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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Notebooks > MacBook Pro [Macworld Official Thread]

MacBook Pro [Macworld Official Thread] (Page 5)
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gulmatan
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Jan 11, 2006, 04:46 AM
 
Hi all,

First off, WHY an Intel gimmick (yes, gimmick)? What's wrong with the G4 platform? Secondly, wasn't one of Apple's goals to produce a sub-$1,000 PowerBook? How is this thing going to lead to that and what's the point since the G3/G4 series already runs OS/X?
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freudling
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Jan 11, 2006, 04:58 AM
 
     
uicandrew
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Jan 11, 2006, 04:59 AM
 
Originally Posted by Targon
A question id like to know. Anyone who does actually travel, will know exactly how precious space is in laptop bags. Most of us don't simply have room for extra USB devices such as Modems, DVI/S-Video adapters of various kinds. I mean its bad enough as it is with the Powerbooks not having enough USB ports and forcing us to lug around USB hubs with powerpacks needed for application protection USB dongles. Not to mention the PITA it is at airport terminals when they demand you removed everything from your laptop bag.
it depends on what kind of case you have. some cases (like marware or waterfield) are essentially sleeves with a shoulder strap. those don't have any space and do not offer much protection.

other cases (like targus) have many pockets and pouches.

traveling with a laptop (pc, until my macbook comes) includes ac adapter, flash drive, small mouse, retractable ethernet cord (with adapters to turn the jacks into regular phone jacks). A small modem adapter is negligible.

in terms of airports, a good tip is to put things in big clear ziplock bags so they can see what is inside.

Besides, if you have so many usb peripherals where you need to bring a POWERED usb hub, then you must have room for another dongle.

I personally use the sumdex neo metro II (i highly recommend it). it is slightly padded and it fits my 1.3" thick 15.4" widescreen laptop, and it still holds a folder or 2 inside.

i have used it as a makeshift briefcase at times.

Icruise, i guess "tame" depends on an individual's perspective. there are trollers who love to see mayhem and arguments, and there are those who prefer posts to be fact-based, and there is everyone in between.

(slightly off topic, but there is this news story on msnbc.com where a bill was recently passed that make it a federal offense to "annoy" someone else online anoymously)
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Daniel Bayer
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Jan 11, 2006, 04:59 AM
 
Originally Posted by Trygve
Funny. Cambodia is one of the few places overseas where I was able to hook up with Ethernet. Golden Gate Hotel, Phonm Penh, $1/hr. In Laos I'd be up the creek without a modem.
That's Phenom Penh, not the Northern border. I *was* up the creek w/ out a spare modem. That is one thing I wished I had an extra device of at the time. This little USB device is really small. The modem part is only twice the length of a the plug proper. When I am doing the airport boogie, I put all those little devices in a zip lock until I am clear of authorities.

Nothing is perfect.

The front side bus speed, ATA drive interface, V-Ram, processor speed, new battery technology, and screen brightness make this a HUGE upgrade.

Please, voice what YOU need, but don't assume a person is less than you or lame if they don't need the same things.

For me and many on here, the benefits strongly outweigh the losses of some features.

I can't wait to fly native Photoshop CS on this thing!!

100GB 7,200 RPM, already a proven MAJOR leap in perfomance in my current machine.
2GB ram at 667 front side bus.
256mb of video ram, aperature and Adobe Bridge might actually run as designed.
A brand new processor that is low power.

Let the early adopting begin, I NEVER mind bieng one...
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Bruck
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Jan 11, 2006, 05:29 AM
 
I have to stand up for the word pro here and myself. The gorgeous idea of a powerbook, was that it was a portalbe laptop version of a powermac when it came out. i hate losing fw800 i use it daily and anyoen who had ever used it compared to fw knowns ITS SO MUCH BETTER!!!!!

also,

what is the deal with not talking about battery life or fixing airport reception problems.

I hate that we might have to wait for another form factor in a year or maybe two years to solve these problems now that steve has decided not to redesign the case. OH AND no 8x SD???? They exist, put them in the freakin' machine, ill give you back the extra thickness for it!!!
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supernature
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Jan 11, 2006, 06:05 AM
 
Express Card, the eventual replacement for high speed data transfer instead of having a locked in FW800 port. I'm assuming FW400 is still on there, b/c what good is iMovie if you can't transfer video easily.

No modem - not that important to have it built-in. Buy one if you need one.

It is the MacBook Pro for people who want the speed, but there's a catch. Not enough native software to realize the speed. So, what does Apple do? They only make one model to appease the god of laptops, or perhaps, to give consumers another choice or give them the taste of the beginning of what's down the road. I don't see a flock or herd of people running down to get this new laptop, and I don't think Apple expects a slew of PowerBook users to jump the gun this soon when there's barely enough native Apps out ther for the "Pro" users. It's obviously aimed at the wanna be "Pro" users, like myself, who just want a faster computer to use everyday, despite that I'll be using FCP, Photoshop, etc occasionally.

