[tonewheel]

Check out the Store...

[RealMadrid]

Its good they update, but the changes do not move me to change my PB 12' Rev B. Well the price is nice with more VRAM and built in AEX.

[yongfook]

WAHOOO!!!!!!

ordering RIGHT now.

[fisherKing]

hmmmm...904am est; just got some specs&prices off the apple site, then...
it went down.
damn!
guess they are updating the index page to advertise the new pbs.

[Simon]

PowerBook G4 1.33GHz/12.1"/256MB RAM/60GB HD/Combo Drive - $1,600
PowerBook G4 1.33GHz/12.1"/256MB RAM/60GB HD/4x SuperDrive - $1,800
PowerBook G4 1.33GHz/15"/256MB RAM/60GB HD/Combo Drive - $2,000
PowerBook G4 1.5GHz/15"/512MB RAM/80GB HD/4x SuperDrive - $2,500
PowerBook G4 1.5GHz/17"/512MB RAM/80GB HD/4x SuperDrive - $2,900

[Eug Wanker]

4X DVD-R!

[Simon]

And the option to have 128MB VRAM on thew 1.5GHz models.

I think that's a first for PowerBooks.

[Link]

One thing nobody has noticed is they have UPGRADABLE VRAM in the 15" and 17" models.. can anyone say 128mb?!

[Eug Wanker]

Originally posted by Link:
One thing nobody has noticed is they have UPGRADABLE VRAM in the 15" and 17" models.. can anyone say 128mb?!

Yeah, my next PowerBook (next revision maybe) will have 128 MB. 128 MB is better if you're using a large external display along with the PowerBook.

[SSharon]

oh please let them still go to G5's over the summer, but these are very tempting

[WizOSX]

Originally posted by link

One thing nobody has noticed is they have UPGRADABLE VRAM in the 15" and 17" models.. can anyone say 128mb?!

But only on the top two models. The base 15" doesn't appear to be upgradable.

[Simon]

Originally posted by WizOSX:
But only on the top two models. The base 15" doesn't appear to be upgradable.

Yeah, it's only an option of the 1.5GHz models.

[chabig]

A $50 option...I can't imaging many people not forking over the extra $50. But it does give you an idea how hard Apple tries to keep the price down. Apparently they thought keeping the price $50 lower was more important than making the 128MB VRAM standard.

Chris

[WizOSX]

Since the 12" models both now use DDR333 is it safe to assume that they both have 167mhz motherboards?

[Eug Wanker]

No 7200 rpm drive option though. I'd like that for my next PowerBook, since the power utilization of the current 7200 rpm drives seem reasonable. There is no 80 GB 7200 rpm drive out yet though, so I suspect that's why there is no 7200 rpm drive option. (Only 60 GB 7200 rpm drives are available.)

I wonder what SuperDrive it is. I'm thinking it's still Matsushita since IIRC, the UJ-825 is a slot load 4X burner. It also supports DVD-RAM, but I'm thinking Apple will remove that feature again.

[chabig]

Yes. The new 12" models have 167MHz motherboards and 512K cache. I think it's safe to say they should be quite a bit faster than the previous generation.

However, I wonder if the new speed will affect battery life, or are the G4 now using less power.

Chris

[Simon]

Originally posted by WizOSX:
Since the 12" models both now use DDR333 is it safe to assume that they both have 167mhz motherboards?

Yes.

Apple says on this page that they have a 167MHz system bus:

Processor and Memory
12-inch models

1.33GHz PowerPC G4 processor with Velocity Engine, 512K SRAM on-chip L2 cache, 167MHz system bus

256MB of PC2700 (333MHz) DDR SDRAM; one open SO-DIMM slot; support for up to 1.25GB

[Eug Wanker]

What the... 4X SuperDrive in an iBook? That one surprised me. (Only in the 14" though.)

[bamchum]

Boy are these upgrades underwhelming. All that waiting for this?

Tell me: what does 128MB of video ram do for you that 64MB doesn't? It's a serious question. I mean, is this of interest to anyone other than gamers and 3D design professionals?

[Simon]

Originally posted by bamchum:
Tell me: what does 128MB of video ram do for you that 64MB doesn't? It's a serious question. I mean, is this of interest to anyone other than gamers and 3D design professionals?

If you work with an additional large external monitor (in spanning mode) you'll be glad to have as much VRAM as you can get.

[St.John]

A 30% speed hike on my 12", and with a faster bus to boot. Not to mention AEx built in. Seems like a pretty good upgrade to me!

I'm no longer riding the Apple front line though.

[bamchum]

Originally posted by Simon:
If you work with an additional large external monitor (in spanning mode) you'll be glad to have as much VRAM as you can get.

Really? But the card in the previous powerbook (the 9600 with 64MB RAM) is supposed to drive monitors up to 2048 x 1536 at millions of colors in spanning mode...

