[icruise]

That seems rather odd, considering that Vivid and others are supposedly making Blu-ray porn.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by icruise 

That seems rather odd, considering that Vivid and others are supposedly making Blu-ray porn.

Yeah, it does seem like something to be taken with a grain of salt.

OTOH, Vivid has not released any Blu-ray pr0n titles thus far.

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Eug 

The reality of it though is something in between. Like I said before, it's going to be a stalemate.

Until those sales numbers came out and showed Blu-ray caught up in less than a month when the PS3 shipped and toshiba's estimates for this year HD-DVD shipments is 75% lower than just the PS3's I was very surprised. I thought this year it would be neck to neck but unless the PS3's sales take a huge dive by end of year we could already see a HUGE gap rather than a close tie.

If so 2008 will be the deciding year.

[Dark Helmet]

Some scary news for HD-DVD:
Universal: No new HD DVD titles for 2007 announced - Engadget HD

Some good news for Blu-ray:
Blu-ray discs to add a little something extra - PS3 Fanboy

If a blueray disk also came with a smaller version of the movie to put on my PSP I would die.

[Peter]

thats awesome

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

Some scary news for HD-DVD:
Universal: No new HD DVD titles for 2007 announced - Engadget HD

Basically, Universal didn't blow their entire year's load at CES like some of the other studios.

They're just going to continue releasing titles like they have been. Specifically, Battlestar Galactica is coming from Universal to HD DVD (and not Blu-ray). BSG is the single most important HD purchase for me.

I'm also happy that the Lord of the Rings triology is coming from New Line to both HD DVD and Blu-ray (possibly on those THD discs though).

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Eug 

Basically, Universal didn't blow their entire year's load at CES like some of the other studios.

What are they waiting for to counter the competition? All the media attention they might get on Easter?

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

What are they waiting for to counter the competition? All the media attention they might get on Easter?

Nah. They just didn't bother. They are planning to release as they did before. Announce their releases a little while before they come out, on an ongoing basis.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Eug 

Yeah, it does seem like something to be taken with a grain of salt.

OTOH, Vivid has not released any Blu-ray pr0n titles thus far.

Cost may be the real reason: The porn industry says HD DVD

One of the big problems they have with Blu-ray is its expense, followed by its market share. "Blu-ray has superior quality, yes," said a spokesperson for porn studio Bangbros, "but HD DVD is easier to produce, cheaper to produce and there are more HD DVD players in homes than there are Blu-ray players, for example in the Xbox 360."

Pink Visual heavily complained about the fact that Blu-ray discs cannot be replicated and a range of other studios, who did not want to be mentioned by name indicated that the cost of going with Blu-ray cancels the technology as a possible HD solution for this industry. "Only bigger studios can afford Blu-ray, and even then it's not economical," we were told.

It would seem that either Blu-ray has to do some catching up very quickly. But we got the strange feeling that HD DVD has won the format war already, at least in the porn industry.

[Dark Helmet]

I don't want HD porn. Seriously.

A month ago I turned on the TV and it was one of those soft core discovery channelish, science of sex shows in 1080i. I got really turned off as you could see every goosebump, pimple, bead of sweat and stray hair. Trust me it almost made me sick.

[Eug]

Heh neither do I but some people want it.

I am just interested in their comments about they are choosing one format over the other.

[Gossamer]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

I don't want HD porn. Seriously.

A month ago I turned on the TV and it was one of those soft core discovery channelish, science of sex shows in 1080i. I got really turned off as you could see every goosebump, pimple, bead of sweat and stray hair. Trust me it almost made me sick.

As opposed to real sex when you...what...have your eyes closed?

[Dakar²]

He has all his partners air-brushed beforehand.

[Gossamer]

Originally Posted by Dakar² 

He has all his partners air-brushed beforehand.

I need some of those gaussian-blur goggles.

[Dakar²]

Isn't that beer?

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Gossamer 

As opposed to real sex when you...what...have your eyes closed?

Sex usually isn't under bright studio lighting and you try to picture a 50 inch nipple looking at you from 8 feet away while you are eating chips. If that is your thing enjoy, but it is not for me.

[Eug]

I got really turned off as you could see every goosebump, pimple, bead of sweat and stray hair.

Ironically, this is one reason why some people like broadcast HD so much. Everything is crystal clear, and the first thing people mention is the hair and pores on skin.

[Gossamer]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

Sex usually isn't under bright studio lighting and you try to picture a 50 inch nipple looking at you from 8 feet away while you are eating chips. If that is your thing enjoy, but it is not for me.

I prefer popcorn.

[Dakar²]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

50 inch nipple

We talkin' height or radius?