Am I going to buy one? No. Give me money, and I certainly will though. Any of you can kindly contribute to the "supernature's need of a new and faster laptop fund" All proceeds will go toward buying this new laptop and any peripherals that I may need.
     
shunt
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Jan 11, 2006, 06:15 AM
 
Originally Posted by bondsteel
I placed my order ...... within 2 minutes of the Apple Store reopening, and I can't wait. The rest of you can continue to bitch...

It's kind of interesting how people who ordered one also tend to mention a bravado-ish reference to how quickly they placed their order. I've seen it referenced in different AMBPPTU too, from minutes after announced (MAA), to minutes after store opened (MASO) and others--it's damn funny.

This is not a dig, it's just an observation.


*AMBPPTU-Apple MacBook Pro Preorder Time Units
( Last edited by shunt; Jan 11, 2006 at 06:24 AM. )
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G. I.
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Jan 11, 2006, 06:33 AM
 
So it's 4-5x faster than a G4 PB?

, if it's true (must be, Stevie boy's always right ), it means that a current simple Centrino laptop is about 2x faster than the G4 PowerBook? LOL and that's what they sold for 2000-2500USD until yesterday?
     
inkhead
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Jan 11, 2006, 06:36 AM
 
wait a minute? You don't have room for a small usb modem in your laptop bag with 500 pockets, but you do have room for ENOUGH accessories that you require a usb hub? I think the modem is stupid, I don't want one on my computer. I'd never carry it with me. And on the one business trip where I know their won't be any wireless broadband (which is absolutely nowhere) i don't mind putting a 3inch weightless cable in my bag.

Stop bitching, you are in the minority of users who actually still use a modem. Abviously you don't travel very light because you find it important enought to take along a bunch of accessories, and usb hubs.


Originally Posted by Targon
A question id like to know. Anyone who does actually travel, will know exactly how precious space is in laptop bags. Most of us don't simply have room for extra USB devices such as Modems, DVI/S-Video adapters of various kinds. I mean its bad enough as it is with the Powerbooks not having enough USB ports and forcing us to lug around USB hubs with powerpacks needed for application protection USB dongles. Not to mention the PITA it is at airport terminals when they demand you removed everything from your laptop bag.
     
icruise
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Jan 11, 2006, 06:37 AM
 
Originally Posted by gulmatan
Hi all,

First off, WHY an Intel gimmick (yes, gimmick)? What's wrong with the G4 platform?
Here's a hint: the new MacBook is up to 4x as fast as the old PowerBooks. That makes it a gimmick? Even if we only realize a 2x speed increase that is huge compared to what we've been have with each new G4 model. It would go from something like 1.5Ghz to 1.67Ghz. That difference in speed is barely noticeable at all. The G4 was great in the past, but it just wasn't working out compared to what was available on the Windows side.

Secondly, wasn't one of Apple's goals to produce a sub-$1,000 PowerBook? How is this thing going to lead to that and what's the point since the G3/G4 series already runs OS/X?
Why would you think this is one of their goals? Their goal is to make money, and PowerBooks (or MacBooks) are supposed to be high margin, high performance machines. They may have had the goal to make a sub $1000 portable (not PowerBook), in which case they have already achieved it long ago with the bottom-of-the-line iBook.
     
inkhead
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Jan 11, 2006, 06:39 AM
 
1) battery life on the machine when i pulled out the power cable said 5 hours 29 minutes at the expo. Which is good, because similar windows machines claim 6+ hours with these chips, so it's right about on the money.

Airport reception is much better in these models, they use the Intel Wireless Pro chipset which is much better with power consumption and all around better than the crappy broadcom card that sat inside the powerbooks. The antenna design is good, and reception appeared to be excellent.

Stop bitching about stuff you haven't even seen yet!


Originally Posted by Bruck
I have to stand up for the word pro here and myself. The gorgeous idea of a powerbook, was that it was a portalbe laptop version of a powermac when it came out. i hate losing fw800 i use it daily and anyoen who had ever used it compared to fw knowns ITS SO MUCH BETTER!!!!!

also,

what is the deal with not talking about battery life or fixing airport reception problems.

I hate that we might have to wait for another form factor in a year or maybe two years to solve these problems now that steve has decided not to redesign the case. OH AND no 8x SD???? They exist, put them in the freakin' machine, ill give you back the extra thickness for it!!!
     
Gee4orce
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Jan 11, 2006, 06:54 AM
 
linkhead - well said, please post more of your impressions.

The rest of you - jeez - you never fail to amaze me. My guess is that most of the people posting here are just fanboys who's mom and dad pay for their computers. For those of us who actually buy them with our own money, the MacBook Pro is a great machine. It's just what we've been asking for, and it's SIX MONTHS early. Seriously, you have no idea how hard it is to engineer a product and get it to market, and to do it so quickly is astounding.