[Simon]

Originally posted by St.John:
A 30% speed hike on my 12", and with a faster bus to boot. Not to mention AEx built in. Seems like a pretty good upgrade to me!

Yeah, I agree completely. My 1GHz 12" just got a nice upgrade. I won't switch from rev B to C since my next PowerBook will be a G5, but this update makes the 12" PowerBook a much better value.

[Uriel]

Tell me: what does 128MB of video ram do for you that 64MB doesn't? It's a serious question. I mean, is this of interest to anyone other than gamers and 3D design professionals

Wouldn't that be a nice chunk of Apple's audience? Obviously not everyone needs it, but why the heck are you whining about them giving you an option?

I for one need a laptop for college. I'm probably going for the 1.5 15in Powerbook. I'll use my EDU discount, and take off the superdrive, and the price isn't half bad.

[Eug Wanker]

Originally posted by bamchum:
Really? But the card in the previous powerbook (the 9600 with 64MB RAM) is supposed to drive monitors up to 2048 x 1536 at millions of colors in spanning mode...

Expos� for some people becomes choppy if you run dual spanned monitors with only 64 MB. With 128 MB the choppiness disappears. Aside from Expos� though, 64 MB is fine.

[Daniel Bayer]

"Boy are these upgrades underwhelming. All that waiting for this?"

I don't think anyone expected anything groundbreaking this time around, I know I didn't.

This is what happens at the end of a "G" cycle.

I have a 1.33 17 right now and will happily wait for the G5 or even a rev-B G5.

Now that jump will be progress!

[Simon]

Originally posted by bamchum:
Really? But the card in the previous powerbook (the 9600 with 64MB RAM) is supposed to drive monitors up to 2048 x 1536 at millions of colors in spanning mode...

The 64MB VRAM will drive that resolution, but the 128MB will do it faster.

[chabig]

Not only is this a speed bump, it's also a $100 price cut because AE is built-in.

[nica]

you know that it's a 167MHz system bus. This is very slow does it matter if you have a fast CPU or a bigger graphic card?

[Simon]

Originally posted by nica:
you know that it's a 167MHz system bus. This is very slow does it matter if you have a fast CPU or a bigger graphic card?

Actually, it's the fastest 74xx bus on the market.

The bus is the G4's bottleneck, therefore it's nice to have the best you can.

You can't expect a G4 Mac to have a bus as fast as the G5's. The chip's architecture has changed entirely.

Having a fast GPU will help everything that is GPU rather than processor dependent. Reagrdless of the frontside bus speed.

[Mr. Bob]

Still the same fuzzy screen though. Just need to get to having a better screen, and a 7200 rpm drive, and then I am there. G5 is cool, but screen and hard drive are the only things holding me backola.

Hopefully soon, I mean at least 1440x900, and then I am there.

[Simon]

Originally posted by Mr. Bob:
Hopefully soon, I mean at least 1440x900, and then I am there.

That gives above 110dpi even if they go to 15.4"!

I think that's a tad too high for notebook use. My 12" has 107dpi and I find that the utter max on OS X.

[Mr. Bob]

Originally posted by Simon:
That gives above 110dpi even if they go to 15.4"!

I think that's a tad too high for notebook use. My 12" has 107dpi and I find that the utter max on OS X.

I really don�t think so. My Dell 8100 "hopefully to be replaced soon" runs 1600x1200, and its great. I looked at the PowerBooks at Tachikawa and the screen is just too fuzzy for me. Also, the extra screen is very useful for just about anything.

I mean, at least the option would be good.

[cenutrio]

The edu prices are super competitive. The 17" top of the game for $2,499

Nice upgrade. I wish I had the money to replace the Ti 400 I'm typing in.

[red_wedge]

So I guess that means no PB G5 until next January then. I doubt they'd release a G5 power book shortly after the new 17" G4 ships in May.

[chrisutley]

The $1999 15" is a great value, IMO. Well equipped and good mobile performance, at a decent price (for Apple anyway). I've been holding on to this 667 DVI long enough now, time to upgrade to aluminum.

I hope they make Airport Extreme standard on pro notebooks from now on.

[Eug Wanker]

Originally posted by Mr. Bob:
I really don�t think so. My Dell 8100 "hopefully to be replaced soon" runs 1600x1200, and its great. I looked at the PowerBooks at Tachikawa and the screen is just too fuzzy for me. Also, the extra screen is very useful for just about anything.

I mean, at least the option would be good.

The option would be good, but 1600x1200 on the 15" Dells I've seen is VERY hard on the eyes. I get fatigued with that pixel density within minutes.

[Simon]

Originally posted by Mr. Bob:
My Dell 8100 "hopefully to be replaced soon" runs 1600x1200, and its great.

