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Severed Hand of Skywalker · Feb 18, 2005, 03:40 PM

"WASHINGTON (AP) -- The nation's Roman Catholic bishops said Friday that over the last year they received 1,092 new allegations of sexual abuse against at least 756 Catholic priests and deacons.

Half of the accused priests over the past year had been previously accused of abuse, said Kathleen McChesney, executive director of the bishops' Office of Child and Youth Protection.

Most of the alleged incidents occurred decades ago: 72 percent of the priests were either dead, defrocked or removed from public ministry before the newest allegations were received, McChesney said."

http://www.cnn.com/2005/US/02/18/chu....ap/index.html

BRussell · Feb 18, 2005, 04:21 PM

Ugh. I have no doubt that there are lots of real cases where this happened, but you can't help but wonder whether all these are true.

Severed Hand of Skywalker · Feb 18, 2005, 04:38 PM

I personally have sat in on an interview with one of the 10 priest who work with the Pope directly at all times. He said that 90% of the priests he worked with are gay.

I also ask a friend of mine who is gay and WAS Catholic why there are so many gay Catholic priests. He gave me a very logical answer.

1) It is the perfect place to hide and not have to answer to your friends or family why you are not dating or married.
2) You are surrounded and work with men.

As to why they end up molesting boys, well imagine living in hiding still having sexual urges and having all these boys dangled under your nose. Not to mention the church largely ignores any allegations.

Makes sense to me.

Splinter · Feb 18, 2005, 04:46 PM

South Park season 6 episode 8 - Red Hot Catholic Love

To close to the truth for comfort...

Kilbey · Feb 18, 2005, 06:59 PM

Originally posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker:
1) It is the perfect place to hide and not have to answer to your friends or family why you are not dating or married.
2) You are surrounded and work with men.

This I can believe. The Catholic Church has been a powder keg ready to go off with the policies they keep

Originally posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker:
As to why they end up molesting boys, well imagine living in hiding still having sexual urges and having all these boys dangled under your nose. Not to mention the church largely ignores any allegations.

Makes sense to me.

You could dangle a young girl "under my nose" all day and that still wouldn't affect me. Why should this be the case with the gay men?

I find it deplorable. And it makes no sense to me at all. If it makes sense to you, I hope you are staying as far away from children as you can.

docbud · Feb 18, 2005, 10:23 PM

Originally posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker:
I personally have sat in on an interview with one of the 10 priest who work with the Pope directly at all times. He said that 90% of the priests he worked with are gay.

That's odd--I was at that same interview and I didn't hear that.

thunderous_funker · Feb 18, 2005, 10:40 PM

Its not a matter of straight or gay.

Anyone who has sex with a kid is unstable, unhealthy and hideously unhappy and in need of serious help.

The priesthood is apparently teeming with all kinds of sexual dysfunction. It would be interesting if it attracted the sexually dysfunctional or bred them. Probably a combination of the two.

Very depressing. Very depressing.

undotwa · Feb 18, 2005, 11:42 PM

Originally posted by thunderous_funker:
Its not a matter of straight or gay.

Anyone who has sex with a kid is unstable, unhealthy and hideously unhappy and in need of serious help.

The priesthood is apparently teeming with all kinds of sexual dysfunction. It would be interesting if it attracted the sexually dysfunctional or bred them. Probably a combination of the two.

Very depressing. Very depressing.

People are often confused with ephebiphiles and paedophiles. I'm not legitimising anything but I just want to say, that the sexual attraction between a grown man and a girl as young as 14, is perfectly normal. Men use to be married off to women at this age all the time. Only prebubescent relationships are unnatural.

thunderous_funker · Feb 19, 2005, 12:16 AM

Originally posted by undotwa:
People are often confused with ephebiphiles and paedophiles. I'm not legitimising anything but I just want to say, that the sexual attraction between a grown man and a girl as young as 14, is perfectly normal. Men use to be married off to women at this age all the time. Only prebubescent relationships are unnatural.

By "kid" I meant prepubescent.

Agent69 · Feb 19, 2005, 01:08 AM

I feel so sorry for those who have been victimized. I hope that they have been able to get past this and find some happiness.

undotwa · Feb 19, 2005, 01:16 AM

Originally posted by Agent69:
I feel so sorry for those who have been victimized. I hope that they have been able to get past this and find some happiness.

I too.

But let's not exagerate the scale of the problem. Only a very small minority of priests are child molesters. I feel sorry for the priests who have made some serious mistakes in the past, and not to mention the many priests which are falsely accused.

Agent69 · Feb 19, 2005, 01:35 AM

Originally posted by undotwa:
I too.

But let's not exagerate the scale of the problem. Only a very small minority of priests are child molesters.

