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maCCer · Jun 6, 2005, 11:49 PM

I found i am in the middle of a cross section

Dinan · Jun 7, 2005, 01:31 AM

same here

t_hah · 02:08 AM

Steve Jobs mentioned in the keynote, that there will be some new Power based products coming (Keynote at around 24:00). I am hoping that this means PowerBooks soon. I need one, and I am kind of waiting for the next one. The current systems are going to be supported for a long time, and I am not worried about compatibility. With universal apps the current computers will be running for a long time.

By the time they stop supporting current hardware, the current hardware will be obsolete anyway. If you need a PowerBook, get it, you will be fine.

The transition will take 2 years. The PowerBook line may not be the first to transition... so you still have plenty of milage left in the current hardware.

maCCer · Jun 7, 2005, 02:39 AM

Originally Posted by t_hah

Steve Jobs mentioned in the keynote, that there will be some new Power based products coming (Keynote at around 24:00). I am hoping that this means PowerBooks soon. I need one, and I am kind of waiting for the next one. The current systems are going to be supported for a long time, and I am not worried about compatibility. With universal apps the current computers will be running for a long time.

By the time they stop supporting current hardware, the current hardware will be obsolete anyway. If you need a PowerBook, get it, you will be fine.

The transition will take 2 years. The PowerBook line may not be the first to transition... so you still have plenty of milage left in the current hardware.

Originally Posted by t_hah

Steve Jobs mentioned in the keynote, that there will be some new Power based products coming (Keynote at around 24:00).

I have not watched the keynote, so that means there would be some update for PB soon?

maCCer · Jun 7, 2005, 08:00 AM

i have just watch throught the keynote, and i found buying PB now is not good idea, at least, not furture wise investment

The road map for Intel processor is much better for powerPC as showed in the keynote, i do not want to spend that amount money on something that would only left little power within the next 1.5 or 2 years compare to intel base Mac.
I love Mac very much, however, i just feel jobs left those consumers like me in the dark(actually planed to buy a PB after WWDC

), in other words, by far, i thought buying Mac during the next 1.5-2 years would take some risks

.

maCCer · Jun 7, 2005, 08:22 AM

Just some thoughts pop up.
We just finished Transition from os to osx, then another complete new TRANSITION Begined, do you guys think that is too frequent for BIG TRANSITION for consumer and apple itself?

wtmcgee · Jun 7, 2005, 08:30 AM

I'll be buying one soon, I'm holding out hope for the new freescale chips in the next powerbook iteration ... hopefully we see some kind of update soon.

NeXTLoop · Jun 7, 2005, 10:04 AM

The real question is: Do you need one now? Just because a new chipset will be used approximately two years down the road, doesn't mean that the current machines are crap. And since the average lifespan of a computer is not much more than a couple of years anyway, if you get a PB now, you should just about be ready for a new one when the Intel based ones start hitting the market. Even more ready by the time the second revisions do.

jasong · Jun 7, 2005, 01:01 PM

I voted yes, but it's a conditional one. Apple has to release a PowerBook that's a large enough upgrade from what I am using now to get me to upgrade. I waited 4 years to upgrade my G3 PowerBook to a G4 one. Why? Because that's how long it took for the new models to have enough to make me jump. The next PowerBook that has enough (faster, more battery life) will get my money. I don't care if it is PPC, Intel, or monkey based. As long as it runs OS X.

Sourbook · Jun 7, 2005, 01:55 PM

I voted "no" because my current Powerbook should serve me well, until the new Intel/P-books hit the market. I do look forward to buying one when they become available.

theBlend · Jun 7, 2005, 04:07 PM

If I didn't have a Powerbook now, I'd probably still be willing to buy a used one. I'm not sure I'd make the leap for a brand new PPC based powerbook however.

Randman · Jun 7, 2005, 04:14 PM

I'd like to wait for a rev b PowerBook. That would be optimum.

Kyros · Jun 7, 2005, 04:20 PM

Absolutely. I need a laptop now, and there's no way it's going to be a pc. Honestly, I really don't care that better ones will be out in a year. That's always the case. It may be more drastic this time, but I know my laptop will be fine for a few years. I will probably get a revision B Mactel laptop once they come out.

maCCer · Jun 7, 2005, 06:49 PM

my current concern is more focusing on Software compatibility, any idea about the following situation:
After 2 years, when new SWs release for mac , would the program still can be run on both PPC and Intel, or Intel ony?

