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The official Leopard thread (Page 20)
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schalliol
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Jun 19, 2007, 10:13 PM
 
Originally Posted by TETENAL View Post
[So much for the automatically turned on thumbnail generation in Leopard...
Could you please clue us into where that image came from?
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TETENAL
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Jun 19, 2007, 10:16 PM
 
     
JLL
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Jun 20, 2007, 05:02 AM
 
You do know that icon previews can be turned off, don't you? (just as in 10.4)
JLL

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kilechki
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Jun 21, 2007, 08:40 AM
 
Does anyone think we could get iPhone's GoogleMap and YouTube Player with Leopard? That would be some nice sauce.
     
mdc
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Jun 21, 2007, 02:54 PM
 
kilechki. That raises a good point. We know that Mac OS X apps are not designed to work out the box on an iPhone, but what about the other way around?
     
Chuckit
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Jun 21, 2007, 02:56 PM
 
I doubt either will work right out of the box. The two systems have completely different user interfaces.
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Kerrigan
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Jun 21, 2007, 07:22 PM
 
Ya, plus I think that on a full fledged computer, having separate apps for what are essentially ajax websites would be a bit cumbersome.
     
sandsl
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Jun 21, 2007, 07:27 PM
 


Please..for the love of god..get rid of the extra shadow! We only need one.
Luke
     
mdc
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Jun 22, 2007, 09:01 AM
 
I'm not sure where you got that screenshot from but could you show the entire desktop? I haven't seen one with a plain coloured desktop picture. It'd be interesting to see what the menubar looks like.

I think the new Dock looks cool with it's shadows on the desktop and reflections.
     
sandsl
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Jun 22, 2007, 12:19 PM
 
Luke
     
olePigeon
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Jun 22, 2007, 12:38 PM
 
Didn't Copland have Piles, kinda like the Stacks?
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xi_hyperon
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Jun 22, 2007, 03:41 PM
 
Originally Posted by sandsl View Post
I have to agree – I ain't diggin' the second shadow against the desktop. If MS could bungle a drop shadow, this is how I would envision them doing it. Not Apple. I understand why they are doing it - to increase contrast with the background - but it looks horrible.
     
Eug
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Jun 22, 2007, 03:45 PM
 
There is a thread about it here, but the latest Leopard developer previews require a G4 800 or better.
     
rem
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Jun 23, 2007, 06:17 AM
 
Although I won't miss brushed metal, for just about every other UI change I see -- I like Tiger better than Leopard and normally I like change. I hope Apple is keeping the final look a surprise! So many people were split on the dull grey look of iTunes 7. It looks like Apple just decided to keep aqua scrollbars with the dull grey iT7 looking buttons. If I never saw Tiger or Leopard and you showed me the buttons on both, my guess would be that the dull grey buttons came from the older OS. Same impression about the new dull, flat icons. I hope users will have more control over the look and feel without needing to buy 3rd party software if Apple can't keep wow-ing us like they did with the iPhone UI.

edit: I just put the Tiger calculator app next to the Leopard calc app in the screenshot, then asked my gf her opinion about the shadows (she is not a mac user). I did not tell her which was which. She preferred the shadows used in Tiger. She immediately said what I was thinking: that the Leopard shadows were too much.

Similar response for the new Gnome-like transparent Apple menu. We both prefer Tiger.
( Last edited by rem; Jun 23, 2007 at 06:58 AM. )
     
analogika
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Jun 23, 2007, 08:02 AM
 
Originally Posted by rem View Post
edit: I just put the Tiger calculator app next to the Leopard calc app in the screenshot, then asked my gf her opinion about the shadows (she is not a mac user). I did not tell her which was which. She preferred the shadows used in Tiger. She immediately said what I was thinking: that the Leopard shadows were too much
Your experiment completely missed the point:

The shadow-aura is there to help differentiate which window is the active one, not to *look good*.

And among Mac newbies (I see lots of them every day at work), I find that telling an active from an inactive window is the #1 difficulty.

