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cold aspiration · Jul 11, 2006, 12:40 AM

Hey guys,

I am nearing the deadline to get my rebate for my free ipod nano that I got with the mac. I want to make sure before I do any of these deals that I have a perfect mac that I would never want to return. The only thing wrong with my mac that I noticed in the few weeks that I have had it is the whine. I just can't get rid of it without the mirror widget ... I know there are lots of threads about the whine but I already know what it is, I just want to know my options. Is it worth it to take the chance to get my MBP relaced for a new one?? Or is the whine just way too commonplace to justify it.. On another note, does apple even replace MBPs if its returned in a month because of the whine? Or do they just ask you to send in the MBP to the repair center ...

Thanks

Jason · Jul 11, 2006, 03:15 AM

Hi cold aspiration,
I can only speak of my own experiences, and that is; if you have a MBP with the 'normal whine' then then the apple stores (resellers) don't want to replace it due to the fact that they think a replacement machine will share the same problems. However if you have other problems with the machine, or other 'whine noises' then they will be more inclined to make the swap! I'm getting a replacement because of a constand irritating whine coming from the bottom of the LCD, i'm now just waiting for the apple reseller to call me...

Also regarding replacements in the one month period, i'm not too sure about that, however i know that apple have the 7-10 day period where you can do the old DOA to get the replacement.

Good luck!

dahcar · Jul 11, 2006, 01:42 PM

Apple's policy on the whine: "what whine?"

imitchellg5 · Jul 11, 2006, 02:22 PM

He he he very true. When I got my iMac G5, it had the video card problem within weeks. They denied any problems. Now they have a warrenty extension for it.

Simon · Jul 11, 2006, 02:49 PM

I think originally Apple only swapped boards if you had the TFT inverter whine. They didn't do anything about the CPU whine. But I just read on MacFixIt that people are supposedly getting back MBPs with new boards that were redesigned and have no whine.

fowler · Jul 11, 2006, 06:10 PM

They're replacing my logic board as we speak. I had that whine that turned off when you turned on the iSight.

QueenOfSwords · Jul 11, 2006, 06:19 PM

Originally Posted by fowler

They're replacing my logic board as we speak. I had that whine that turned off when you turned on the iSight.

Really? Nice. Let us know how it goes.

I hope they put together some new boards for we 1.83 owners as well. ShhMBP works, but I'd like that 20 min of battery life back.

Simon · Jul 12, 2006, 02:55 AM

Originally Posted by fowler

They're replacing my logic board as we speak. I had that whine that turned off when you turned on the iSight.

That means you had the CPU whine. Good to hear you're getting your board swapped. I hope you still have your original serial number. When you get the repaired MBP back, could you post if the MBP itself has the same serial number (check the label inside the battery bay) as before and what serial number (the first 5 digits are enough) the motherboard has?

harrisjamieh · Jul 12, 2006, 03:06 AM

Yeh Apple has brought out a new version of the logic board for the Pro's that has no whine. When they send the MacBooks w/new boards back, they also send new installation discs (with 10.4.6, as this is needed for the new board), as well as a letter explaining that its a new version board, needing 10.4.6 at least, to run.

cold aspiration · Jul 12, 2006, 03:41 AM

So that means I can get my whine fixed but I'll have to send it in to the repair center?..

Simon · Jul 12, 2006, 03:59 AM

Yes. At least that's what's being reported.

salaryman · Jul 12, 2006, 08:59 AM

Originally Posted by cold aspiration

So that means I can get my whine fixed but I'll have to send it in to the repair center?..

My MBP is currently being repaired.

It took several hours of phone calls to Apple Support to get them to take it back in - the 1st/2nd line support people are obviously told to say that it's 'normal' to whine like this but if you are persistent you will get the case escalated to a Product Specialist. As soon as this happened to me, the Specialist acknowledged the problem and sent a box for me to send the MBP back for repair (a new logic board apparently).

I'll let you know if the whine is fixed when I receive the machine back (couple of days I think).

cold aspiration · Jul 12, 2006, 01:49 PM

^nice, I hope it works out for you. Currently, I've read up on all those software work arounds but I don't want to do something like editing a kext file that I will regret. So for now, I am doing the thing where you turn the miror widget on and then off. Then put the computer to sleep and then waking up. I can't seem to find any side effects to this and it makes the mbp silent.

dimmer · Jul 12, 2006, 01:57 PM

Apple's policy on the whine: they wish you'd stop.

salaryman · Jul 12, 2006, 02:10 PM

Originally Posted by cold aspiration

^nice, I hope it works out for you. Currently, I've read up on all those software work arounds but I don't want to do something like editing a kext file that I will regret. So for now, I am doing the thing where you turn the miror widget on and then off. Then put the computer to sleep and then waking up. I can't seem to find any side effects to this and it makes the mbp silent.