As for the form factor - what exactly are you guys wanting ? The Powerbook has the best form factor of any laptop - or prove me wrong. I love the drop-hinge screen, and the ports on the side (where you can actually see them). Nothing comes close. It's a process of evolution, and over time you evolve closer and closer to the ideal design. Apple are clearly very close. Don't forget that it was Apple who first put the trackball - as it was at the time - in front of the keyboard, and set the keyboard back to provide you with a wrist rest. Every other laptop follow the same basic layout these days.

As for the name - it'll grow on you. I didn't care for iPod when I first heard it, now it's entered the English language ! Powerbook was never really that great a name - seriously. Where's the association with Macs or apple in that name ? Clearly a 'MacBook' is a Mac that's shaped like a book. Maybe the name hints at other future products too: MacDesk, MacTablet ?

Anyway, my MacBook is ordered. It's GOT to be a big improvement over my 3 year old 800 MHz 12" Powerbook !!!!!
     
inkhead
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Jan 11, 2006, 07:06 AM
 
So all macbook pros aren't available until febuary huh.. I thought the lower models were. I have a new powerbook (3 months old) that I guess is gonna go up on ebay :-)
     
John123
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Jan 11, 2006, 07:22 AM
 
Originally Posted by inkhead
wait a minute? You don't have room for a small usb modem in your laptop bag with 500 pockets, but you do have room for ENOUGH accessories that you require a usb hub? I think the modem is stupid, I don't want one on my computer. I'd never carry it with me. And on the one business trip where I know their won't be any wireless broadband (which is absolutely nowhere) i don't mind putting a 3inch weightless cable in my bag.

Stop bitching, you are in the minority of users who actually still use a modem. Abviously you don't travel very light because you find it important enought to take along a bunch of accessories, and usb hubs.
This was an excellent post. I enjoyed how you caught the inherently contradictory logic. Well done.
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Ambassadeur
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Jan 11, 2006, 07:54 AM
 
Apart from the real problems (aka name, modem, and FW800), what's really up with the yet to be announced battery life of the new macbooks? Someone mentioned 8hrs, someone 5-6hrs when the plug is pulled. Would that be under full working condition (brightness up, programs and harddisk running)?

Plus, I read that the processor used is not (!) the low energy version of the core processor and is the same as in the new iMac (posted on german newssite macnews.de ). So, much brighter display, faster (relatively more) power-hungry processor, faster graphics, slimmer design: What about heat and fans, noise levels and stuff. Any experiences from the show floor?

The new 'book is a lot what everyone hoped for, but still there are a few things to be clarified and real world tests to be done before any real judgements are possible. I am pretty positive on it being a good notebook, albeit it seems to be just the avantgarde for the new generation of intel-based notebooks: only one screen size, old product range still fully available, no price drops there, some pro features missing, some compromises that seem a little out of place (e.g. DVD drive: they had to use a slimmer one and thus drop some features to fit it in the enclosure).

But eventually Apple will present a product line up of intel Macs (as stated around the end of the year) that will offer something for everyone and please most of our needs. And the notion that there'll only be one notebook line seems a little awkward, given the gap this would open up in the low-end (i.e. iBook) segment. I guess we'll see some close to 1000$ MacBook Basic or whatever (let the guessing begin) as well in the final lineup.

That said, I'm really looking forward to seeing one of the new MacBooks in action and to get a real-world feeling for its capabilities! Cheers to the act Apple pulled of with the two new intel-based products in this short time! Now let them proof themselves...
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one09jason
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Jan 11, 2006, 08:45 AM
 
Originally Posted by production_coordinator
FW800: No big deal considering there are very few pieces of hardware with this floating around. Also, few pieces of hardware could saturate firewire 400.

I use firewire 800 all the time. Ever try video editing with external disks, FW400 vs FW800? There's a very good reason for FW800.
     
one09jason
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Jan 11, 2006, 08:46 AM
 
Originally Posted by production_coordinator
FW800: No big deal considering there are very few pieces of hardware with this floating around. Also, few pieces of hardware could saturate firewire 400.

I use firewire 800 all the time. Ever try video editing with external disks, FW400 vs FW800? There's a very good reason for FW800.
     
I WAS the One
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Jan 11, 2006, 09:05 AM
 
Originally Posted by SirCastor
I think Firewire is going to last a bit longer. The new iMac's got two of them.
The only thing I can say about this (besides it's REALLY cool) is: What's with the name? MacBook? That does not sell me. Other than that though, it's a pretty kick-ace machine.
Steve explain that very clearly, it was a move to erase the PowerPC-style-name and its a new marketing strategy, they will use the word "Mac" in front of avery product's name from now on....

but let me tell you that I was praying for another name instead of "Mac-tel" I hate that name and almost everybody was using it since all rumors begun. For that matter I like Mac Book better. Anyway MacBook Pro sounds like a new generation Macs kind of name.
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inkhead
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Jan 11, 2006, 09:29 AM
 
Let me take a wild guess, you sir have a LaCie drive and have been suckered into believing that the firewire 800 is what makes it faster.

1) The actually hard drive inside those cases is much, much slower than firewire 800 or even firewire 400 maxium.