Ron Goodman · Jun 7, 2005, 07:16 PM

I plan to buy one to replace my old iBook while I still can. Right now, I have no interest at all in buying an Intel based Mac, especially one with DRM built-in.

flukewurm · Jun 7, 2005, 07:44 PM

Originally Posted by maCCer

my current concern is more focusing on Software compatibility, any idea about the following situation:
After 2 years, when new SWs release for mac , would the program still can be run on both PPC and Intel, or Intel ony?

long answer: watch the keynote. pay attention to the part where they talk about universal binary appz for the future.

short answer: dont worry so much.

i dont understand why so many people are freaking the f0ck out. apple seems to have a pretty good plan to make a fairly smooth end-user transition into x86-land. the only thing we really should be worried about is how much quicker the intel sheeps will be compared to the current IBM line

yticolev · Jun 7, 2005, 10:15 PM

I don't see any issue in keeping my 1.25 PB for two more years. In fact, the only compelling upgrade will be a mobile chip with 5 plus hours of battery life. That is the only thing I miss from my titanium. Performance is fine for my uses after a year and a half. Both Panther and Tiger provided noticable performance gains.

Dinan · Jun 7, 2005, 11:29 PM

just bought a 1.67ghz 15"

i figure that even when the intel chips come out, my computer will still work for what i need. i dont plan on upgrading for a good 4 years

rhythmicmoose · Jun 8, 2005, 12:01 AM

Yes, I ordered a 15" today, and here's why. I'm heading off to college, where it is said computers generally last for two years. I've waited forever - too long in my opinion - for the next PowerBook architecture to be released, and as time has progressed I've lowered my standards from G5 to dual-core G4 until finally, on Sunday, I was considering buying a new machine if Apple released 7448-based PowerBooks at WWDC (I was still in denial about Intel). Monday sealed it. The new architecture that I've been waiting for this entire time won't be here until at least a year from now, maybe more.

So I ordered a 15" PowerBook a few hours ago on this logic: if my computers last me two-three years on average, anything I buy today will work just fine for me well into the big Transition phase. Once the Intel-based PowerBooks are out, I'll reevaluate, and probably sell the machine I just bought. Looking from that angle, any updates to the PowerPC-based systems seem pretty irrelevant. And this way I get to enjoy my new PowerBook for the rest of the summer.

It makes sense to me. In the words of the Wolfram Research guy, your mileage may vary.

newsushi · Jun 8, 2005, 12:45 AM

Actually, I'd say that if you're in need of a new PowerBook, you'd better buy one soon. We're looking at a 1 - 2 year break before the Intel PBs are out, perhaps 6 months longer if there are any delays at all (ALWAYS expect delays), and I usually like to wait for RevB before upgrading because of problems that always plague RevA's (Hey, they learn from their mistakes...). For me, then, it will likely be 3 - 3.5 years before I'm ready to move over to Intel-based PowerBooks. That's stretching it....really REALLY thin. I have a 1 year old 1.33 Ghz 12", and use it intensively with the Adobe Creative Suite (all of it). I kind of wish I was in need of a new PB now, That way I'd know that I was set until RevB Intel Powerbooks came along.

I just hope that Apple revamps their aging laptop lines first. With laptop sales surpassing desktop sales for the first time last month, Apple knows that they need to get some laptops out quickly. And I'm counting on that so that I can upgrade in 2.5 - 3 years.

My wish list for summer, 2007.

RevB 13.3" widescreen Powerbook
3Ghz mobile processor with 1Ghz system bus
2GB built-in RAM: expandable to 6Gb
250GB 7200rpm drive
GPU capable of powering 30" Cenima Display
Firewire 800 (1600?)
backlit keyboard (useless, but cool)
5 hour battery life

Ok Apple, you've got 2 years. Get to work. Make and correct your mistakes, and get my machine off of the assembly line!

andreas_g4 · Jun 8, 2005, 07:36 AM

Originally Posted by newsushi

backlit keyboard (useless, but cool)

Useless? Right...

b11051973 · Jun 8, 2005, 03:38 PM

Originally Posted by Randman

I'd like to wait for a rev b PowerBook. That would be optimum.

I was thinking the same thing. Wait till they offer the first upgrade of the Intel system.

Applecare on my 867Mhz 12" PB runs out in Feb of 2006. I was hoping a G5 PB would be out by then. Obviously, now I'll be waiting for an Intel PB. There's no way I'm buying another PowerPC Mac. Hopefully, the Intel PB comes out in the spring of 2006 and rev b comes out in the fall or early winter. That's when I'll be buying.

I find my current PB to be a little slow at 867Mhz. Especially compared to a G5 desktop. I watched the keynote on my 3.6Ghz Dell using QT 7.0. That looked amazing and was so smooth. I then tried the same on my 1.42Ghz Mac mini. That thing was noticeably jumpy. I didn't even want to try on my PB.

