[Horsepoo!!!]

Nibiru, is it a brown dwarf (unborn star) coming to wipe us out in 2012 or is it the home planet of the Anunnaki? Well...

...here it is! Google Sky

Do you see it? I don't.

I think this is the only part of the sky that has been censored out. Funny huh? Not really. This is not Google's or MS's fault...it's part of a cover up.

Anyway...secrets can't stay hidden for long. Of course, maybe the secret will mean the death of a lot of people. Who knows. Something's coming...there are too many independent theories, prophecies, legends, calendars that mark 2012 as a time of huge change for 2012 to go by as a nonevent.

Links of interest...keep an open mind but not so open that your brain falls out.

http://www.planetxvideo.com/intro.php

http://planetxforecast.com/videos/su.../index.shtml#1 *

Just saying that if there's anything increasingly strange going on with our planet between now and 2012, chances are it's Nibiru, or the solar maximum (perhaps caused by Nibiru's highly elliptical orbit swing between Mars and Jupiter), the crossing of the galactic equator (or galactic alignment), or a combination of them.

Global warming might not exactly be man-made.

I'm not asking anyone to believe any of this...I'm just putting it forth to provoke some thought and perhaps prepare for some upcoming changes (if this really does happen).

* commercializing a book on 2012 survival is kinda dumb though...I admit. Why would they charge people for this stuff after telling everyone in their 'promo' videos that the planet will be wiped out. Dumb I say.

[64stang06]

Heh, I like that big black box. Like it isn't obvious something's missing.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by 64stang06 

Heh, I like that big black box. Like it isn't obvious something's missing.

I don't know enough to say with certainty that Nibiru might be censored out or if something else is being censored out but there's obviously something we're not allowed to see.

The people that don't want us to see this part of the sky could have at least photoshopped something and make it look like there's nothing there instead of just omitting that part of the sky.

[design219]

Beware the Y2K bug! The end is nigh!

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by design219 

Beware the Y2K bug! The end is nigh!

Here's the contrast though:
Everyone was well informed about the man-made Y2K bug and a lot of people were overpanicking about something with little impact because the media was hyping this thing like there's no tomorrow (har har, I should be a comedian).

I'd say about 95% of people have no clue about any of the 2012 theories/prophecies. So if something actually happens, almost everyone will be caught with their pants down. There's nothing in the media about any of this. Everyone is going about their business like there's *for sure* a tomorrow. Actually, the media is probably giving people some hints but they're the wrong hints...global warming, tsunamies, hurricanes, earthquakes...

Global warming is apparently our doing...perhaps...but perhaps not.
Massive earthquakes (and underwater earthquakes causing tsunamies) and hurricanes are definitely not our doing.

People that want to remain ignorant about these environmental shifts and keep their blinders on about 2012 are free to do so though. It's these kind of people that, if they happen to survive after being caught pants down, will probably be the ones trying to steal other people's pants or killing for them. Which is a shame because they could have avoided being caught off guard if they simply kept an open mind.

Of course, many won't even know about anything 2012 until 2012 when the media will finally start talking about it when it's too late.

[Andrew Stephens]

What is the ratio of the sides of that big black, er... monolith?

[design219]

Phil Plait's Bad Astronomy: Misconceptions: Planet X and Real Science

Horsepoo!!!, I'll be willing to bet you $1,000 that planet X will not swing by in a few years. Of course, if I or you win, you still lose!

[invisibleX]

I'm going to have a little fun at your expense.

if something actually happens, almost everyone will be caught with their pants down.

I don't think the end of the world is something you can be caught with your pants up on. I am assuming the secret that you do not know would be the end of the world.

commercializing a book on 2012 survival is kinda dumb though...I admit. Why would they charge people for this stuff after telling everyone in their 'promo' videos that the planet will be wiped out. Dumb I say.

I know, that was a really silly move. It almost makes it seem like the author had some sort of alterior motive in writing the book!

The people that don't want us to see this part of the sky could have at least photoshopped something and make it look like there's nothing there instead of just omitting that part of the sky.

Indeed. It is awfully strange that the "people" who don't want us to know what is there would just black it out. Perhaps they're an extremely lazy conspiracy?

there are too many independent theories, prophecies, legends, calendars that mark 2012 as a time of huge change for 2012 to go by as a nonevent

Aren't these the types of things you generally want to, you know, avoid basing predictions on? You better add fortune tellers, fortune cookies, and tea leaves to the list of things that don't accurately predict the future.

