[besson3c]

I'm sure that several of you have ordered the Apple TV. Do you own a laptop? If so, what value do you see in the Apple TV?

[C.A.T.S. CEO]

I think we will get one (at some point or another) and I have 1 desktop and 1 laptop (Macs only tho)

(PS, should have been a poll )

[Calimus]

I ordered one for my mom so she can play her iTunes music on the big speakers hooked up to the "home theater" setup. She is also excited about having access to the iPhoto pics as her mini is in a back room and not practical for showing her friends & family that visit. She doesn't have cable either, so she might buy a few shows that she doesn't have access to to watch via the Apple TV.

[goMac]

I've been thinking about an Apple TV. I don't want to busy my laptop just driving my tv (and I watch a lot of iTunes store stuff).

I might eventually get a Mini though. I haven't made up mind.

[besson3c]

I'm using MythTV as a scheduling interface for recording programs, but I don't use it for feeding live TV to my TV because of being too lazy to string cables from my office to the TV, but I've thought about getting a cheap and fanless PC such as the Shuttle, running the MythTV front and backends on it, and going video out to my TV. The PC would be right by the TV.

I know this is a much geekier solution than what many people here would be hip to, but this does make a pretty good permanent PVR and recording/video watching interface, and you could probably put this rig together for just a few hundred dollars, although I haven't really priced it out yet.

I've also looked at the Hauppauge MediaMVP, which is basically a low-cost Apple TV, but the unit doesn't have enough RAM on it to really house a full Myth Frontend, which creates restrictions for the MVPMC project (MVPMC = Myth frontend hack for the Hauppauge MediaMVP). Still, the Hauppauge box is only $70 or $80, and MVPMC provides most of the core functionality of MythTV.

I bet one of the holdups with Apple providing their own PVR is dealing with satellite interfaces that are IR based. Having to reverse engineer the remote control signals is a PITA (although many have done it via LIRC and the like).

[Gossamer]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

I'm using MythTV as a scheduling interface for recording programs, but I don't use it for feeding live TV to my TV because of being too lazy to string cables from my office to the TV, but I've thought about getting a cheap and fanless PC such as the Shuttle, running the MythTV front and backends on it, and going video out to my TV. The PC would be right by the TV.

I know this is a much geekier solution than what many people here would be hip to, but this does make a pretty good permanent PVR and recording/video watching interface, and you could probably put this rig together for just a few hundred dollars, although I haven't really priced it out yet.

I've also looked at the Hauppauge MediaMVP, which is basically a low-cost Apple TV, but the unit doesn't have enough RAM on it to really house a full Myth Frontend, which creates restrictions for the MVPMC project (MVPMC = Myth frontend hack for the Hauppauge MediaMVP). Still, the Hauppauge box is only $70 or $80, and MVPMC provides most of the core functionality of MythTV.

I bet one of the holdups with Apple providing their own PVR is dealing with satellite interfaces that are IR based. Having to reverse engineer the remote control signals is a PITA (although many have done it via LIRC and the like).

That's funny because I was just thinking a little while ago about setting up a MythTV server with my sister's current computer once she gets her MacBook. She's taking a class that requires she use Office 2003 which neither she nor her high school has, so I got her a Dell with a 1 GHz PIII, 512MB of RAM, and a 20gig HD for $30. I figure I'll drop in a big hard drive and a Hauppauge PVR-150, get MythTV configured and it will be a nice media server to sit next to the TV since it's fairly small.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Gossamer 

That's funny because I was just thinking a little while ago about setting up a MythTV server with my sister's current computer once she gets her MacBook. She's taking a class that requires she use Office 2003 which neither she nor her high school has, so I got her a Dell with a 1 GHz PIII, 512MB of RAM, and a 20gig HD for $30. I figure I'll drop in a big hard drive and a Hauppauge PVR-150, get MythTV configured and it will be a nice media server to sit next to the TV since it's fairly small.

Yeah, if you aren't a Linux person I would suggest installing Knoppmyth - a Linux distro specifically designed for MythTV. The card does come with some Windows software, but from what I've heard it is crappy - MythTV is much cooler.