2) the reason it seems better with firewire 800, and not 400 is that LaCie uses the worst firewire chipsets available on earth. If you got an external case with good firewire chipsets you would see no difference in the firewire 400

3) Apple can confirm this, you think the hundreds of engineers working day and night on this powerbook, accidentially? forgot about firewire 800? Of course not, they weight every detail

Firewire 800 drives are just a crock of crap... And if you need 800 to get the performance then i can tell you that the drive and company that you are using are using crappy chipsets. I high quality (mostly everyone except lacie) 400 chipset will more than fullfill your needs, you've just been sucked into the marked up crappy slow hard drive, shoved into a firewire 800 case, with a cheepo chipset, put inside a "sexy" case, and then told that its' the porsch gold standard for video editing.


Originally Posted by one09jason
I use firewire 800 all the time. Ever try video editing with external disks, FW400 vs FW800? There's a very good reason for FW800.
     
fisherKing
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Jan 11, 2006, 09:31 AM
 
funny...as if, by coming up with a "better" name on this forum, we could change the world (or just apple's name for the new laptop).

i'm gonna miss "powerbook", but am practicing "macbook pro" (shudder), as that's what we'll be talking about for the next few years or so... (probably much longer...)

we'll get used to it; then we can spend more time grumbling about (and praising) it's actual features....

time to rename this forum! (please mods, not a seperate one!)
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And that is what you all are: inverted Nothings...with potential" (Sun Ra)
     
one09jason
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Jan 11, 2006, 09:32 AM
 
Originally Posted by - - e r i k - -
Actually, for me, it was last decade's modem. I have seriously not used one since 1997 - and never on a laptop (got my first powerbook in 2001). And yes, I have been traveling with my laptops. Have you never heard of BT / GPRS or even cellphone's with built in browsers for the occasional WiFi outage?
And that's great for you. But I have to say, you probably don't travel to rural areas much. I always have this sneaking suspicion when I look at Apple laptops, that they designed the laptop that Steve Jobs wanted most for himself. I'm reminded of that again looking at the new MBP. What use does Steve Jobs have for a modem? Yep, none. So it's gone. I suspect that there is a slightly distorted perspective at Apple about what most people want because of this. I don't know the statistics of where people use their laptops most, but let me tell you for sure that WiFi and Cell phone data connections are urban-only things. Most of this country is still wide open spaces.
( Last edited by one09jason; Jan 11, 2006 at 09:58 AM. )
     
Gee4orce
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Jan 11, 2006, 09:43 AM
 
However, the vast, VAST majority of the US population lives in urban areas. And then there's the rest of the world. Remember that ? A funny place called Europe for instance, where we have good cellphone coverage everywhere and decent cellphones ! We don't need no stinking modem - if you do, then you can buy the apple accessory that's about the size of an iPod shuffle.
     
Voch
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Jan 11, 2006, 09:52 AM
 
Personally, I think this new model is very exciting, but is not necessarily the model to replace my trusty TiBook juuuuust yet (I'm reluctant to blow $2000 right now...$1500 is more in my ballpark because I want to add lots 'o RAM). There's potential there for great future offerings, though...I'm thinkin' Core Duo 12"/13" (as long as it doesn't burn my leg).

This is just the beginning.

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one09jason
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Jan 11, 2006, 09:53 AM
 
Originally Posted by inkhead
Let me take a wild guess, you sir have a LaCie drive and have been suckered into believing that the firewire 800 is what makes it faster.
No, actually I use OWC Mercury Elite Pro FW800/400 hard drives / enclosures that use the Oxford911 chipset. I work with uncompressed digital video from specialized cameras, and I use dozens of these drives to store data from a single project. Working with the data on the drives directly, and copying portions of it to local drives proceeds much faster with FW800 than with FW400. Not twice as fast, but on the order of 60-70% faster in my experience. Makes a big difference in application performance.
     
Jay Random
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Jan 11, 2006, 10:07 AM
 
Originally Posted by one09jason
No, actually I use OWC Mercury Elite Pro FW800/400 hard drives / enclosures that use the Oxford911 chipset. I work with uncompressed digital video from specialized cameras, and I use dozens of these drives to store data from a single project. Working with the data on the drives directly, and copying portions of it to local drives proceeds much faster with FW800 than with FW400. Not twice as fast, but on the order of 60-70% faster in my experience. Makes a big difference in application performance.
If you're working with dozens of these drives, why are you using a laptop? That kind of storage array isn't exactly portable.
     
one09jason
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Jan 11, 2006, 10:15 AM
 
Originally Posted by Gee4orce
However, the vast, VAST majority of the US population lives in urban areas. And then there's the rest of the world. Remember that ? A funny place called Europe for instance, where we have good cellphone coverage everywhere and decent cellphones ! We don't need no stinking modem - if you do, then you can buy the apple accessory that's about the size of an iPod shuffle.
Well, that's true, but in some ways I guess that's not the point. I only ocassionally use the modem also. It's just that it was a nice piece of Apple design that a port or or acessory was built in and we didn't have to remember to bring it. I don't use the s-video much either, but it's nice to have. I never once thought to myself, "damn, this Powerbook is so heavy, I wish it didn't have a modem in it." Or, "I never use this modem, I wish I hadn't paid for it". It was nice to have it there when you needed it. I think people here are reacting to that. We are used to Apple giving it all to us in a nice package, unlike typical PCs that require carrying around lots of dongles, and wires and accessory cards. Also, I think the other thing that people are reacting to here is that the modem didn't dissappear because it was time for it to (like the floppy drive), but rather because of some other constraint (too expensive, not enough room in the case, etc.

