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theDailyGrind · Nov 2, 2003, 02:46 AM

This is something that amuses rather than disturbs me, but poses a potential threat to freedom of speech.

For example, when I submitted Kimdom Come ( http://www.thedailygrind.net/software/KimdomCome.html ), a Kim Jong-Il themed missile command game, to Apple's "OS X Downloads", I got a reply saying:

"We decline to use your submission due to the current political climate."

I was confounded. Not only does Apple have its own foreign policy, but it's pro Kim Jong-Il. Maybe they're shipping 1000s of suspect aluminium containers in the form of G5s?

Another example: macUpdate.com wouldn't list FaithConverter ( http://www.thedailygrind.net/softwar...Converter.html ).

To their credit, VersionTracker did, and left it up despite a furious subscriber's bizarre claim that the app is antisemitic.

Obviously it is the right of site administrators to decide what they publish. And if either rejected item was popular then the sites would be fining themselves by not including them, so a developer is really just a victim of their own lack of marketpower.

Computer software is becoming a form of art and expression, like literature and film. Not only has the internet, and especially Flash, blurred the distinction, but the US Army gives away a computer game promoting itself, and one of the recent LucasArts Star Wars games has been widely described as a liberals-vs-conservatives diatribe.

Similarly to the older mediums, violence is still perfectly acceptable but you must pick and choose your ideas. Maybe we need a Dr Strangelove (think Kubrick, not hentai) game?

Landos Mustache · Nov 2, 2003, 02:50 AM

Freedom Fries. That is all I have to say.

nonhuman · Nov 2, 2003, 03:52 AM

Originally posted by Landos Mustache:
Freedom Fries. That is all I have to say.

With an anti-American attitude like that you must be a Freedom-Canadian!

Landos Mustache · Nov 2, 2003, 03:56 AM

Originally posted by nonhuman:
With an anti-American attitude like that you must be a Freedom-Canadian!

That is not Anti-American. That is Anti-extremely stupid.

But I can see how you get the 2 mixed up.

MindFad · Nov 2, 2003, 04:17 AM

Dear Universe,

Why do you not collapse violently upon yourself?

Regards,

MindFad

nonhuman · Nov 2, 2003, 04:21 AM

Originally posted by Landos Mustache:
That is not Anti-American. That is Anti-extremely stupid.

But I can see how you get the 2 mixed up.

Sigh, I was hoping the "Freedom-Canadian" part would tip you off to the fact that it was a joke...

But what do you expect from a Canuck.

dtriska · Nov 2, 2003, 08:02 AM

Originally posted by theDailyGrind:
This is something that amuses rather than disturbs me, but poses a potential threat to freedom of speech.

The Commies are coming! The Commies are coming!

sideus · Nov 2, 2003, 08:25 AM

A private company decided not to list software on it's own website. Seems to be their choice.

benign · Nov 2, 2003, 09:51 AM

Senseless destruction and the possibility of
offending the megalomaniacal religious types
is very high on peoples agendas right now.

If they have artistic merit maybe it would be
worth it - do they ?

theDailyGrind · Nov 2, 2003, 11:05 AM

Originally posted by sideus:
A private company decided not to list software on it's own website. Seems to be their choice.

Of course it is. I totally agree. I'm not whining about sour grapes. I'm just surprised to find political editorial policy on these sites.

Remember when Rupert Murdoch blocked the publication of Chris Patten's book East and West because the Chinese government didn't like it? He was perfectly entitled to decide what companies linked to his empire published.

This kind of issue is something I have trouble solidifying an opinion over.

1) Clearly it's a publisher or webmaster's right to list or not list according to their opinions, and the market rewards or punishes them accordingly.

2) An example for the other side: media companies these days are going out of their way to appear patriotic (=nationalist). Alternative views and inconvenient facts regarding Palestine, "terrorism" and the war on Islam were frozen out of the mainstream media. No government decree could have been as powerful. This reached disgusting levels between late 2001 and early this year, but fortunately seems to be receeding now Iraq has gone spin-cycle.

My point in posting this thread was not to pine for sympathy or be alarmist. Rather, I wanted to use these software anecdotes to demonstrate how much voluntary censorship/filtering/selection goes on where you'd never expect it, without our knowledge.

Misanthrope · Nov 2, 2003, 11:12 AM

Originally posted by MindFad:
Dear Universe,

Why do you not collapse violently upon yourself?

Regards,

MindFad

It needs a freedom-fry addict to sit on the damn thing.

ReggieX · Nov 2, 2003, 11:14 AM

Originally posted by MindFad:
Dear Universe,

Why do you not collapse violently upon yourself?

Regards,

MindFad

Dear MindFad.

Thanks for asking! Total gravitational collapse is currently scheduled for approximately t+10 billion years, give or take a few depending on the final value of the Hubble constant (currently estimated to be between 50 kilometers/sec/Megaparsec and 100 km/s/Megaparsec). Thanks for asking!

Regards,

Universe

rjenkinson · Nov 2, 2003, 12:24 PM

Originally posted by theDailyGrind:
Of course it is. I totally agree. I'm not whining about sour grapes. I'm just surprised to find political editorial policy on these sites.

My point in posting this thread was not to pine for sympathy or be alarmist. Rather, I wanted to use these software anecdotes to demonstrate how much voluntary censorship/filtering/selection goes on where you'd never expect it, without our knowledge.

exhibit A: a truck (not actual size)

except the gaping hole in your argument big enough to drive a truck through is that no one is preventing those developers from publishing their software elsewhere or even, get ready for it, on their own websites. it's no more censorship than asking for a favour and being told "no" is.

-r.

Landos Mustache · Nov 2, 2003, 01:39 PM

Originally posted by nonhuman:
Sigh, I was hoping the "Freedom-Canadian" part would tip you off to the fact that it was a joke...

But what do you expect from a Canuck.

I was equally kidding

nonhuman · Nov 2, 2003, 02:00 PM

Originally posted by Landos Mustache:
I was equally kidding

I figured as much.

jckalen · Nov 2, 2003, 02:19 PM

someone here has been spending faaaar too much time trying to read between the lines. Maybe your apps just don't meet their standards. I have seen some of these via macgamefiles.com and, while they are amusing, they are not necessarily the next biggest thing since pong.

I think you would have a hard time finding similar software anywhere on apples site - it just ain't up their alley. Maybe they were trying to be polite when they meant to say "chances are, it will annoy people because it will end up in their trash minutes after downloading it" or "it's not worth the bandwidth"

I mean no offense - I find some of your apps amusing (liked taxpayers millions but much of it was a little insider-ish) but I did not feel compelled to save them for any length of time - and that has nothing to do with politics.