I mean, at least the option would be good.

A BTO option is OK with me. I just don't think it should be standard.

Your Dell does 1600x1200 with Windows which offers more GUI scalability than OS X. Running Panther on a 132dpi resolution would kill most people's eyes because we can't adjust fonts and GUI widgets on the fly! (the 107dpi of the 12" iBook is the reason Apple offers a 14" iBook with the same number of pixels, but with a reduced 91dpi)

[Commodus]

Apple probably won't up the resolution on the 15" display until they can do the same on the 17". I would love it if we had a 15" 1440x900 display followed by a 1680x1050 17" model.

[threestain]

My housemate has a dell at some stupid resolution. He's one of those guys that can't see anything on the desktop as he has it all so small, yet complains about it. He also needs glasses that he doesn't wear...

Why do you need such big resolutions? Surely if you need that high a resolution you would have a nice big screen for it - hence the cinema screens.

Just me I suppose!

[Lateralus]

I'm glad that Apple has decided to included AE on all the PowerBooks. We can think Centrino for the push Apple got into including it.

[gostan]

Apple Store near me in Chestnut Hill advises no new 17" Powerbooks until May 1. Discontinued 15" with superdrive is now $2299 and 17" is now $2599. Not much of a discoun for discontinued models.

I need to upgrade m ibook 800 to either a 15 or 17 superdrive. I cannot decide if I want to carry the 17 back and forth to work every day. With only a $300.00 difference it is tough to pass up the 17.

[Shaddim]

Originally posted by Eug Wanker:
The option would be good, but 1600x1200 on the 15" Dells I've seen is VERY hard on the eyes. I get fatigued with that pixel density within minutes.

Agreed, it's truly horrible. Not what a graphics person wants to stare at for several hours.

[PeteWK]

The real reason Apple included the too-good-to-pass-up video upgrade is that they want to push as many customers to an online purchase as possible. More profit margin that way. They'll get me that way.

PeteWK

[Toyin]

Ordered my 15" with 128mb VRAM and upgraded HD before 7:00am PST.

Shipping date on or before the 26th!!!

I'm pumped that I waited the extra few weeks.

As for too much VRAM, no such thing. When I got my Dual 500 G4 people also thought the 32MB might be overkill. Then a thing called Quartz Extreme came out. I think as OSX ages more and more graphics work will be pushed to the graphics card. It can't hurt to anticipate that.

[[APi]TheMan]

Originally posted by St.John:
A 30% speed hike on my 12", and with a faster bus to boot. Not to mention AEx built in. Seems like a pretty good upgrade to me!

I'm no longer riding the Apple front line though.

I feel ya... I just picked up a new 15" 1.25 Ghz with SuperDrive and Airport Extreme about... 2 weeks ago. I really couldn't care less about the 250 Mhz increase, but the Radeon Mobility 9700 would have been nice for the long run. I have an external Sony 4x DVD-/+RW so I'm not too bummed about the new 4x SuperDrives in the new 15 inch powerbooks. (Actually I'm battling with Sony to get them to honor my warranty because the drive ceased functioning correctly recently, and they are saying that they can't help me because it's not supported on Mac)

I got a good deal on my 15", so I guess I'm not too bummed, I had just hoped I wouldn't be outdated this soon.

[scottiB]

Originally posted by PowerMacMan:
I'm glad that Apple has decided to included AE on all the PowerBooks. We can think Centrino for the push Apple got into including it.

Very astute point.

RE: Future PowerBook G5s, I can see it happening at a special event this October-November. Honestly, how much further can you speed bump a G4 while furthering diminishing returns because of the choked FSB? A 1.5GHz is the fastest G4 ever offered. Is a 1.733 (or whatever) going to be that big a deal? Like the DP1.42 PowerMacs, the current PBook platform has been stretched 10% beyond its max viability (IMHO).

When IBM gets Fishskill optimized: 1.8 12"; 2.0/2.2 15"; 2.2 17"--G5s all around.

This is not to say that I'm not digging these revs. My SO and I will be getting a 1.5/17" as soon as refurbs hit the Apple Store.

[scottiB]

Originally posted by PeteWK:
The real reason Apple included the too-good-to-pass-up video upgrade is that they want to push as many customers to an online purchase as possible. More profit margin that way. They'll get me that way.

PeteWK

Another very astute point.

[madmacgames]

Originally posted by chabig:
Yes. The new 12" models have 167MHz motherboards and 512K cache.

The 12" models have had a 512K L2 cache since the September '03 upgrade (revision B). That is nothing new. Though the DDR333/167FSB is a nice little step up, but not enough to make me want to go drop another $2G after I just dropped $2G in October on one (and still paying it off )

[MrCaN]

Just orderd my 15" Powerbook, this will be my first apple computer, and can't wait.