The 150 includes the MPEG-2 encoder, but not the decoder, so your PC will need to be powerful enough to play back the video via software without skipping. I'm not sure if the Dell will cut it, so you might want to look at a Hauppauge card that includes the hardware decoder, or possibly a faster video card that might handle this. I'm not sure if video cards normally help with MPEG-2 playback or not...

[Gossamer]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Yeah, if you aren't a Linux person I would suggest installing Knoppmyth - a Linux distro specifically designed for MythTV. The card does come with some Windows software, but from what I've heard it is crappy - MythTV is much cooler.

The 150 includes the MPEG-2 encoder, but not the decoder, so your PC will need to be powerful enough to play back the video via software without skipping. I'm not sure if the Dell will cut it, so you might want to look at a Hauppauge card that includes the hardware decoder, or possibly a faster video card that might handle this. I'm not sure if video cards normally help with MPEG-2 playback or not...

I've played with Linux some, my main desktop at home has Ubuntu on it (rarely used) and two of my three servers run Ubuntu Server edition, plus my roommate runs Ubuntu all the time on his computer, so between the two of us we have a bit of Linux experience. I did download a copy of Knoppmyth last summer but the TV tuner I have isn't compatible so I dropped that idea for a while. I also realized I'd need a way to get the video from the computer to a TV without VGA, and I figured a Radeon 7000 or 7500 would do the trick. It has S-Video out, available DVI out, plus an mpeg-2 decoder, all for $20-30. edit: It looks like the 7000's s-video out doesn't work with Knoppmyth, but I couldn't find anything concrete on the 7500.

[Calimus]

I tried to get MythTV running 2-3 years ago, even had a friend who is a linux system admin help me and we couldn't get everything working right with my current hardware. I'm sure I could have bought a couple things and gotten it running, but I decided to see what options were available for *shudder* windows. I found GBPVR which I have been running for the past 3 years. The wife even loves it and it never crashes and very rarely do we find any bugs or miss a show due to conflicts.

It's free, same as MythTV, and has many plugins to offer extra functionality. I've got emulators for NES, SNES, N64, MAME, PSX and others all accessible from my tv remote and playable via a wireless gamepad. Only hardware I bought to get it running was 2 250 gig drives and 2 hauppauge 150 tuner cards. At any given time I've got 100-150 episodes, movies, and other stuff recorded to select from on one drive, and the other drive I have all my downloaded video and my ripped dvds(from ones I own so I don't have to mess with discs when I want to watch a movie). There's even a Youtube plugin so you can watch the occasional clip if there is something worth watching.

[Railroader]

Hmm... hours spent managing a linux box, or plug it in and it works, with a warranty and tech support to back it, with an Apple TV.

Hmmm... my time is worth more than linux

[Calimus]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

Hmm... hours spent managing a linux box, or plug it in and it works, with a warranty and tech support to back it, with an Apple TV.

Hmmm... my time is worth more than linux

I would totally agree if Apple TV had pvr functionality(though I'm sure they are working on either a software option, or a stackable pvr device). For anything over 5-6 shows, it's cheaper to have a cable subscription VS buying the shows via iTunes. If you are downloading shows via bittorrent or getting them via another method, you'll still have the work of transcoding to a format the Apple TV will play.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by Calimus 

I would totally agree if Apple TV had pvr functionality(though I'm sure they are working on either a software option, or a stackable pvr device). For anything over 5-6 shows, it's cheaper to have a cable subscription VS buying the shows via iTunes. If you are downloading shows via bittorrent or getting them via another method, you'll still have the work of transcoding to a format the Apple TV will play.

OK, I'll concede that. Here's my refined reply:
Hmm... hours spent managing a linux box, or plug it in and it works (perfectly), with a warranty and tech support to back it, with an Apple TV and a TiVo.

Hmmm... my time is worth more than linux

[Calimus]

Originally Posted by Railroader 

OK, I'll concede that. Here's my refined reply:
Hmm... hours spent managing a linux box, or plug it in and it works (perfectly), with a warranty and tech support to back it, with an Apple TV and a TiVo.

Hmmm... my time is worth more than linux

Normally I'm totally in that camp, the reason I didn't go with a Tivo(I ended up using windows + GBPVR because Linux was too much trouble) was the subscription. I spent $400 up front 3 years ago to get my pvr box going, and literally haven't touched the box since except for a couple of times when the power went out to switch it back on.

