[NewsPoster]

[Updated with real-world photo of the Mac Pro] Apple on Monday gave developers and the public a "sneak preview" of the next Mac Pro coming later this year -- a radical new "cannister" form factor in black that is 1/8th (by volume) the size of the previous model. It features a 12-core configuration based on all-new (E5) Intel Xeon processors, dual AMD-provided FirePro workstation graphics, new PCIe flash storage, new faster RAM, PCI Express gen 3 support, the ability to use up to three 4K-quality displays, and external outputs dominated by Thunderbolt 2.

One of the bigger surprises on the unit -- besides its overall form factor, which is pint-sized by comparison to the current models, and was kept secret until today -- is that it is the mystery Mac that will be assembled in the United States, as well as being designed in California (the latter being a major theme of Apple's presentation). The unit's IO ports include four USB 3.0 ports, six Thunderbolt 2, and two Ethernet ports at an unknown speed. There are also separate audio in and out ports and an HDMI (v1.4) port.

The small form factor does include PCIe third-gen technology, but there was no clear illustration of how that was implemented and may only refer to the built-in flash-based storage, which is some 2.5 times faster than current SATA flash storage and more than 10x conventional hard drive storage. As rumored, the innards will be more closed off and reliant on Thunderbolt 2 to handle most expansion duties. The RAM modules appeared to be upgradable, but no clear way into the machine was shown.

During the sneak preview, Apple VP Phil Schiller mentioned that a future update of Final Cut Pro X will be available that fully supports the new graphics system, allowing editors to work on multiple (up to three) 4K displays if needed. In a move that will remind some of the legendary (and equally innovative, though commercially unsuccessful) G4 Cube workstation, the entire top rim of the machine is a handle for easy transport, and relies on a single extruded aluminum "thermal core" that uses augmented convention cooling, but which also employs a single, larger fan that pulls air upwards -- maintaining Apple's penchant for nearly-silent operation.

No weight was mentioned, but the device is so dramatically smaller than the current model that its weight is likely to be comparable to a notebook. The device stands 9.9 inches tall and is 6.6 inches wide, and as expected uses 802.11ac and Bluetooth 4.0. Both the outside and inside are made of machined aluminum.

The company has now completely revamped its Mac Pro pages on its website to showcase the device in greater detail, revealing that it can handle up to 60GB of 1866MHz DDR3 four-channel RAM, twice the bandwidth and capacity of the existing model. A photo of the actual unit (in a glass display case at WWDC) was taken by MacObserver using an open hand as a size reference. The picture is seen below.

Schiller, who mistakenly referred to the Thunderbolt 2 ports as "Firewire 2" during the presentation, added a note of triumph as he unveiled the new machine, directly addressing critics: "'Can't innovate', my ass!"

[bdmarsh]

and they prove they don't understand the Pro market. LIke the failed Cube before, this is a good Pro-Sumer design (if they had single GPU and maybe Core i7 CPU). Although even the Cube had upgradable GPU, which this new "Mac Pro" does not. Fairly disappointed based on what it is intended to replace. (I was looking to replace my 2007 Mac Pro which has had 4 ram upgrades, 9 hard drive upgrades, 3 video card upgrades and 2 add-on PCIe cards - now I'm not sure, for me the Xeons aren't critical)

[Charles Martin]

With respect, I think you may be the pro-sumer here. While there will be some bitching from pros about the lack of internal expandability (though these are the exact same people who were screaming for a mini-tower), you get all the expandability you want externally, and you know the peripheral designers are on overtime making new models look compatible. The only complaint I have at present is whether I can ever get in there to change out RAM, and the cost of TB accessories presently (though that will come down soon I suspect).

[coffeetime]

Apple's new strategy:

Final Cut Pro becomes iMovie Pro
Mac Pro becomes Mac Mini Pro

I think Apple is pretty consistent lately.

[Charles Martin]

Agreed. And FWIW, "iMovie Pro" has still (after a shaky start) become the top-used video editor, at least among the LA firms I work with. Here's to the "Mac Mini Pro" giving designers and other creative pros a well-earned new machine. Can't wait to see the accessory companies rise to the challenge.