I like this though. Its sort of the conspiracy for conspiracy theorists because even they do not know what it is, why it is coming, just when. You must prepare yourself! Something is coming, to do something, it might be bad even, and its coming in 2012.

The only thing that annoys me is that the shelf life of conspiracies are so long. Couldn't we have a mysterious and ominous event, say, next week? By the time 2012 rolls around I'll have completely forgotten all this.

[Lava Lamp Freak]

I've been hearing about the impending pole shift for a long time. The only thing that ever shifts is the freaking date.

Prepare for 2003 Pole Shift

Were there any massive earthquakes, volcanic eruptions, and hurricane force winds in 2003? Nope. The theory is true, so obviously the date is just off. Duh! It's gonna happen sometime between 2003 and 2010.

Now we're close to 2010 and the Pole Shift & Planet X botherers are getting a little nervous. Just to be safe, they've bumped the date to 2012 -- which gives them a little more time to sell their crap.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by design219 

Phil Plait's Bad Astronomy: Misconceptions: Planet X and Real Science

Horsepoo!!!, I'll be willing to bet you $1,000 that planet X will not swing by in a few years. Of course, if I or you win, you still lose!

Debunked with a whole lot of new bunk. Is badastronomy supposed to be a serious source? I don't normally put all my faith into a single source, so...

Anyhow, I'm not saying that this will happen. There are other theories and prophecies marking 2012 as a year of huge change. Galactic alignment, solar maximum, and other theories have been brought forth. Some of them very independent to the Maya long count calendar.

[- - e r i k - -]

Bad Astronomy is THE source for debunking conspiracy nutters. Your name is so ironic I'm sure you are having us all on

[Chuckit]

Galactic alignment and solar maxima are neither theories nor prophecies. Inferring completely unrelated ideas ("2012 will be a year of great change") from raw data is the definition of a non sequitur.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by - - e r i k - - 

Bad Astronomy is THE source for debunking conspiracy nutters. Your name is so ironic I'm sure you are having us all on

So one guy named Phil Plait is debunking other astronomers? If it's THE source and you're putting all your faith in it as the end all debunking site, you're not being careful either.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

Galactic alignment and solar maxima are neither theories nor prophecies. Inferring completely unrelated ideas ("2012 will be a year of great change") from raw data is the definition of a non sequitur.

Sorry, I did not mean that galactic alignment and solar maximum were theories...I was adding them to the list of 2012 doomsday scenarios.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

So one guy named Phil Plait is debunking other astronomers? If it's THE source and you're putting all your faith in it as the end all debunking site, you're not being careful either.

He's presenting evidence and reasoning. It doesn't require a lot of faith, does it?

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

He's presenting evidence and reasoning. It doesn't require a lot of faith, does it?

He's providing just as much evidence and reasoning as other astronomers. Yet Phil is to be believed and the others not? There's no reason to blindly believe any astronomer that has something to say.

Like I said, I'm not saying Nibiru will be the end of us...but it is a possibility.

The subject is vast and nobody seems to know for sure and Google Sky has a region censored out.

An astronomer in Japan has perhaps found Planet X: CPS : Center for Planetary Science and it may not have any affect on Earth. But it just goes to show how little astronomers know about even our local system.

Phil seems convinced about what he's writing because he thinks he knows everything.

The question is, what is being censored from Google Sky?

[Lava Lamp Freak]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

So one guy named Phil Plait is debunking other astronomers? If it's THE source and you're putting all your faith in it as the end all debunking site, you're not being careful either.

He isn't debunking astronomers. He is debunking common myths and misconceptions about the subject. For example, all of my childhood I was told that you can only stand an egg on its end on the first day of spring, the Vernal Equinox. I tried it every year, and it worked, thus theory proven. Right? Nope. After reading his book I realized that you can do this any day of the year. Yet, people still believe that it can only be done one day a year, and they still mention it on the news every year.

I stumbled across a conspiracy website a few weeks ago and was amazed at all of the crap people believe regarding New World Order, 9/11, and such.

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

So one guy named Phil Plait is debunking other astronomers? If it's THE source and you're putting all your faith in it as the end all debunking site, you're not being careful either.

Phil Plait is a highly respected astronomer promoting real science against junk science. If you don't know who Phil Plait is, I suggest you do some research.

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!!

keep an open mind but not so open that your brain falls out.

I fear this might be too late for you

[::maroma::]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

Here's the contrast though:
Everyone was well informed about the man-made Y2K bug and a lot of people were overpanicking about something with little impact because the media was hyping this thing like there's no tomorrow (har har, I should be a comedian).