For many new users, the logical and automatic solution is to full-screen every window. On the Mac, the dumbest thing you can do, as it runs *completely* contrary to the basic usage fundamentals (screen depth + drag & drop between windows/applications), and it *still* doesn't solve the problem that the topmost window may not actually be active - which the new shadow subtly helps alleviate.
     
rem
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Jun 23, 2007, 12:17 PM
 
if Apple is worried that users cannot tell the difference between black & white vs. color, between darker tones vs. ligher, and can't be bothered to read the bolded word(s) at top-left of the screen, nor to use alt-tab or Exposé if still disoriented, if exaggerated drop shadows are ALSO needed, then why not make it a new Accessibility option for n00btards instead of penalizing people who were attracted to OS X due to Apple's careful attention to aesthetics? What are they thinking in Cupertino? Is this how the meetings go: "a lot of Mac users really did not like the new iTunes UI look. Instead of trying something else, we're gonna put it all over the OS."
( Last edited by rem; Jun 23, 2007 at 07:11 PM. )
     
rem
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Jun 23, 2007, 06:15 PM
 
and another thing:



Is it not clear already that Library, Store and Playlists are the parents WITHOUT HAVING TO USE ALL CAPS? I fix this manually everytime there is an update to iT7 in addition to restoring Aqua scrollbars/buttons. Now its going to be everywhere???
     
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Jun 24, 2007, 01:56 AM
 
Originally Posted by sandsl View Post
I guess I can live with the translucent menu with wallpaper like those.
     
Kevin
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Jun 25, 2007, 08:16 AM
 
Found this in Safari.

And I notice Photoshop has hard coded bits of a GUI like this in it as well..

This is a screenshot of the latest Safari.


     
Kevin
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Jun 25, 2007, 08:25 AM
 
BTW I don't think the GUI is finalized yet. iTunes has those plain bars (Which I like better than Aqua) and the Finder doesn't?

Something isn't adding up.
     
JLL
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Jun 25, 2007, 08:39 AM
 
Originally Posted by Kevin View Post
Found this in Safari.

And I notice Photoshop has hard coded bits of a GUI like this in it as well..

This is a screenshot of the latest Safari.

That's outdated now: http://webkit.org/blog/108/yet-anoth...web-inspector/
JLL

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roosta
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Jun 25, 2007, 01:43 PM
 
Originally Posted by TETENAL View Post


So much for the automatically turned on thumbnail generation in Leopard...

actually you still have to turn that on in view options. unfortunately it doesn't seem to carry over to items stacked in the dock.
     
moonmonkey
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Jun 26, 2007, 02:14 AM
 
Originally Posted by sandsl View Post
What is the gap between the apps?
     
mdc
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Jun 26, 2007, 01:14 PM
 
I noticed this during the Apple iPhone Syncing video. When iPhone syncs in iTunes it has a different 'loading' bar.
Is iTunes in 10.5 a newer version? Has anyone synced an iPod and seen this bar?



edit: I just realized I have iTunes on my PC here at work.

That's the current progress bar we have in iTunes currently. I like the new one.
( Last edited by mdc; Jun 26, 2007 at 02:37 PM. )
     
besson3c
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Jun 26, 2007, 01:34 PM
 
Originally Posted by mdc View Post
I noticed this during the Apple iPhone Syncing video. When iPhone syncs in iTunes it has a different 'loading' bar.
Is iTunes in 10.5 a newer version? Has anyone synced an iPod and seen this bar?
Or am I going crazy and is this the loading bar we have in 10.4?

Wow, what an eye!

Do you normally look for this sort of stuff, or did you accidentally stumble across this?
     
sandsl
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Jun 26, 2007, 01:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by moonmonkey View Post
What is the gap between the apps?
Just a blank spacer for better visual clarity between apps and stacks.
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Art Vandelay
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Jun 26, 2007, 01:55 PM
 
Originally Posted by mdc View Post
I noticed this during the Apple iPhone Syncing video. When iPhone syncs in iTunes it has a different 'loading' bar.
Is iTunes in 10.5 a newer version? Has anyone synced an iPod and seen this bar?
Or am I going crazy and is this the loading bar we have in 10.4?

That's just an indeterminate progress bar. If you're syncing a lot of stuff, that will occasionally pop up in the beginning before it displays the normal progress bar. Nothing new.
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todd
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Jun 26, 2007, 02:10 PM
 
Any "Home Theater PC" relevant updates in Leopard? I know DVD player has some cosmetic updates, anything more substantial? Maybe things like:

- Commercial HD-DVD / Blue-Ray support in DVD Player.app? (this was rumored in the WWDC build, but others said No).
- H.264 GPU acceleration? The AppleTV apparently uses GPU accel for H.264, to be able to play 6-8Mbps H.264 with a 1GHz Pentium-M. Is this feature rolled back into Mac OS X?
     
Thinine
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Jun 26, 2007, 02:33 PM
 
AFAIK, the AppleTV doesn't use the video card for H.264 decoding, it has a dedicated chip for it.
     
mdc
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Jun 26, 2007, 02:36 PM
 
Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
That's just an indeterminate progress bar. If you're syncing a lot of stuff, that will occasionally pop up in the beginning before it displays the normal progress bar. Nothing new.
I know that that progress bar is in iTunes currently, but for some reason I thought it was a flat grey-scale look, and not this almost-3D look of this one.

