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You are here: MacNN Forums > Software - Troubleshooting and Discussion > macOS > Are you going to dive into Panther or wait a bit?

Are you going to dive into Panther or wait a bit?
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danengel
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Oct 9, 2003, 06:49 AM
 
... just as I should have with the 10.2.8 Update

Are you going to install it at 24/10 at 9 pm, or do you want to wait a few weeks to make sure it *really* works?

I'll polish the baseball bat to make sure I'll get one at 8 pm
     
pjmurphy
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Oct 9, 2003, 06:54 AM
 
Originally posted by danengel:
... just as I should have with the 10.2.8 Update

Are you going to install it at 24/10 at 9 pm, or do you want to wait a few weeks to make sure it *really* works?

I'll polish the baseball bat to make sure I'll get one at 8 pm
Dive in? The Speedos are all ready on!
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Eriamjh
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Oct 9, 2003, 06:59 AM
 
Wait. Too busy to spend and hour or two installing/reinstalling an OS when the one I have runs fine. Waiting for a special from Amazon or something....

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sanity assassin
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Oct 9, 2003, 07:00 AM
 
Oh yeah, always willing to be a crash test dummy

I'll put the client version on one machine, and maybe on the others, but I've got Panther server coming too, but will wait a bit to install that.
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chris v
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Oct 9, 2003, 07:30 AM
 
Depends on cash flow. I'll prolly stick it on a partition on my home machine relatively soon and play with it for a couple weeks before installing it at work.

CV

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stew
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Oct 9, 2003, 08:09 AM
 
I will need to install it in order to work with the new CoreAudio features.


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RooneyX
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Oct 9, 2003, 09:12 AM
 
DIVE! My Alu17 doesn't really need it but my Alu12 feels a tiny bit sluggish even with 384MBs, even though I only use it for writing.
     
cambro
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Oct 9, 2003, 09:13 AM
 
I will install it that same evening!

Can't wait for Expose...it will greatly streamline my workflow.
     
ligux
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Oct 9, 2003, 09:15 AM
 
I will keep my G4 867 with 10.2.6, that works pretty fine. And I will have a try with Panther in my hopefully new PB12".
-Mac G4 867, 240Gb HD, +1gb Ram . OS9.2.2 and OS X 10,2,8
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Preciousss
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Oct 9, 2003, 12:38 PM
 
I'm gonna dive into the local Apple store that evening to see all the features demo-ed and hang with the rest of the freaks (went to the Jag release party and it was like a rock concert--lines around the block, people all excited).

But I won't buy a copy just yet. I'd rather wait to read all of the reports here and elsewhere first for any freakiness.

     
Mrjinglesusa
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Oct 9, 2003, 01:38 PM
 
Already dove. 7B85 on both my Pismo and 800 MHz 17" iMac. Panther is, in a word, awesome.
     
mitchell_pgh
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Oct 9, 2003, 01:45 PM
 
I'm going to dive in. If there are problems, Apple will [should] correct them within the first few days via software update.

I'm also planning on a new hard drive and RAM upgrade...

I thought I would do them all at the same time.
     
alphasubzero949
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Oct 9, 2003, 02:37 PM
 
Diving In
     
barbarian
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Oct 9, 2003, 02:55 PM
 
As the Panther Beta is more robust than even 10.2, I will install the minute I get it in the mail.
     
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Oct 9, 2003, 03:01 PM
 
I dove at WWDC and I keep swimming at 7B85. I can seriously never go back to Jaguar. Too slow, too many features on Panther I can never live without.

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Cop Rock
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Oct 9, 2003, 03:07 PM
 
Diving in with my PowerBook, waiting on my Cube. (Just as I did with the 10.2.8 Update.)
     
mitchell_pgh
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Oct 9, 2003, 03:12 PM
 
Yah, the 10.2.8 update hurt the reputation of Apple. It was one of the worst ever!

I'm going to hold off on my work computer.
     
BZ
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Oct 9, 2003, 03:18 PM
 
DIVE!!! DIVE!!! DIVE!!!

I have had so few problems with upgrading from one X to another (10b -> 10 -> 10.1 -> 10.2) that I will be installing this on the first day...

It will be like 3/24/2001 all over again!

BZ
     
RAILhead
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Oct 9, 2003, 03:42 PM
 
I already dove: I've been running it on my PowerBook and 1GHz G4 at work since 7B21 and it's been great. I'll also be picking up a Family Pack the 24th to complete the installs on my other Macs.