I'd say about 95% of people have no clue about any of the 2012 theories/prophecies. So if something actually happens, almost everyone will be caught with their pants down. There's nothing in the media about any of this. Everyone is going about their business like there's *for sure* a tomorrow. Actually, the media is probably giving people some hints but they're the wrong hints...global warming, tsunamies, hurricanes, earthquakes...

I'm willing to bet that the media will bring this notion to the forefront in 2011. Especially late in the year. Right now no one will care. The media will have fun filling time with this one come 2011, I'm almost certain of this.

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

Global warming is apparently our doing...perhaps...but perhaps not.
Massive earthquakes (and underwater earthquakes causing tsunamies) and hurricanes are definitely not our doing.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this planet has had major temperature shifts for millions of years. I believe that our current shift is being accelerated by human activity, but it is by no means a one of a kind event.

This also goes for massive earthquakes, hurricanes, super volcanoes, etc. These have all been with this planet since the beginning. Just because we are seeing an increase in some of these events as of late doesn't mean it has anything to do with anything outside our planet.

What I'm seeing with all of these 2012 theories, prophecies and predictions is that events that have happened for millennia are being used as evidence of an impending doom of which no one knows how. This screams of crackpotness if you ask me.

Now, if they were planning on firing up the Large Hadron Collider in 2012, I might actually be a tad worried.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by ::maroma:: 

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this planet has had major temperature shifts for millions of years. I believe that our current shift is being accelerated by human activity, but it is by no means a one of a kind event.

This also goes for massive earthquakes, hurricanes, super volcanoes, etc. These have all been with this planet since the beginning. Just because we are seeing an increase in some of these events as of late doesn't mean it has anything to do with anything outside our planet.

What I'm seeing with all of these 2012 theories, prophecies and predictions is that events that have happened for millennia are being used as evidence of an impending doom of which no one knows how. This screams of crackpotness if you ask me.

Now, if they were planning on firing up the Large Hadron Collider in 2012, I might actually be a tad worried.

Yes these catastrophes have been recurring events on our planet since the beginning of time. I'm not saying they're for sure caused by Planet X, or crossing the galactic equator, or solar maxima or any other event that may or may not shift the Earth's fragile balance...but it could very well be.

The catastrophes are recurring at an increased frequency and ferocity.

2012 doomsday could very well be crackpotedness...but no other date has ever had so many independent and intersecting prophecies, theories, events.

I'm sure many of the theories are piggybacking off Sumerian scripts and prophecies and the Maya long count calendar in an attempt to seem credible but this date is some sort of peak for this.

The Y2K bug was the Y2K bug...there wasn't anything predicted at the time other than some old computer systems behaving erratically because the date would be rolled back to 1900 instead of moving on to 2000 because of the way the systems stored the year as a 2 digit number. And even that was mostly baloney to anyone with some computer knowledge. A lot of people freaked out.

I had never heard of the year 2003 doomsday (polar shift or even Planet X's dip into our solar system).

A lot of it (or all of it) may turn out to be false. But between Nostradamus' 1999 world end prophecy, the Y2K bug, 2003 polar shift (which I've only known today thanks to Lave Lamp Freak), 2012 is the only one that makes some sense considering all the independent sources (pieces of a puzzle if you will).

Of course, you're all free to say "Haha, dumbass, I told you so" when 2012 rolls around.

[Lava Lamp Freak]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

The catastrophes are recurring at an increased frequency and ferocity.

According to whom?

No doubt in the past and at some point in the future bad things will happen to the planet. Maybe even wipe out the all lifeforms bad. Keep checking the Drudge Report, you'll read about it there first I'm sure.

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

The Y2K bug was the Y2K bug...there wasn't anything predicted at the time other than some old computer systems behaving erratically because the date would be rolled back to 1900 instead of moving on to 2000 because of the way the systems stored the year as a 2 digit number. And even that was mostly baloney to anyone with some computer knowledge. A lot of people freaked out.

Hah. True that. I was waiting for the lights to go out at midnight. My truck wasn't even supposed to start the next morning. The world continued on and I still had to go to work on the 1st.

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

A lot of it (or all of it) may turn out to be false. But between Nostradamus' 1999 world end prophecy, the Y2K bug, 2003 polar shift (which I've only known today thanks to Lave Lamp Freak), 2012 is the only one that makes some sense considering all the independent sources (pieces of a puzzle if you will).