I found that if you upgrade to MacOS 10.4.7 then the mirror widget fix doesn't work any more. I reckon you should send it back and get it fixed!

fowler · Jul 12, 2006, 02:27 PM

I didn't have to do much work at all. I took it in to an Apple store with a short list of what was wrong, including the whine, my airport losing connection after it went to sleep and the processor getting stuck at 1ghz, he went to the back room then came out and said they were going to replace my junk. We'll see. I guess I'll have it back this weekend.. or next weekend.

once i get it back, I'll check the serial and see if they've changed anything.

cold aspiration · Jul 12, 2006, 05:00 PM

Originally Posted by salaryman

I found that if you upgrade to MacOS 10.4.7 then the mirror widget fix doesn't work any more. I reckon you should send it back and get it fixed!

the mirror widget works for me even after 10.4.7, but yeah, i think its best to get this fixed before the school year.

dahcar · Jul 12, 2006, 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by fowler

I didn't have to do much work at all. I took it in to an Apple store with a short list of what was wrong, including the whine, my airport losing connection after it went to sleep and the processor getting stuck at 1ghz, he went to the back room then came out and said they were going to replace my junk. We'll see. I guess I'll have it back this weekend.. or next weekend.

once i get it back, I'll check the serial and see if they've changed anything.

How do you find the processor speed? Did your airport lose connection every time it went to sleep? Mine does it randomly and I can't seem to replicate it, which means I'll never be able to prove it to a "genius."

nerd · Jul 12, 2006, 05:39 PM

What does the whine sound like? I can hear a faint sound coming from mine but it's nothing compaired to the G5 chirp. Is the whine as loud as the G5?

salaryman · Jul 14, 2006, 06:37 AM

Originally Posted by salaryman

My MBP is currently being repaired.

It took several hours of phone calls to Apple Support to get them to take it back in - the 1st/2nd line support people are obviously told to say that it's 'normal' to whine like this but if you are persistent you will get the case escalated to a Product Specialist. As soon as this happened to me, the Specialist acknowledged the problem and sent a box for me to send the MBP back for repair (a new logic board apparently).

I'll let you know if the whine is fixed when I receive the machine back (couple of days I think).

I have received the machine back and, unexpectedly, the 'Proof of repair' says they have replaced the left and right fan - no mention of a logic board replacement. I'm not in a position to test for the whine right now (I'm at work) but I'll post a response later regarding whether this has fixed the whine.

I'm really not hopeful right now

Jason · Jul 14, 2006, 10:23 AM

Yes please let us know whether the whine has gone away or not. I have my replacement machine in the box! i booted it up at the apple reseller and it seemed a lot better although i still have to check it by making the CPU work a bit harder. I hope its all good!

salaryman · Jul 14, 2006, 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by Jason

Yes please let us know whether the whine has gone away or not. I have my replacement machine in the box! i booted it up at the apple reseller and it seemed a lot better although i still have to check it by making the CPU work a bit harder. I hope its all good!

Needless to say the whine is still there! Doh! It's actually not as bad as it was but it's still there for sure.

However, the replacement of the left and right fan appears to have marginally improved the heat issues I was having. CoreDuoTemp used to report an idle temperature of around 65C. Now it's more like 55-60C. Hardly worth it was it?

I have spoken, yet again, to Apple about this and I have now been told that the Product Specialist made a mistake - he typed into his system that my MBP had the 2.0GHz processor instead of the 2.16GHz processor and it told him to replace the logic board. However, the 2.16GHz processor already has the new board. Jeez...

So (again) I have been told there is nothing they can do. The specialist I spoke to tonight (different one) is going to talk to his superiors and to discuss it further then get back to me on Monday. I'll report back when I hear anything....

QueenOfSwords · Jul 14, 2006, 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by dahcar

Apple's policy on the whine: "what whine?"

Apple's policy on the whine -

Technician with fingers in their ears - "THE WHINE IS WITHIN SPEC! LA LA LA! CAN'T HEAR THE WHINE!"

Kidding....

If there *is* in fact a new board that takes care of heat and whine (and it looks like a few lucky MBP owners have one), I might have to turn my (1.83) machine in for repair as well.

It's winter in Melbourne so currently I don't mind it heating my home

won't like it in summer though.

harrisjamieh · Jul 14, 2006, 02:46 PM

Originally Posted by QueenOfSwords

Apple's policy on the whine -

Technician with fingers in their ears - "THE WHINE IS WITHIN SPEC! LA LA LA! CAN'T HEAR THE WHINE!"

