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Battlestar Galactica [SPOILERS] (Page 72)
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analogue SPRINKLES
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Apr 29, 2008, 12:26 PM
 
Originally Posted by Mithras View Post
I thought Tigh and Six's conversation was under the assumption that Six knew what Tigh was? Maybe I'll have to listen again.
Na I think she is trying to say that she is just as "human" as him but has no clue as to who he really is which makes it so much ironic.

The other Cylons have no clue who the final 5 are and aren't even allowed to think about who they might be.
     
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Apr 29, 2008, 05:49 PM
 
Originally Posted by Mithras View Post
I thought Tigh and Six's conversation was under the assumption that Six knew what Tigh was? Maybe I'll have to listen again.
Originally Posted by jokell82 View Post
Yeah I thought she had figured it out as well.
Originally Posted by design219 View Post
I didn't get it that way. I thought it was Tigh being worried that she could sense him.
I don't think she knew, either.
"Everything's so clear to me now: I'm the keeper of the cheese and you're the lemon merchant. Get it? And he knows it.
That's why he's gonna kill us. So we got to beat it. Yeah. Before he let's loose the marmosets on us."
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Don Pickett
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Apr 29, 2008, 09:57 PM
 
Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES View Post
Na I think she is trying to say that she is just as "human" as him but has no clue as to who he really is which makes it so much ironic.

The other Cylons have no clue who the final 5 are and aren't even allowed to think about who they might be.
That scene is all about the subtext: you have a Cylon who is claiming to be as, or more, human than a human. The human she's talking to is, in fact, a cylon, and is wondering how human he is at all. To me this could be the beginning of a theme which will take us to the end of the series: what if there's actually little or no difference between cylon and human?

edit:

There are essentially three possible ending:

1) All, or enough, of the cylons are destroyed to reduce their threat to an acceptable level;
2) All, or enough, of the humans are destroyed to reduce their threat to an acceptable level;
3) Something Else, which allows some kind of truce between the two. This, to me, would require some kind of meeting of the minds.
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Apr 30, 2008, 11:49 AM
 
I thought "Escape Velocity" showed an important step in the self-discovery of the "revealed four" Cylons.

Tory seems to enjoy some sort of superiority in being a Cylon while Col. Thigh seems revolted by it. They could find themselves on opposite sides of the Cylon Civil War with Tory joining Cavil's "hard-liners" and Thigh joining Six's "progressive" group. Anders and Tyrol seem too preoccupied with their current human relationships to have explored their road to self-discovery.

Baltar is also creating a new rift in the fleet between his "progressive" religious followers and the old-school religious "hard-liners."

Theory #69824.

Perhaps the "progressives" on both sides (Human and Cylon) will find common ground as they move closer to Earth. Perhaps even an alliance. Also, The final Cylon could be the one who brings them (Human and Cylon Progressives) together. Following this theory, Baltar would be the only one capable of doing this.

Think about it. Head-Six and Head-Baltar could be a part of their original programing. They continue to influence each other even when they are apart. Six was meant to divide the Cylons and Baltar was meant to divide the Humans.
     
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Apr 30, 2008, 12:55 PM
 
BUT BALTAR IS NOT THE FINAL CYLON, so says RDM.
"Everything's so clear to me now: I'm the keeper of the cheese and you're the lemon merchant. Get it? And he knows it.
That's why he's gonna kill us. So we got to beat it. Yeah. Before he let's loose the marmosets on us."
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Sourbook
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Apr 30, 2008, 01:06 PM
 
RDM has been programed to say that.
     
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Apr 30, 2008, 01:17 PM
 
And he has a plan.
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May 1, 2008, 12:23 AM
 
Originally Posted by Sourbook View Post
Think about it. Head-Six and Head-Baltar could be a part of their original programing. They continue to influence each other even when they are apart. Six was meant to divide the Cylons and Baltar was meant to divide the Humans.
If Head-Six means that Baltar is the Final One, then Head-Baltar means that Six is the Final One.

I agree that Head-Six and Head-Baltar probably have something to do with the Final One and that they appear to have something to do with causing divisions, but they don't mean that Baltar is the Final One.
     
analogue SPRINKLES
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May 1, 2008, 12:49 AM
 
I wonder why head six is trying to set up baltar as a God when she says there is only one god. Seems like blasphemy to me.
     