BTW, I haven't been to Europe in the last two years, so maybe great GPRS connections can be had anywhere. But in my experience, GPRS connectins aren't any faster that a good modem connection anyway. And they're more expensive. Don't get me wrong, I'd love cheap available wireless internet everwhere on the globe, I just haven't seen it yet.
     
one09jason
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Jan 11, 2006, 10:26 AM
 
Originally Posted by Jay Random
If you're working with dozens of these drives, why are you using a laptop? That kind of storage array isn't exactly portable.

Because I capture the video and fill up those drives in places where you can't plug in a desktop computer. Anyway, I don't cary them all at one time, just 2-3 at a time. ANd FW800 also makes it possible to capture the data at the frame rates I need.
     
f1000
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Jan 11, 2006, 10:28 AM
 
Originally Posted by one09jason
BTW, I haven't been to Europe in the last two years, so maybe great GPRS connections can be had anywhere. But in my experience, GPRS connectins aren't any faster that a good modem connection anyway. And they're more expensive. Don't get me wrong, I'd love cheap available wireless internet everwhere on the globe, I just haven't seen it yet.
I've wanted Apple to ditch the internal modem for over a year. I use a Cingular EDGE phone and it greatly exceeds the performance of POT modems (at least 2x the speed of 56k). If you're still using GPRS, then you need to upgrade.

Cingular is going to introduce several UMTS/HSPDA phones in the next few months that'll make EDGE look pokey.

Do a search for "Cingular" and "tethering" in the Peripherals forum.
     
aman
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Jan 11, 2006, 10:36 AM
 
Does anyone else think that Intel had something to do with the name change?
     
f1000
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Jan 11, 2006, 11:54 AM
 
I posted the following a month ago,

Originally Posted by f1000
Interesting. I posted a thread on tethering to an EDGE modem some months ago, and one of the things I noted was that adjusting the sendspace and recvspace buffers made a significant difference in high-latency EDGE modem throughput.

Maybe this Tuner is being put out in anticipation of Mactel PowerBooks with built-in UMTS and/or HSPDA. HSPDA is supposed to have theoretical speeds of up to 14.4 Mbps. Cingular, coincidentally, is activating UMTS in over a dozen cities this month.

UMTS/HSPDA would make cellular teleconferencing using the built-in iSight possible. It'd also open up a new way to download iTunes media...maybe even provide a streaming alternative to satellite radio.
Fast forward to today and we see that Apple has:
  • provided this "Broadband Tuner" software
  • added iSight to the new MacBook Pro
  • removed the RJ-11 modem from the new MacBook Pro
I went too far in suggesting that Apple might build UMTS into their notebooks, which would have been a wholly unnecessary move. MacBook users can always add a PC Card modem or tether to a UMTS phone via Bluetooth instead.

A tantalizing possibility is that MacBooks will be the first laptops to incorporate Intel's WiMAX technology. That'll be a shot across the bow of both satellite and cellular radio.
( Last edited by f1000; Jan 11, 2006 at 02:02 PM. )
     
ort888
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Jan 11, 2006, 02:27 PM
 
Am I the only person who really dislikes the styling of these newer Apple laptops? I didn't like it before when they were G4s and I still don't like it. Something about the keyboard/speaker placement and color really throw me off. It just looks cheap.

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uicandrew
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Jan 11, 2006, 02:52 PM
 
ort888, well, given that the styling is exactly the same, i wouldn't expect you to like it the second time around.

if you want more flair, then alienware or colorware could be it.
people rave about the simplicity and clean look of the powerbook.

can you give an example/link to a laptop that you think looks good?
now i'm really curious to see what you have in mind.
Mac User since Summer 2005 (started with G4 mini bought from macnn forums!)
     
krove
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Jan 11, 2006, 03:36 PM
 
Originally Posted by uicandrew
it depends on what kind of case you have. some cases (like marware or waterfield) are essentially sleeves with a shoulder strap. those don't have any space and do not offer much protection.

other cases (like targus) have many pockets and pouches.small modem adapter is negligible.
Umm, I think most people buy a case for the laptop, not a laptop for a case.

Everyone who owns a laptop has at least one accessory: a power adaptor. The addition of a DVI to S-video adaptor (which exists and Apple sells) is miniscule in comparison. Even the USB modem offers little burden on top of the much-larger and already-in-tow power brick.