Just because all of the crackpots are picking the same year does not give any single one of them credibility. I've not been able to find a single reputable scientist buying into this. Seriously, look into the backgrounds of all of the people on the Planet X bandwagon. This theory originated from a UFO cult.

[starman]

This thread wins.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by Lava Lamp Freak 

Just because all of the crackpots are picking the same year does not give any single one of them credibility. I've not been able to find a single reputable scientist buying into this. Seriously, look into the backgrounds of all of the people on the Planet X bandwagon. This theory originated from a UFO cult.

And how is not believing this better than believing some guy called Phil Plaits spewing out grade school astronomy lessons on the web (I can't wait until he tells people that the sun is a star...it's almost that kind of level of astronomy that we're talking here) saying he's debunked all the crackpots all the while making tons of calculation mistakes (caught by his readers no less) and then trying to sell his book Bad Astronomy. This guy is as bad as all the 'crackpots'.

Bad Astronomy = Bad Astronomy for realz

The only think that he's debunked is that Planet X isn't a brown dwarf. This does not mean Planet X does not exist or that it's not on a highly elliptical course around the sun.

Other theories suggest some things that most people here would try to discredit right away. So I won't even try. But those that want an interesting story can read about the Anunnaki. In this case Planet X would neither be a brown dwarf (inhabitable - too hot) or a home planet (inhabitable - too cold as this planet spends most of its time far, far away from the sun)

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

And how is not believing this better than believing some guy called Phil Plaits spewing out grade school astronomy lessons on the web (I can't wait until he tells people that the sun is a star...it's almost that kind of level of astronomy that we're talking here) saying he's debunked all the crackpots all the while making tons of calculation mistakes (caught by his readers no less) and then trying to sell his book Bad Astronomy. This guy is as bad as all the 'crackpots'.

Do your research young padawan. I think you will find that Phil Plait has far more credibility than say…Robert Sepher. Or Mark Hazlewood

[Andrew Stephens]

The Bad Astronomy site doesn't need to go into a great deal of depth since nearly all the issues it deals with can be debunked using only basic school science grade astronomy. It isn't really a single source either since the conclusions reached are not Plaits own but rather the standard scientific consensus. Corroborating evidence is available in multiple respected sources all over the net. Bad Astronomy is really just an aggregator of evidence against bad science not one scientists set of pet theories.

I would say most scientists agree that we know very little about our solar system. For instance it is common knowledge the the discovery of Pluto did not solve the anomalous movement of the outer planets (it was even found in the wrong part of the sky), so there may well be a planet (or planets) X to find. Only yesterday Voyager 2 discovered that the edge of our solar system (the termination shock) is egg shaped rather than spherical.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by - - e r i k - - 

Do your research young padawan. I think you will find that Phil Plait has far more credibility than say…Robert Sepher. Or Mark Hazlewood

I'm sure he is more credible than Sepher and Hazlewood. Like Andrew Stephen has said, this guy is using grade school astronomy and grade school language to explain all this. Phil Plait is essentially catering to people that have zero knowledge of astronomy by answering questions like "does the moon rotate", "Dark side vs far side"...all very uninteresting questions to people that have the very basic astronomy knowledge. To make things worse, and like I said earlier, he treats his target audience like children...dumb ones no less.

Most of his 'debunking' brings nothing new to the table: in 'Why Hubble Data Are Withheld for a Year' absolutely nothing is answered. 'Astrology = Garbage' answers nothing. Most of his articles are riddled with mistakes (which he has the decency to correct though, which is a good thing).

Anyway, grade school astronomy. Nothing to see here.

He could try to answer a ton of other much more interesting questions...but I don't think he can. He's already struggling with most of the current ones on his Bad website.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

And how is not believing this better than believing some guy called Phil Plaits spewing out grade school astronomy lessons on the web (I can't wait until he tells people that the sun is a star...it's almost that kind of level of astronomy that we're talking here) saying he's debunked all the crackpots all the while making tons of calculation mistakes (caught by his readers no less) and then trying to sell his book Bad Astronomy. This guy is as bad as all the 'crackpots'.

Bad Astronomy = Bad Astronomy for realz

So far, he's offered more evidence and reasoning than you or these "astronomers" you keep vaguely mentioning. The fact that some of this "Nibiru" rot can be debunked by grade-school science isn't really a mark against Plaits — no need to make things more complicated than they are. If you want to argue, feel free to put some of your experts on the table or offer some actual evidence and reasoning. Grade-school astronomy is more concrete than the vague allusions and ad hominems you've given us so far.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

So far, he's offered more evidence and reasoning than you or these "astronomers" you keep vaguely mentioning. The fact that some of this "Nibiru" rot can be debunked by grade-school science isn't really a mark against Plaits — no need to make things more complicated than they are. If you want to argue, feel free to put some of your experts on the table or offer some actual evidence and reasoning. Grade-school astronomy is more concrete than the vague allusions and ad hominems you've given us so far.