[svencito]

This is the time to upgrade from my 2006 MacPro, despite the nagging from the previous comments. Can't innovate - my ass!

[bobolicious]

...for what it is worth & from what I can tell I love it... 3 @ 4k displays ? yessa !

[aristotles]

Are you guys complaining really professionals or just prosumers trying to make yourself better about your past purchases?

Thunderbolt 2 is faster than the PCI-e slots on your old machine. Get over it already. It will support about to 60GB of ram and the video cards will support up to 6GB of video ram and drive 3 4K resolution displays. What more do you want?

It's not like people went around upgrading their SGI workstations. If you need more Storage, get a storage array and hook it up via Thunderbolt 1 or 2.

[Medazinol]

Ever try lugging around a 50lb Mac Pro? No thanks, this new one is perfect! Thanks to Thunderbolt the days of needing expansion card slots (which most don't use anyhow) and internal drive bays are gone. Let's just hope Apple keeps the pricing a bit more reasonable than the Mac Pro was (not holding my breath though).

[mwprewitt]

In the next to the last paragraph you state: "The company has now completely revamped its Mac Pro pages on its website to showcase the device in greater detail, revealing that it can handle up to 60GB of 1866MHz DDR3 four-channel RAM, twice the bandwidth and capacity of the existing model."

Actually they have only stated that the memory bandwidth is 60 GB/s, and shown that there are 4 slots. No capacity has actually been announced.


Read more: http://www.electronista.com/articles/13/06/10/black.cannister.shape.12.core.configuration.thunde rbolt.2.more/#ixzz2Vqht7OnJ
Read more at http://www.electronista.com/articles/13/06/10/black.cannister.shape.12.core.configuration.thunde rbolt.2.more/#go5fZDvoyIQ6IyMs.99

[jreades]

Looks to me like they're making a wager that most pros are already using massive external storage (Drobos, etc.) and would be more keen on something that doesn't require its own cart. There are shades of the Cube here, but I think that the peripheral market has changed a lot (Thunderbolt, cheap RAID, etc.) since then and their gamble might pay off a bit better this time.

[Grendelmon]

http://www.apple.com/mac-pro/

FirePro "workstation-class" cards?

[Athens]

There is a lot I dont like about the machine and a lot has been said exactly as to why. I put most of my feelings about it in my blog which is to blog to copy and paste here.

http://brianboisvert.blogspot.com/2013/06/why-new-mac-pro-is-failure-out-of-gate.html

But in essence the only selling feature of the pro was its expansion ability. If you have to turn to external hard drives and external PCIe boxes for everything then I see no reason to get this over a iMac and Mac Mini.

[Elderloc]

Perhaps Apple has not revealed everything around this. With TB2 I'm not sure what the bandwidth is for the external PCIe break out boxes but I had a feeling it would be a modular computer. As for the video cards it kind of sucks but there might be an area for either Apple or Third party cards as it looks like they use a socket.

Considering they didn't announce the maximum RAM for this unit and the fact you can get 32 GIG DIMMs I wouldn't worry. At this time I believe OSX is still limited to 96 gig. Sure when you compare this to a HP Z820 that can handle 512 GIG of ram it's a little disappointing. And considering the iMac has two internal storage options it would have been nice to have at least two SSD slots, considering costs. Perhaps they feel people will rely on external arrays.

And then there is the CPU issue, are these soldered in? If that is the case then yes this really sucks. But keep in mind Haswell will be the last CPU that has a socket at least that's what I have read. Also I believe there is at least one Haswell chip that is only available soldered on.

There are some things I do not 100% agree with, I always like the tower design. A simple upgrade to the internals would have made me happy but the times they are ah changing....

[OS2Guy]

OMG! I have waited so long. I've pushed my 2008 3.2GHz Mac Pro to the limits - 24TB of internal/external HD, 32G RAM, two 30" Cinema Displays. Can't Wait!