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Eug 

Ironically, this is one reason why some people like broadcast HD so much. Everything is crystal clear, and the first thing people mention is the hair and pores on skin.

The makeup industry is scared shitless of it. Many actress' wont do it. Watching Star Trek Enterprise I could see the aliens contacts and the seams where the plastic forhead began and ended.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

The makeup industry is scared shitless of it. Many actress' wont do it. Watching Star Trek Enterprise I could see the aliens contacts and the seams where the plastic forhead began and ended.

Hell, you could see that anyway before the DVDs even came out.

[goMac]

Sony bans porn on Bluray:

http://duggmirror.com/tech_news/No_P...D_DVD_Blu_ray/

Looks like Bluray has lost.

(Sorry it takes forever to load, being dugg)

[icruise]

Um, that just links to the same exact article that spurred this current discussion.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by icruise 

Um, that just links to the same exact article that spurred this current discussion.

Oh, I scrolled up a bit and I didn't see it. I just saw the link that said HD-DVD was easier to produce.

Sorry bout that.

[Eug]

This post is old, but it's from the prez of Synapse Films:

When we met with Sony to discuss titles and told them about THRILLER and THE IMAGE and that we wanted to do BLU-RAY discs of those two titles, they pretty much told us they WOULDN'T do them because of their extreme adult content! They were like "umm... well... we don't know if we can do that sort of thing." That attitude may just outright kill the BLU-RAY format. People want adult films... it's a hundreds of millions of dollars a year business... and HD-DVD will have them. It's funny how, when I bring this up (about the adult films), that people say that "they didn't think of that" when discussing which format will prevail.

[Eug]

A Sony Pictures insider confirms it is Sony policy (and Sony does much of the disc replication right now).

"Sony replication will not handle pornographic product and I think many of other major replicators have similar policies."

[icruise]

But does that mean that Sony is forbidding porn to appear on Blu-ray, or just that they won't press it themselves?

[Eug]

It means they won't press it themselves, and neither will many others.

He didn't say specifically that Blu-ray isn't stopping anyone else from doing it, but one can infer that Sony is leaving it up to the companies themselves, so that's fine.

The problem is that there are currently limited replication services for Blu-ray, and if the major disc replication companies say no, then you're probably SOL.

On the HD DVD side, it is likely much less of a problem, since supposedly existing DVD stamping lines can be quickly changed to HD DVD stamping lines (and back again) at will, so there is no such limitation on HD DVD replication.

EDIT:

I forgot to mention that at least according to a Microsoft insider (who is biased towards HD DVD obviously), Sony is the only company who is currently stamping BD50 in significant quantities. There are other BD replicators, but they are only doing BD25, and are still in the testing phase for BD50. If true, that means it's basically impossible to get porn made on BD50 at the moment. BD25 should be possible, but would still be problematic for the reasons outlined previously.

Hence, some porn companies are switching to HD DVD.

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Eug 

If true, that means it's basically impossible to get porn made on BD50 at the moment. BD25 should be possible, but would still be problematic for the reasons outlined previously.

Holy cow how much porn does one need on a single disk?!!

[Gossamer]

I thought you wanted realistic audio...

[zro]

Porn on VHS killed Betamax.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

Holy cow how much porn does one need on a single disk?!!

Hey, you're the one that says BD50 is better. At least with porn you'll get the bazillion angles and maybe some "interactive" features. But yeah, 30 GB per movie should be enough, as evidenced by the fact they're going to HD DVD.

And to think I was excited when I bought my Fujitsu 1 GB hard drive...

[icruise]

Originally Posted by zro 

Porn on VHS killed Betamax.

Yes it did. I'm not convinced that porn will be such a decisive factor in the next generation, though. With VHS vs. Beta, it was the idea of being able to watch porn in the comfort of your own home that was such a big draw, but we already have that with DVD, which isn't going away anytime soon. Also, most studios can't afford to shoot in HD -- a lot of them even still shoot on crappy analog video tape and put that on DVD. Of course the quality sucks, but most people don't seem to mind.

[Eug]

It's actually pretty cheap to shoot on HD these days from what I gather. Cheaper than film anyway. Most mid to higher end pron outfits should have no problem. The uber low budget stuff is another story, but even then, I'm hearing that some wedding videographers are now even shooting HD now. Sure, their cameras aren't so great, but it's still much higher resolution than before.

I mean, even iMovie fully supports HD, as does iDVD.

I agree though, I don't think it will have a huge affect on the war this time around. That said, it will have some affect if nearly all are on HD DVD early on.

