[TETENAL]

Apple discontinues eMac, Airport and iSight in Europe after June 30 and has instructed dealers to pull these products off the shelf at that date. More info...

[Mastrap]

Bit of a bummer for people who want to use a camera but don't want to upgrade to a new Mac. Airport, I never understood why people spend $250 on an, admittedly pretty, wireless router when the same functionality is available from Linksys for a fraction of the price.

[Goldfinger]

iSight and Airport were both hugely overpriced so meh. They'll probably release new, updated ones.

[seanc]

Does "Airport" mean the base stations e.g express, extreme etc or are there still some ancient original airport base stations floating around which they're getting rid of? :/

[Kerrigan]

Nice to see Apple trimming the fat. Hopefully they've realized that they need to rework their European pricing scheme.

[Krypton]

It's fairly amazing that Apple had no contingency plan for European legislation that has been at least 3 years in the making.

[ghporter]

The legislation did not have teeth until June, and the technical details weren't finalized until a while after the legislation was passed. That's typical government working speed.

However, if you read the article, you'll see that these products are being pulled because of how they're made, not what they are. A little tweak in the manufacturing process (like lead-free solder, different chemicals in the coatings and cases, etc.) and they should be back and better than ever.

[Krypton]

Originally Posted by ghporter

The legislation did not have teeth until June, and the technical details weren't finalized until a while after the legislation was passed. That's typical government working speed.

However, if you read the article, you'll see that these products are being pulled because of how they're made, not what they are. A little tweak in the manufacturing process (like lead-free solder, different chemicals in the coatings and cases, etc.) and they should be back and better than ever.

I agree; the manufacturing modifications are not major at all.

However, why announce the discontinuation of existing products if making them WEEE and RoHS compliant is relatively trivial? It has been clear for many years now what the directives would restrict, the most recent changes have been to exempt certain products and put in place the mechanisms for recycling and product take back schemes.

[Severed Hand of Skywalker]

I hope Apple doesn't move to N wireless networking yet as it isn't finalized.

[Dork.]

Originally Posted by Krypton

I agree; the manufacturing modifications are not major at all.

However, why announce the discontinuation of existing products if making them WEEE and RoHS compliant is relatively trivial? It has been clear for many years now what the directives would restrict, the most recent changes have been to exempt certain products and put in place the mechanisms for recycling and product take back schemes.

It's not as trivial as you think. It's not just the manufacturing process for that particular product, it's the manufacturing process for all the chips, boards, and components that make up the products as well. All of these products are relatively older products, probably designed before the RoHS directives were clear. If there's not a drop-in replacement for all parts that are not RoHS compliant, then it's probably not worth the trouble to redesign it if it's not a high-volume product. (and since Apple buys these parts off-the-shelf, if there's a key part Apple uses that the vendor chooses to discontinue, Apple's SOL.)

And for all you conspiracy theorists out there, this is all about RoHS compliance (which basically means that all materials used must be lead-free), nothing more. It's causing no end of trouble for people who buy off-the-shelf parts and integrate them into consumer devices, because you need to make sure all the parts are compliant. Especially since some companies don't change the part number when they change over (because the parts are exactly the same, jsut a different manufacturing process), they just add a compliance label to the datasheets, which can make searching for problem parts, well, problematic....

[Krypton]

Originally Posted by Dork.

And for all you conspiracy theorists out there, this is all about RoHS compliance (which basically means that all materials used must be lead-free), nothing more.

That is not the case; lead happens to be one of many substances that are being phased out of mass production. Others include mercury, cadium, chromium, PBB and PBDE (the latter are flame retardants).

RoHS PDF

Exemptions are granted where there are no suitable alternatives, or for highly specialised products; two recent topical examples include lead glass and organ pipes. However, the restrictions only apply to household goods and consumer electronics.

With regard to lead, there are restrictions on how much can be used per product based on the product weight. Thus Apple can either reduce the lead content in the eMac and iSight to suitable levels, or look for suitable replacements.

