that's being investigated through a lot of different companies. Apple is one of them. I predict some fallout, but the main players will be OK.

Of course this is all my opinion based on no legal experience whatsoever. But I prefer to stay positive. Because if I don't, I'll fall into a deep depression I fear I'll never get out of. Thats how much I love this damned company. :o
     
imitchellg5
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Washington + Colorado
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 01:57 PM
 
^^^ You sound like me.
     
besson3c
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: yes
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 02:21 PM
 
Originally Posted by ::maroma:: View Post
I think this will eventually blow over. There will be discrepancies found, and people will be punished, but Jobs and Apple will be fine. This is an issue that's being investigated through a lot of different companies. Apple is one of them. I predict some fallout, but the main players will be OK.

Of course this is all my opinion based on no legal experience whatsoever. But I prefer to stay positive. Because if I don't, I'll fall into a deep depression I fear I'll never get out of. Thats how much I love this damned company. :o


Wow... What warrants such unconditional love?
     
imitchellg5
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Washington + Colorado
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 02:29 PM
 
Beautiful products.
     
::maroma::
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: PDX
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 02:29 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Wow... What warrants such unconditional love?
Decades of pure joy.
     
Agent69
Mac Elite
Join Date: Jun 2000
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 02:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
Ya, this is certainly not Enron or insider trading or anything like that, but if he knew about the falsification, then there could be pressure on him to resign.
It's hard to run a company from jail.
Agent69
     
imitchellg5
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: Washington + Colorado
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 02:36 PM
 
Steve Jobs would never resign again.
     
besson3c
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: yes
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:09 PM
 
Originally Posted by imitchellg5 View Post
Beautiful products.

Which are flawed just like anything else. They happen to be the computers I use for my client-side work too, but if something better came along I wouldn't hesitate to jump ship. I don't feel any particular loyalty to Apple, and I don't see why anybody else should either. They are just a company.

Same goes with politicians, except for the part about them being companies
     
besson3c
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: yes
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:10 PM
 
Originally Posted by ::maroma:: View Post
Decades of pure joy.

How far would that love take you? Is it really unconditional?
     
Gossamer
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Which are flawed just like anything else. They happen to be the computers I use for my client-side work too, but if something better came along I wouldn't hesitate to jump ship. I don't feel any particular loyalty to Apple, and I don't see why anybody else should either. They are just a company.
What exactly is 'better?' It's hard to suddenly have a company jump up with a great history of innovation and support. I'm not saying that Apple nothing but wonderful but something like this happening any time in the forseeable future is very unlikely.
     
besson3c
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: yes
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:21 PM
 
Originally Posted by Gossamer View Post
What exactly is 'better?' It's hard to suddenly have a company jump up with a great history of innovation and support. I'm not saying that Apple nothing but wonderful but something like this happening any time in the forseeable future is very unlikely.

It all depends on what you use your computer for. Apple is not the best at many different areas of computing. There are also several different areas where they do not innovate.
     
Kerrigan
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Apr 2005
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:25 PM
 
Originally Posted by Gossamer View Post
What exactly is 'better?' It's hard to suddenly have a company jump up with a great history of innovation and support. I'm not saying that Apple nothing but wonderful but something like this happening any time in the forseeable future is very unlikely.
Let's not get sidetracked by his vague generalities and pointless questions. The issue here is Jobs, and whether or not he's guilty.

A few CEOs have already been fired for this, and according to Law.com, backdating even sent one CEO (of Comverse Technology) into hiding in Namibia.

We can only hope that Jobs didn't know about this activity, but it would be hard to see how this is the case, seeing that he benefited from this forgery (sort of- he did eventually return the options though).
     
Chuckit
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Diego, CA, USA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:32 PM
 
Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
We can only hope that Jobs didn't know about this activity, but it would be hard to see how this is the case, seeing that he benefited from this forgery (sort of- he did eventually return the options though).
Yeah, but you know Steve could have just strolled into a meeting and said, "Yo, bitches, give me more money or I walk" and he could have achieved the same goal. I have a hard time seeing why he'd conspire with their CFO to get money.
Chuck
___
"Instead of either 'multi-talented' or 'multitalented' use 'bisexual'."
     
besson3c
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: yes
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:36 PM
 
I've never fully understood what drives this sort of insatiable appetite for more money. I mean, people like Jobs already have 248290348 zillion dollars...
     