[Eug]

Hmm.... Even more HD DVD porn announcements. Some reports say there are now a dozen independent porn producers that will be doing HD porn exclusively on HD DVD, at least until Blu-ray gets its head screwed on straight. Wicked pictures and ClubJenna are two of these studios:

InfoWorld: CES - HD DVD gets boost from adult film industry

"It's a lot less expensive to use HD DVD," said Jackie Ramos, vice president of DVD production at Wicked Pictures, at the Adult Entertainment Expo in Las Vegas, which runs parallel with the International Consumer Electronics Show.

Wicked faced a huge hurdle because neither the HD DVD nor Blu-ray Disc camps seemed willing to help the adult industry mass-produce their films on high-definition discs, Ramos said. But some members of the HD DVD camp -- whom Ramos declined to name -- finally lent a hand.

"Suddenly we got help, and boom, we were able to move forward and do it," he said.

Blu-ray never offered such help. Wicked had no access to the "stampers" it needed to reproduce its films in bulk, Ramos said. Still, Wicked has not ruled out Blu-ray Disc and hopes to work with the format some time in the future.

[Gossamer]

Originally Posted by Eug 

at least until Blu-ray gets its head screwed on straight.

I know there's a joke in there somewhere.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Gossamer 

I know there's a joke in there somewhere.

Heheh.

[Dark Helmet]

For the recored though both blu-ray and HD-DVD sales seem to be doing pretty good right now and that is with no porn on either.

[Dark Helmet]

Blu-ray sales up 700%, edge into a lead over HD-DVD - PS3 Fanboy

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

Blu-ray sales up 700%, edge into a lead over HD-DVD - PS3 Fanboy

"Ignore for a moment that the original article comes from Blu-ray.com and it's a few days old..."

[Rumor]

HD-DVD goes beyond 50GB with new disc - DVDTOWN.com

Toshiba has announced a new 51GB HD-DVD Rom disc at this year's CES.

Beating Blu-ray by 1GB, Toshiba today said that they had successfully created a triple layer HD-DVD disc that could contain 51GB worth of data with 17GB on each layer.

[Dakar²]

Impressive.

That coupled with porn might just win it for them.

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by Dakar² 

Impressive.

That coupled with porn might just win it for them.

Except that these guys thinks they can get 250GB on Blu-ray.

http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=5656

Anyway it is all pointless if they don't work on current gen players.

Also the 51 gig HD-DVD disk is coming at the end of the year and that might be too late.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Rumor 

HD-DVD goes beyond 50GB with new disc - DVDTOWN.com

That was posted several days ago. Anyways, as mentioned earlier, so far it's just a technology proposal. It works (prototypes), and it's manufacturable since it's actually only 2 physical discs (with one of the discs having data on the middle surface, constituting the extra layer), but it has not yet been adopted by the DVD Forum. And even if it were adopted, there is no guarantee it would work on existing hardware.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by icruise 

That seems rather odd, considering that Vivid and others are supposedly making Blu-ray porn.

Debbie Does Blu-ray & HD-DVD

"...a Vivid spokeswoman today said Debbie Does Dallas...Again will be released in both formats on the same day."

[Eug]

Originally Posted by icruise 

That seems rather odd, considering that Vivid and others are supposedly making Blu-ray porn.

Vivid: We found a Blu-ray replicator, but they tried to block us

---

P.S. When asked about Blu-ray vs. HD DVD, a bull-riding nymph replied: "I prefer blondes"

[Dark Helmet]

I think this 51 gig HD-DVD disk will do more harm than good.

The HD-DVD specs for manufacturers is TWO layer switching, not 3. I can't understand how suddenly 3 layer disks would work on 2 layer readers. The fact that Toshiba also doesn't touch on that subject makes it look like they will not work on current players.

The 51 gig disk "Hopes" to be approved this year with titles at the end of the year which may be too late with the way PS3's are moving Blu-ray.

Even then what will current HD-DVD owners think? They will be pissed.
What will who PLANNED on getting HD-DVD think? They will want to wait for 3 layer players.
Why wait till the end of the year for 51 gigs if you can have 50 gigs today with Blu-ray that works on all players?

So all current 300,000 HD-DVD players could be out in the cold with 51 gig disks.

How will these disks be labeled? HD-DVD 3 layer? 51 gig HD-DVD? Do you think any HD-DVD owner wants to check the packaging to find out if it will even play?

Also how do manufacturers deal with it? Do they only release 51 gig disks leaving their current install base in the cold or do they release a 25 gig AND 51 gig disk of the same movie. If they do that how do they decide how to get a 51 gig movie on to a 25 gig one? Do they cut extra's, lower quality?

Even IF it works on current players (And I can't see how) it is still not worth waiting a year for 51 gigs when there is 50 today.

Plus all that aside it really makes Toshiba and HD-DVD seem desperate or aware that storage size matters to consumers.