That said, if Apple comes out with pvr update extension/update for the Apple TV, I'll drop my current setup in a heartbeat(assuming there are no glaring issues with their implementation of course).

[besson3c]

Like I said, in order for Apple to offer a PVR, they would have to find a way to overcome the huge obstacle of being able to change channels via both RF and IR, particularly when the latter involves proprietary set top boxes and mimicking remote control signals via an IR blaster.

[Calimus]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Like I said, in order for Apple to offer a PVR, they would have to find a way to overcome the huge obstacle of being able to change channels via both RF and IR, particularly when the latter involves proprietary set top boxes and mimicking remote control signals via an IR blaster.

Since the Apple TV itself doesn't have enough hard drive space to make pvr practical, I think they would almost certainly offer a stackable add on. In that case, it could support cable card, and there would be no need for an IR blaster. Who knows what route they will go though, they might wait a year or two to see how the apple tv is accepted, then either offer a new model with pvr, or a pvr add on at that point.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Like I said, in order for Apple to offer a PVR, they would have to find a way to overcome the huge obstacle of being able to change channels via both RF and IR, particularly when the latter involves proprietary set top boxes and mimicking remote control signals via an IR blaster.

Completely incorrect. "Huge obstacles"?!?! Hardly. If remote control manufacturers can sell universal remotes for $10, Apple can do it.

RF would be very easy. Simply build the transmitter into the unit. IR would only require a little adapter, like TiVo includes, to control Satellite boxes that don't have PVR built in.

What Apple should to do is include tuners or cablecard slots.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by Calimus 

Since the Apple TV itself doesn't have enough hard drive space to make pvr practical, I think they would almost certainly offer a stackable add on. In that case, it could support cable card, and there would be no need for an IR blaster. Who knows what route they will go though, they might wait a year or two to see how the apple tv is accepted, then either offer a new model with pvr, or a pvr add on at that point.

I really thought I heard somewhere today that it could be paired with a mini for DVR functionality. I really wish I knew something more concrete about that...

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Calimus 

Since the Apple TV itself doesn't have enough hard drive space to make pvr practical, I think they would almost certainly offer a stackable add on. In that case, it could support cable card, and there would be no need for an IR blaster. Who knows what route they will go though, they might wait a year or two to see how the apple tv is accepted, then either offer a new model with pvr, or a pvr add on at that point.

With no IR Blaster this would mean that Apple TV would not work with any DishTV style satellites, or with services using this style dish, such as Bell ExpressVu in Toronto... This would create a lot of product confusion, as this accounts for a significant percentage of the population who might be interested in a product like this.

[Calimus]

Originally Posted by goMac 

I really thought I heard somewhere today that it could be paired with a mini for DVR functionality. I really wish I knew something more concrete about that...

The problem there is what does the mini give you that the apple tv doesn't have? A bigger hard drive and a faster processor perhaps, but you still need a tuner which would be another thing to add to the stack. Apple TV has a usb port, so it's a much better option to have a specific "pvr" device to stack with tuners and a bigger harddrive(this seems a less than ideal solution for Apple), or to offer Apple TV "PVR" at a later date which would just add tuners or cable card support and have a larger drive.

[Calimus]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

With no IR Blaster this would mean that Apple TV would not work with any DishTV style satellites, or with services using this style dish, such as Bell ExpressVu in Toronto... This would create a lot of product confusion, as this accounts for a significant percentage of the population who might be interested in a product like this.

I'm not familiar with Dish setups, or the cable card situation for that matter, but is there nothing on the horizon for a cable card that would work from Dish? I know the Microsoft MCE setups are working towards cable card support, so it seems that Dish could just offer a cable card that works with Dish service. After all a Cable card is essentially replacing your Dish/Cable box and putting it inside another device that can control it.

[besson3c]

Yeah, until the Mini offers PCI Express, unfortunately it does nto make a great PVR option.