Luca Rescigno
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May 1, 2008, 01:01 AM
 
Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES View Post
I wonder why head six is trying to set up baltar as a God when she says there is only one god. Seems like blasphemy to me.
Isn't that kind of like how some people consider Jesus to be not only the son of God, but rather God himself? I don't get it but I've heard that.

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May 1, 2008, 09:32 AM
 
he's not a god, he's a prophet, and as such, touched by god.
     
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May 2, 2008, 07:51 AM
 
Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES View Post
I wonder why head six is trying to set up baltar as a God when she says there is only one god. Seems like blasphemy to me.
I never got that impression. From the beginning, it's always been Head Six trying to turn Baltar into the Hand of God, or the instrument by which God acts through.

His cult followers may see him as a spiritual leader, but I don't think they're making him out to be a living deity.
     
synthfiend
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May 2, 2008, 12:38 PM
 
I think that Lawyer is the last Cylon. And I'm not the only one.

The Final Cylon of Battlestar Galactica - Episode by Episode Commentary

To quote:

"He terrified and stunted Baltar, duped a conniving cylon, tore apart a father and son and then freed Gaius Baltar (and stole the President's glasses!). He enraged the entire fleet by representing Baltar while teaching a lesson on their flawed system AND pulled their heartstrings at the same time. All while staying relatively under the radar and being the focus of NO ONE'S wrath in the process. Then, he just vanished into the crowd. "

It makes sense, but knowing Moore, it'll be boxey
     
analogue SPRINKLES
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May 2, 2008, 04:55 PM
 
Ya I was thinking the lawyer would be a good choice also but they got to bring him back some more before they make the revelation or people won't remember who he is.
     
scottiB
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May 2, 2008, 11:21 PM
 
The pace, she needs to pick up.
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mrtew
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May 3, 2008, 06:18 AM
 
True, this is the last season. There's no time left for building the suspense. One more episode of Baltar giving the same stupid sermon to those airheads for 15 minutes and I'm gonna puke.

I love the U.S., but we need some time apart.
     
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May 3, 2008, 09:13 PM
 
This week Starbuck mentioned a "sound" associated with the path to earth. This is another parallel with the Ship of Lights. For some unknown reason it made a loud sound when it approached. The ability or not of sound to travel through space was never addressed.
     
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May 5, 2008, 12:20 PM
 
Originally Posted by scottiB View Post
The pace, she needs to pick up.
Ha! That's what I was thinking.

I miss the real conflict from the Pegasus episodes. Those were some good watchin'!

I'm ready to skip the next few episodes and wait for the final 3-4 hours because this is just dragging on. However, I will still watch.

I just hope that RDM adn company do not write something lame in the end. They say the journey is the adventure, not the destination. Bullsh*t. If this has a lame ending, I will feel betrayed and cheated... cheated of 80 hours of watching it unfold.
( Last edited by Eriamjh; May 5, 2008 at 12:28 PM. )

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Luca Rescigno
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May 5, 2008, 12:32 PM
 
Yeah, they need to do some cool stuff, and soon. The last episode was SO boring. Nothing happened until the last two minutes! Ack, so disappointing. The first couple seasons were really strong but it's really dragging now. Sometimes I wish they had only gotten approved for a half-season for Season 4 so they'd have to wrap things up sooner.

If I wanted to watch the hand-wringing of unlikable, angst-filled characters, I'd watch a soap opera.

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May 5, 2008, 03:16 PM
 
Originally Posted by Luca Rescigno View Post

If I wanted to watch the hand-wringing of unlikable, angst-filled characters, I'd watch a soap opera.
that's exactly what we thought after watching it last night. What a frakking soap opera.

Maybe BSG will discover Earth and land in Jericho. The characters sure would fit in. Grrr. Just kidding -- Jericho was rough. But season 4 sure is moving slow.
     
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May 5, 2008, 03:22 PM
 
Huh, I actually found myself wishing it would get more into the characters' heads. Like, it seems like Athena might have some useful insight about the Cylon Civil War, and her husband seemed to be totally ignoring that, but it didn't matter because she was basically just filling the role of Mutineer #3.
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May 5, 2008, 03:37 PM
 
I've noticed they don't ask Athena anything about the Cylons since she married Helo. My thought was that marriage to a citizen most likely conveys citizenship, and there may have been an agreement that she doesn't get asked questions concerning matters from before she met Helo. She could certainly volunteer stuff if she chose to.