Kidding....

If there *is* in fact a new board that takes care of heat and whine (and it looks like a few lucky MBP owners have one), I might have to turn my (1.83) machine in for repair as well.

It's winter in Melbourne so currently I don't mind it heating my home

won't like it in summer though.

Actually, I doubt there is a new logic board for the 1.83 versions, seeing as they are no longer made.. I can't imagine Apple spending money developing a new board for it if they no longer sell it...

QueenOfSwords · Jul 14, 2006, 04:18 PM

Originally Posted by harrisjamieh

Actually, I doubt there is a new logic board for the 1.83 versions, seeing as they are no longer made.. I can't imagine Apple spending money developing a new board for it if they no longer sell it...

Well one reported lucky recipient (http://discussions.apple.com/thread....60387&tstart=0) has the same machine. Besides, these machines have up to 3 years warranty left on them, even refurbs (mine's only a week or two old). They have to have boards in stock to cover that.
Worst case scenario, they have 1.83 Core Duo chips, and the MBP logic boards are all the same (128 VRAM anyway), they can slap together a few on demand if needed.

fowler · Jul 14, 2006, 09:54 PM

I got my computer back and as far as I can tell, there isn't much of a difference, aside from it running a lot cooler.. I haven't check for the whine yet, but I will soon.

drewcifer · Jul 15, 2006, 02:49 AM

ughhhh im so on the fence as to whether or not i should try to get mine repaired.
the crooked keys/heat/whine are getting on my nerves. I really dont wanna go through the process though, sounds like a pain.

@fowler
how did you discover that your processor wasnt running at full speed??

cambro · Jul 15, 2006, 08:38 AM

Originally Posted by fowler

I haven't check for the whine yet, but I will soon.

You have to "check" for the whine???

I don't see how you could possibly miss it unless you are partially deaf or talking about a whine other than the processor whine. It freaking drives me crazy and I can't ignore it even with ambient noise.

drewcifer, I'm in the same boat. I think I may try to go to an Apple Store and talk to someone about the problem and then go from there. It would be good for me to take a break from working on this thing anway!

fowler · Jul 15, 2006, 12:04 PM

My hearing is pretty good.. and the whine has never been unbearable. Maybe in a quiet room it can get annoying, but when it's 100º outside and fans are a blazin', it's probably not something that stands out too much.

As far as the processor, coreduo temp tells you how fast it's running.

I wish there was a program that would ping it at it's fastest speed while it's plugged in..

salaryman · Jul 17, 2006, 07:52 AM

Originally Posted by salaryman

So (again) I have been told there is nothing they can do. The specialist I spoke to tonight (different one) is going to talk to his superiors and to discuss it further then get back to me on Monday. I'll report back when I hear anything....

I have now been told that the noise was tested when my machine was 'repaired' and was "found to be acceptable". This is beyond a joke.

Apple refuse to repair the problem (they say they can't fix it) and I have been referred to After Sales Support. During my initial conversation with them I was told that I could NOT have a replacement or a refund, namely because it is 3 months since I bought it (despite them having a record of my dozen or so support calls over the past 2 months). I complained about this and a "supervisor" is looking over my case and is going to call me back tomorrow with a decision.

What a joke. If they come back to me and say nothing can be done, what can I do? Absolutely nothing, that's what.

I'm fuming about this. I moved from the PC world to Mac with this machine and it's been a devastating experience. If I can't get a refund I'll most certainly be punting the MBP on eBay and buying a PC. The funny thing is, even by doing this I'll still have money left over.

Troll · Jul 20, 2006, 09:51 AM

I have a Dell Latitude D620 as a work machine and the 2GHz MBP at home. Both have the whine. Don't be sure that moving over to the PC is going to solve your problem.

My MBP has both whine - inverter and processor. I also have the battery issue. I took it in today and asked about the whine. The repair guy said they know about both whines and that both are reparable. We'll see if they do manage to fix it though.

hickey · Jul 20, 2006, 11:50 AM

my 1.25ghz pbook whines sometimes, but I have music playing almost constantly, so i rarely notice it

Dave Hagan · Jul 20, 2006, 05:00 PM

Originally Posted by Troll

I have a Dell Latitude D620 as a work machine and the 2GHz MBP at home. Both have the whine. Don't be sure that moving over to the PC is going to solve your problem.

My MBP has both whine - inverter and processor. I also have the battery issue. I took it in today and asked about the whine. The repair guy said they know about both whines and that both are reparable. We'll see if they do manage to fix it though.