[Railroader]

Most satellite boxes have USB ports on them. They could also be controlled by an Apple device that way.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Calimus 

I'm not familiar with Dish setups, or the cable card situation for that matter, but is there nothing on the horizon for a cable card that would work from Dish? I know the Microsoft MCE setups are working towards cable card support, so it seems that Dish could just offer a cable card that works with Dish service. After all a Cable card is essentially replacing your Dish/Cable box and putting it inside another device that can control it.

I'm not sure what you mean by cable card, but the differences in changing channels are RF vs. IR, where the Disk network style boxes send IR signals to their proprietary set top box locked with a Smartcard where all we can do is mimick the IR signals being sent to the box. Essentially, the end result is a device that sends IR signals from the PC to the satellite box, so there are logistics to deal with as well, such as positioning the two devices so that the IR signal can reach the receiver.

It's a pretty significant obstacle.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Yeah, until the Mini offers PCI Express, unfortunately it does nto make a great PVR option.

Do you mean it "doesn't"?

What a simple mistake. Don't you hate it when people, who claim to be intelligent, make such simple mistakes over and over again? It is so annoying!

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

I'm not sure what you mean by cable card, but the differences in changing channels are RF vs. IR, where the Disk network style boxes send IR signals to their proprietary set top box locked with a Smartcard where all we can do is mimick the IR signals being sent to the box. Essentially, the end result is a device that sends IR signals from the PC to the satellite box, so there are logistics to deal with as well, such as positioning the two devices so that the IR signal can reach the receiver.

It's a pretty significant obstacle.

No, it's not.

And since you don't know what a cable card is, you should probably leave to conversation to people who do.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

I'm not sure what you mean by cable card, but the differences in changing channels are RF vs. IR, where the Disk network style boxes send IR signals to their proprietary set top box locked with a Smartcard where all we can do is mimick the IR signals being sent to the box. Essentially, the end result is a device that sends IR signals from the PC to the satellite box, so there are logistics to deal with as well, such as positioning the two devices so that the IR signal can reach the receiver.

It's a pretty significant obstacle.

Cablecard = Cable box on a sort of a PCIMIA card.

Basically you can install a cable company's cable box directly into your tv (assuming your tv supports cablecard), or into a cable card slot in a computer, meaning you can tune into your cable companies encrypted channels.

It blows any hacky cable box + dvr setup using IR out of the water.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Cablecard = Cable box on a sort of a PCIMIA card.

Basically you can install a cable company's cable box directly into your tv (assuming your tv supports cablecard), or into a cable card slot in a computer, meaning you can tune into your cable companies encrypted channels.

It blows any hacky cable box + dvr setup using IR out of the water.

I see. Unfortunately, this won't work with these satellite services because they require a Smartcard to be present.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

I see. Unfortunately, this won't work with these satellite services because they require a Smartcard to be present.

Technically it could work with a satellite service because the Cablecard would have the Smartcard on board.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Technically it could work with a satellite service because the Cablecard would have the Smartcard on board.

The Smartcard is specific to the satellite service, and selling reverse engineered copies of these cards would be illegal, no?

[goMac]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

The Smartcard is specific to the satellite service, and selling reverse engineered copies of these cards would be illegal, no?

Cablecards are unique to each cable service, your point?

Cablecards bridge a providers proprietary service to a data stream who's specifications are regulated by the federal government.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Cablecards are unique to each cable service, your point?

Cablecards bridge a providers proprietary service to a data stream who's specifications are regulated by the federal government.

Well, I don't know anything about cable cards, but I know that the smart card satellite service is a PITA, and there is no hardware out there that I'm aware of that will allow you to bypass the Smart card and send RF signals to an IR box.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Well, I don't know anything about cable cards, but I know that the smart card satellite service is a PITA, and there is no hardware out there that I'm aware of that will allow you to bypass the Smart card and send RF signals to an IR box.

Yes, and back to the original point, if satellite services adopted cable card, it wouldn't be a problem. Companies that provide television programming over a wire will be bound by law in the very near future to supply Cablecards, meaning that their services will work with any DVR box or computer cleanly. In fact, they won't actually be able to sell normal cable boxes anymore. The closest they can get to a cable box will actually be to sell a "shell" box for a CableCard, and then supplying a CableCard for the box. The integrated cable box modal is going away.

Because DirectTV does not run over wires, they are not actually regulated by FCC regulations regarding Cablecard, and are therefore free to make things as inconvenient for their customers as possible.