How did it come to this? Goodbye PowerPC. | sensory output
     
Karim
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Jan 11, 2006, 03:59 PM
 
Originally Posted by Ambassadeur
Apart from the real problems (aka name, modem, and FW800), what's really up with the yet to be announced battery life of the new macbooks? Someone mentioned 8hrs, someone 5-6hrs when the plug is pulled. Would that be under full working condition (brightness up, programs and harddisk running)?
....
When I pulled the plug on the MPB-1.83 it gave me an 8 hour time remaining. That was with screen brightness on full, no wireless options on, ethernet in use, and the processors idled sitting on the finder desktop. The videocard was also under little load. This isn't necessary very telling other than under the same circumstances on my 17" 1.67GHZ time remaining when plug is first pulled will be around 3:50. Now that ratio is around 2x but the screen sizes are different and a 17" I'm sure has more drain than a 15" screen.

I travel alot, and actually bring a rev 1 airport with me (that has the built in modem) when I do. That way I can still use a modem and I don't have to sit near the phone line to use it. This works equivalent to a built-in modem other than not being able to fax.

For faxing, I use an internet fax comany (efax) that has a nice OS X client that lets me send or receive faxes over any connection. It does cost ~ $10 a month though and charges per page sent but not received - (and gives you a dedicated fax line #) - Just for info purposes, I don't own or work for the company.

When I placed my order, I skipped the usb modem but may pick one up in the future.

I ordered a 1.83 with 2GB Ram and 120GB HD options. My current PB is a 1.67 17" with 1GB and 100GB drive.

The fact that the new one will be 3-4X faster with potentially 2x battery life has me sold.

Could you imagine if the new laptops were 30% faster (a typical model upgrade) same battery life but had all the ports+isight & ir, would there be more or less screaming?

The USB modem, to me, seems like an extension of the line cord you would have anyway. I would keep the two plugged in together in my bag wrapped up so it wouldn't seem like anything extra.

The fw800 should come out as an expresscard as would a scsi card so I think users will be ok there. But who knows how long... Especially for scsi...

The dvd burner is the only thing that "slightly" bothers me. But, I'm looking forward to HD-DVD or Blueray or HD-Blueray (if we're lucky) or whatever comes out for serious archiving. And it is obviously going to be external for the first generation of products.

I wish the 17" intel was coming out. I would have gotten it instead. It has been several years since I used 15" Ti-books but I used to admire the 12" powerbooks for their size when I would travel with my monster. I think in the future I would switch to the 17" when it has intel in a year or so, and maybe even and HD drive by then.

I'm looking forward to the 3-4x speed increase, 2x battery life (fingers crossed), isight camera built in and the potential to play some PC games at full or almost full speed.
     
mosespatrader
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Jan 11, 2006, 04:27 PM
 
I called my local Apple Store to find out when iLife 06 will be available. They finally got smart the automated system says "press 9" for availablity of Macworld products.

I was a little discouraged when I heard "The Macbook Pro will be available by the end of February." I was hoping for an early to mid February.
     
JoshKurtz
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Jan 11, 2006, 04:29 PM
 
I like the name. Call me weird but I don't see a problem with it. I thought that "PowerBook i" would be better but I understand why they want to get away from the Power name.
If I had the couple grand I'd get one. And the price, while high, isn't too far off some of the better pc manufacturers prices for some comparable notebooks. Check out Alienware or Voodoo's site and see what those guys are charging. It's pretty crazy but it make's the MacBook Pro's price point seem a little more palatable.
iMac 17" 2GHz Core2Duo | 1GB RAM | 160GB hdd | Superdrive | Tiger and XP Pro
     
Chuckit
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Jan 11, 2006, 04:32 PM
 
Early to mid-February is by the end of February.
Chuck
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"Instead of either 'multi-talented' or 'multitalented' use 'bisexual'."
     
kagebird
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Jan 11, 2006, 04:45 PM
 
I'm gonna be call'in mine the "Powerbook Pro".

Kage
     
mmintler
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Jan 11, 2006, 04:52 PM
 
This is not an upgrade! IMO this a Transitional "book" sigh..hate the name too!

I know people will buy this because it's the latest but not the greatest. Universal versions of major apps are at least 6 mo. to a year away. Everything you currently own is going to run slower- Not an upgrade.

I have always thought the "Powerbook" was a pro machine yet this MacBook Pro is not capable of running the current Photoshop as fast as my 2 year old G4 Alum.???? I don't know why a pro user would bother with this upgrade.

IMO they should have release the intel based ibook first- and when more pro apps are available then release the powerbook.

I actually think they made big mistake with this one.
Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-
Albert Einstein
     
krove
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Jan 11, 2006, 05:14 PM
 
Well, despite the petty moaning and b++ching by all the people who seem to always be waiting for the Next Big Thingâ„¢, I have placed my order for a new MacBook Pro.