You're right. Without a doubt, we are talking about a minority of priests giving the whole group a bad name. (I wasn't trying to imply that all priests are molesters.)

malvolio · Feb 19, 2005, 03:05 AM

Originally posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker:
Half of the accused priests over the past year had been previously accused of abuse, said Kathleen McChesney, executive director of the bishops' Office of Child and Youth Protection.

That's the really appalling part. For decades, the Catholic Church simply shuffled abusers off to new parishes.

BRussell · Feb 19, 2005, 04:19 AM

Originally posted by undotwa:
But let's not exagerate the scale of the problem. Only a very small minority of priests are child molesters.

Close to 5% of priests have had allegations of child sexual abuse. That's an absolutely astounding number. The vast majority of child sexual abusers are family members of the victims. I bet there's no other profession - teacher, day care worker, etc. - that comes anywhere close to that number. Can you imagine if 5% of teachers had allegations of sexual abuse against them? There's something very strange going on - it's not just "priests do it the same as everyone." I'm not sure if it's the male thing, or the single male thing, or the gay thing, or the unwillingness of the Church to deal properly with the issue, or what. But there's something going on.

And to be fair, a small percentage (<5%) of the accused priests received a fairly large percentage (~30%) of the abuses allegations.

This is probably the most comprehensive and factual study of the issue.

Disgruntled Head of C-3PO · Feb 19, 2005, 02:58 PM

Originally posted by malvolio:
That's the really appalling part. For decades, the Catholic Church simply shuffled abusers off to new parishes.

Not surprising, but sick. Probably why it happens so much as the church is in denial over it and wants to keep it quite.

mitchell_pgh · Feb 19, 2005, 03:43 PM

For the record, I was an alterboy for two priests and neither of them every touched me inappropriately. I'm also rather comfortable saying that they were not gay, but rather were simply very religious... and said "I was given a calling"

mitchell_pgh · Feb 19, 2005, 03:45 PM

Originally posted by Disgruntled Head of C-3PO:
Not surprising, but sick. Probably why it happens so much as the church is in denial over it and wants to keep it quite.

I would also argue that another reason is the priest and the child never say anything...

...and only after the child grows up does it come out (10 to 20 years after the encounter).

bubblewrap · Feb 19, 2005, 06:06 PM

I'm curious to how many young girls were molested by preists.
It seem only boys are accosted. Why is this?

mitchell_pgh · Feb 19, 2005, 10:59 PM

Originally posted by bubblewrap:
I'm curious to how many young girls were molested by preists.
It seem only boys are accosted. Why is this?

There are no catholic alter-girls (traditionally, this has changed). I'm guessing that's part of it.

undotwa · Feb 20, 2005, 03:37 AM

Originally posted by mitchell_pgh:
There are no catholic alter-girls (traditionally, this has changed). I'm guessing that's part of it.

The priests didn't just molest altar boys.

undotwa · Feb 20, 2005, 03:39 AM

Originally posted by Disgruntled Head of C-3PO:
Not surprising, but sick. Probably why it happens so much as the church is in denial over it and wants to keep it quite.

Or perhaps the church, which has never faced anything like this before, didn't know how to do deal with the problem. The Catholic Church always thought of itself as indenpendant from secular legislative bodies.

undotwa · Feb 20, 2005, 03:40 AM

Originally posted by BRussell:
Close to 5% of priests have had allegations of child sexual abuse. That's an absolutely astounding number. The vast majority of child sexual abusers are family members of the victims. I bet there's no other profession - teacher, day care worker, etc. - that comes anywhere close to that number. Can you imagine if 5% of teachers had allegations of sexual abuse against them? There's something very strange going on - it's not just "priests do it the same as everyone." I'm not sure if it's the male thing, or the single male thing, or the gay thing, or the unwillingness of the Church to deal properly with the issue, or what. But there's something going on.

And to be fair, a small percentage (<5%) of the accused priests received a fairly large percentage (~30%) of the abuses allegations.

This is probably the most comprehensive and factual study of the issue.

The problem in the United States is much worse than say here in Australia. But there have been quite a few claims against priests here though.

bubblewrap · Feb 20, 2005, 10:27 AM

What man in his right mind wants to touch a young boy?

Sick sick sick.
Ranks right up there with NAMBLA.
And what bothers me even more is the lack of action by the heads of the Catholic church.
Ubless they are reverting back to the days when ancient Romans were OK with accosting boys...

Kilbey · 12:38 PM

Originally posted by bubblewrap:
What man in his right mind wants to touch a young boy?
Sick sick sick.
Ranks right up there with NAMBLA.
And what bothers me even more is the lack of action by the heads of the Catholic church.
Ubless they are reverting back to the days when ancient Romans were OK with accosting boys...

