[Eug]

How the British (and the rest of the world?) regard Canada?



Regret the Error� The Guardian is confused about what the Canadian flag looks like

[Doofy]

What's a "Canada"?

[Eug]

The name Canada comes from the St. Lawrence Iroquoian word kanata, meaning "village" or "settlement". In 1535, indigenous inhabitants of the present-day Quebec City region used the word to direct French explorer Jacques Cartier to the village of Stadacona. Cartier later used the word Canada to refer not only to that particular village, but also the entire area subject to Donnacona (the chief at Stadacona); by 1545, European books and maps had begun referring to this region as Canada.

In the 17th and early 18th centuries, "Canada" referred to the part of New France that lay along the Saint Lawrence River and the northern shores of the Great Lakes. The area was later split into two British colonies, Upper Canada and Lower Canada. They were re-unified as the Province of Canada in 1841. Upon Confederation in 1867, Canada was adopted as the legal name for the new country, and the word Dominion was conferred as the country's title. However, as Canada asserted its political autonomy from the United Kingdom, the federal government increasingly used simply Canada on state documents and treaties, a change that was reflected in the renaming of the national holiday from Dominion Day to Canada Day in 1982.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

What's a "Canada"?

In case you didn't get it Eug, that was shorthand for "Britons don't tend to think of Canuckistan much at all". ...And if they do, it's usually all "mounties running around buggering each other before settling down to an evening of buggery whilst watching Kids In The Hall before retiring to bed for a bit of buggery".

[Spheric Harlot]

I dunno about Britain, but in mainland Europe, Canada is generally regarded as a less insane version of the United States.

[Waragainstsleep]

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot 

I dunno about Britain, but in mainland Europe, Canada is generally regarded as a less insane version of the United States.

Less insane and more polite.

[ghporter]

My wife first visited Canada on a drive up to Windsor from Detroit. She noted "it looks just like Detroit, only a lot cleaner." Which was very accurate, considering that this was 1980 and the part of Detroit that leads to the bridge was pretty ugly looking at the time. She then noticed all the little maple leaves on everything, followed by the signs in French and English. On the way back, she also mentioned "everybody was extremely polite, weren't they..."

This past spring, we visited Windsor again, this time with our son (his first time in Canada), and the biggest difference was the very polite Canadian Customs officer (by his accent he must have been from much farther west) who went through all the appropriate customs questions with us. My son seemed a trifle disappointed, as Canada seemed extremely similar to the US to him. I reminded him that Vancouver is frequently used as "generic large US city" locations for TV and movies, and he was a bit mollified by that.

A sometime coworker from Canada reminded me that Windsor is often considered "the armpit of Canada," with perhaps some part of that being because it's so very close to Detroit and so involved in shipping through the Great Lakes. Maybe that's a common sentiment, but it was still nice to visit and be reminded that, on a personal level, our similarities vastly outnumber our differences.

[lpkmckenna]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

In case you didn't get it Eug, that was shorthand for "Britons don't tend to think of Canuckistan much at all". ...And if they do, it's usually all "mounties running around buggering each other before settling down to an evening of buggery whilst watching Kids In The Hall before retiring to bed for a bit of buggery".

A guy from Britain is making fun of buggery in other countries?

[iM@k]

*Insert Monty Pyhton's "I'm a lumberjack" skit here*

[Doc Juansinn]

Hmmm.... where are all these "polite" Canadians? In my encounters here in the Vancouver area (the suburbs really), I see no better than a 50/50 polite to rude ratio, which is perhaps slightly worse than what I experienced while living in the San Francisco area, and much worse than what I experienced living in Germany (although that is a somewhat different form of politeness). I can understand how visitors would form one opinion, but living someplace allows one to see what's really there.

I keep my other passports well hidden behind my Canadian one because I don't what people to relate to me as a foreigner. Whew! The amount of insulting comments about the US and its people become just a tad too much. Interestingly. those who travel to the US frequently (for more than just shopping) have a much more positive view of their southern neighbours.

Oh, just a tip for anyone wishing to get into Canada without a sponsor; get some type of medical degree or lab technician certification. Apparently the folks who get degrees here head to the US. Canada is bringing over doctors from the UK, Australia (my personal favourite), South Africa, Iran, Pakistan, Bulgaria, Ukraine, and other lands too numerous to mention. No racism, just reality.

Oh, and this business about Canada having no crime? Well, it ain't true, Jethro. If you don't believe me just ask Mirjam Ott.

Let's see... where shall I go next year? Oh, Canada? Umm no. Oh say can you see...? Soon but not quite yet. Deutschland, Deutschland über alles...? Yeah, that's the ticket. I'll call up BoFrost and have a week's supply of Röstipfanne brought over and burn some of it off walking through my old neighbourhood.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

In case you didn't get it Eug, that was shorthand for "Britons don't tend to think of Canuckistan much at all".