It's certainly not a mark FOR him either. In fact, and like I said, there's nothing in what Plait argues that debunks Nibiru or Planet X. Only that it's probably not a brown dwarf as certain Planet Xers believe it is.

There are no experts on the subject...not Plait or anyone. Stop being so naive. Stop thinking that astronomers know a lot. They don't. They know very little. A lot of it is based on math calculations and terrible photos. You know very little. I know very little. Plait knows very little (perhaps a bit more than most people but not by a huge margin...then again, his readers are constantly correcting his calculations).

Have you ever seen a brown dwarf, or another planet, have you ever set foot on Mars? You're ready to believe anything anyone says also if you 'know' the characteristics of a brown dwarf, or another planet or 'seen' pictures of Mars through word of mouth from PhD astronomers. Do you also believe in God? Do you believe there is no governmental UFO cover up? Come on, stop being naive.

[invisibleX]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

It's certainly not a mark FOR him either. In fact, and like I said, there's nothing in what Plait argues that debunks Nibiru or Planet X. Only that it's probably not a brown dwarf as certain Planet Xers believe it is.

There are no experts on the subject...not Plait or anyone. Stop being so naive. Stop thinking that astronomers know a lot. They don't. They know very little. A lot of it is based on math calculations and terrible photos. You know very little. I know very little. Plait knows very little (perhaps a bit more than most people but not by a huge margin).

Have you ever seen a brown dwarf, or another planet, have you ever set foot on Mars? You're ready to believe anything anyone says also if you 'know' the characteristics of a brown dwarf, or another planet or 'seen' pictures of Mars through word of mouth from PhD astronomers. Do you also believe in God? Do you believe there is no governmental UFO cover up? Come on, stop being naive.

And so, not knowing very much at all, you choose to believe a random bunch of myths and legends and crackpots with no evidence at all.

I think I'll stick with math and terrible photos, thanks.

[Horsepoo!!!]

This is all much akin to closing your eyes and borrowing some else's sense of sight. You can get a visual report from your trusted friend or perhaps an untrustworthy stranger but it all comes down to trust. Even if you think your friend is telling the truth, you can't really be sure because you're not seeing it with your own eyes (and even one's own eyes can be deceiving but that's another story altogether).

You can believe astronomers, you can believe NASA, you can believe what the government tells you, you can believe in some sort of god (or gods) because ancients scripts, testaments, witnesses say it or they exist but they're all 2nd hand information. Is there one 2nd hand source that is more trustworthy than another? Perhaps but you can't be 100% sure of the validity of any 2nd hand information.

I'm not saying Plait is wrong...I'm not saying he's right...I'm not saying Nibiru exists, I'm also not saying that is doesn't exist.

[Chuckit]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

There are no experts on the subject...not Plait or anyone. Stop being so naive. Stop thinking that astronomers know a lot. They don't. They know very little. A lot of it is based on math calculations and terrible photos. You know very little. I know very little. Plait knows very little (perhaps a bit more than most people but not by a huge margin...then again, his readers are constantly correcting his calculations).

Have you ever seen a brown dwarf, or another planet, have you ever set foot on Mars? You're ready to believe anything anyone says also if you 'know' the characteristics of a brown dwarf, or another planet or 'seen' pictures of Mars through word of mouth from PhD astronomers. Do you also believe in God? Do you believe there is no governmental UFO cover up? Come on, stop being naive.

If we don't know very much, I can't help but be naive. But I don't think randomly believing whatever crazy theory you hear first is a very good policy. I'm skeptical, which is to say that until somebody gives me a good reason to believe something, I generally won't. The comic posted earlier demonstrates why this is a good idea.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by invisibleX 

And so, not knowing very much at all, you choose to believe a random bunch of myths and legends and crackpots with no evidence at all.

I think I'll stick with math and terrible photos, thanks.

Almost all religious texts tell the same tale. Isn't that evidence enough that there could very well be a race of beings out there that swing by every few thousand years using Nibiru as a large transportation device? Large group of independent cultures - check. Same tale different words - check. Big ****ing coincidence - ... Isn't that how science works? Peer reviewing? Independent studies corroborating the same results? Well what's different between science and religious stories that have the same intro, body and conclusion? Nothing!