I thought of something earlier today. I'm more willing to buy a more expensive Intel PB since they've said it should be able to run Windows. Currently I use my PB more for entertainment purposes. If I could run Windows in dual boot or natively in a Virtual PC type configuration, that would be awesome. VPC now is too slow. I could just buy one laptop and I could run both Windows and OS X on it.

Come to think of it, I'm on my third Dell. When it comes time to upgrade that, I might just get a PowerMac instead for the same reasons. This Intel switch may end up saving me money. I'll just need one computer and one laptop instead of the two of each I have now. Granted I don't use my Windows laptop much because that's just for work.

songoku912 · Jun 8, 2005, 03:56 PM

Nope. My 1.33ghz pb is still rocking on, but will upgrade when they release the rev B pentium m powerbooks.

Voch · Jun 8, 2005, 03:57 PM

I'm thinking about grabbing a Mac mini to offload some of my current PowerBook tasks and get a Rev. B Intel Mac when the time comes (or a Rev. A after it's usability, etc. is "proven").

It's still a toss-up whether the first Intel-based Macs will be portables or desktops and pro or consumer.

b11051973 · Jun 8, 2005, 04:31 PM

I think PowerBooks will be the first to get Intel. They have the most need for an upgrade. I wonder if there will be another speed bump or 2 for the G4 PB??

olePigeon · Jun 8, 2005, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by songoku912

Nope. My 1.33ghz pb is still rocking on, but will upgrade when they release the rev B pentium m powerbooks.

Ditto. I figure 3 years is enough use outta my PowerBook. Rev B Pentium M for me too.

paul w · Jun 9, 2005, 02:35 AM

What has me wavering about upgrading to a new PPC now as opposed to a possible intel laptop in a year is the software availabilty. I certainly don't want to rush buy a machine just to run all my ppc apps with rosetta. But that also means shelling out for Microsoft and Adobe products when the current PPC versions work beautifully.

Then again if I go for a new ppc model I don't want to get squeezed in 3 years time when I have a perfectly good laptop speed wise, but am noticing there's less and less software available- despite all the promises of unversal binaries.

So: Buy now, get squeezed down the line?

OR wait a year and not have much new software and maybe a hefty Adobe/Microsoft tax?

hmmmm.

d.fine · Jun 9, 2005, 11:24 AM

No, because my RevA 1.25GHz Alu PB will go a long way still...

Go PPC

capuchin · Jun 9, 2005, 12:38 PM

Sure. I'll buy one if I need one. It'll be supported by Apple and pretty much every developer for the next five years at least, so why not?

craigthomas · Jun 9, 2005, 02:01 PM

I'm looking for any solid reason to upgrade my 1Ghz/1GB TiBook. I don't expect the IntelBooks for some time, and I'm ok with getting one more PPCBook before. The question I'm toying with is to get the 1.67 now or hope for another PPC speed bump soon.

wilsonng · 12:11 AM

I'm happily chugging away on my 867 Mhz PB G4 12" right now.

I think I'm gonna get the high-end Mac Mini as a stop-gap performance booster until the Intel PBs come out.

My PB 12" is still strong enough as a portable solution while the Mac Mini will give me some breathing room (albeit not much) when it comes to current applications.

nuggetman · Jun 9, 2005, 08:16 PM

There's 10 years of PowerPC based systems out in the market place. Any developer, including Apple, who does not compile for Intel and PPC for the very long term will be comitting suicide

Simon · Jun 10, 2005, 08:25 AM

Here's what I posted somewhere else already (this thread seems more appropriate).

I got a 15" 1.67 GHz PowerBook right after they were introduced and I expected that it would allow me to get past the rev A of the next generation PowerBook (Freescale 7487+ or whatever vapor name they gave it or low-power 970), so that I could buy the rev B of the next big thing.

But now, I'm afraid the wait could be quite a bit longer. Not that I believe that my 1.67 GHz won't be any good in a year from now, but I just like getting a new PowerBook with every other revision, meaning roughly once every 12-14 months. Judging by Jon Stoke's rather sensible guessing over at at Ars, it will be no earlier than spring 2006 till we get the first Intel PowerBook (with a Jonah chip), making it probably at least winter 06/07 till we get a rev B (Merom chip).

OTOH, after just getting a new PowerBook, I don't really think it makes much sense to buy the next one Apple throws out, just to be sure to have the last PPC PowerBook to get me over till the second Intel PowerBook...

Carnage Visors · Jun 11, 2005, 10:50 PM

I was in the market for a new powerbook... and I just got one this week (after the steve note). My feelings are, that the 15" PowerBook is fast enough for me right now, and I tend to go 2 years between upgrades anyway.