[TETENAL]

Originally Posted by Krypton

With regard to lead, there are restrictions on how much can be used per product based on the product weight. Thus Apple can either reduce the lead content in the eMac and iSight to suitable levels, or look for suitable replacements.

Or increase the product weight. Screwing a thick steel plate into the eMac should drastically reduce its lead rate.

[Dork.]

Originally Posted by Krypton

That is not the case; lead happens to be one of many substances that are being phased out of mass production. Others include mercury, cadium, chromium, PBB and PBDE (the latter are flame retardants).

RoHS PDF

Exemptions are granted where there are no suitable alternatives, or for highly specialised products; two recent topical examples include lead glass and organ pipes. However, the restrictions only apply to household goods and consumer electronics.

With regard to lead, there are restrictions on how much can be used per product based on the product weight. Thus Apple can either reduce the lead content in the eMac and iSight to suitable levels, or look for suitable replacements.

I'll defer to your knowledge, then, since I don't have to deal directly with RoHS compliance and am going on second-hand knowledge from co-workers who do have to deal with it.

My point, though, is that Apple may not be able to find a suitable replacement for an off-the-shelf part without a redesign cycle, and if the product does not have enough sales volume it may be cheaper for them to take the product off the market entirely then to re-design it.

[Krypton]

Originally Posted by Dork.

My point, though, is that Apple may not be able to find a suitable replacement for an off-the-shelf part without a redesign cycle, and if the product does not have enough sales volume it may be cheaper for them to take the product off the market entirely then to re-design it.

That much is true; however, the point still stands that Apple has had plenty of time to think about how they are going to resolve this.

However, we are still commenting on a snippet of an interview rather than official copy from Apple. I'm hoping they haven't been as daft as we are implying

[Socially Awkward Solo]

I used to think that the Airport base stations looked incredibly cool until a friend of mine came over and had no clue what it was and tried to push it in (it is hanging on the wall) because he thought it was one of those cheap push lights:

[Goldfinger]

Originally Posted by Socially Awkward Solo

I used to think that the Airport base stations looked incredibly cool until a friend of mine came over and had no clue what it was and tried to push it in (it is hanging on the wall) because he thought it was one of those cheap push lights:

That was probably a pretty funny sight.

[Dork.]

Originally Posted by Krypton

That much is true; however, the point still stands that Apple has had plenty of time to think about how they are going to resolve this.

They may not have had a choice, if one of their suppliers chose not to update a part. They could have had all the time in the world to do a redesign, yet it may still have not been cost effective to do so. For the past three years, their strategy to resolve this could have been to try and get an exemption, and if that didn't happen, take the products off the market.

[Socially Awkward Solo]

Originally Posted by Goldfinger

That was probably a pretty funny sight.

It was kinda embarrassing as I have been trying to get him to go Mac for a while. It also took the cool factor away for me.

When was this thing designed anyway? 1999 right? I think it is due for a total redesign.

[King Bob On The Cob]

Originally Posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker

I hope Apple doesn't move to N wireless networking yet as it isn't finalized.

Apple moved to G wireless before it was finalized. It actually ended up with a bit of say as to how the protocol was implemented at the end because it had a large penetration of G based wireless routers.

[Socially Awkward Solo]

Originally Posted by King Bob On The Cob

Apple moved to G wireless before it was finalized. It actually ended up with a bit of say as to how the protocol was implemented at the end because it had a large penetration of G based wireless routers.

Problem is N just got delayed again and the current ones are running into a lot of problems. Even the hardware requirements aren't final.

[slugslugslug]

Originally Posted by King Bob On The Cob

Apple moved to G wireless before it was finalized. It actually ended up with a bit of say as to how the protocol was implemented at the end because it had a large penetration of G based wireless routers.

Do you have a source for that first statement? I don't remember ever hearing that.

[MaxPower2k3]

Originally Posted by slugslugslug

Do you have a source for that first statement? I don't remember ever hearing that.

i don't have a source, but i do remember them being the first on the block with G equipment, and then releasing firmware updates for everything when the final spec was approved.