I'm expecting Athena's opinions to be interesting if they get mixed up with the rest of the Cylons.
     
analogue SPRINKLES
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May 5, 2008, 03:47 PM
 
Anyone notice how many characters were missing from the last episode? No Adama or Roslin to name a couple. Did they all have the week off?
     
Chuckit
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May 5, 2008, 03:54 PM
 
Originally Posted by reader50 View Post
I've noticed they don't ask Athena anything about the Cylons since she married Helo. My thought was that marriage to a citizen most likely conveys citizenship, and there may have been an agreement that she doesn't get asked questions concerning matters from before she met Helo. She could certainly volunteer stuff if she chose to.

I'm expecting Athena's opinions to be interesting if they get mixed up with the rest of the Cylons.
I've always figured that they didn't want to put Athena in a difficult situation where she'd have to totally betray either her sisters or her husband. But that didn't really seem to apply here. She seemed to have a strong opinion, but rather than exploring or even caring what she knows, everybody pretty much ignored it.
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May 6, 2008, 03:14 AM
 
Originally Posted by scottiB View Post
The pace, she needs to pick up.
Yup. Disappointing so far, even with the deaths.

Originally Posted by ThinkInsane View Post
Yes the caduceus is a medical symbol used on earth, but in mythology it was the staff carried by the god Hermes, so that might not be significant in and of itself.
Hermes is the god of commerce and theft.



As an aside, the caduceus is used as a medical symbol, but it's a mistake. The actual staff symbol for medicine was the rod of Asclepius (son of Apollo, a healer) , which is a single staff entwined by a single serpent. Look at the side of an ambulance sometime, that's the version of the staff used in the EMS "star of life".
World Health Association:
American Medical Association:
( Last edited by Eug; May 6, 2008 at 03:22 AM. )
     
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May 6, 2008, 11:59 AM
 
According to Wikipedia, the main source of confusion comes from the U.S. Army using the caduceus instead of the staff. The secretary to the Surgeon General noticed the error, but did not change it.

An interesting statistic; the majority of professional associations use the staff, while the majority of commercial associations use the caduceus.
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May 6, 2008, 01:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by olePigeon View Post
An interesting statistic; the majority of professional associations use the staff, while the majority of commercial associations use the caduceus.
Originally Posted by Eug View Post
Hermes is the god of commerce and theft.
     
analogue SPRINKLES
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May 6, 2008, 04:46 PM
 
It also seems that Baltar's group has there own logo now. Some squiggly line thing.
     
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May 9, 2008, 01:19 PM
 
I'm utterly un-enthused for tonight's episode. Anyone think maybe "all ... will ... be ... revealed ... " again tonight?
     
analogue SPRINKLES
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May 9, 2008, 01:22 PM
 
Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton View Post
I'm utterly un-enthused for tonight's episode. Anyone think maybe "all ... will ... be ... revealed ... " again tonight?
Tonight's should be cool because you can see in the trailers that Starbuck gets on a Basestar and talks to the Hybrid which mentions the same things about her as the God Hybrid did.

I've mentioned it before but Katie (Starbuck) said in an interview that she is up to filming ep 14 of this season and still doesn't know how or why she came back from the dead. So don't hope for too many answers yet.
     
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May 9, 2008, 11:05 PM
 
Yep it was just like the preview. No surprises at all. Except for the twin on twin lesbian murder scene.

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May 9, 2008, 11:09 PM
 
Great episode! I'm glad I didn't see the preview...
     
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May 10, 2008, 02:08 AM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Great episode! I'm glad I didn't see the preview...
The only thing answered in this episode was the theory that the star Starbuck saw in her visions which she was painting was a basestar not some alien vessel.

So, well... no real answers this week.

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Luca Rescigno
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May 10, 2008, 05:56 AM
 
No, but at least the episode was better than last week's.

Still, I want to see them really pick up the pace. Things are still moving slowly.

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May 10, 2008, 09:13 AM
 
Originally Posted by Weyland-Yutani View Post
So, well... no real answers this week.
And that the Final Five are from Earth.
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May 10, 2008, 12:06 PM
 
Originally Posted by Luca Rescigno View Post
No, but at least the episode was better than last week's.
Still, I want to see them really pick up the pace. Things are still moving slowly.
Well, it was only marginally better, and I agree about the pace. The show is really beginning to hit me in the same way the last season or so of Farscape did...nothing but violence, paranoia, and people screaming all the time.
It's getting very hard to want to keep watching.
     