I want to verify that the notebooks on the PC side whine too. I am writing this post from a Latitude D620 and whines just like the MBP.

salaryman · Jul 20, 2006, 05:04 PM

Originally Posted by Dave Hagan

I want to verify that the notebooks on the PC side whine too. I am writing this post from a Latitude D620 and whines just like the MBP.

This is really bad news isn't it? I found it very hard to work with the whining, it was so annoying.

Perhaps it's an Intel quality control issue? Hopefully they'll sort it out by Merom then I'll have a quieter and a faster MBP!

mduell · Jul 20, 2006, 07:46 PM

Originally Posted by salaryman

Perhaps it's an Intel quality control issue? Hopefully they'll sort it out by Merom then I'll have a quieter and a faster MBP!

I don't believe it's anything Intel-specifc, but rather an inductor design issue. I've seen/heard desktop motherboards and graphics cards that whined.

EdipisReks · Jul 21, 2006, 08:57 PM

Originally Posted by harrisjamieh

Actually, I doubt there is a new logic board for the 1.83 versions, seeing as they are no longer made.. I can't imagine Apple spending money developing a new board for it if they no longer sell it...

i have a 1.83, and i just got mine back from apple. new mainboard, no whine, lower temps.

npeterh · Jul 21, 2006, 10:11 PM

How did you get it repaired, via Apple Store and was it within the first 30 days?
I dont feel like handing it in just to get it back with the same whine.

What temparature did you record before and after?

Thanks

Peter

EdipisReks · Jul 22, 2006, 02:28 PM

it was through AppleCare, not a store. i've had my laptop for about three months. temps would spike as high as 90*C and would usually stay in the mid 60's *C during normal usage (azureus, surfing the web, watching DIVX videos, often all at the same time). the highest temp i've seen since was 75*c which was while azureus was running multiple torrents and i was transferring 30 GB of data to my MBP from another computer via ethernet. normal running temps are now in the upper 40's* to mid 50's*. i consider that a pretty substantial improvement. also, since i'm not having to run speedit, or any other whine cancelling hack, i have regained 30 to 45 minutes of battery life. this is the laptop that should have been sent to me originally. sucks that it took so long to get it properly fixed, but i really like the machine now.

EdipisReks · Jul 22, 2006, 02:30 PM

one last thing. they didn't just replace the mainboard, they replaced the temp sensor and the heatpipe/heatsink assembly. the fan comes on more often now, though it stays quiet. before the repair, the fan would only come on every once in a while, and would only come on full bore. this mainboard also seems to apply speedstep more aggressively while the machine is on battery power.

cold aspiration · Jul 23, 2006, 02:14 AM

How about an update from anyone else? Is anyone else finding that apple finally fixes the whine once you send it in applecare?

EdipisReks · Jul 23, 2006, 08:47 PM

ugh, i've started getting the dreaded ticking fan under the delete key. my laptop was great for a whole one day after the repair.

anyone know if Apple will fix the fan issue quickly? this will be the fourth time in a month i've had to send this thing in (twice was due to Apple botching a repair).

dahcar · Jul 25, 2006, 05:52 PM

i took mine into the apple store today and said that i have an annoying noise coming from it that gets worse with each os x update and that i know there is a new logic board that will eliminate the noise. he took it to the back room to listen then said they'd replace it but it would only reduce the noise by 1 or 2 decibels. they estimated 5 days. it's going to be a long 5 days, but i'll let you know when i get it back.

i emailed this to myself to show them if there was an issue where they said it was "within spec" http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=303365

alphasubzero949 · Jul 25, 2006, 08:55 PM

Originally Posted by dahcar

Apple's policy on the whine: "what whine?"

http://www.osx86project.org/index.ph...d=221&Itemid=2

There are a few very interesting points about this KB article.

First, notice that it just covers the 15-inch model, despite the fact that other models exhibit the same problems.

Second, check out the date at the bottom of the page. It seems the problem was noticed as early as February 24, 2006 but wasn't made public until July 21, 2006. That means that Apple was aware of the issue as the first units were being shipped back in February... but didn't take the time to either 1) let the public know about it by making the KB article live or 2) working to fix the problem!

Frankly Apple's behavior should surprise no one. It's the same old song with a different verse (e.g. PowerBook G4 white spots, iBook G3 logic boards, Cube cracks, etc.).

dahcar · Jul 25, 2006, 09:19 PM

as for the date it was "created," that is questionable. Apple reuses old templates from previous postings. I'm too lazy to find it now but i saw a posting on MBP heat issues that said it was created sometime in 1998. i'm willing to bet Apple didn't know about heat issues on the MBP back then.