I just realized that I have iTunes on my PC here at work.

That's the current progress bar we have in iTunes. The one they showed in their video is very different. I like the new one.

Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Wow, what an eye!
Do you normally look for this sort of stuff, or did you accidentally stumble across this?
I'm *very* bored at work
     
Simon
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Jun 26, 2007, 02:39 PM
 
Absolutely. The progress bar in the movie is definitely not identical to any progress bar in iTunes 7.2.

I'm guessing they didn't use the actual iTunes for the video (check out the hi res graphics), but a mockup.
     
I WAS the One
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Jun 27, 2007, 08:04 AM
 
Well... Honestly I admited that I love the new look of OS X, and I do think that Stacks and Quickview will be usefull for all of us... I mean I use Exposé everyday for fast productivity tasks... (I have a 5 button mouse and one of them is assigned to exposé only) so I think that this other benefits will be welcome in my everyday jobs...

but...

I HATE THE NEW FOLDERS!!!!!!
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todd
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Jun 27, 2007, 08:32 AM
 
Originally Posted by Thinine View Post
AFAIK, the AppleTV doesn't use the video card for H.264 decoding, it has a dedicated chip for it.
Do you have a reference for this? I'm pretty sure that is not true. None of the AppleTV internals pictures, or lists of chips, show an H.264 accelerator.

The only claim of H.264 accelerator chips I have seen is that old Cringely column claiming all Macs would soon have hardware accelerated H.264 (that article was before the most recent MacBook, MacBook Pro, and Mac Pro bumps, which of course did not include an H.264 chip).

The AppleTV has an NVidia GeForce Go 7300, which has some media acceleration capabilities, which are not currently used in Leopard, but appear to be used in AppleTV to accelerate H.264 playback. The question is whether Apple will roll those AppleTV features back into Leopard.
     
Kevin
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Jun 28, 2007, 06:55 AM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Do you normally look for this sort of stuff, or did you accidentally stumble across this?
Ah the passive aggressive besson even bringing his game into the OS threads

My offer is still on the plate.

Originally Posted by I WAS the One View Post

I HATE THE NEW FOLDERS!!!!!!
I love them! No more stripes!
     
monkeybrain
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Jun 28, 2007, 11:00 AM
 
Those folders are definitely better than the 'orrible stripey and outdated ones in Tiger. My only issue that the symbols may be hard to see, certainly at smaller sizes. What do they look like in column view?
     
Thinine
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Jun 28, 2007, 02:38 PM
 
I like the new folders, I just wish they were as dynamic as the old ones. I mean, the don't even have an item drop animation.
     
d70
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Jul 4, 2007, 12:22 PM
 
Just got dualboot leopard (WWDC 07 build) installed on mbp. Seems nice so far but probably not worth the upgrade price tag. The new features Finders such as QuickLook, Coverflow, more shortcuts!!! are nice. Spaces is good as expected.

My question is how stable is this build? Is it stable enough for day-to-day usage? I mostly do development using eclipse, vmware and office stuff. Is there a list of leopard software compatibility somewhere?
     
Chuckit
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Jul 4, 2007, 12:53 PM
 
Originally Posted by d70 View Post
Is there a list of leopard software compatibility somewhere?
If there were, I don't think it would still be up. Nobody is supposed to have Leopard yet.
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CharlesS
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Jul 4, 2007, 01:00 PM
 
Some of us are supposed to have it, but you're definitely not supposed to be talking about it yet.

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hmurchison2001
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Jul 4, 2007, 01:03 PM
 
Originally Posted by d70 View Post
Just got dualboot leopard (WWDC 07 build) installed on mbp. Seems nice so far but probably not worth the upgrade price tag. The new features Finders such as QuickLook, Coverflow, more shortcuts!!! are nice. Spaces is good as expected.

My question is how stable is this build? Is it stable enough for day-to-day usage? I mostly do development using eclipse, vmware and office stuff. Is there a list of leopard software compatibility somewhere?
I'm not sure If I agree with you about not being worth the upgrade price. $129 isn't even a days pay for many. If you're a developer it's worth if for the dev tools alone. Xcode 3, Dtrace, Dashcode etc. I've only read small reports but there don't appear to be many instability issues.