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May 10, 2008, 01:28 PM
 
I've not been disappointed with any episode this season (or any season) thus far. But I understand that people watch the show for different reasons. Some need to see the main story-line progress rapidly. Some watch it purely for the human drama. Some for the who-done-it aspects. And some for the way-cool space battles. I enjoy all of it. Some episodes more than others, but I do enjoy all of them.

Right now it's winding-up for the final race to the conclusion. Everything seems to be pretty important. Thy hybrid had something important to say. The reaction of Six to meeting her murderer. The reaction of the Centurion to the death of the hybrid. Anders temptation. Baltar's continually growing popularity. Crossing the river of life. The collaboration of Humans and Cylons. There's a lot going on.
     
besson3c
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May 10, 2008, 02:37 PM
 
Originally Posted by Weyland-Yutani View Post
The only thing answered in this episode was the theory that the star Starbuck saw in her visions which she was painting was a basestar not some alien vessel.

So, well... no real answers this week.
Patience... We are only in episode 6 of 20.

Honestly people, it's no wonder you don't enjoy this show, or presumably any others when you are critiquing the whole thing as it moves along. Just turn that part of your brain off and enjoy it, or if you really can't, don't watch the show. I don't understand the "it is so painful to watch the show... But I MUST!" Why partake in a leisure activity like this that you aren't enjoying?

The other interesting angle is the Sharons/Athenas (whatever their number is) sort of breaking away from the Cylons, taking cues from Athena. It is interesting that each Cylon has their own personality, and the whole struggle over unity and independence is really cool.
     
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May 10, 2008, 05:20 PM
 
Originally Posted by besson3c View Post
Honestly people, it's no wonder you don't enjoy this show, or presumably any others when you are critiquing the whole thing as it moves along. Just turn that part of your brain off and enjoy it, or if you really can't, don't watch the show. I don't understand the "it is so painful to watch the show... But I MUST!" Why partake in a leisure activity like this that you aren't enjoying?
Because we have been watching, studying, and enjoying this show for several seasons now and some of us might feel that it's getting bogged down? Because, from day one, it's been a show that invites critical review and commentary from episode to episode? Because turning your brain off to watch something as well-written and played as BSG would be doing the show a huge disservice?
     
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May 10, 2008, 05:24 PM
 
Go back and rewatch the first few episodes and then tell me that these are plodding.
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analogue SPRINKLES
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May 10, 2008, 06:52 PM
 
Holy cow that episode was awesome. One of my favs for sure.

The scene where they killed the 6 was disturbing because you can see that they are just as emotionally fragile as humans.

It was also cool finding out what the Comet was in Starbucks painting.

Anyone else catch yet another hidden star trek reference?
     
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May 10, 2008, 07:01 PM
 
Anyone catch that apparently Roslin's mother is Barbara Bush?
     
Don Pickett
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May 10, 2008, 07:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by Thorzdad View Post
Because we have been watching, studying, and enjoying this show for several seasons now and some of us might feel that it's getting bogged down? Because, from day one, it's been a show that invites critical review and commentary from episode to episode? Because turning your brain off to watch something as well-written and played as BSG would be doing the show a huge disservice?
I don't feel it's getting bogged down. I like the pace: I actually felt a fair bit of tension when the Demetrius was waiting for Starbuck and Company to return, because I didn't know if they would make it.

That said, the writers are doing a careful and deliberate job of setting up a resolution to the series, and for resolving the biggest and trickiest issue the series has discussed: God, religion and belief. What's interesting is that you have splits within both the Cylons and the humans which are mirrored. Baltar's followers are akin to the renegade cylons. They are both bucking tradition and history and attempting to move into an uncertain future. Against this you have the traditionalist cylons and the polytheist humans, who are more traditional. As the logic is set up now, it is those breaking with tradition, on both sides, who seem to be taking a new path, but a lot is left to be discovered.

I think those viewers who want less thought and more shoot 'em up will be disappointed with this season. Personally I am enjoying it. I get tired of episodes which consist of characters yelling at each other for 44 minutes at a time.
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Don Pickett
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May 10, 2008, 07:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES View Post
Anyone else catch yet another hidden star trek reference?
Missed it. What was?
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Luca Rescigno
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May 10, 2008, 08:15 PM
 
The woman dying of cancer was played by Nana Visitor, who played Kira Nerys in Deep Space 9.

I noticed in the episode two weeks ago that the room that Tigh, Tyrol and Tory meet in is numbered 1701D.