That was really uncalled for

Disgruntled Head of C-3PO · Feb 20, 2005, 03:36 PM

kilby is suggesting twice on this page just because I am gay that I am also a child molester

Kilbey · Feb 20, 2005, 04:35 PM

Originally posted by Disgruntled Head of C-3PO:
kilby is suggesting twice on this page just because I am gay that I am also a child molester

Nope, you are suggesting that having the boys "dangled under your nose" is a temptation for gay priests. One they can't overcome.

I personally disagree with that line of thought.

undotwa · Feb 23, 2005, 03:33 AM

Originally posted by bubblewrap:

And what bothers me even more is the lack of action by the heads of the Catholic church.

The thing is, the Catholic Church is taking action and things are moving forward. Hopefully now we can say the worst is by far behind us.

Kilbey · Feb 23, 2005, 01:53 PM

Originally posted by Kilbey:
That was really uncalled for

I didn't realize we were into censorship here.

SWF has me on his ignore list anyway. What does it matter to him?

BRussell · Feb 23, 2005, 02:06 PM

Originally posted by Kilbey:
Nope, you are suggesting that having the boys "dangled under your nose" is a temptation for gay priests. One they can't overcome.

I personally disagree with that line of thought.

He's not saying they can't overcome it. Obviously the vast majority don't molest anyone. But it may raise the likelihood of it happening. Not sure what's wrong with saying that. What's your theory, if you disagree with that explanation?

budster101 · 01:32 PM

Originally posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker:
I personally have sat in on an interview with one of the 10 priest who work with the Pope directly at all times. He said that 90% of the priests he worked with are gay.

I also ask a friend of mine who is gay and WAS Catholic why there are so many gay Catholic priests. He gave me a very logical answer.

1) It is the perfect place to hide and not have to answer to your friends or family why you are not dating or married.
2) You are surrounded and work with men.

As to why they end up molesting boys, well imagine living in hiding still having sexual urges and having all these boys dangled under your nose. Not to mention the church largely ignores any allegations.

Makes sense to me.

Why and How would you be sitting in any interviews with one of the 10 priests who work with the Pope directly at all times?

Having asked that questions, why on earth would he tell you that 90 percent of the priests he worked with are gay? 9 of the 10 he works with? Is he the straight one? What is his name?

You are stating in this post that gay priests molest children.

"As to why they end up molesting boys....these boys are dangled under your nose. Not to mention the church largely ignores any allegations."

budster101 · Feb 24, 2005, 01:24 PM

Originally posted by Disgruntled Head of C-3PO:
kilby is suggesting twice on this page just because I am gay that I am also a child molester

You suggested it in your post.

"90 percent of the priests are gay, and......As to why they end up molesting boys, well imagine living in hiding still having sexual urges and having all these boys dangled under your nose. Not to mention the church largely ignores any allegations."

Zimphire · Feb 24, 2005, 06:55 PM

You guys took SWFs bait.

Shame.

Disgruntled Head of C-3PO · Feb 24, 2005, 07:08 PM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
You guys took SWFs bait.

Shame.

Once again, except this time a 4 day break, first post back is about me

Second, also me

Talk about taking bait

Zimphire · Feb 24, 2005, 07:17 PM

Originally posted by Disgruntled Head of C-3PO:
Talk about taking bait

Indeed.

<-- You

Xeo · Feb 24, 2005, 10:55 PM

I think what SWG was trying to say is simply that these men, assuming they are gay, have feelings towards other men and cannot ever act on them. So they snap and finally start using their power to get sexual gratification. Not "just because they were gay" but because they are gay and have never been able to act on it... they couldn't take the pressure anymore.

Now, I don't really buy that because to be attracted to a prepubescent is different than just being attracted to men. Also, what about the straight population of priests? Surely some of them would encounter the same "snap" and molest girls. Have we ever heard of a case where the victim was female?

I think the molestation of young boys is the same as the rape of anyone else. Those who commit it are more attracted to the feeling of power it brings rather than the victim. It is one male dominating another. It happens in prison too. You think all those guys are gay? No. But rape still goes on.

It's all about power.

undotwa · Feb 25, 2005, 01:54 AM

Originally posted by Xeo:
I think what SWG was trying to say is simply that these men, assuming they are gay, have feelings towards other men and cannot ever act on them. So they snap and finally start using their power to get sexual gratification. Not "just because they were gay" but because they are gay and have never been able to act on it... they couldn't take the pressure anymore.

Now, I don't really buy that because to be attracted to a prepubescent is different than just being attracted to men. Also, what about the straight population of priests? Surely some of them would encounter the same "snap" and molest girls. Have we ever heard of a case where the victim was female?

I think the molestation of young boys is the same as the rape of anyone else. Those who commit it are more attracted to the feeling of power it brings rather than the victim. It is one male dominating another. It happens in prison too. You think all those guys are gay? No. But rape still goes on.

It's all about power.

Paedophiles are really mentally ill and deserve to receive treatment. Jail isn't the right place for them but hospitals.