[jokell82]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

I think this 51 gig HD-DVD disk will do more harm than good.

The HD-DVD specs for manufacturers is TWO layer switching, not 3. I can't understand how suddenly 3 layer disks would work on 2 layer readers. The fact that Toshiba also doesn't touch on that subject makes it look like they will not work on current players.

The 51 gig disk "Hopes" to be approved this year with titles at the end of the year which may be too late with the way PS3's are moving Blu-ray.

Even then what will current HD-DVD owners think? They will be pissed.
What will who PLANNED on getting HD-DVD think? They will want to wait for 3 layer players.
Why wait till the end of the year for 51 gigs if you can have 50 gigs today with Blu-ray that works on all players?

So all current 300,000 HD-DVD players could be out in the cold with 51 gig disks.

How will these disks be labeled? HD-DVD 3 layer? 51 gig HD-DVD? Do you think any HD-DVD owner wants to check the packaging to find out if it will even play?

Also how do manufacturers deal with it? Do they only release 51 gig disks leaving their current install base in the cold or do they release a 25 gig AND 51 gig disk of the same movie. If they do that how do they decide how to get a 51 gig movie on to a 25 gig one? Do they cut extra's, lower quality?

Even IF it works on current players (And I can't see how) it is still not worth waiting a year for 51 gigs when there is 50 today.

Plus all that aside it really makes Toshiba and HD-DVD seem desperate or aware that storage size matters to consumers.

If it can be fixed via a firmware update then the only thing early adopters will need to wait for are the movies. It's not like what they're watching right now just stops working until the update comes...

[Dark Helmet]

Originally Posted by jokell82 

If it can be fixed via a firmware update then the only thing early adopters will need to wait for are the movies. It's not like what they're watching right now just stops working until the update comes...

I fully understand that but I still don't see how a ROM update could allow that. If it was that easy why aren't all single layer burners ROM updated to Duals or DVD's upped to 3 or 4x layers by now.

It seems that it would require a totally different lens that can focus on 3 different layers.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Dark Helmet 

I think this 51 gig HD-DVD disk will do more harm than good.

The HD-DVD specs for manufacturers is TWO layer switching, not 3. I can't understand how suddenly 3 layer disks would work on 2 layer readers. The fact that Toshiba also doesn't touch on that subject makes it look like they will not work on current players.

The 51 gig disk "Hopes" to be approved this year with titles at the end of the year which may be too late with the way PS3's are moving Blu-ray.

Even then what will current HD-DVD owners think? They will be pissed.
What will who PLANNED on getting HD-DVD think? They will want to wait for 3 layer players.
Why wait till the end of the year for 51 gigs if you can have 50 gigs today with Blu-ray that works on all players?

So all current 300,000 HD-DVD players could be out in the cold with 51 gig disks.

How will these disks be labeled? HD-DVD 3 layer? 51 gig HD-DVD? Do you think any HD-DVD owner wants to check the packaging to find out if it will even play?

Also how do manufacturers deal with it? Do they only release 51 gig disks leaving their current install base in the cold or do they release a 25 gig AND 51 gig disk of the same movie. If they do that how do they decide how to get a 51 gig movie on to a 25 gig one? Do they cut extra's, lower quality?

Even IF it works on current players (And I can't see how) it is still not worth waiting a year for 51 gigs when there is 50 today.

Plus all that aside it really makes Toshiba and HD-DVD seem desperate or aware that storage size matters to consumers.

I don't think 51 GB discs will make it to market.

However it seems the bigger issue may not actually be reading the discs, as it seems the discs are being tested on modified versions of current hardware. ie. At least some current drives might be able to play these discs back with a firmware upgrade. It has already been demonstrated for TL45 with first gen NEC drives. I suspect the same is true for 2nd gen Toshiba drives. I dunno about the LG drive though.

The bigger issue could actually be playing the stuff back. TL51 is supposedly 1.5X, and current equipment may not be fast enough to decode at 1.5X speeds. OTOH, much of the hardware in HD DVD players is the same hardware as in Blu-ray players, and Blu-ray players can decode at these speeds, so maybe HD DVD players might be able to, too. However, if this were a problem, I suppose they could stick with TL45, since that spins at 1X.

But like I said, I doubt TL51 on HD DVD will ever make it to market. Too many potential headaches.

BTW, triple-layer 51 GB HD DVD is only two physical layers. It's just that one of the two physical layers has two data layers. For this reason, some HD DVD companies are claiming that TL HD DVD is still cheaper and easier to make than DL Blu-ray.

P.S. I don't think it actually matters. 30 GB is fine, as is evidenced by current releases. The only time it really makes a difference is with 3.5+ hour movies when you want extras on the same disc.