[Charles Martin]

mwprewitt: the article has now been corrected to say it can handle 64GB RAM, though there is no word from Apple on what it will sell in terms of configurations yet. The max single stick of 1866 DDR3 is 16GB I believe, ergo four slots x 16GB.

[Arne_Saknussemm]

Well I rest my case.

Apple has finally confirmed it abandoned the professionals.
This very beautiful miniature black monolith (Cube/Lisa.?...) will serve very well as a proper tombstone.

Many thanks to Mr. Brian Boisvert, for putting many of my ideas into words, plus quite a few details new to non-Mac users.

I take the liberty to reproduce the last couple paragraphs of his blog, (one to keep visiting for sure):

"The new Mac Pro will only sell to very rich Apple enthusiasts that have to have the greatest and latest of products. It won't sell to gamers, not that many bought Mac pros for gaming, it won't sell to professionals and it wont sell to companies.

The real question is what effect this will have on the pro line software from Apple like Final Cut Pro, Aperture, Logic Pro. If a music studio that uses PCIe hardware to interface with music hardware cant upgrade to the new Mac Pros and end up going PC, will they stop using Apple software that only works on Mac as well? Time will tell. "

[jwdsail]

I'm cautiously optimistic...

I'm hoping that:

1. The entry level New Mac Pro is affordable for Pro-sumers (4-core version? 6?), otherwise this will be a machine that doesn't appeal to many pro users that want a certain amount of upgradeability, nor pro-sumers that want more power than the iMac but lack $3000+. If the new Mac Pro craters... will Apple finally have the excuse to kill it all together?

2. That what appear to be distinct daughter cards for each circuit board are designed in such a way that 3rd parties may be able to sell upgrades in the future. If nothing else, if different GPU options are available in the Apple Store BTO/CTO options, I'm sure a few of them will find there way into 3rd party suppliers for use as upgrades to lower-spec machines.

3. That if #2 isn't possible that Apple caters to pros wishing some type of future-proof-ability and offers in-store GPU upgrades of these daughter cards in the future, perhaps if a Applecare+Pro is purchased at time of Mac Pro purchase?

4. That what appears to be automotive black chrome on the sneak peek Mac Pro becomes an option for other Apple products. The decorative finnish doesn't really seem at home on the Pro, and may not be part of the finished product, but it's interesting to see Apple trying something different with the metal finishing for its products.

[billmboy]

You apparently have no knowledge of what is needed by real professional video editors why they need supper speed in a remote situation. You can plug this thing in at the studio or take it on the road with 20 pounds of gear in one case with a small generator. I can't wait. No more "laptops" this and a couple Red cameras and I'm off, just what I need. A need for speed. All my PCI card's work in Sonnet's Echo's expansion chassis. Time is money in this business. I can leave my client with a finished product, what more could I ask.

"The real question is what effect this will have on the pro line software from Apple like Final Cut Pro, Aperture, Logic Pro. If a music studio that uses PCIe hardware to interface with music hardware cant upgrade to the new Mac Pros and end up going PC, will they stop using Apple software that only works on Mac as well? Time will tell. "

[Zanziboy]

Billmboy raises a good issue that I overlooked. The portability of this solution allows a pro's to be mobile. This is a game changer.

[WiseWeasel]

@Athens and Arne: Lack of PCI expansion is moot; TB2 implements the PCI protocol, and has more bandwidth than PCIe x16. You can get an external enclosure if you need PCI slots.

[WiseWeasel]

Actually, TB2 doesn't have more bandwidth than PCIe 3.0 x16, which is what motherboards ship with nowadays; the latter supports up to 16 GB/sec, while TB 2 is at 20 Gb/s, or 2.5GB/s per channel.