Of note, Verizon FIOS has Cablecards available for their service.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by goMac 

Yes, and back to the original point, if satellite services adopted cable card, it wouldn't be a problem. Companies that provide television programming over a wire will be bound by law in the very near future to supply Cablecards, meaning that their services will work with any DVR box or computer cleanly. In fact, they won't actually be able to sell normal cable boxes anymore. The closest they can get to a cable box will actually be to sell a "shell" box for a CableCard, and then supplying a CableCard for the box. The integrated cable box modal is going away.

Because DirectTV does not run over wires, they are not actually regulated by FCC regulations regarding Cablecard, and are therefore free to make things as inconvenient for their customers as possible.

Of note, Verizon FIOS has Cablecards available for their service.

I look forward to this happening! I wonder what these companies will do to lock down their service to replace this loss of "functionality"?

[goMac]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

I look forward to this happening! I wonder what these companies will do to lock down their service to replace this loss of "functionality"?

Sorry, just read up on CableCard. Apparently it decrypts channels and sends them to the built in QAM tuner.

So to answer your question, there isn't much they can do. The descrambled signal comes in as QAM.

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by Calimus 

I ordered one for my mom so she can play her iTunes music on the big speakers hooked up to the "home theater" setup. She is also excited about having access to the iPhoto pics as her mini is in a back room and not practical for showing her friends & family that visit. She doesn't have cable either, so she might buy a few shows that she doesn't have access to to watch via the Apple TV.

This is essentially why I am ordering one. I already have a TiVo satellite system and don't need PVR ability in the Apple TV. I just need something that will connect easily to the network, display my iTMS purchases on my TV, all of the other neat things it can do.

I do NOT want to worry about a linux box and wasting the time setting that monstrosity up. Plus the Apple TV will fit right in with the rest of my A/V devices.

[besson3c]

The whole digital/HD/QAM/DVB thing is another variable I know very little about. I believe the Hauppauge cards in question offer mainly analog inputs (at least, my 250 does), although MythTV does support HD content and there are OSes that support DVB cards.

I know that the HD tuners are also more expensive now, so maybe HD hasn't fully caught on yet?

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

I know that the HD tuners are also more expensive now, so maybe HD hasn't fully caught on yet?

I guess that's why Apple TV only connects to HDTVs.

"maybe HD hasn't fully caught on yet"?!?! Where in the world do you live?!?!

[ApeInTheShell]

Like any other computer device you should think about why you want to own it. Some people who have iMacs, Mac Pros, and Mac Minis will get an AppleTV because its sleek, stylish, and easy to hide. People who have Macbooks and Macbook Pros probably don't need an Apple TV but the larger screen size for the media is tempting I suppose. So to answer your question, we'll just have to wait.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by ApeInTheShell 

Like any other computer device you should think about why you want to own it. Some people who have iMacs, Mac Pros, and Mac Minis will get an AppleTV because its sleek, stylish, and easy to hide. People who have Macbooks and Macbook Pros probably don't need an Apple TV but the larger screen size for the media is tempting I suppose. So to answer your question, we'll just have to wait.

Larger screen size? Mac laptops come with a DVI port, it is easy to connect them to an external display... In fact, it is pretty much trivial.

I've never understood people who are willing to shell out $300 for techno-fashion. To me, this is simply a bonus examined only after the functionality the gadget provides.

[awaspaas]

But really who wants to plug their laptop into the tv every time you want to watch a show? That's a very college-student solution. Having a nice permanent box with a great interface that's always plugged in and ready to go is the way to do it.

(PS my MythTV box is now the most powerful computer in the house)

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by awaspaas 

But really who wants to plug their laptop into the tv every time you want to watch a show? That's a very college-student solution. Having a nice permanent box with a great interface that's always plugged in and ready to go is the way to do it.

(PS my MythTV box is now the most powerful computer in the house)

I hear you! This is why I played around with the Hauppauge MediaMVP, since this was worth $80 to me, but not $300.

Have you played around with MediaMVP and the MVPMC hack that allows you to install a custom Myth frontend on the device?