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BrunoBruin
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Oct 9, 2003, 03:49 PM
 
I have two copies coming and one will go on my PowerBook as fast as I can get the CD out of the packaging. If all goes well, the second copy will go on my work machine the next morning! I always dive right in, I installed 10.0 on my work box the day it was released.
     
businezguy
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Oct 9, 2003, 04:21 PM
 
More then any hardware release, or new gadge Apple releases, this is what I look forward to most. I love new operating systems, with their added functonality, and Panther has a lot of the features I have desired. I hope the increased speed is as good as everybody has been saying. My iBook could use a little boost.
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malvolio
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Oct 9, 2003, 07:33 PM
 
Originally posted by Eriamjh:
Waiting for a special from Amazon or something....
Yeah, judging by past history, MacZone or MacMall or one of those folks will soon mail me a catalog offering Panther for $99 with free shipping.
Since I'm not eligible for a educational discount, I'll go for an offer like that.
/mal
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Superchicken
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Oct 9, 2003, 07:38 PM
 
Ed discount. I'll be in winnipeg and at the U of M book store to buy saturday or friday hehe... my new iBook is pleading for Panther. She says to me... David buy me that sleek new sexy OS, then you can make all your bible college friends swoon over Expose!

Not to mention the refined Finder and Save sheets are more than enough for the cash I'll be layin down.
     
keston
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Oct 9, 2003, 07:52 PM
 
I think i will put it on my Laptop (Pismo - Non-main machine) for a week or two before I put it on my G4/Desktop (main) machine. I cant afford any catastrophes on my main machine.
     
Person Man
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Oct 9, 2003, 08:04 PM
 
Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
Yah, the 10.2.8 update hurt the reputation of Apple. It was one of the worst ever!
How, pray tell, did it hurt their reputation? Certainly the iTunes 2 erase-your-hard drive thing was worse?

Apple pulled the 10.2.8 release within hours of it being released, and then released a fix roughly 10 days later. They not only released a fixed version, but they also released a 550K fix for those who installed the flawed version.

That said, never install an update (or major upgrade for that matter) on a machine you rely on to do work. Even if it is from a company that you normally would trust. Play around with it on a "non-production machine" or "non-production partition" first. Then, when you're satisfied that it is "OK," you can put it into your production workflow.

Geez, Apple is allowed to make a mistake now and again. But no, people around here put them on such a pedestal, that when Apple makes a mistake, they're "becoming more like Microsoft"

If this were Microsoft, it probably would have been up for more than a few hours, and it would take them a month or more to release a fix. And all the while, they would deny that there was a problem.
     
theolein
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Oct 9, 2003, 08:15 PM
 
Wait. I'm not that much in a hurry and installing a new OS always messes up my old settings. I'll let others do the walking a bit first first to see how the new changes shape up (apps, the shell etc).
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javabeans
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Oct 9, 2003, 08:38 PM
 
Dive in....I read from www.slashdot.org that 10.3 is faster even on old hardware...I have a PB 17' ....so I wont be waiting...
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tdvorak
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Oct 9, 2003, 08:46 PM
 
I won't be waiting either. Everything that I have read says the OS is faster on older hardware. I am also really curious to see what has been done to the UI. I accept the risk.

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WJMoore
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Oct 9, 2003, 09:22 PM
 
I ordered it as soon as I read it was announceed. Due to typical international delays and the fact that I will be doing a clean install requiring a backup prior to installation it will probably be a week or so after the release before I install it. By that time I imagine any issues will have been exposed on these forums and I will know what to be careful of, if anything.
     
asxless
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Oct 9, 2003, 10:23 PM
 
I'm waiting for 10.4 because...
* 10.4 will almost certainly cost the same whether I upgrade to 10.3 or stick with 10.2.
* 10.4 will probably be available in about a year.
* 10.4 will include 350* more "innovative new features" than 10.2, making it an even better value
* By that time, I'll have had time to use the rest of the 150 'innovative new features' that were included in the 10.2 update. As much as I like messing around with Macs, there are other things in life that I enjoy.

And frankly, I'm pretty happy with 10.2. Oh, I'd like a better Finder. But the 10.3 Finder is both better (speed, bug fixes, etc.) and worse (iTunes 'user centric' GUI - get serious!) than the 10.2 Finder. An improved Preview would be nice. But these are the ONLY two highlighted features that I find even remotely interesting after reading Apple's Panther pages several times over the last few months. I'd need to be schizophrenic to need "fast user switching", have never even launched iChat, long time ago developed a window management/work flow that makes Expose cute but irrelevant, etc. And all that under the hood (bonnet) stuff... well, I'm pretty happy with 10.2.