Gossamer
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:37 PM
 
The world is not enough.
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by Gossamer View Post
The world is not enough.
But it is such a perfect place to start.

And I always considered that a statement of Bond's inability to be bribed by the simple material aspects of life.
(An opposite meaning of your usage here)
     
::maroma::
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: PDX
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
How far would that love take you? Is it really unconditional?
Of course it isn't unconditional. That would be silly. But its a loyalty that runs deep. Sure, Apple is just a company, who's purpose is to make money (off of people like me). But, unlike 99.9% of the other companies out there, Apple has given me joy in return for my money. Not only in the products I buy, but in their philosophy and how they conduct themselves. This incident is a blemish, but it isn't something that will tarnish my appreciation for Apple.

But I think my biggest fear from this whole thing is that something will happen to Steve. I feel that if/when Steve leaves Apple for good, Apple will slowly slide into oblivion, as it almost did when he was gone before. I just haven't heard of or seen anyone that has the capacity and vision to take Steve's place at Apple and have it moving forward like it is now.

So, my loyalty to Apple is strong. Stronger than any other company. But its not unconditional. But it would also take a huge incident or incidents for me to jump ship.
     
Gossamer
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:46 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dakar² View Post
But it is such a perfect place to start.

And I always considered that a statement of Bond's inability to be bribed by the simple material aspects of life.
(An opposite meaning of your usage here)
I only saw the movie once and it was a while ago, so I don't remember the context of the quote. But I will say it's quite odd to see rich people embezzling more money or movie stars shoplifting. I think that's evidence that having lots of stuff definitely won't satisfy. At what point does someone have "enough" money? Cars? Women?
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by Gossamer View Post
I only saw the movie once and it was a while ago, so I don't remember the context of the quote.
Great movie. The title itself is gold to me, though.

Originally Posted by Gossamer View Post
But I will say it's quite odd to see rich people embezzling more money or movie stars shoplifting. I think that's evidence that having lots of stuff definitely won't satisfy. At what point does someone have "enough" money? Cars? Women?
Gimme a couple mil and I'll let you know in a year.
     
Gossamer
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dakar² View Post
Great movie. The title itself is gold to me, though.
Was that the one with the guy that had the bullet in his brain? I think I tried watching it again but I fell asleep.
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:52 PM
 
Yeah the ol' bullet-brain dude. Def have to use suspension of disbelief to get past that part.
     
Gossamer
Professional Poster
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: "Working"
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:57 PM
 
I want an ice castle.
     
Dakar²
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: The Annals of MacNN History
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 03:58 PM
 
Screw that movie.
     
besson3c
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: yes
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 04:01 PM
 
Originally Posted by ::maroma:: View Post
Of course it isn't unconditional. That would be silly. But its a loyalty that runs deep. Sure, Apple is just a company, who's purpose is to make money (off of people like me). But, unlike 99.9% of the other companies out there, Apple has given me joy in return for my money. Not only in the products I buy, but in their philosophy and how they conduct themselves. This incident is a blemish, but it isn't something that will tarnish my appreciation for Apple.

But I think my biggest fear from this whole thing is that something will happen to Steve. I feel that if/when Steve leaves Apple for good, Apple will slowly slide into oblivion, as it almost did when he was gone before. I just haven't heard of or seen anyone that has the capacity and vision to take Steve's place at Apple and have it moving forward like it is now.

So, my loyalty to Apple is strong. Stronger than any other company. But its not unconditional. But it would also take a huge incident or incidents for me to jump ship.

If Steve Jobs is found guilty, you would rather pardon him than have justice be served?
     
Jawbone54
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Louisiana
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 04:03 PM
 
Maybe Roz Ho can come in and run things for a few years.
     
Wiskedjak
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Calgary
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 04:17 PM
 
Originally Posted by Kerrigan View Post
We can only hope that Jobs didn't know about this activity, but it would be hard to see how this is the case, seeing that he benefited from this forgery (sort of- he did eventually return the options though).
I think the question are, did he know about it, and did he return the options because he knew it was wrong or because he thought he might get caught.

Regardless, I don't think it would have any serious effect on Apple. Might even be good as they could make product announcements more about the product than about Jobs.
     