Haven't seen a list that covers Leopard friendly apps yet.
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TheoCryst
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Jul 4, 2007, 01:32 PM
 
Agreed. I've had a chance to play around with it a little bit on my MacBook, and Xcode 3.0 alone is worth the price of upgrade. Then there's Spaces, which is incredibly addictive, and the new iChat, plus Stacks, the unified look, the revamped Finder, the new Interface Builder, integrated OpenDocument support...

Yeah, I'm pretty sure I'll be upgrading.

Oh, and try this thread (InsanelyMac) for app compatability.

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d70
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Jul 4, 2007, 02:00 PM
 
my bad I didn't factor in other things I hadn't tried using when I said it wasn't worth the upgrade. $130 for leopard ultimate doesn't seem too bad after all.

The dock and spaces animation lag a little on my mbp1.1.

By the way I got my leopard copy legally from my company.
     
hmurchison2001
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Jul 4, 2007, 02:07 PM
 
I didn't think I was going to like Spaces that much but quite honestly after seeing more of Apple's implementation and the fact that it's affordable to have 4GB of RAM or more I could see Spaces being more popular than I had originally thought.

I'm going to start to learning Xcode and IB and I totally forgot that IB 3.0 is totally new. Apple certainly is working hard on the development tools. I know I'm keeping my eye on their work with LLVM. I'm guessing that Clang -http://llvm.org/devmtg/2007-05/09-Naroff-CFE.pdf will factor into Xcode 4 and 10.6. I'm not even at noob status yet but the pdf listed above offers some tantalizing glimpses into the future of development in OS X.

Leopard is a "must have" for me. The only areas I'm not too happy with the improvment is in Speech Synthesis/Recognition. Love the new Alex voice but I want Speech Recognition to become a potential input method.
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hmurchison2001
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Jul 4, 2007, 02:10 PM
 
Originally Posted by d70 View Post
my bad I didn't factor in other things I hadn't tried using when I said it wasn't worth the upgrade. $130 for leopard ultimate doesn't seem too bad after all.

The dock and spaces animation lag a little on my mbp1.1.

By the way I got my leopard copy legally from my company.
It's all good..you're entitled to your opinion and the right to change that option whenever you want. Seeing as how python and ruby now integrate so well along with Applescript I might try to focus on that as well. I know there's a lot of little nuggets in there. Hell Apple didn't even mention Resolution Independence but I'm dreaming about a 30" Cinema Display taking advantage.
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d70
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Jul 5, 2007, 11:23 PM
 
Is there a workaround/fix for font rendering in Firefox 2 under Leopard? I know Firefox 3 is doing better in that category but it's still an alpha.

Another question is why is page scrolling in Safari so much smoother than in Firefox? I mainly use Firefox but sometimes have to use Safari just because it has an Acrobat plugin support.
     
TheoCryst
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Jul 5, 2007, 11:51 PM
 
Originally Posted by d70 View Post
Another question is why is page scrolling in Safari so much smoother than in Firefox? I mainly use Firefox but sometimes have to use Safari just because it has an Acrobat plugin support.
You'll find that this is true in both Tiger and Leopard. Safari's page rendering is just more closely integrated with OS X than Firefox's. Also, you may have smooth scrolling off: in Firefox, go to Preferences -> Advanced -> Use smooth scrolling.

Any ramblings are entirely my own, and do not represent those of my employers, coworkers, friends, or species
     
Fusion
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Jul 6, 2007, 11:30 AM
 
Originally Posted by TheoCryst View Post
You'll find that this is true in both Tiger and Leopard.
Actually you won't. There was a rendering issue that popped up around 10.4.7 that caused chippy scrolling in Safari again and they never fixed it in any official release.

They did however fix it for the newer WebKit so if you use the latest WebKit nightlies or 3 beta you'll get the smooth scrolling back and then of course Leopard has it as well.

It's very subtle, but a big difference and I'm glad to see that it came back.
     
analogue SPRINKLES
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Jul 11, 2007, 08:08 PM
 
The new DVD player is totally amazing, it impressed the hell out of me.

On the bad side though when you minimize the movie to the dock it stops playing (prob a bug) and even worse the DVD player badge appears over it!
     
monkeybrain
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Jul 11, 2007, 10:14 PM
 
Why would you want it to pause anyway? It's always seemed to me they did that in Quicktime simply because they could do it. Surely if you minimise a movie it is because you have to do something else, so it should pause. Although I think you're being sarcastic, right?
     
vertigociel
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Jul 12, 2007, 01:47 AM
 
Originally Posted by roosta View Post
actually you still have to turn that on in view options. unfortunately it doesn't seem to carry over to items stacked in the dock.

Huh, works fine for me, once I turn it on in view options.
     
 
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