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Kaby Lake
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P
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Aug 31, 2016, 05:44 AM
 
So Kaby Lake is out and Apple hasn't even put Skylake in the MBP yet. Not that Kaby Lake changes anything remotely relevant, but still.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
OreoCookie
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Aug 31, 2016, 06:15 AM
 
Well, strictly speaking, Apple could only update their MacBook and MacBook Airs (with Y- and U-series cpus), the chips for the Pros haven't been released yet, correct? So then people who want new MacBook Pros have to wait. Even longer.
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P  (op)
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Aug 31, 2016, 07:09 AM
 
Sort of. The 13" uses U-series, but so far it has used higher TDP parts than these, and also tends to use parts with a bigger GPU - these are only the regular, GT2-style GPUs. Put another way, these are the 13" MBA chips. But still, it illustrates how crazy the current situation is.

I want to know who got fired over this. If they fired Forstall over maps and Papermaster over antenna-gate, someone should walk the plank for this mess.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
BLAZE_MkIV
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Aug 31, 2016, 08:39 AM
 
Cook needs to spend less time on social issues and deal with company issues.
     
Spheric Harlot
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Aug 31, 2016, 09:52 AM
 
Originally Posted by P View Post
I want to know who got fired over this. If they fired Forstall over maps and Papermaster over antenna-gate, someone should walk the plank for this mess.
The traditional Apple answer to that question would be "Intel".

It's almost impossible to believe that Apple isn't either working on an in-house alternative to the intel dependency, or looking at…AMD? What else is there?
     
OreoCookie
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Aug 31, 2016, 10:13 AM
 
Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot View Post
The traditional Apple answer to that question would be "Intel".

It's almost impossible to believe that Apple isn't either working on an in-house alternative to the intel dependency, or looking at…AMD? What else is there?
Well, apart from switching to ARM on its OS X machines, Apple won't have much of a choice. AMD has just gotten back to merely being competitive with Broadwell if AMD's benchmark numbers are to be believed. Those are the chips which are in the MacBook Pros right now. And there is no word on how efficient these are. While Intel is responsible for a lot of it, someone at Apple believed (and hopefully no longer believes) that it was ok to skip a generation of chips or two, and get away with it.
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P  (op)
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Aug 31, 2016, 12:10 PM
 
I'm sure there is a good reason that the MBP hasn't been updated, but I don't know which. Some options:

* They have a new MBP in the pipeline, someone thought to hold off on the Skylake update until that one dropped, and it got delayed. This is what I think, and this should lead to the firing of someone if true. They could have, should have, updated the MBP once with Skylake before the new model dropped, at the very least when it was delayed.
* There is a problem with Skylake and Apple is staying away from it for this reason. I very much doubt that, since it is used in the 27" iMac and the MacBook, but it has been rumored and MS has had issues with its Surfaces.
* They're holding off on the straight update because the redesign will use a lower TDP model and they don't want to show a performance regression. This is standard Apple behavior, but this should also be a firing offense, because they shouldn't drop the MBP to a lower TDP. They have the silly thin model already, and this isnt that.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
P  (op)
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Aug 31, 2016, 12:23 PM
 
As for alternatives... I sure Apple could replace Intel in the laptops now if it wanted to, the A9X in particular is plenty fast. It isn't really designed for more than 2 cores (actually the A7 cache arch was a better fit for that), but it could be. IPC probably even beats Intel now.

AMD finally has the new Zen arch on the way out. I could talk about that for pages of this thread, but the short version is that it looks a lot like the A9 and a lot like Skylake, but isn't here yet. AMD has shown a single benchmark where it barely beat a Broadwell-E when clock to the same level. It was an 8-core model, and there isn't an 8-core Skylake-E out yet, so AMD put it up against Intels best and seemingly matched it in IPC - on a single hand-picked benchmark, but still. Exact clocks it will launch at is unknown, but the 8-core model supposedly runs at 95W in at least one config, so that is very good (Broadwell 8-core goes all the way up to 140W for the highly clocked models, although there are also options for 85W and even 55W models.).

But none of those chips are here. Volume production for Zen without GPU is Q1 2017, while the mobile chips are a few months later still - and performance laptops was never AMDs target market. They want server revenue first.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
OreoCookie
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Aug 31, 2016, 08:24 PM
 
Originally Posted by P View Post
I'm sure there is a good reason that the MBP hasn't been updated, but I don't know which. Some options:
Yeah, none of these options make the DRI look good. Plus, some of the machines could have been updated with little to no effort and no Skylake-specific problems (the Mac Pro and the Mac mini come to mind).
Originally Posted by P View Post
As for alternatives... I sure Apple could replace Intel in the laptops now if it wanted to, the A9X in particular is plenty fast. It isn't really designed for more than 2 cores (actually the A7 cache arch was a better fit for that), but it could be. IPC probably even beats Intel now.
Apple could design a SoC specifically for the Mac, and that would evidently lead to different design choices. So I don't see the particular details of the A9 and A9X as an indication one way or the other.
Originally Posted by P View Post
AMD finally has the new Zen arch on the way out. I could talk about that for pages of this thread, but the short version is that it looks a lot like the A9 and a lot like Skylake, but isn't here yet. AMD has shown a single benchmark where it barely beat a Broadwell-E when clock to the same level.
Even if this one benchmark is “representative”, it just means AMD has caught up with Broadwell. I have the feeling that if Apple were to commission a custom part, the more interesting story would be told on the GPU side.
Originally Posted by P View Post
But none of those chips are here. Volume production for Zen without GPU is Q1 2017, while the mobile chips are a few months later still - and performance laptops was never AMDs target market. They want server revenue first.
Which makes sense because this is where the money is, and AMD's likely problem with higher power consumption is less of an issue.
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Ham Sandwich
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Sep 22, 2016, 12:55 PM
 
Any updates for the 15" Pro MacBook, will it be Kaby Lake?
( Last edited by Ham Sandwich; Sep 22, 2016 at 01:32 PM. )
     
P  (op)
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Sep 23, 2016, 04:00 AM
 
Depends on when it launches. Kaby Lake is still trickling out, so if the launch is soon (and I certainly hope it is), the bigger Kaby Lake CPUs may not be ready.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
Ham Sandwich
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Sep 26, 2016, 09:43 AM
 
Well maybe for WWDC it'll be, I'd like to see

WWDC 17: Back to the Mac.

I'd like to see the 13" model updated and the current 15" price reduced until updated. For a dGPU model put more fans and a faster processor. $2000 for an outdated gaming laptop is a bit nuts.

(And the Pro Macs updated, and iMacs reduced in price.)


Edit: Maybe sooner
http://wccftech.com/macbook-macbook-...alyst-october/
( Last edited by Ham Sandwich; Sep 26, 2016 at 10:04 AM. )
     
P  (op)
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Sep 26, 2016, 10:11 AM
 
They can't wait until WWDC, the MBPs are already WAY overdue for an update, and Apple's sales have dropped significantly over the last few months. We also know from inside sources that this is a real FUBAR situation for Apple retail, to not have new models for back-to-school. October is already extremely late.
The new Mac Pro has up to 30 MB of cache inside the processor itself. That's more than the HD in my first Mac. Somehow I'm still running out of space.
     
   
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