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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Notebooks > 256GB SSD vs 320GB HD

256GB SSD vs 320GB HD
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Trygve
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Jun 12, 2009, 04:38 AM
 
Any comments on the new 256gb SSDs? I am thinking of getting a new 13" MBP to go backpacking around the world with. Looking for comments on speed, battery life, reliability etc. Looking for a very reliable machine to run my business with from the back of beyond.

Thanks!
     
aehaas
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Jun 12, 2009, 10:31 AM
 
From tests I have seen of SSDs the speeds were sometimes less and sometimes faster than a large, fast HD as a 320gb 7,200 RPM drive that was less than half full at the time.
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jokell82
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Jun 12, 2009, 02:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by Trygve View Post
Any comments on the new 256gb SSDs? I am thinking of getting a new 13" MBP to go backpacking around the world with. Looking for comments on speed, battery life, reliability etc. Looking for a very reliable machine to run my business with from the back of beyond.

Thanks!
I went with the SSD on my new 15" MBP. Won't be here for another 2 weeks, though, so I can't comment on how it performs.

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mduell
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Jun 12, 2009, 06:48 PM
 
Apple is using the cheap MLC technology, so they're the slower SSDs. Performance differential compared to hard drives is well documented (great for random reads, not so good for small writes, about the same sustained either way). Impact on battery life is small at best. Reliability is no worse than hard drives.
     
shawmanus
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Jun 28, 2009, 12:03 AM
 
With the rumors swirling around that Gen 2 Intel SSD's are launching in 2 weeks with capacities up to 320GB, I am wondering if Apple will offer those as an option. Even if it costs 1200 to add 320GB SSD, I am sure there will be fanboys to buy them.
     
turtle777
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Jun 28, 2009, 12:48 AM
 
Originally Posted by mduell View Post
Apple is using the cheap MLC technology, so they're the slower SSDs. Performance differential compared to hard drives is well documented (great for random reads, not so good for small writes, about the same sustained either way). Impact on battery life is small at best. Reliability is no worse than hard drives.
So is there any reason to buy SSD for Apple notebooks ?

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amazing
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Jun 28, 2009, 01:00 AM
 
     
amazing
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Jun 28, 2009, 01:14 AM
 
disktester: MBP L08 (late '08), SSD vs HD

"late 2008" MacBook Pro - HDD vs SSD

hot-rodding: raid-0 option for MBP using the MaxConnect Optical Bay kit (replaces the disk drive with another internal drive)

Unibody MacBook Pro with dual SSDs?
     
Simon
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Jun 28, 2009, 04:02 AM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
So is there any reason to buy SSD for Apple notebooks ?
Even the cheaper MLC SSDs* Apple uses beat the fastest HDD in most tests. Battery life is not huge difference. SSDs are significantly lighter and a tad cooler too though. Ultimately the question is if those benefits are worth the extra cost to people and IMHO there is not a single right/wrong answer. It depends on your needs and budget. Also on how important capacity vs. performance is to you.

Personally (for notebooks) I'm a huge fan of the fast and big Momentus 7200.4 (500GB, 72000 rpm). But I'm almost sure I'll order my next MBP with an SSD.


*) For reference, the fast SLC SSDs cost about an order of magnitude more than already expensive MLC SSDs of similar capacity. An Intel 64 GB SLC costs $750. Apple's charges the same for an upgrade to the 256 GB MLC SSD.
     
ghporter
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Jun 28, 2009, 08:10 AM
 
Originally Posted by Simon View Post
Ultimately the question is if those benefits are worth the extra cost to people and IMHO there is not a single right/wrong answer.
I think this is the most succinct and insightful statement ever made in one of our hardware forums. Seriously. It's particularly applicable to the current "SSD vs. HDD" discussion, but it also applies to things like "should I go with the white MacBook or the Unibody 13"?" or similar questions.

On the subject of mass storage, for significantly more money, I want significantly better performance and similar capacity. While they're close, 256GB is not quite "similar" enough to 320GB to meet that part of the criteria, so even if this series of SSDs is somewhat faster, it's not going to compete enough against the HDD.

I have also not found nearly enough about how SSDs work on a logical level. Do they have "tracks," "sectors," and "clusters," or does the interface in the SSD virtualize that to the extent that it doesn't matter? How does that work with a SATA controller-does the controller want to see those hardware features? Basically I'm wondering if SSDs are currently mimicking disk drives, and if so, does that impair their ability to take full advantage of their own potential? That might just sway me (a lot) in one direction or the other.

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Simon
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Jun 28, 2009, 08:28 AM
 
Originally Posted by ghporter View Post
On the subject of mass storage, for significantly more money, I want significantly better performance and similar capacity. While they're close, 256GB is not quite "similar" enough to 320GB to meet that part of the criteria, so even if this series of SSDs is somewhat faster, it's not going to compete enough against the HDD.
I think you make an excellent point here, Glenn. Let me just add one thought.