[analogika]

Originally Posted by Mastrap

Bit of a bummer for people who want to use a camera but don't want to upgrade to a new Mac. Airport, I never understood why people spend $250 on an, admittedly pretty, wireless router when the same functionality is available from Linksys for a fraction of the price.

Actually, the Airport Base Station does WDS, which isn't available in competing products in the price range at all, AFAIK.

Makes extending networks hella easier.

[indigoimac]

Originally Posted by MaxPower2k3

i don't have a source, but i do remember them being the first on the block with G equipment, and then releasing firmware updates for everything when the final spec was approved.

Yep, I remember them moving to G before it was finalized.

[King Bob On The Cob]

Originally Posted by slugslugslug

Do you have a source for that first statement? I don't remember ever hearing that.

"As of early 2003, 802.11g has not been finalized and ratified by the IEEE, the engineering group that develops new standards. Ratification should happen relatively soon, in summer or fall 2003. Until then, the 802.11g "standard," as Steve Jobs called it so confidently, remains in draft form, although that hasn't stopped several chip manufacturers from shipping the silicon necessary to implement the current draft of 802.11g. (Apple's Web site now calls 802.11g a draft, reflecting reality.)"
http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/wire...23/80211g.html

[ironknee]

Originally Posted by Socially Awkward Solo

I used to think that the Airport base stations looked incredibly cool until a friend of mine came over and had no clue what it was and tried to push it in (it is hanging on the wall) because he thought it was one of those cheap push lights:

punch punch::

yo, what are you doing?

what?

[MindFad]

Originally Posted by Socially Awkward Solo

I used to think that the Airport base stations looked incredibly cool until a friend of mine came over and had no clue what it was and tried to push it in (it is hanging on the wall) because he thought it was one of those cheap push lights:

Another funny story: a friend of mine had his running taillights go out on his car (breaklights worked when the pedal was pressed, though). Since he was nearly broke, and to avoid further ticketing and pull-overs, he bought two of these, painted them red—and, well, you guess what he did. It worked well, though.

[- - e r i k - -]

The Airport base-station still looks awesome to me. Real time-less design.

[tooki]

Originally Posted by Mastrap

Bit of a bummer for people who want to use a camera but don't want to upgrade to a new Mac. Airport, I never understood why people spend $250 on an, admittedly pretty, wireless router when the same functionality is available from Linksys for a fraction of the price.

1. Added functionality (different between models, but options include: WDS, dialup modem, PoE, AirTunes, printer port, proper configuration application)
2. Reliability and compatibility. Apple wireless gear is guaranteed to work with Macs. The same cannot be said for all the other brands, some of which use non-standard modifications of the standards, causing connection problems, some just hate Macs (*cough* D-Link *cough*) and won't work right. Some of the web interfaces are minimally Mac-compatible.

I went through 4 non-Apple routers (4!!) before getting this Linksys, which works OK. But if it ever gives me trouble, that's it, I'll get an Apple unit.

tooki

[slugslugslug]

Originally Posted by King Bob on the Cob

Originally Posted by slugslugslug

Do you have a source for that first statement? I don't remember ever hearing that.

"As of early 2003, 802.11g has not been finalized and ratified by the IEEE, the engineering group that develops new standards. Ratification should happen relatively soon, in summer or fall 2003. Until then, the 802.11g "standard," as Steve Jobs called it so confidently, remains in draft form, although that hasn't stopped several chip manufacturers from shipping the silicon necessary to implement the current draft of 802.11g. (Apple's Web site now calls 802.11g a draft, reflecting reality.)"
http://www.oreillynet.com/pub/a/wire...23/80211g.html

Thanks. I guess the ol' memory's going.

Originally Posted by analogika

Actually, the Airport Base Station does WDS, which isn't available in competing products in the price range at all, AFAIK.

Makes extending networks hella easier.

Apparently, you can use an open-source firmware on the Linksys WRT54G to get WDS that cooperates with Airport gear. Except that I can't figure out how to get it to work with WPA encryption (not that I've tried in a while; maybe someone got it by now). And of course, most users aren't gonna go putting a 3rd-party firmware on their router. So yes, the Apple stuff is easier. Just wanted to mention that there are alternatives.