Why? To get a decent computer with plenty of headroom in speed and power, a slick display, isight (which I use often), and front row. I took a look at my most-used applications, and just a few are not Universal binaries yet (Adobe apps). To put it simply: the need for an upgrade surpassed my threshold for waiting for the Next Great Thingâ„¢.[/b]

I'm upgrading from a four-year old iBook (600 MHz G3 with 640 MB RAM). This machine has served me well: it was meant as a temporary solution when I purchased it, but given how long it has been in use, that turned out to be wrong.

Now, I have always held a special place in my heart for that "perfect" Mac: the one with all the right speed, hardware configuration and price. Let me tell you something. In the 15+ years I have owned and used Macs, such a machine has never existed. For most of us who cannot spend $4500 on the top of the line, "dream" configuration every few years, we must make do with what Apple delivers. Did you hear Steve say "Oh, and one more thing...?" I sure did, and what came next no one was expecting.

Sure, Blu-Ray, FW 800, modem, higher-res, longer battery life would satisfy, but at what cost (and weight)? The loss of FW 800 is a bit of a disappointment, but probably for less than 10% of PowerBook and now MacBook Pro users. If you need the speed, you should probably have a G5 tower with SATA arrays anyway. For the small segment of users that require FW 800, an express card is sure to be made available. The same logic applies to the modem. Who knows, maybe Apple was designing the motherboard, and it came down to : built-in iSight or modem?

For the few "minor" disadvantages the MBP has (minor resolution difference, lack of a $50 modem, no FW 800), the advantages are far greater (huge speed increase, greatly increased FSB, PCI express graphics and expansion slot, brighter display, built-in iSight, Front Row/remote, and MagSafe power connector, all of which were not present on the last generation of PowerBooks). I was sold. So long iBook; hello, MacBook Pro!



I do have a pertinent question however: Does it support FireWire / Target Disk Mode (holding T during booting)?

How did it come to this? Goodbye PowerPC. | sensory output
     
stuepfnick
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Jan 11, 2006, 05:18 PM
 
Originally Posted by JoshuaZ
Yeah, I`m looking to upgrade my 12in 1.33 Pbook within a year and a half, and was really wanting the release of of the new intelbook to be a bit better.

As much as I can agree with almost everything Apple did, the whole DVD thing is just really annoying. I mean my 12in has a 4x DVD-R drive.

Though the addition of the iSight caught me way off guard. That would be really cool to have, as I do travel a lot and having an iSight has let me stay in contact with my family with a bit more ease then some of my friends over here.
Oh please, what's the problem with a 4x Superdrive? I can't image a single problem... if it's really to slow (14 instead of 9 minutes for burning a DVD...)

The BIG problem is the lack of FW800. So there is NO WAY to connect a decent harddrive for Audio or Video-Professionals! That's really very hard! So the whole thing is not really a ProBook... sadly.

The next HUGE problem is the Adobe Creative Suite. The Universal Binary version won't be out before the end of the year, and in Rosetta you can expect it to run about in half the speed of the last Powerbook revision (1.67 Ghz).
The next thing is, that this release will be CS3, so you need to pay the full price to get native Intel-Performance.

So if you rely on professional work with Adobe apps (and others), I would suggest that you better buy a 1.92 Ghz G4 Upgrade for your old Powerbook. Then you can use Photoshop at least twice as fast, for about a year.
Then, if you have an IntelBook and money for CS3 it will be surely about twice as fast, as on a G4-book.

For information: The 1.92 Ghz G4 runs cooler and needs much less power, then the 1.25 Ghz G4, that it upgrades. So longer battery-life and a decent speed bump. And another advantage is that you can continue to use fast Harddrives or Raids (FW800).

If you are a iLife, Safari, Mail and maybe Office user, or don't need speed for professional apps within this year, just go with the MacBook Pro!
greetings,
Stefan
     
Karim
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Jan 11, 2006, 05:23 PM
 
Here is a little info that may be helpful to the "performance minded".

Several months ago, people were getting Mac OS X develper release working on their intel based PC's. Some people got it working on desktops and some on laptops.

I decided on a little experiment:

I purchased a Fujitsu tabletpc T4010. It is a Centrino-based notebook with a 1.6GHz Intel Dothan M725 processor. I put in 1GB of ram.

I was able to check out OS X running on it and I have to tell you it was extremely fast, I was very surprised. The macbench score was within a few points of my 1.67GHZ 17" powerbook.

Running non-native PPC software on it through rosetta was very fast, and yes Photoshop is slower but to a non-photoshop guru it feels absolutely fine to me for occasional tasks. All my other non-native software that I use regularly: Office, timbuktu, iApps, quicken and a bunch of obscure others worked just fine and the speed penalty was not or hardly noticeable by me. (A little about me - first computer a 8K Pet in 1977, an Apple ][ in 1979, then various Apple ][ variants up to the Mac in 1984 and then Mac II's, Powerbook 170's, 5300's, Powermac G3's, G4's and then Tibooks and Al books) So I think I can tell speed from one model to the next.

