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l008com · Nov 2, 2011, 04:14 PM

I'm looking for a good CSS editor. I was using BBEdit forever for editing CSS. But I'm realizing that it wouldn't take all that much for a CSS editor to be 'smart' and allow much better editing. So I found "CSSEdit" which does allow groups. But I don't like the way it implements groups, I think it could be done better. Plus I'd love to find something free-er. I'm even switching from BBEdit to TextWrangler since I only do basic coding in it.

So I'm wondering if there are any other CSS editing apps for OS X.
What I envision is a program that has groups like CSSEdit, but showed the groups as items in a list, where when you click on one item, you see just that group's text in the next column. Like column view in Finder. CSSEdit is close to that. But it uses folders and it can nest folders, and when you click on a group, you go to that group but you still see the whole file. It's not quite as sleek as I'd like.

l008com · Nov 2, 2011, 04:14 PM

Oh and also it seems like the company that makes CSSEdit might have discontinued it, another reason to abandon it.

andi*pandi · Nov 2, 2011, 04:40 PM

Hmm, never tried CSSEdit, but I use BBEdit and Dreamweaver. Dreamweaver will autofill parameters as you start typing, handy for me who is forgetful about syntax. However it doesn't have any folder structure that I've ever used.

l008com · Nov 2, 2011, 04:42 PM

I really want some kind of grouping. It will make working with longer CSS files so easy if it's done right.

besson3c · Nov 2, 2011, 05:52 PM

Why not just rely on the Webkit Inspector to figure out what line number the rule you need to edit lives at, and how it relates to other CSS declarations?

l008com · Nov 2, 2011, 05:54 PM

What?

besson3c · Nov 2, 2011, 06:02 PM

Webkit Inspector has made a CSS editor pretty much worthless for me with its ability to edit existing styles and create new ones within your web browser. Are you familiar with this tool?

l008com · Nov 2, 2011, 06:04 PM

If it's worthless, why are you telling me to use it?

besson3c · Nov 2, 2011, 06:30 PM

Huh? The Webkit Inspector is not just a CSS editor, it is a number of things. I meant that I don't really see a use for a dedicated CSS Editor given the existence of the Webkit dev tools.

l008com · Nov 2, 2011, 06:31 PM

How do you edit css files on a server, with safari's inspector?

besson3c · Nov 2, 2011, 06:35 PM

Originally Posted by l008com

How do you edit css files on a server, with safari's inspector?

You don't, you make the changes you want based on the live preview, and record your changes to your CSS files with a text editor of your choice.

I don't see what a CSS Editor buys you that you don't get with the Inspector.

l008com · Nov 2, 2011, 06:37 PM

I don't even know what to say to this............. other than WTF

besson3c · Nov 2, 2011, 06:54 PM

Since you seem like the kind of person that wants to confine your options and do things in a way that suits your predefined sense of the way things ought to be, your reaction is not surprising, but to others reading this thread, the Inspector is a great way to edit CSS and see what rules apply to what elements, what is being inherited, what is being applied based on user agent defaults, etc. I get the sense that a lot of people don't realize what sort of mileage you can get out of the inspector, so I encourage people to explore its functionality before looking to other solutions.

Also, drop the attitude, you'll have more people willing to help you with some good manners.

l008com · Nov 2, 2011, 06:56 PM

I can think of no more asinine a way of creating CSS files than the one you just described. I guess that makes me a square peg in a square hole.

besson3c · Nov 2, 2011, 06:59 PM

Originally Posted by l008com

I can think of no more asinine a way of creating CSS files than the one you just described. I guess that makes me a square peg in a square hole.

Creating CSS files? You're right the Inspector won't do that, but most sites I've ever seen have no more than a few CSS files. Editing existing CSS files? You bet, a lot of people rely on the Inspector, as well as Firebug, heavily for that.

besson3c · Nov 2, 2011, 07:02 PM

This thread is worth looking at too, if you are interested in committing Webkit Inspector/Firebug changes:

tools - Export CSS changes from inspector (webkit, firebug, etc) - Stack Overflow

besson3c · Nov 2, 2011, 07:04 PM

This is referenced from that thread:

Skybound Stylizer - An Exotic Visual CSS Editor

andi*pandi · Nov 2, 2011, 07:08 PM

I use Firebug a ton, but would never consider using it to create long css files. If I am solving a problem I will make fixes in firebug and copy the new css into my dreamweaver file.

I think the OP asked for an apple and you gave him an orange... They're both nice but not the same thing.

l008com · Nov 2, 2011, 07:10 PM

Originally Posted by andi*pandi

asked for an apple and you gave him an orange

I wish I had a dollar for every answer he gave me that wasn't to the question I asked.

l008com · Nov 2, 2011, 07:10 PM

Also I've been using CSSEdit for a few hours and despite not being exactly what I was looking for, it's pretty good. Once you get your groups setup, you are much more productive with it than with a simple text editor.

Demonhood · Nov 2, 2011, 07:18 PM

CSSEdit is what I use, despite it being outdated and discontinued (rolled into another product). I don't think I'll consider another option until Coda 2 comes out.

besson3c · Nov 2, 2011, 07:25 PM

Originally Posted by andi*pandi

I use Firebug a ton, but would never consider using it to create long css files. If I am solving a problem I will make fixes in firebug and copy the new css into my dreamweaver file.

I think the OP asked for an apple and you gave him an orange... They're both nice but not the same thing.

Fair enough, I'll shaddup.

I still don't get the point of a dedicated CSS editor, but maybe I'm just weird like that. I also do a lot of JavaScript work, so maybe one factor is the niceness of not having to incorporate another tool while developing stuff.

besson3c · Nov 2, 2011, 08:03 PM

Originally Posted by l008com

I wish I had a dollar for every answer he gave me that wasn't to the question I asked.

You'd have a dollar, cause your borrowing a G5 XServe thread doesn't really count.

If somebody came in here asking for advice on the best way to continue to run OS 9 (which only works on discontinued hardware) you'd fully expect people raising question "maybe you shouldn't in the first place?"

However, I'll shaddup on this too if you don't ever expect your business to outgrow what can be provided by a Mac Mini, or you have a company that will rack a Mac Pro and you don't mind overpaying for 2010 technology and you don't need physical access to the OS running your business.

l008com · Nov 11, 2011, 02:38 PM

Originally Posted by Demonhood

CSSEdit is what I use, despite it being outdated and discontinued (rolled into another product). I don't think I'll consider another option until Coda 2 comes out.

Do you have the 'bug' where the font preference is not remembered?

One other thing that I'm realizing is that other simpler text editors (or maybe calling them more multi-purpose is more accurate) do syntax coloring based on keywords. CSSEdit colors based on the "punctuation" of a CSS file. In other words, a mis-spelled property in CSSEdit shows up just like a real property. In Text-Wrangler, if you spell it wrong, it doesn't get colored.

Big Mac · Nov 14, 2011, 05:06 AM

Originally Posted by besson3c

Creating CSS files? You're right the Inspector won't do that, but most sites I've ever seen have no more than a few CSS files. Editing existing CSS files? You bet, a lot of people rely on the Inspector, as well as Firebug, heavily for that.

besson is absolutely correct about this. No reason to doubt him on his home turf, especially.