[panjandrum]

WOW! What a wonderful looking yet completely useless piece of hardware. It's the new Cube! Apple clearly and completely does not understand the professional market. It's sad. I'm not sure now what we will do to replace our old (and wrongfully abandoned - it will run Mountain Lion Server, search for it, Apple just wants to sell new units and the hell with doing what's right for their customers) 2006 XServe. Was hoping that a new MacPro could at least be installed sideways in our server rack. What we need is something that fits industry-standard racks, and has INTERNAL expansion capabilities for BIG CHEAP storage. Overall speed of the drives is simply not an issue in many server configurations because the data is being fed across a network anyway. We have 191 users across a gigabit network and am running just two 7200rpm drives in striped mode (with plenty of redundant backups), and not a single person has every complained that they are reading and writing data too slowly - we never come close to maxing out the drive potential. What we do need is the ability to plug in cheap SATA drives without buying expensive external enclosures and have power-cords and data-cords snaked all the heck over the place. I expect this new Mac Mini Pro to be a flop, and that we will see late-model real MacPro towers hold their resale value incredibly well. If they think they will be getting Kudos from the design firms, I bet they are wrong there also. Easy cheap big storage is simply too darn important to these markets. Or maybe Apple simply doesn't mind driving people into the "Hackintosh" market, or worse yet to competing operating systems. Apple really needs to hire someone who understands the Professional market. I guess time will tell, but I'm really not impressed with anything about this system at this point.

[bdmarsh]

Thunderbolt 2 does not have more bandwidth than PCIe 8x even, not sure where people are getting that from.

[bdmarsh]

Chas_M: I'm not a pro video or audio guy (just non-professional), I have done graphic design and am a certified tech who has worked with Pro's in all fields for many years. All of them have expressed with me what they wanted in a new Mac Pro - most of them had even accepted it wouldn't have optical drives. The video guys wanted more PCIe slots with more power for GPUs, the Audio guys were generally happy with the system. Both of these groups told me they wouldn't have minded a slightly smaller Mac Pro that could be rack mounted. Maybe they will change their minds and if this is priced cheap enough they would just replace the box more often (which based on spec information so far doesn't seem likely)
The graphic designers are the ones who for the most part would have been happy with a smaller system, but many of them had already switched to iMacs for the same price or less compared with a Mac Pro they get an IPS display (most of them had had towers, G3, G4, G5 - even early Mac Pro until the iMacs could handle enough ram)
As billmboy mentioned, time is money, he is happy with the power for the size for remote work, for those not doing remote work, time is money, not being able to boost things like GPUs easily and cost efficiently after a year is a factor (especially with several new Mac cards being released this year by 3rd parties). Most cards do work fine in external Thunderbolt to PCIe chassis - although some the speed reduction of going through Thunderbolt can be noticeable for certain types of work (based on what I've been told by Pro's in the field, not just the specs) For some other technologies going through new Thunderbolt adapters is a dramatic speed increase, so even this.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by bdmarsh 

Most cards do work fine in external Thunderbolt to PCIe chassis - although some the speed reduction of going through Thunderbolt can be noticeable for certain types of work (based on what I've been told by Pro's in the field, not just the specs) For some other technologies going through new Thunderbolt adapters is a dramatic speed increase, so even this.

This is Thunderbolt 2. Thunderbolt 2 is faster than the PCIe slots in a current Mac Pro.

Of course, the hope is that this new machine will be priced lower, so that buying an external expansion chassis AND a Mac Pro will be more or less equivalent to buying the slotted monster before.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by Athens 

But in essence the only selling feature of the pro was its expansion ability. If you have to turn to external hard drives and external PCIe boxes for everything then I see no reason to get this over a iMac and Mac Mini.

The new Mac Pro is far more expandable than the previous ever was, with FASTER interfaces (6x TB 2) than the PCIe available in the previous generation.

And faster storage interfaces than the previous generation (TB 2 is WAY faster than the S-ATA you had before).

Yeah, it's external. Are you a pro, or a hobbyist interior decorator? Because for pros, faster means faster, and you live with cables and boxes when necessary (though boxes are generally rack-mounted or stuck in a machine room).

Even if the new Mac Pro + PCIe expansion chassis comes out to a higher price than the previous Mac Pro, a professional will budget the cost and deal with what needs to be purchased. If it's $400 more, who cares? The flexibility and speed of Thunderbolt 2 will more than make up for it in the long run. And the rest of the market won't be paying for functionality (and bulk) they'll never need.