People who are worried about performance have always known that you need to buy HDDs with excess capacity. For example, I need about 250 MBs for OS, apps, work. But I would never buy a 250 GB or 320 GB HDD for performance reasons. The performance hit you take from filling up a HDD is just way to big. Instead I'll get a 500 GB for 250 GB of stuff to make sure I get the best performance.

This is completely different with an SSD. If I need about 100GB of space and I expect to add maybe 50-100GB later I can buy a 256 GB SSD and will never really have to worry about a performance hit. I don't need to pay extra for an oversized SSD the way I do with a HDD.

I'm just saying this because for people in such a situation, you probably won't compare a 256GB SSD with a 250 GB HDD. You'll be comparing it to a 320 or 500 GB HDD. There's a factor two in price right there.

But of course if OTOH somebody is mainly worried about capacity and not about performance, the comparison will end up being a different one. And the HDD will likely end up being the better choice.
     
jokell82
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Jun 28, 2009, 10:36 AM
 
While I agree that there is no one answer, I am completely satisfied with my SSD upgrade. I boot into Snow Leopard in about 10 seconds, and shut down in about three seconds. The machine feels like it is an order of magnitude faster than any other computer I've used. Also my machine is noticeably cooler than my last (2.8Ghz vs. 2.2).

Whether or not that's worth $750 is up to you.

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QuadG5Man
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Jun 28, 2009, 12:46 PM
 
Two weeks ago, I was with a friend in the local Apple Store and I noticed two Macbook Air's on display, one with HDD and one with SSD. I restarted both air's and then simultaneously launched apps (GarageBand, iPhoto, iMovie, etc.) on both machines.

On the HDD-based Macbook Air, the apps would completely launch in ~30 seconds.

On the SDD-based 1-5 seconds.

"This is how computers are supposed to work," said my friend - a woman of little patience who owns a 1.33GHz 12" iBook G4 with 4200 RPM HDD. "The word of the day is what, SDDS?"

SSD is now a part of her vocabulary. If she wasn't a broke student she would have bought the Macbook Air SSD model right there in the store.

Then I showed how I demonstrated the speed difference in the Air's to the Apple Store employee lurking nearby. He seemed kind of offended that he was learning from a customer and was completely unaware of the speed gains the SSD offers. "That's how you sell computers," I said. I own a a p l so I figured I was doing shareholders a favor.

Note to Apple: I would like to train your sales staff on the national level. PM me here on MacNN for my resume or LinkedIn. Thank you for your consideration.
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Cold Warrior
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Jun 28, 2009, 12:50 PM
 
While that may work from a narrow up-sell point of view, that sales pitch isn't something Apple would adopt. SSD prices most consumers out of Apple's target hardware prices, and showing off SSD to everyone would only make consumers feel bad about their hardware w/ HDD purchase. Apple never wants to do that, so SSD is currently a low-profile niche play for the more well-funded and tech savvy consumer.
     
QuadG5Man
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Jun 28, 2009, 01:30 PM
 
I don't know. I used to work in retail sales of both pc's and macs when iTunes came out for Windows for a major retailer. When anyone came in that door I made sure they had an iTunes for Windows disc (free) in their hands. I remember they were in green envelopes. I passed out hundreds, if not thousands.

The point being, iTunes flourished because it was a better experience for music management than anything that had ever been done on Windows.

My college student friend was so impressed by the difference in the computing experience that the Macbook SSD presented, she would have gone further into debt right there if I didn't tell her that her iBook G4 was getting along just fine for her use. And she plays WOW!

One thing in retail I learned is that people love buying the fastest computer they can. It's also quite possible the SSD model Macbook Air has higher margins than the base model with HDD. I would stock all models with SSD and sell for higher margins.
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CharlesS
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Jun 28, 2009, 01:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by QuadG5Man View Post
Two weeks ago, I was with a friend in the local Apple Store and I noticed two Macbook Air's on display, one with HDD and one with SSD. I restarted both air's and then simultaneously launched apps (GarageBand, iPhoto, iMovie, etc.) on both machines.

On the HDD-based Macbook Air, the apps would completely launch in ~30 seconds.

On the SDD-based 1-5 seconds.
Word. I've been patiently waiting for SSDs to come down in price so I can swap the HDD in my MacBook Pro with one, but my patience may eventually break down. I have Mail, Terminal, DragThing, QuickSilver, and ClamXAV Sentry in my Login Items, and it takes an annoying amount of time before they're all up and ready to go. This wouldn't be the case with a SSD.

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milhous
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Jun 28, 2009, 02:56 PM
 
I'm really waiting for Sandisk to come out witheir their G3 SSD.

Prices for 60, 120, and 240GB will be 149, 249, and 499 respectively.

They were announced at CES in January.
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