Because of my experience with the Fujitsu I'm not worried that a dual-core intel processor is going to smoke the Fujitsu and therefore it is certainly going to be a-ok with rosetta on the MBP 1.83ghz!

If I'm one of the first to receive my MBP (quoted ship data is 2/15/06) I will be sure to post a review.
     
stuepfnick
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Jan 11, 2006, 05:23 PM
 
Originally Posted by krove
I'm upgrading from a four-year old iBook (600 MHz G3 with 640 MB RAM). This machine has served me well: it was meant as a temporary solution when I purchased it, but given how long it has been in use, that turned out to be wrong.
Ok, when upgrading from a 600 Mhz G3, even the Adobe Apps in Rosetta won't be slower than now. But don't expect them to (much) be faster! btw: Adobe CS3 comes end of 2006, it will be the first Intel-compatible version and you have to buy it, of course, to get native speed.

Also it is joke to say FW800 is not really needed. It is the only way to get a fast hardrive or even a Raid connected to the Notebooks. A MacBook Pro without an option for a fast HD makes the new IntelBooks obsolete for Pro-customers who do video or audio editing.
greetings,
Stefan
     
shabbasuraj
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Jan 11, 2006, 05:25 PM
 
not what the people wanted
blabba5555555555555555555555555555555555555
     
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Jan 11, 2006, 05:27 PM
 
the name still sucks
     
BlackJade
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Jan 11, 2006, 05:34 PM
 
Name works for me but will take a bit to get use to.
But is it a pre-cursor to things to come instead of "Pro" is there going to be a "light" or "home" or "i" to distinguish models.

I am not fond of a built in iSight.. I personally do see the need. But it won't keep me from buying one.

But now the real question have they changed the start up chime to distinguish the intel inside?
     
krove
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Jan 11, 2006, 05:34 PM
 
In answer to my own question, "Does it support Firewire Target Mode?"

Yes, it does:
http://arstechnica.com/journals/appl...2006/1/11/2458

How did it come to this? Goodbye PowerPC. | sensory output
     
shunt
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Jan 11, 2006, 05:41 PM
 
Wow, the Axe came down....5 threads locked.
Please keep in mind the ambiguously selective general understandings we've all agreed upon...
     
jersey
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Jan 11, 2006, 06:23 PM
 
Does anyone know how much this thing costs with ADC discount? I dont have an ADC membership, but might pick one up for the discount.
     
SkiBikeSki
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Jan 11, 2006, 06:46 PM
 
I agree with everyone else that the new name is pretty poor. I suppose there aren't much better alternatives though. When I get one, I'm just gonna keep calling it a PowerBook. Did anyone really ever say "PowerBook G4" in conversation, or did you just say "PowerBook" and every still knew exactly what you meant. I think people will still know what I mean.

I'm dissappointed with the small change in screen resolution, but then again a 6% change isn't going to kill anyone. The loss of FireWire 800 is also dissappointing, but I won't lose sleep over it. The loss of S-Video is the only thing that really concerns me. I would like to hook it up to my TV, a Sony Vega it's SD but it's good, any watch movies with Front Row, or put on iTunes visualizations, etc... My friend hooks his 12" iBook up to his TV and gives slideshows, but with a bright 15" screen I guess I don't need to do that. It's been mentioned that Apple sells a DVI to S-Video adapter, but that only works with the G5 and Mac Mini. It's doesn't actually do any adapting or converting of the signal. Instead it merely gives you ports to access the S-Video and Video signals the card is already generating. I hope there is some fix for this soon. It's likely up to the 3rd Party community to make some kind of converter that doesn't cost a fortune. I remember years ago my QuickSilver G4 didn't have a microphone port, so I got the iMic and it's been great ever since. I wish there will be something that elegant in the future for S-Video.

All the other features of the new PowerBook are great. 1.83GHz is awesome. Yes 2.13 would be better but I don't want a huge desktop replacement laptop, and want a sleek PowerBook. 1GB of DDR667 is amazing. That's the fastest laptop RAM ever, and there's a gig of it! The Radeon X1600 is so unexpected. I was hoping there would at least be a 6600 Go, something pretty good from the previous generation. But to have something pretty good from this generation is even better. And it supports pixel shader 3.0, so it'll support some cool CoreImage features in the future.

I do have one thing about the PowerBook that I can't quite figure out myself: Should I get AppleCare when I buy it? I'm buying it through MacMall since they're offering a free 1GB of RAM, thus maxing it out. From them AppleCare is only $250, which is a bit more than the cost of fixing something myself. I've replaced RAM, Airport Cards, HDD,CD/DVD Drives in iBooks and PowerBooks before, and replacing any 1 of those would be cheaper than AppleCare. Then again if 2 were to go bad then I'd better off with AppleCare. And what about the new Intel motherboard that's powering this beast. What are the odds that something will be wrong with that in this first rev? Is anyone else getting AppleCare with theirs simply because of the fact that its the first Intel based Mac laptop?
-- SBS --
     
 
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