You stick with that math and those photoshopped pictures. It's hard to find a single picture nowadays that isn't photoshopped (except personal photos).

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by Chuckit 

If we don't know very much, I can't help but be naive. But I don't think randomly believing whatever crazy theory you hear first is a very good policy. I'm skeptical, which is to say that until somebody gives me a good reason to believe something, I generally won't. The comic posted earlier demonstrates why this is a good idea.

If you're insinuating that I believe this, you're wrong. I have merely mused since the very first post that it could be a possibility because, well, it is a possibility. If Planet X is on an highly elliptical orbit, it's definitely possible that we can't see it.

I think you may be fixated on the brown dwarf theory...this is the only thing Plait debunks. Plait has said nothing about the idea of a smaller Earth-sized planet on an elliptical orbit.

What's more open-minded? Putting absolute trust into science and outright dismissing legends. Or a healthy dose of skepticism with regards to science and legends.

This is going nowhere though...I feel like I bruised some egos here and things may turn too personal.

[Chuckit]

I'm not insinuating anything. It definitely sounded like you were saying there's mounds of credible evidence that 2012 will be something special, but I've yet to see any. Did I misunderstand you?

[ghporter]

Is it just me, or does that rectangle look like its proportions are 4 X 9? I wonder how thick it is...

[starman]

16.

[invisibleX]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

Almost all religious texts tell the same tale. Isn't that evidence enough that there could very well be a race of beings out there that swing by every few thousand years using Nibiru as a large transportation device? Large group of independent cultures - check. Same tale different words - check. Big ****ing coincidence - ... Isn't that how science works? Peer reviewing? Independent studies corroborating the same results? Well what's different between science and religious stories that have the same intro, body and conclusion? Nothing!

You stick with that math and those photoshopped pictures. It's hard to find a single picture nowadays that isn't photoshopped (except personal photos).

And don't most agree that many religious texts share the same backgrounds or are derivatives of one another? No, multiple voices saying the same thing is not evidence of any kind. I'm not even going to go into the fact that a brief glance at the "evidence" shows a ludicrous amount of errors and misinterpretations of said facts. Need I go on how much of the so-called evidence is "channelled" or "past-life memories"? No, no I don't because there is no more reason for the Anunnaki to be real than for Anubis to be a symbiotic alien who used the pyramids as a landing pad.

I think you have that the other way around, but okay. I don't buy that the original photo was photoshopped because even I could put in some stars in that space. Not only that but even the crackpots admit that it is not visible.

Sorry man but you've definitely opened your head and let all the wack-jobs get to you. Just because there is a void in the way of knowledge doesn't mean you need to start pouring things in to fill it (much like that picture). Not knowing something is no reason to start inventing facts or clinging to stories of dead cultures.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by invisibleX 

And don't most agree that many religious texts share the same backgrounds or are derivatives of one another? No, multiple voices saying the same thing is not evidence of any kind.

It's not? Then what is?

I'm not disagreeing with you here. I just want to hear what you think is 'evidence'.

edit: I'd like to thank those who are keeping this thread on track (even those making fun of it)...I'd really like to know also why that part of the sky is blackened out.

[Horsepoo!!!]

The region of interest on an older picture of Orion.

[Lava Lamp Freak]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

It's not? Then what is?

I'm not disagreeing with you here. I just want to hear what you think is 'evidence'.

edit: I'd like to thank those who are keeping this thread on track (even those making fun of it)...I'd really like to know also why that part of the sky is blackened out.

I've read that you can view that region in Microsoft's WorldWide Telecope software.

[invisibleX]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

It's not? Then what is?

I'm not disagreeing with you here. I just want to hear what you think is 'evidence'.

edit: I'd like to thank those who are keeping this thread on track (even those making fun of it)...I'd really like to know also why that part of the sky is blackened out.

Umm, well, stories. Most cultures have some sort of god(s), creation myth, etc. The first thing you need to decide is if someone, a long long time ago, believed in X will you believe it just because they did.

To answer your question: 'evidence' in this case would be proof saying these gods were literal beings and not just stories, proof that these beings were of an alien origin. Once you do that you might as well claim that they're made of cheese because everyone will be busy picking their jaws up off the floor.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by invisibleX 

Umm, well, stories. Most cultures have some sort of god(s), creation myth, etc. The first thing you need to decide is if someone, a long long time ago, believed in X will you believe it just because they did.