But to be honest, I would rather not get a revision 1. intel PowerBook, you never know if there could be any issues, like with the first run of ppc machines.

-B

osxisfun · Jun 11, 2005, 10:54 PM

>OTOH, after just getting a new PowerBook, I don't really think it makes much sense to buy the next one Apple throws out, just to be sure to have the last PPC PowerBook to get me over till the second Intel PowerBook...

Dual core baby! that's more than reason enough!

I do hope. (and see no reason why not and in fact they prob. HAVE to.) they have faster revs of machines now...

the pc guys are constanly doing the bumps. guess apple will have too.

sure to cut down on the "When is the new powerbook coming out?" threads.

hihowareyou · Jun 12, 2005, 12:14 AM

i voted no

but only because i just bought a new powerbook last year and don't need a new one. i wouldn't hold out buying a one if i really needed it, especially since you could be waiting until 2007

mgl · Jun 12, 2005, 09:12 AM

I think the first Intel PBs will be out in Q1 or Q2 06. Probably March or April. Less than a year from now. This will be the dual core Yonah.

I bought a new iMac G5 yesterday, because I would have bought one now without the Intel announcement and guessing that the iMacs won't get updated until Q3 06. But I wasn't going to replace my book for another 6 months so I will just delay that by 6 months and get the rev A Intel PB instead.

Yes, there are sometimes problems with rev A units but not always but I've personally had worse problems with non rev A units.

I will order an Intel PowerBook on the day they're announced.

jimcpherson · Jun 12, 2005, 11:14 AM

I'll wait. Just got a 17" Powerbook 2 months ago. I'll stick it out until the 2nd rev. of Intel based Powerbooks are available.

veryniceguy2002 · Jun 19, 2005, 01:41 AM

No. I was planned to buy a PowerBook G5 around December timeframe. Since there will be no PowerBook G5 by then, and then an Intel Powerbook sometime next year, I would keep my 2.5 years old 1GHz PB G4 for a bit longer... or perhaps I should get a small Sony Vaio notebook for my own Christmas present this year?

wilsonng · 02:25 AM

Originally Posted by veryniceguy2002

No. I was planned to buy a PowerBook G5 around December timeframe. Since there will be no PowerBook G5 by then, and then an Intel Powerbook sometime next year, I would keep my 2.5 years old 1GHz PB G4 for a bit longer... or perhaps I should get a small Sony Vaio notebook for my own Christmas present this year?

Do you have a project that requires more power then what your current PB can do? If the answer is yes then go ahead and get a new Vaio or even a new PowerBook.

Alot of people are forgetting that developers will most likely be making Universal Binary versions of their programs that will work on both MacTel and PowerPC chips.

The PowerBooks are still viable laptops so there's no need to worry about obsolescence.

My 867 Ghz 12" PB G4 is also getting long in the tooth but my work requirements aren't demanding enough to upgrade. So until my laptop breaks or I encounter a project that requires more horsepower, I'm staying with my faithful workhorse.

I've read other threads on this forum about how some folks upgrade every year. It's mind-boggling. Some folks just want to keep up with the latest and greatest. If their work demands the latest and greatest, I'd say they were right in upgrading.

Heck, I still have my first generation iPod 5gb when it first came out! I sometimes look longingly at the new iPods but my old one still works. So I don't see any real need to upgrade to a new one unless the new iPod can take out my trash and cook 3 meals a day for me

cmx · 11:35 AM

Yes, I'm going to buy a Powerbook soon (15" 1,67 SD), even if there are faster ones on the way (actually, there are always faster PB's on their way).

I'm a college student in film, and at my school we always use PowerPC's to edit our work. To give you an example: my 'year assignement' was partially edited using Final Cut Pro 4.5 on a G5 (model that came out in September, don't know at what speed) and a G3. I didn't really notice any speed differences, only when actually rendering the films when I exported them.

Now, because my brother is going to college too next year, and he will be taking my now four year old Windows-based computer, I will be buying an Apple: working on Mac has made me realize what sort of crap Windows really is for most of it.

Because I stay at my dorm during the week, and for the rest of the time, I'm making 1,5 hours traintravels and staying at home, I figured it would be best to buy me a portable. With the software I'd be running (Photoshop CS and Final Cut, ... ) I thought it would be best to get a Powerbook because of the speed.

Since I am still able, at school, to work fluently with Final Cut Pro HD on a G3, and I'm not so much of a have-to-update-everyear kind of person, I think buying a new Powerbook this year won't be so much of a mistake; I will be editing for the next three years or so to come and by then, updating might be an option (and selling the by then 'old' Powerbook).