Disgruntled Head of C-3PO · Feb 25, 2005, 02:20 AM

Originally posted by Xeo:
I think what SWG was trying to say is simply that these men, assuming they are gay, have feelings towards other men and cannot ever act on them. So they snap and finally start using their power to get sexual gratification. Not "just because they were gay" but because they are gay and have never been able to act on it... they couldn't take the pressure anymore.

Exactly, like I said many of them don't even want to be priest they are just there in hiding from their family. So yes, eventually they snap.

There are also lots of cases of girls getting molested.

undotwa · Feb 25, 2005, 02:42 AM

Originally posted by Disgruntled Head of C-3PO:
Exactly, like I said many of them don't even want to be priest they are just there in hiding from their family. So yes, eventually they snap.

There are also lots of cases of girls getting molested.

Very true. The reasons are many more, and complex dependant upon each case.

Disgruntled Head of C-3PO · Feb 25, 2005, 02:59 AM

I don't think they are pedo's by nature but they really have no other access to men. It is not like they can go to a gay bar as they can't drink OR have sex with men or woman.

malvolio · Feb 25, 2005, 03:55 AM

Originally posted by Disgruntled Head of C-3PO:
It is not like they can go to a gay bar as they can't drink OR have sex with men or woman.

Priests can't drink? That's news to me.
I bet half of them take vows just for the sacramental wine.

Zimphire · Feb 25, 2005, 08:23 AM

Originally posted by Disgruntled Head of C-3PO:
I don't think they are pedo's by nature but they really have no other access to men.

Yeah, there are no other men in the clergy.

Xeo · Feb 25, 2005, 09:33 AM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
Yeah, there are no other men in the clergy.

No other men they could risk coming out to... one wrong word and they are ousted and outed.

Originally posted by SWG:
There are also lots of cases of girls getting molested.

I haven't heard about those. I was under the impression that all the cases brought forward were by males. I haven't read much so did I just miss it?

Zimphire · Feb 25, 2005, 10:06 AM

Originally posted by Xeo:
No other men they could risk coming out to... one wrong word and they are ousted and outed.

You know if all these other priests are gay as SWF claims, and they also want such affection as he claims, It shouldn't be too difficult. Right? Right.

Xeo · Feb 25, 2005, 10:31 AM

Originally posted by Zimphire:
You know if all these other priests are gay as SWF claims, and they also want such affection as he claims, It shouldn't be too difficult. Right? Right.

Theoretically, but even if 90% of all priests are gays, there is still a 10% chance of getting the wrong priest. Would you risk ruining your life if you only had 9:1 odds?

Then again, maybe we are both right. The ones out molesting are the ones that didn't want to risk talking to adults, and the others (that can't stay abstinent) are just doing each other. After all, it wouldn't be public knowledge if that was going on.

Severed Hand of Skywalker · Feb 25, 2005, 01:33 PM

Originally posted by Xeo:

I haven't heard about those. I was under the impression that all the cases brought forward were by males. I haven't read much so did I just miss it?

Yep:
http://archives.cnn.com/2002/LAW/04/...sex/index.html

It does happen. Not as much as girls don't usually work as closely with them.

undotwa · Feb 25, 2005, 10:03 PM

Originally posted by Xeo:
I think what SWG was trying to say is simply that these men, assuming they are gay, have feelings towards other men and cannot ever act on them. So they snap and finally start using their power to get sexual gratification. Not "just because they were gay" but because they are gay and have never been able to act on it... they couldn't take the pressure anymore.

This is the problem with our society. We assume we need sex to survive or to live happy lives. Why can't someone live celibate? If someone needs sex to be happy or survive, I think something's wrong with him.

BRussell · Feb 25, 2005, 10:24 PM

Originally posted by undotwa:
This is the problem with our society. We assume we need sex to survive or to live happy lives. Why can't someone live celibate? If someone needs sex to be happy or survive, I think something's wrong with him.

Sure, people can do it, but it's really really hard. Sex is a pretty basic human motivation, up there with hunger and companionship and the like. I think it's denying human nature.

Severed Hand of Skywalker · Mar 1, 2005, 03:38 PM

10,667 allegations involving sexual abuse of minors by Catholic priests and bishops between 1950 and 2004, according to an analysis by the John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York

budster101 · Mar 1, 2005, 04:13 PM

Originally posted by Severed Hand of Skywalker:
10,667 allegations involving sexual abuse of minors by Catholic priests and bishops between 1950 and 2004, according to an analysis by the John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York

*allegations*

How many "allegations" are there of anything? Since 1950...

You suck.

Severed Hand of Skywalker · Mar 1, 2005, 05:24 PM

Originally posted by budster101:
*allegations*

How many "allegations" are there of anything? Since 1950...

You suck.

Ya great argument. You sound like you want to brush it off just as the church as been doing cuz the truth scares that crap out of you