Also, I have to wonder about the credibility of an analysis provided by someone who writes things like "And in a year form now the old Mac Pros will have Thunderbolt 2 added through expansion cards as well, maybe." What are they going to connect to the Main Logic Board through - PCIe? Why not via USB?

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by panjandrum 

WOW! What a wonderful looking yet completely useless piece of hardware. It's the new Cube! Apple clearly and completely does not understand the professional market. It's sad. I'm not sure now what we will do to replace our old (and wrongfully abandoned - it will run Mountain Lion Server, search for it, Apple just wants to sell new units and the hell with doing what's right for their customers) 2006 XServe. Was hoping that a new MacPro could at least be installed sideways in our server rack. What we need is something that fits industry-standard racks, and has INTERNAL expansion capabilities for BIG CHEAP storage. Overall speed of the drives is simply not an issue in many server configurations because the data is being fed across a network anyway. We have 191 users across a gigabit network and am running just two 7200rpm drives in striped mode (with plenty of redundant backups), and not a single person has every complained that they are reading and writing data too slowly - we never come close to maxing out the drive potential. What we do need is the ability to plug in cheap SATA drives without buying expensive external enclosures and have power-cords and data-cords snaked all the heck over the place. I expect this new Mac Mini Pro to be a flop, and that we will see late-model real MacPro towers hold their resale value incredibly well. If they think they will be getting Kudos from the design firms, I bet they are wrong there also. Easy cheap big storage is simply too darn important to these markets. Or maybe Apple simply doesn't mind driving people into the "Hackintosh" market, or worse yet to competing operating systems. Apple really needs to hire someone who understands the Professional market. I guess time will tell, but I'm really not impressed with anything about this system at this point.

This machine is not aimed at the server market.

The "Professional" market for a Mac "Pro" is media professionals, not IT professionals.

They killed the Xserve and Xsan for a reason. This is not a replacement.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by Arne_Saknussemm 

The real question is what effect this will have on the pro line software from Apple like Final Cut Pro, Aperture, Logic Pro. If a music studio that uses PCIe hardware to interface with music hardware cant upgrade to the new Mac Pros and end up going PC, will they stop using Apple software that only works on Mac as well? Time will tell. "

Thunderbolt PCIe Expansion | Magma



(these guys have been serving audio professionals for over a decade; a studio tech I worked with used a Magma chassis to add SCSI drives to his titanium Powerbook for recording.)

[besson3c]

I'm starting to come around to the Mac Pro.

If media professionals benefit from a smaller form factor, I guess the Mac Pro makes sense, but it is definitely not an all-purpose professional machine as Spheric pointed out, it is very specifically targeted at media professionals. I guess it is consistent with Apple's past decisions to cut out the server market.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot 

The new Mac Pro is far more expandable than the previous ever was, with FASTER interfaces (6x TB 2) than the PCIe available in the previous generation.

And faster storage interfaces than the previous generation (TB 2 is WAY faster than the S-ATA you had before).

Yeah, it's external. Are you a pro, or a hobbyist interior decorator? Because for pros, faster means faster, and you live with cables and boxes when necessary (though boxes are generally rack-mounted or stuck in a machine room).

Even if the new Mac Pro + PCIe expansion chassis comes out to a higher price than the previous Mac Pro, a professional will budget the cost and deal with what needs to be purchased. If it's $400 more, who cares? The flexibility and speed of Thunderbolt 2 will more than make up for it in the long run. And the rest of the market won't be paying for functionality (and bulk) they'll never need.

Also, I have to wonder about the credibility of an analysis provided by someone who writes things like "And in a year form now the old Mac Pros will have Thunderbolt 2 added through expansion cards as well, maybe." What are they going to connect to the Main Logic Board through - PCIe? Why not via USB?

Hopefully the Mac Pro will stimulate more and cheaper Thunderbolt stuff. I like the concept of Thunderbolt, I just wonder if this might be a little too soon for Apple to pull this trigger.