To answer your question: 'evidence' in this case would be proof saying these gods were literal beings and not just stories, proof that these beings were of an alien origin. Once you do that you might as well claim that they're made of cheese because everyone will be busy picking their jaws up off the floor.

Whoa, wait a minute...evidence is not proof and proof is not evidence. If you have proof, you don't need evidence anymore. Sorry but that's exactly what I thought you'd say. Your definition of evidence is completely wrong.

Take a look at OS X's Oxford Dictionary definition:

the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid : the study finds little evidence of overt discrimination.
• signs; indications : there was no obvious evidence of a break-in.

Corroborating stories are very much evidence that may lead to proof. Eye witness testimonies are used as evidence in judiciary systems: they're stories told by people that have witnessed something. If enough people tell the same story (even with minor changes), it can lead to proof.

It's not ultimate truth...it's not infallible...but it's the best we've got. That's how science works. That's how the judiciary system works. That's how religion works. And that's why you can't always be sure about science, justice or religion.

These "dead culture stories" as you call them are the same as testimonies in court. If you dismiss the stories, you're also dismissing the validity of testimonies.

edit: I'd also like to point out that reaching unambiguous proof (or being 100% certain) is unrealistic. You can have a mountain of evidence and not be 100% certain. But most system will accept being an arbitrary amount of certainty to be proof...if this wasn't so, science would never have gotten to where it is now...and you'd always have people off the hook for crimes...and everyone would dismiss religious scripts as stupid tales that have no founding. 100% certainty is pretty much unachievable.

[invisibleX]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

Whoa, wait a minute...evidence is not proof. Sorry but that's exactly what I thought you'd say. Your definition of evidence is completely wrong.

Take a look at OS X's Oxford Dictionary definition:



Corroborating stories are very much evidence that may lead to proof. Eye witness testimonies are used as evidence in judiciary systems: they're stories told by people that have witnessed something. If enough people tell the same story (even with minor changes), it can lead to proof.

It's not ultimate truth...it's not infallible...but it's the best we've got. That's how science works. That's how the judiciary system works. That's how religion works. And that's why you can't always be sure about science, justice or religion.

These "dead culture stories" as you call them are the same as testimonies in court. If you dismiss the stories, you're also dismissing the validity of testimonies.

You're right, I used the word 'proof' when I meant to say 'evidence'. I did not intend to define evidence, you can look it up in a dictionary for yourself if you don't know and if you want to go play word games you can do it with someone else, I was merely saying what would be evidence of your claim that something big will happen in 2012.

Again, I'm sorry but you're wrong. Car accident: one person says it happened this way, another says it happened that way. In this case the eye witness account is evidence. However if two people both say that an accident occurred on day X, but both accounts differ so much that the only commonality is the day it occurred, and there is no other evidence that anything occurred, you probably wouldn't assume both people are talking about the same event. So wouldn't use the word "corroborate" when you really mean "happen to involve the same year".

Last time I checked science is based on empirical evidence not "the best you have".

I felt it would be wrong of me to simply push back your flawed logic. I mean.. sure, you haven't pointed to any evidence, put forth any theory, etc, but there is a lot of back info on this. Clearly the root of this is the Sumerian thing because without that all you have is a date and a planet that you have no proof of (oh and lots of completely invalid "evidence"). Here is a website that refutes the ties between the Sumerians and your little 2012/PlanetX.. "evidence": www.sitchiniswrong.com.

Well that was fun! Want to go a few rounds with Aliens Shot Kennedy?

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by invisibleX 

You're right, I used the word 'proof' when I meant to say 'evidence'. I did not intend to define evidence, you can look it up in a dictionary for yourself if you don't know and if you want to go play word games you can do it with someone else, I was merely saying what would be evidence of your claim that something big will happen in 2012.

Again, I'm sorry but you're wrong. Car accident: one person says it happened this way, another says it happened that way. In this case the eye witness account is evidence. However if two people both say that an accident occurred on day X, but both accounts differ so much that the only commonality is the day it occurred, and there is no other evidence that anything occurred, you probably wouldn't assume both people are talking about the same event. So wouldn't use the word "corroborate" when you really mean "happen to involve the same year".

Last time I checked science is based on empirical evidence not "the best you have".

I felt it would be wrong of me to simply push back your flawed logic. I mean.. sure, you haven't pointed to any evidence, put forth any theory, etc, but there is a lot of back info on this. Clearly the root of this is the Sumerian thing because without that all you have is a date and a planet that you have no proof of (oh and lots of completely invalid "evidence"). Here is a website that refutes the ties between the Sumerians and your little 2012/PlanetX.. "evidence": www.sitchiniswrong.com.

