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Save my job (Page 2)
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sek929
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Feb 23, 2009, 04:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by Trygve View Post
When American auto manufacturers start making quality vehicles, maybe I'll buy one, but for now you could not pay me to take one of these off your hands.
If your looking for quality it's pretty much universally known America makes the best full size trucks on the market. The Tacoma bests the small size market but the Tundra is to overpriced and lacks a Heavy-Duty model.

Sounds like a mountain of bias, if you don't even know that the F150 is a marvelously engineered truck then you might want to stay out of this conversation.
     
OreoCookie
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Feb 23, 2009, 05:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
Yeah, and the poor Corvette ZR1's LS9 only manages to put out a paltry 638hp with its (bleck!) 2-valve heads and (barf!) pushrods. Having 320lb-ft of torque at 1000rpm is just terrible.
If you look at the specific power output, it's not so amazing, about 103 hp/l. Just as a comparison, the new 1.4 l engine in the VW Golf VI produces 10 % more per l of displacement than that while consuming 40 % less fuel than its predecessor at equal power output (a slightly less powerful 2 l engine). This engine isn't designed to make the Golf into a rocket-propelled gunship, it's not tuned for power. But it's more fuel economic, cleaner and has more specific power than a Corvette.

I'm not saying this to compare apples and oranges, I'm merely pointing out that quite a few components American cars use are of yesteryear. And even if they can keep up in terms of power, they cannot keep up in terms of fuel economy and cleanliness.
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Laminar
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Feb 23, 2009, 06:12 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
If you look at the specific power output, it's not so amazing, about 103 hp/l. Just as a comparison, the new 1.4 l engine in the VW Golf VI produces 10 % more per l of displacement than that while consuming 40 % less fuel than its predecessor at equal power output (a slightly less powerful 2 l engine). This engine isn't designed to make the Golf into a rocket-propelled gunship, it's not tuned for power. But it's more fuel economic, cleaner and has more specific power than a Corvette.

I'm not saying this to compare apples and oranges, I'm merely pointing out that quite a few components American cars use are of yesteryear. And even if they can keep up in terms of power, they cannot keep up in terms of fuel economy and cleanliness.
I wouldn't call a 430hp car capable of highway mileage in the high 20s inefficient. The LSX series is simple, lightweight, and versatile.

Old != outdated.

Cadillac admitted the only reason that they developed the Northstar 32V V8 was because their customers wanted this new DOHC technology, not because there was any specific advantage to it.

And I'm not sure why comments are being tossed specifically at American cars. I can't think of a mainstream American care that doesn't have overhead cams and multiple valves per cylinder (besides the Corvette), and base model 2-valve engine found in the F150 still keeps it competitive within its class.

Just because it's new doesn't mean it's better.
     
OreoCookie
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Feb 23, 2009, 06:43 PM
 
I would.
People don't want cars with a gas mileage in the high 20s -- and that's on the highway. The concept of having large-volume engines is outdated (no replacement for displacement, yeah, right!). Besides reducing gas consumption and pollution, smaller, more modern and efficient engines are the way to go. Not just because `newer = better', but because newer engines have tangible benefits. Chances are, your job is safer in a factory that produces parts for newer, more efficient engines.
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Laminar
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Feb 23, 2009, 06:53 PM
 
Originally Posted by OreoCookie View Post
I would.
People don't want cars with a gas mileage in the high 20s -- and that's on the highway.
I never said its mileage was impressive. I said the fact that it puts out 430hp and still gets mileage like that is impressive. And that's just the rated mileage. Users often report 30+ highway mpg out of these cars. The Mazdaspeed 3 puts out about 270 hp with a turbocharged DOHC 16V four cylinder, but only gets 25 highway mpg, and that's on premium gas.

The concept of having large-volume engines is outdated (no replacement for displacement, yeah, right!). Besides reducing gas consumption and pollution, smaller, more modern and efficient engines are the way to go. Not just because `newer = better', but because newer engines have tangible benefits. Chances are, your job is safer in a factory that produces parts for newer, more efficient engines.
There are many many more factors at work than simply displacement. An engine with large displacement and great low-end torque can be geared much lower. My roommate in college had a Grand Am with a 12 valve pushrod 3.4 V6. It had plenty of low end power and because of that at 70mph the car was geared so that it was only turning 1800rpm. My Mystique had a DOHC 24V 2.5 V6 that put out the exact same number of horsepower, but because its torque curve was much higher, it had to be geared higher, so at 70mph it was turning 3000rpm. My roommate could easily pull 28-30 highway mpg, but the best I could ever do was about 26-27, and that was using my best hypermiling skills. In this case, my more modern, fancy, better-hp-per-liter engine wasn't able to compete with a simpler, bigger engine in power AND efficiency, not to mention how easy that engine is to work on. Because of my Mystique's dual overhead cams and consequently wide valve covers, spark plug changes are quite a hassle (Ford recommends removing the entire intake manifold) and a good number of components have to be pulled off in order to get at one of the O2 sensors, which means big bucks for something that should be simple to replace.

Again, there are advantages to both technologies.
     
OreoCookie
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Feb 23, 2009, 07:04 PM
 
Again, that's a thing from the past. Most modern diesel engines have about the same torque as large V8s (something like 400 Nm and 185 hp for a 4 cylinder diesel engine with about 2.2 l displacement is nothing out of the ordinary). Ditto for the new VW engine I wrote about which has a supercharger and a turbo (so there is no turbo hole).

Larger displacement means more friction and less efficiency if you are using only a fraction of all of the available power. Also note that most newer engines are fitted with equally modern transmissions (e. g. VW's 7-speed DSG or 6-speed manuals). You won't save much if you still have 3- or 4-speed automatic trannies.
( Last edited by OreoCookie; Feb 23, 2009 at 07:14 PM. )
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
     
smacintush  (op)
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Apr 3, 2009, 04:28 PM
 
Well, looks like my job has been saved.

We've got several new jobs that are both high volume as well as being 4 cylinder. One of which will put us in a position to possibly attract some new customers (like Toyota) due to the technology required. We also got 2 new surprises that will mean ramping up production within the next few weeks. One of those is a customer that is bringing their business BACK FROM CHINA due to the logistical problems of having to wait 6-8 weeks for shipments to arrive by boat. Most of these are simple, easy to produce jobs that we will make a mint from. We also may be shedding a job (due to some of the things going on with the auto makers and the Obama administration right now) that we lose money on. (due to our making a cluster **** of the production launch. We screwed that one up so badly it made the industry news. )

We also are sitting pretty with some new aftermarket business as well as some Light Vehicle Diesel business that was put on hold, but soon may finally come to fruition. (LVD would be a boon for us and mean a ton of new capital expenditure.)

Plus…we have a new executive overseeing our division (they canned the previous loser) who seems to be a real no **** guy (which we sorely need) and he recognizes that with all the money we have made the company they haven't really reinvested back into our plant and much of our equipment is old. So, we are looking the likelihood of modernizing and retooling the plant so that we can remain competitive in the future.

So I guess the moral is that I'm happy now. In the past months we went from eliminating a large percentage of our workforce to being concerned about possibly having to FEW people. So now I think I can keep my job AND my promotion.
Being in debt and celebrating a lower deficit is like being on a diet and celebrating the fact you gained two pounds this week instead of five.
     
SpaceMonkey
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Apr 3, 2009, 04:34 PM
 
Good to hear!

"One ticket to Washington, please. I have a date with destiny."
     
OreoCookie
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Apr 6, 2009, 05:50 AM
 
Glad to hear. Looks like your company got its act together in time.
I don't suffer from insanity, I enjoy every minute of it.
     
 
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