Before you hit that reply button...
I know many (perhaps most) MacNN forum readers find the new Finder, Preview and the other 148 'innovative new features' in 10.3 to be compelling reasons to upgrade ASAP. That great. I wish you a happy Oct 24th

BTW I probably won't be upgrading any of our other major commercial software (Adobe, Macromedia, etc.) during this time frame either. The current versions are reasonably good and will do everything we need for at least another year. And I already know they work with the version of OS X that I'll be using till next fall.

-- asxless in iLand

* If 10.2 had over 100 more 'innovative new features' than 10.1 and 10.3 has 150 innovative new features, then surely 10.4 will have at least 200 more innovative new features than 10.3
( Last edited by asxless; Oct 9, 2003 at 10:31 PM. )
     
TheIceMan
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Oct 10, 2003, 12:19 AM
 
I just dove in about 10 minutes ago. Couldn't resist. I figure that with some issues of the 15" Aluminum PowerBooks, I'll just get Panther and wait til the Rev.B of the 15" comes out (of course that might be 1-2 yrs), hopefully by then the G5's will be in them. For now, I'm happy with Panther.
     
Jim_MDP
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Oct 10, 2003, 02:40 AM
 
asxless,

I understand...I passed on .2 until just ~5-6 months ago. It got to where more shareware needed Jag than didn't so I got an upgrade that by then had dropped to US$30. No major feelings about waiting either way (and I'm one of the non-ADC buyers of the orig OS X public beta).

This one is different...

I'm close to your position about which new features I can take advantage of, however...

... the new finder window panel (ala iTunes) ROCKS! Especially in open/save dialogs.

I can't convey how tremendously better they are this new way.

much more to say, but basically ... however good feature x, y or z has been described in the threads here... the reality is better. The totality of this upgrade has to be experienced.

Honest.


*edit* - I didn't mention the sizable speed increase with my 400/G3 Pismo since most folks will have newer machines and won't get as much boost. But I'm pleased.
( Last edited by Jim_MDP; Oct 10, 2003 at 03:07 AM. )
     
nobitacu
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Oct 10, 2003, 06:14 AM
 
By 9 PM of that day, I'll have it up and running. Putting it where it belongs, in my Powerbook.

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yellowdog
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Oct 10, 2003, 10:21 AM
 
Just plunked down my $$$ for my Panther beta testing license and cleared my Saturday calendar for action. Can't wait to see it.
     
Spheric Harlot
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Oct 10, 2003, 10:44 AM
 
Originally posted by Jim_MDP:
basically ... however good feature x, y or z has been described in the threads here... the reality is better. The totality of this upgrade has to be experienced.

Honest.


*edit* - I didn't mention the sizable speed increase with my 400/G3 Pismo since most folks will have newer machines and won't get as much boost. But I'm pleased.
ALL OF THAT.

Expose alone is worth twice the money. It has absolutely revolutionized my workflow to the point where I - seriously - can't imagine ever being without it again on a 1024x768 screen (12" Powerbook).

The G3 iMac 400 (family computer, router, and file server via Airport) is a LOT better. a LOT. It's quite a bit nicer than my 12" Powerbook was, running Jaguar. Fast user switching is a NECESSITY.

I had Panther installed on the iMac for a couple of hours, doing setup and stuff, and after that, I seriously couldn't bear using Jaguar on my Powerbook any longer. Luckily, uControl and my audio interface seem to be the only conflicts on my machine, and the latter appears remedied by a beta driver sent to me by tech support.

Everything else - including Logic - appears fine, and is a LOT better than it ever was before.

And Expos� has changed my life.

-s*
     
lacrymology
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Oct 10, 2003, 11:17 AM
 
Panther is 1of2 reasons why I am going to buy a G5. The other 1/2 is the desire for Rev. B hardware. I am currently Mac-less, so perhaps I will be getting bug-free (relative to initial releases) versions of both the G5 and Panther.

-m
     
Scarpa
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Oct 10, 2003, 12:55 PM
 
I always wait on OS upgrades to be sure that the features I want really work as expected. Luckily everyone here seems to love jumping on the latest half-finished software so I won't have to wait long to hear what's good and bad.
     
Mrjinglesusa
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Oct 10, 2003, 01:09 PM
 
Originally posted by Scarpa:
I always wait on OS upgrades to be sure that the features I want really work as expected. Luckily everyone here seems to love jumping on the latest half-finished software so I won't have to wait long to hear what's good and bad.
Half-finished? It's by all accounts at least 60% finished.
     