[awaspaas]

Big difference between the MVP and Apple TV is HD. MediaMVP only outputs NTSC and PAL from what I can tell. 90%+ of my content is HD. Looks good if you only want analog SD though.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by awaspaas 

Big difference between the MVP and Apple TV is HD. MediaMVP only outputs NTSC and PAL from what I can tell. 90%+ of my content is HD. Looks good if you only want analog SD though.

Good point...

I wouldn't be surprised if they made an HD version of the MediaMVP soon. I wouldn't imagine it would cost a whole lot more to provide a MPEG-2 decoder that will handle 1080i/p, but I could be wrong...

[Railroader]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

I've never understood people ...

And this is where about 90% of you're posts on here come from. Your inability to understand people.

I am getting a AppleTV to play my iTunes content on my HDTV without a mess of linux and incompatibility to deal with.

And $300?!?! Chump change. I'd put a Mac Mini in there, but that would be overkill.

[goMac]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Larger screen size? Mac laptops come with a DVI port, it is easy to connect them to an external display... In fact, it is pretty much trivial.

I've never understood people who are willing to shell out $300 for techno-fashion. To me, this is simply a bonus examined only after the functionality the gadget provides.

You know, I've thought about this, but in the end I just can't justify hooking an entire dedicated computer to my TV. The reality is that the AppleTV is cheaper and more convenient. And it looks like people have figured out how to load additional codecs onto the AppleTV.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by goMac 

You know, I've thought about this, but in the end I just can't justify hooking an entire dedicated computer to my TV. The reality is that the AppleTV is cheaper and more convenient. And it looks like people have figured out how to load additional codecs onto the AppleTV.

I guess I can see things this way... The price point for this luxury is a little too much for me personally, but that's cool. I recognize that things are worth different amounts to different people, it's all cool

I guess you guys have managed to change my thinking on this a little... I'm still inclined to think that this won't yet be a runaway success like the iPod or something, but I wouldn't be surprised if it sold decently.

[b1NARY73]

I bought one. I have a desktop PeeCee and a Macbook Pro. I was using my video iPod to play iTunes stuff on my TV, but the lack of wireless on the iPod ( Please God, make this available in the next revision ) was limiting. The idea of being abke to sync via wireless with my Desktop with has Two 500 GB Drives in it was to tempting to resist! I have a Ton of movies and music that I was constantly having to pick and choose what went on my iPod. Mine should be here next week, and I am very excited. I sold my iPod video and now use my Nano for my morning Bike rides. I never used the 80GB for anything but movies.... and the TV is a cheaper, more efficient way for me at least. I hope the advent of the Apple TV does not kill the idea of the iPod's having wireless sync capabilities.... I hope they use Bluetooth as well.
My 2 cents.

[mac128k-1984]

I'm not going to dive in buy one. The reason - video quality, I'm sorry but in this day and age, the video quality that is being offered is subpar. TVs, broadcasters, DVDs are all moving towards High Def, why is apple providing quality that's even below current dvd standard; 640x480 - that's piss poor if you ask me. That then translates into no real reason to buy the appletv unit.

[Gossamer]

Originally Posted by mac128k-1984 

I'm not going to dive in buy one. The reason - video quality, I'm sorry but in this day and age, the video quality that is being offered is subpar. TVs, broadcasters, DVDs are all moving towards High Def, why is apple providing quality that's even below current dvd standard; 640x480 - that's piss poor if you ask me. That then translates into no real reason to buy the appletv unit.

What?

Video formats supported
H.264 and protected H.264 (from iTunes Store): Up to 5 Mbps, Progressive Main Profile (CAVLC) with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps (maximum resolution: 1280 by 720 pixels at 24 fps, 960 by 540 pixels at 30 fps)
iTunes Store purchased video: 320 by 240 pixels or 640 by 480 pixels
MPEG-4: Up to 3 Mbps, Simple Profile with AAC-LC audio up to 160 Kbps (maximum resolution: 720 by 432 pixels at 30 fps)

[mac128k-1984]

ITMS movies are "near DVD-quality, 640-by-480-pixel video"
Apple

Correct me if I'm misunderstanding this but any movie I buy at the itunes store to play on the apple tv will be playing at "near DVD-quality, 640-by-480-pixel video". Did I misunderstand this?