Well that was fun! Want to go a few rounds with Aliens Shot Kennedy?

I didn't start this thread to prove anything. I'm throwing ideas around...not saying that something will for sure happen in 2012 but there is a strong possibility that something will happen.

I did not say that two stories that are vastly different can corroborate to prove anything either.

Empirical evidence is exactly that...observation. Just like eye witnesses observe things. Like a computer program, you can have algorithms solve a problem...it doesn't mean it's the only way, or the most efficient way. Science evolves. What is true today in science isn't necessarily going to be true tomorrow. Like a computer program with an author that wants to improve performance and accuracy, it gets updated as new knowledge comes in.

I think you're very confused and your backpedalling on your definition of evidence and proof and putting words in my mouth is only hurting your cause (whatever it may be...I understand that on the internet some people want to feel tough and superior to others...well you've done it, you tough guy you.)

Now if you'll excuse me, I'm trying to get this thread back on its rails. You're just here to cause trouble.

[- - e r i k - -]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

not saying that something will for sure happen in 2012 but there is a strong possibility that something will happen.

I'd say this would be a certainty

[iLikebeer]

Originally Posted by - - e r i k - - 

I'd say this would be a certainty

I bet I have a baby in 2012.
I bet people will change the number of the year the world ends in 2012.
I bet these people will still be "batshat, meet crazy" in 2012.
I'll wonder why the Mayans ended their calendar 600 years too late in 2012.

BUT!!!!!!, if they're right, I hope it's a mass relay that "changes" the world in 2012 so I can hook up with a hot blue chick.

As sad as I am about the sad state of our edumacation, threads like this make me enjoy other people's stupidity. At least we can ridicule people that use crazy conspiracy theories as religion. Thank you Horsepoo for trying to make everyone stupider in a funny way!

[ghporter]

Originally Posted by starman 

16.

I was thinking it was a quarter as thick as it is wide. That would fit...

And I'm sad that nobody else has commented on this proportion issue.

[Horsepoo!!!]

Originally Posted by iLikebeer 

I bet I have a baby in 2012.
I bet people will change the number of the year the world ends in 2012.
I bet these people will still be "batshat, meet crazy" in 2012.
I'll wonder why the Mayans ended their calendar 600 years too late in 2012.

BUT!!!!!!, if they're right, I hope it's a mass relay that "changes" the world in 2012 so I can hook up with a hot blue chick.

As sad as I am about the sad state of our edumacation, threads like this make me enjoy other people's stupidity. At least we can ridicule people that use crazy conspiracy theories as religion. Thank you Horsepoo for trying to make everyone stupider in a funny way!

Bill Nye? Is that you?

Are you a dude? It would be pretty amazing if you had a baby and would constitute a big change to humanity.

Anyway...I'm glad you think there are no conspiracies out there. Makes me feel somewhat superior to know that there are people so ignorant. People that truly believe there are no extra-terrestrial beings watching us or alien cover ups are going to be scared shitless when these guys do show up for a real first contact.

There will be those that are prepared because they did see the signs, and there will be those that will panic and probably be hostile to them (like yourself). When the truth does come out, however, I think many Americans will lose trust in the US government: one of the very few government 'till this day that still denies UFO and covers up signs of extra-terrestrial life.

See...you're not the only one that can play the "thanks for being stupid" game. Keep drinking that beer and float back into that daze.

[Lava Lamp Freak]

Originally Posted by Horsepoo!!! 

Bill Nye? Is that you?

Are you a dude? It would be pretty amazing if you had a baby and would constitute a big change to humanity.

Anyway...I'm glad you think there are no conspiracies out there. Makes me feel somewhat superior to know that there are people so ignorant. People that truly believe there are no extra-terrestrial beings watching us or alien cover ups are going to be scared shitless when these guys do show up for a real first contact.

There will be those that are prepared because they did see the signs, and there will be those that will panic and probably be hostile to them (like yourself). When the truth does come out, however, I think many Americans will lose trust in the US government: one of the very few government 'till this day that still denies UFO and covers up signs of extra-terrestrial life.

See...you're not the only one that can play the "thanks for being stupid" game. Keep drinking that beer and float back into that daze.

I have some good news and some bad news for you. The good news is you're not alone in your way of thinking. There are tens, possibly hundreds of thousands of people who would agree with you. The bad news is they're all crackpots.

[Eriamjh]

People have been predicting the end of the world for a long time.

Only for those who kill themselves does it end when predicted.