Scarpa
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Oct 10, 2003, 01:53 PM
 
Originally posted by Mrjinglesusa:
Half-finished? It's by all accounts at least 60% finished.
LOL

My real point was I want to hear how the *production* software works, from average users.

I don't trust feedback from developers or testers. But honestly, it really does sound like Panther is going to kick ass and I will probably upgrade much sooner than I did to Jaguar.
     
timmerk
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Oct 10, 2003, 05:38 PM
 
I have to wait till November 15ish. That's when my free copy arives. Too bad not sooner.. :-(
     
clarkgoble
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Oct 10, 2003, 08:02 PM
 
I'll wait a little, if only because it will be a pain to do a fresh install. Further I use Fink and it'll probably take a while before everything works with 10.3. I figure if I wait for 10.3.1 that the big bugs the beta testing missed will be fixed. <grin>
     
jfischetti
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Oct 10, 2003, 09:59 PM
 
I'm in bay-bee and loving it!!!
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�
     
vsurfer
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Oct 10, 2003, 10:46 PM
 
I'm eager to get going with it, but will wait a week or so until feedback comes on Apache, MySQL and PHP and whatever else surfaces.
     
NYCFarmboy
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Oct 21, 2003, 07:27 PM
 
OK>..I was all set to at least try panther then I read this thread at Appleinsider:





The official release of Apple's Panther operating system is still 3 days away, but that has done little to stop early adopters. Last week Apple provided thousands of its premier and select developers with the final release of Mac OS X 10.3 Panther for personal, professional and testing purposes.

A number of users have written in to express slight frustration with speeds of the new OS when installed on slightly dated Apple computers, and those that do not meet the requirements for Apple's Quartz Extreme technology.

One of the primary complaints is poor window redraw speeds across the board. Users of G3 based and older G4 systems are citing multi-second delays during application switching. Apple benchmarks show that Quartz Extreme equipped G4 machines perform about 40% faster than those which support basic Quartz rendering.

The issues are not just limited to renderings, users say. One AppleInsider reader, running a Dual 500MHz G4 with 1.5GBs of RAM, claims that fast user switching requires almost a minutes wait. Emptying half a gigabyte of files from the trash on the same machine was said to take nearly 5 minutes.

"This isn't quite ready for prime time," exclaims the user. "Wasn't this supposed to be faster?"








having read this, my thoughts are to wait. I'm very very very happy with 10.2.8. I think I will wait on 10.3.1 before I upgrade again. I have a orange ibook g3 clamshell I may install Panther on for kicks. If I do that, it will be a clean install.

I understand that a clean install leads to better performance? Why is this?
     
Footy
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Oct 21, 2003, 07:45 PM
 
I would of course do my usual "dive right in" but I'm going back packing tomorrow and will be deep in the woods for the release party.

I'll pick it up Sunday when I get home, check things out here on MacNN and then "dive right in".
     
NYCFarmboy
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Oct 21, 2003, 08:15 PM
 
Originally posted by Footy:
I would of course do my usual "dive right in" but I'm going back packing tomorrow and will be deep in the woods for the release party.

I'll pick it up Sunday when I get home, check things out here on MacNN and then "dive right in".
Congratulations on your 1,000dth post!
     
rezzi
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Oct 21, 2003, 09:00 PM
 
A back flip with a 3/4 twist, since I can probably get it at an ed discount. Woo-hoo!
     
romanesq
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Oct 21, 2003, 09:32 PM
 


How could they, how could they?
Beat me to it....
By all means, Dive, Dive, Dive.
I really wanted to be the first to say that.

But to make it official, I don't have much fear on a 15" PB with what seems to me a very fast 10.2.8. I'll go ahead and try it first on the backup firewire disk first.

Based on all the reports I've heard, this is plenty tested recently and now with all the folks reports.

To me, it's absolutely fascinating that folks can install it on G3 systems. Wow.
Well, aye hearrrrr you
     
sushiism
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Oct 21, 2003, 09:53 PM
 
"I will keep my G4 867 with 10.2.6"
ahhh 10.2.6 forever!!!!!
dont think i'll upgrade i love jag and im not upgrading till the brushed metal finder goes anyway, i dislike that user centric ui crap, id upgrade if i could use it exactly like i do in jag (toolbar only icon view and aqua) just for the new preview, but otherwise nahhh not worth paying for a downgrade
     
aapljack
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Oct 21, 2003, 09:56 PM
 
I will definately dive right in on my new 15" PB, but I will probably wait a few days or a week before I put it on my desktop machine. More to deal with on the desktop. The PB is still pretty fresh, I'll probably reformat and all that.

Can't wait! I just hope Airborne can find my house this time!

-b
     
 
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