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Sourbook
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May 10, 2008, 08:18 PM
 
Originally Posted by Don Pickett View Post
What's interesting is that you have splits within both the Cylons and the humans which are mirrored. Baltar's followers are akin to the renegade cylons. They are both bucking tradition and history and attempting to move into an uncertain future. Against this you have the traditionalist cylons and the polytheist humans, who are more traditional. As the logic is set up now, it is those breaking with tradition, on both sides, who seem to be taking a new path, but a lot is left to be discovered.
Sort of goes with what I wrote two weeks ago.

Originally Posted by Sourbook View Post
I thought "Escape Velocity" showed an important step in the self-discovery of the "revealed four" Cylons.

Tory seems to enjoy some sort of superiority in being a Cylon while Col. Thigh seems revolted by it. They could find themselves on opposite sides of the Cylon Civil War with Tory joining Cavil's "hard-liners" and Thigh joining Six's "progressive" group. Anders and Tyrol seem too preoccupied with their current human relationships to have explored their road to self-discovery.

Baltar is also creating a new rift in the fleet between his "progressive" religious followers and the old-school religious "hard-liners."

Theory #69824.

Perhaps the "progressives" on both sides (Human and Cylon) will find common ground as they move closer to Earth. Perhaps even an alliance. Also, The final Cylon could be the one who brings them (Human and Cylon Progressives) together. Following this theory, Baltar would be the only one capable of doing this.

Think about it. Head-Six and Head-Baltar could be a part of their original programing. They continue to influence each other even when they are apart. Six was meant to divide the Cylons and Baltar was meant to divide the Humans.


Originally Posted by Don Pickett View Post
I think those viewers who want less thought and more shoot 'em up will be disappointed with this season. Personally I am enjoying it. I get tired of episodes which consist of characters yelling at each other for 44 minutes at a time.

I agree. Space battles are cool, but not the whole BSG enchilada.
     
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May 10, 2008, 08:21 PM
 
Originally Posted by Don Pickett View Post
Missed it. What was?
Major Kira?

Edit - too slow, already posted above.

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Don Pickett
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May 10, 2008, 08:53 PM
 
Originally Posted by Luca Rescigno View Post
The woman dying of cancer was played by Nana Visitor, who played Kira Nerys in Deep Space 9.

I noticed in the episode two weeks ago that the room that Tigh, Tyrol and Tory meet in is numbered 1701D.
Oh. I thought you meant real Star Trek, not one of the flimsy imitations which have come afterwards.

That said, as of now I could see an alliance between the new Cylons and humans.

Some other random thoughts:

1) We don't know if the Cylon God is real or not. It is assumed it is, but what if it's not? What if we discover that the Cylon God is just another piece of the programming?
2) We also don't really know much about the history of the Cylons. We don't know why they revolted and or what made the decision. We really have no idea where the skinjobs come from. In other words, things could be revealed about the Cylons and their history, and their possible relationship to Earth, which could throw the series in an entirely new direction.
3) We also have no idea what condition Earth is in. It could be populated by Neandrathals, by a species with an incredibly advanced technology. Or it could be a barren rock, still glowing from the radiation of a civil war. We have no idea what will happen when they find Earth.

Anyway, should be interesting.

edit: Didn't Moore say that the final Cylon wasn't in the Last Supperish picture. Isn't Baltar in there?
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Luca Rescigno
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May 10, 2008, 09:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by Don Pickett View Post
Oh. I thought you meant real Star Trek, not one of the flimsy imitations which have come afterwards.
Then why are you watching this show? It's a flimsy imitation of the real Battlestar Galactica.

Originally Posted by Don Pickett
edit: Didn't Moore say that the final Cylon wasn't in the Last Supperish picture. Isn't Baltar in there?
Yes. Other non-Cylons in the image are Roslin, Apollo, Starbuck, Helo, and Admiral Adama. So that doesn't leave a whole lot of major characters who could end up being Cylons. One possibility that has been brought up a few times was Felix Gaeta. He's not a very major character but he's been with the show a long time and he hasn't faded away the way a lot of other minor characters have.

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May 10, 2008, 10:13 PM
 
Originally Posted by analogue SPRINKLES View Post
Anyone else catch yet another hidden star trek reference?
The "undiscovered country" line used by Baltar in one of his radio addresses? (Which is from Hamlet, originally.)

My money is on Zarek as the finalist 5.
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