Cheers, and hello to everyone over here

gerwin

Edit: I forgot to mention, in case you wondered if I wanted to edit on a 5400 RPM HD: no, I use an external drive.

MrForgetable · Jun 19, 2005, 02:52 PM

mm.. Pentium M-ac

iceage · Jun 20, 2005, 02:02 AM

I am planning to buy a new powerbook before Xmas this year . I think the transition between the PowerPC chip will take longer than planned . If you are going to run Final Cut Pro you should be good to go right out of the box but and it is a big but , what if the applications you need to use don't work properly with Rosetta ? I am sure most people will find they have 5-10 apps that won't run properly on the Intel chips and they probably have to upgrade the app ( after waiting 6 to 12 months for the upgrade ) to make it work . Developers making a little ka-ching while the sun shines. I noticed at the U.S Applestore all the powerbooks are shipped same day - makes me wonder if they are having a little inventory build-up problem ?

powermacj7 · Jun 20, 2005, 06:13 AM

I just purchased a PB, knowing about the Intel switch. I needed a new one, and did not hesitate to get it. Apple will be supporting PPC for awhile, no fear. I was not about to wait a year to get my work done, etc. If I all ready had a computer, I may have waited. In my opinion, you want a PB now, go for it.

solero · Jun 20, 2005, 06:35 AM

As soon as Apple updates the Powerbook I'll be getting one - doesn't matter if it's G4, G5 or Intel - Just do it soon!

maCCer · Jun 20, 2005, 06:47 AM

Originally Posted by solero

As soon as Apple updates the Powerbook I'll be getting one - doesn't matter if it's G4, G5 or Intel - Just do it soon!

my one is coming

can not wait

justinkim · Jun 20, 2005, 11:20 AM

I'll most likely wait. My 1GHz TiBook isn't so much slower than the current machines for it to make sense for me to upgrade right now. It handles the small amount of freelance webdev work I do just fine and I have a dual 1.8 G5 at work. Any heavy processing I need done at home (outside Photoshop), I can do on one of my two Athlon 64s.

maCCer · Jun 20, 2005, 07:06 PM

look at that http://www.appleinsider.com/article.php?id=1142

I was David B. · Jun 21, 2005, 04:48 AM

Originally Posted by maCCer

I found i am in the middle of a cross section

I see no reason to wait because of intel chips.

The power pcs have done a good job over the last years. My Powerbook is fast enough for me (and all the previous powerbooks and iBooks have been fast enought too). I never had the feeling that an up to date mac was slower in everyday tasks than an up to date pc (but I don't play games except a little tomb raider and myst from time to time).

The pentium M in my Thinkpad is awfully slow when it runs on battery. I compared java performance on my powerbook running linux and Mac OS with java performance on a thinkpad running linux. This shows that the powerbook hardware is roughly as capable as the thinkpad when both are running linux. Mac OS is the bottleneck (still). And this might not change with intel hardware. I assume that it will take apple some tuning until Mac OS runs as well on intel chips as it runs on power pcs now.

The fact that it compiles on pentiums does not mean that it is optimized in any way. My 24 years of programming experience says that the real work starts, after a code compiles. Remember how may years apple is already tuning Mac OS? The software still becomes faster with every release. And the first releases were terribly slow.
So be again prepared for some years of non optimized OS.

So the golden rule, avoid rev a, will very likely apply here too.
I am very curious, how intel macs will run. But I will not throw money into them before I have thoroughly checked them. I remember the trauma with my rev a TiBook and the Mac OS 10.0/10.1 too well.
The current powerbooks are end of the line machines. That means for a long time they are the best quality/reliability/price you can buy.

Some months ago I sold a TiBook for a very good price only because it booted into Mac OS 9. After the intel things are out I am sure the power pcs can be sold to pros who rely on a working and stable system. And indeed, they pay well

.

alimunnik · Jun 22, 2005, 12:49 PM

I would suspect that an Intel PB will appear sooner than we think, unless theym anage to wring a dramatic performance boost out of the G4. It's been more than 6 months since the last upgrade. The PB is a great machine, and most loyal Mac users would not hesitate to buy a new one. But it's a different story for first time buyers who will probably be cajoled into buying faster and cheaper pc laptops. For sure the PB will be the first to get the new Intel chip. Without a major PB upgrade they can't really improve the specs of the iBook which right now ships with insufficient RAM to optimize Tiger performance. I wouldn't be surprised if new PB's appear before the end of the year. Going any longer than a full year without laptop upgrades doesn't seem like a very sound marketing strategy.