Anyway, my logic board is being replaced, as long as it comes back quiet i'll consider my machine perfect and 100% satisfied.

cold aspiration · Jul 25, 2006, 10:27 PM

I read on the the apple discussion forums that many many users were successful at getting back a queit MBP after sending it in to applecare after the "new" logic board was announced. This inspired me to call applecare and get my whine fixed while its summer and I have the time. Well, my rep wasn't surprised with my issue and told me it was a "known issue" but ONLY for the 15" MBP. My reaction, O_o, !!!, sldfkjsd!!. I even pointed out the new logic board that people received seemed to fix the problem according to an extremely long thread on apple discussion board (when are they going to incorporate pages??? ). Anyway, so the rep told me he would send a box and the techs will examine my MBP 17" for the issue and will most likely address it in one way or another. I hope they do address it instead of sending it back or applecare will get a very angry phone call from me.

The rep had me do these "troubleshooting" steps:

1.Close everything and open one finder window. Let it sit there for one minute. Then drag the window around the screen and see if the sound changes.

2. Lower and increase the brightness of the screen and listen for the sound changing.

My sound of course remained constant at all times. I did tell the rep that it goes away with heavy cpu usage. Later on, he told me it was probablyl the power inverter?? I just really hope I get a silent MBP back. I'll tell you guys how it goes, lucky 15" owners.......

Simon · Jul 26, 2006, 02:45 AM

Originally Posted by cold aspiration

The rep had me do these "troubleshooting" steps:

1.Close everything and open one finder window. Let it sit there for one minute. Then drag the window around the screen and see if the sound changes.

2. Lower and increase the brightness of the screen and listen for the sound changing.

My sound of course remained constant at all times. I did tell the rep that it goes away with heavy cpu usage. Later on, he told me it was probablyl the power inverter?? I just really hope I get a silent MBP back. I'll tell you guys how it goes, lucky 15" owners.......

The rep was trying to find out if you had the inverter whine (whine amplitude changes depending on screen brightness setting) or if you had the CPU whine. Since your whine seems to be independent of the screen brightness setting, it's the CPU whine.

lars-man · Jul 26, 2006, 03:24 AM

Finally, an official statement from Apple?

http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=303365

Kind regards, Lars

cold aspiration · Jul 26, 2006, 03:24 AM

Originally Posted by Simon

The rep was trying to find out if you had the inverter whine (whine amplitude changes depending on screen brightness setting) or if you had the CPU whine. Since your whine seems to be independent of the screen brightness setting, it's the CPU whine.

Yeah that is what I figured. I am aware of the different whines. However, I found it strange that he still thought it was the inverter whine at the end... Plus, he had to go talk to a specialist in order to see what troubleshooting steps to take, put me on hold for 10 minutes to do so ... I don't think he was too knowledable about the problem.

However, I trust a tech will be able to recognize it. The following is the problem description I got in my email to confirm my repair request.
Problem Description: Customer sensory issues - Unusually noisy: CPU/Unit

olli_g · Jul 26, 2006, 10:04 AM

Originally Posted by cold aspiration

I read on the the apple discussion forums that many many users were successful at getting back a queit MBP after sending it in to applecare after the "new" logic board was announced.

This new logic board fixes the CPU whine?

With the Knowledge Base article that was posted yesterday, is Apple acknowledging the brightness whine or the CPU whine? Does this article mean, they are finally fixing the CPU whine or just the brightness whine?

Because my MBP 15'' has the CPU whine (the one that can be eliminated with Photo Booth), and I want to get it fixed in the next couple of weeks...

cold aspiration · Jul 26, 2006, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by olli_g

This new logic board fixes the CPU whine?

With the Knowledge Base article that was posted yesterday, is Apple acknowledging the brightness whine or the CPU whine? Does this article mean, they are finally fixing the CPU whine or just the brightness whine?

Because my MBP 15'' has the CPU whine (the one that can be eliminated with Photo Booth), and I want to get it fixed in the next couple of weeks...

I'm sorry I can't give you the direct link to the apple discussion thread (that place is a mess) but if you are 15" you have a very high chance to get the whine fixed in my opinion from reading all the happy 15" owners there. Haven't found a person with a 17" that got it fixed on the forums yet. You should try calling applecare when you get the time, the whine shouldn't be something you are forced to put up with.

On another note, the current status of my repair says that it is on hold waiting on parts. So that is good that they are actually doing something to it instead of just sending it back to me.

. Fingers crossed the whine is gone