Chuckit
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Diego, CA, USA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 04:30 PM
 
Originally Posted by Wiskedjak View Post
Regardless, I don't think it would have any serious effect on Apple. Might even be good as they could make product announcements more about the product than about Jobs.
Right, because everybody was so excited about Apple's product announcements back in the days of Amelio. I don't see what Steve Jobs has done for Apple that's so great…you know, other than start the company and then come back to save it when it was dying in his absence.
Chuck
___
"Instead of either 'multi-talented' or 'multitalented' use 'bisexual'."
     
::maroma::
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: PDX
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 05:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
If Steve Jobs is found guilty, you would rather pardon him than have justice be served?
I'm not suggesting that at all. I was merely stating my hope, in the form of an uneducated prediction, that all will turn out well for Apple in this matter. If Steve is found guilty of something that warrants his dismissal, then I'm all for him taking responsibility for his crime(s). If that means being fired, stepping down, or whatever, then so be it. But I'll be very sad.
     
Atomic Rooster
Registered User
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: retired
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 05:49 PM
 
I was wondering how Stevie was getting by on $1 a year salary.

By the way, isn't that called stealing?
     
finboy
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Garden of Paradise Motel, Suite 3D
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 05:55 PM
 
Originally Posted by C.A.T.S. CEO View Post
FT.com / Companies / IT - Apple ‘falsified’ files on Jobs’ options

On a scale of "Its ok" to Enron how bad is this?

This is pretty bad. Somebody is going to jail, put it that way. Everyone who knew about this will probably end up in court. Shareholder lawsuits will be filed, too.

In the Enron case, you could argue that some of the stuff was plausibly deniable (some of the folks were stupid, but didn't do things on purpose). Here, it was all done on purpose to hide something. Big no no.

This is going to make the Martha thing look like penance.
     
Kerrigan
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Apr 2005
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 06:08 PM
 
If Apple's stock falls some more, then next week might be a good time to buy some shares, since in all likeliness the stock will be back up for MWSF.
     
Spliffdaddy
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: South of the Mason-Dixon line
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 07:37 PM
 
Steve will, no doubt, be serving some prison time for this scandal. The environment is *just right* nowadays for corporate bigshots to be severely punished. Gone are the days when they merely got a slap on the wrist.

Don't kid yourselves...it'll be a good opportunity to make an example out of a semi-well-known executive. Steve Jobs isn't widely loved - except for a few computer geeks.
     
besson3c
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: yes
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 07:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by ::maroma:: View Post
I'm not suggesting that at all. I was merely stating my hope, in the form of an uneducated prediction, that all will turn out well for Apple in this matter. If Steve is found guilty of something that warrants his dismissal, then I'm all for him taking responsibility for his crime(s). If that means being fired, stepping down, or whatever, then so be it. But I'll be very sad.

Me too.. I see what you're saying. However, pragmatically speaking, I don't think it would surprise me if he did it knowingly either..
     
Chuckit
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Diego, CA, USA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 07:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by Spliffdaddy View Post
Steve Jobs isn't widely loved - except for a few computer geeks and most people in the media and really anybody who has bought an iPod.
With these additions, I agree with you.
Chuck
___
"Instead of either 'multi-talented' or 'multitalented' use 'bisexual'."
     
Jawbone54
Posting Junkie
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Louisiana
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 07:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chuckit View Post
With these additions, I agree with you.
Ditto. The media gushes constantly over Jobs.
     
besson3c
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: yes
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 08:04 PM
 
So, here's the question...

Somebody points a gun at your head, says you have to either kiss Steve Jobs or Bill O'Reilly on the lips. Who do you kiss?
     
Kerrigan
Addicted to MacNN
Join Date: Apr 2005
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 08:07 PM
 
Why do you bring politics into everything? You've attempted to derail this thread a bunch of times, please grow up.
     
Chuckit
Clinically Insane
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: San Diego, CA, USA
Status: Offline
Reply With Quote
Dec 28, 2006, 08:12 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
So, here's the question...

Somebody points a gun at your head, says you have to either kiss Steve Jobs or Bill O'Reilly on the lips. Who do you kiss?
Adriana Lima. At least I'd die happy.
Chuck
___
"Instead of either 'multi-talented' or 'multitalented' use 'bisexual'."
     
 
Thread Tools
 
Forum Links
Forum Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts
BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Top
Privacy Policy
All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:44 PM.
All contents of these forums © 1995-2017 MacNN. All rights reserved.
Branding + Design: www.gesamtbild.com
vBulletin v.3.8.8 © 2000-2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.,