It's kind of funny how they went from insanely woefully behind to what could be the bleeding edge with this sort of reliance on Thunderbolt.

What is the verdict on CPU and GPU upgradability in the Pro?

This new Pro Mac reminds me a bit of Darth Vader/ STAR WARS

[Mike Wuerthele]

Now I want xGrid back.

[colinet]

There will always be 'amateur pros' moaning no matter what they're offered. I think it looks fantastic and I will certainly be getting one even though I've got a 12 core MacPro with 64Gig of ram which cost me a fortune about 15 months ago. Even with this configuration I can make it run pretty slowly when I'm working on Photoshop files that can sometimes be over 1Gig. So anything that can speed up my workflow will be very welcome and pay for itself fairly quickly. And to other complainers, I think the new Adobe sales model is fine too.

[Arne_Saknussemm]

"it looks fantastic" Now there's a great argument towards a workstation purchase!

On another note; why only 12 cores, when you can currently get even 10 core processors now?

I got an 8 core Xeon for my latest workstation last september. It was quite expensive back then but now I can add the second processor for about $500 less. And the dual 4core Xeon workstation (8 cores total) it replaces is less than one fourth as powerful as the new single 8 core Xeon setup.

So, as impressive as the New Mac Pro's specs are, they could still be quite a bit better, and will most likely be if you take away the Apple Designed Tax and you purchase any other real workstation.

[AlohaMacintosh]

Steve Jobs last computer was a MacPro Tower. Steve Jobs was a 'computer-guy.' Tim Cook is a money guy...and a complete Wuss. Tim Cook doesn't understand anything that matters to normal people. Amen

[Arne_Saknussemm]

Originally Posted by AlohaMacintosh 

Steve Jobs last computer was a MacPro Tower. Steve Jobs was a 'computer-guy.' Tim Cook is a money guy...and a complete Wuss. Tim Cook doesn't understand anything that matters to normal people. Amen

Not much can be added, except maybe mentioning Steve's Arrogant character, that did not keep him from having a super-human like feeling for Great Industrial Design.

Can you imagine how awesome that new Power Mac could have been if it would have been designed to be stackable without cables?

On top the current machine, bellow cylindrical sections with a power, TB, and USB, buss, that could contain standard PCI cards, drive enclosures, or whatever...

Mac Professionals could have had the best of expandability without clumsy/expensive cables; really the ultimate custom workstation.

Sad the latest incarnation of Apple Inc, is all about money.

[Mike Wuerthele]

Originally Posted by AlohaMacintosh 

Steve Jobs last computer was a MacPro Tower. Steve Jobs was a 'computer-guy.' Tim Cook is a money guy...and a complete Wuss. Tim Cook doesn't understand anything that matters to normal people. Amen

I'm fairly sure Steve had the MacPro and didn't do anything that required its power. The CEO gets the best, regardless of use case.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by AlohaMacintosh 

Steve Jobs last computer was a MacPro Tower. Steve Jobs was a 'computer-guy.' Tim Cook is a money guy...and a complete Wuss. Tim Cook doesn't understand anything that matters to normal people. Amen

Did you know them both personally? How do you know this?

I'm so tired of people clinging to these narratives that they create about celebrities, athletes, and anybody of significance, as if the complexities of these individuals can be reduced into such simplifications.

[Spheric Harlot]

Arne's shill account is getting a little desperate. He's starting to mix and match incompatible talking points within a single comment thread:

Originally Posted by Arne_Saknussemm 

"it looks fantastic" Now there's a great argument towards a workstation purchase!

vs.

Originally Posted by Arne_Saknussemm 

Can you imagine how awesome that new Power Mac could have been if it would have been designed to be stackable without cables?

On top the current machine, bellow cylindrical sections with a power, TB, and USB, buss, that could contain standard PCI cards, drive enclosures, or whatever...

Mac Professionals could have had the best of expandability without clumsy/expensive cables; really the ultimate custom workstation.

Whoever you're working for here: they're overpaying you.

Either that, or you need to stop sharing accounts.