You don't say?

Originally Posted by iM@k 

*Insert Monty Pyhton's "I'm a lumberjack" skit here*

Lumberjack Song - Monty Python - YouTube

You're welcome.

[Athens]

The updated article with the right flag. I think he has some good points.
Canada's multiculturalism is no model for Europe | Kenan Malik | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk

[Athens]

Originally Posted by Spheric Harlot 

I dunno about Britain, but in mainland Europe, Canada is generally regarded as a less insane version of the United States.

I've always considered Canada as a nice in between of the US and Europe. Our economy and markets are more American while our attitudes and social systems are more European. I've always thought of us as a good balance between American capitalism and Europe's socialism. Not extreme in either direction and more balanced overall.

[The Final Dakar]

Originally Posted by Athens 

I've always considered Canada as a nice in between of the US and Europe. Our economy and markets are more American while our attitudes and social systems are more European. I've always thought of us as a good balance between American capitalism and Europe's socialism. Not extreme in either direction and more balanced overall.

And your penance for that is having Quebec.

[Athens]

Originally Posted by Dr. Wahnsinn 

Hmmm.... where are all these "polite" Canadians? In my encounters here in the Vancouver area (the suburbs really), I see no better than a 50/50 polite to rude ratio, which is perhaps slightly worse than what I experienced while living in the San Francisco area, and much worse than what I experienced living in Germany (although that is a somewhat different form of politeness). I can understand how visitors would form one opinion, but living someplace allows one to see what's really there.

Heh I like the ratio, the 50/50 polite to rude ratio. Vancouver and Metro Vancouver is 65% immigrant population. You are experience first hand some of what I have bitched about in other threads. I can tell you the makeup of Vancouver has changed drastically in my life. When I was a kid and early teen the city was much more polite overall. Once the flood gates opened and Vancouver was put on the International map from Expo 86, its progressively become more hostile, dirtier, and expensive. When compared to other Canadian cities Vancouver is the least polite these days. But internationally from most people I know who have visited many places around the globe its still pretty good.

As a port city Vancouver is also ground zero for much of the illegal drug trade, so property crime has always been highest in Vancouver compared to the rest of Canada. And with the drug trade comes the gangs. And to add to the gang troubles is the Asian gangs which took root here in the last decade are competing with the established gangs and themselves. So violence is some what higher then most other parts of Canada but its mostly criminals killing criminals. It hasn't affected the general population much. If you take out the gang related murders Vancouver has a extremely low murder rate. Winnipeg and Edmonton have far higher murder rates.

Rapid growth, international investments, uncontrolled immigration over a very short period has caused a lot of social strain on a constricted region. Roads are beyond capacity, bridges are beyond capacity, water systems are not keeping up, hospitals, schools are beyond capacity and cost of living has been and will continue to sky rocket which makes for some grumpy people. If you want a good taste of Canadian go do a trip to Victoria or the bc interior like Kelowna or Kamloops, they represent the country more.

[Athens]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

And your penance for that is having Quebec.

Huh?

[Leonard]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

And your penance for that is having Quebec.

Actually Quebecers (those Canadians who aren't Canadians) are a nice bunch, if they didn't want out of Canada every 20 years. Ho well, that's what we get for letting them stay when we conquered them.

[ShortcutToMoncton]

Originally Posted by The Final Dakar 

And your penance for that is having Quebec.

True story: Quebec is one of the coolest places to visit in all of North America. Seriously.

Originally Posted by Leonard 

Actually Quebecers (those Canadians who aren't Canadians) are a nice bunch, if they didn't want out of Canada every 20 years. Ho well, that's what we get for letting them stay when we conquered them.

You mean "when we conquered them and France suddenly didn't want them back and we suddenly and unexpectedly had to keep them."

[Athens]

Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton 

True story: Quebec is one of the coolest places to visit in all of North America. Seriously.

You mean "when we conquered them and France suddenly didn't want them back and we suddenly and unexpectedly had to keep them."

Until you have to work with them, they have a bitchy attitude with English Canada. The head office where I work used to be based out of Montreal before a US company took us over. And when ever you called the head office and pressed 2 for English the phone system was programmed to hang up lol

Pitney Bowls head office is in Quebec and its hell dealing with them. Same goes for our Telus reps

That said Quebec is very pretty, and lots of history. One of the best places in North America to "VISIT" If they could drop the victim mentality and realize that every one not french isn't out to get them I think it would go a long way to improving general relations.

[Leonard]

Originally Posted by Athens 

Until you have to work with them, they have a bitchy attitude with English Canada.

I do work with alot of Quebecers. Half of them work in Ottawa (well maybe not half, but alot).

I know every swear word in both official languages. Although, the french swear words are quite religious. Which is strange as the french are quite religious and you would think they find them... what's that s word. sancrosant?

The head office where I work used to be based out of Montreal before a US company took us over. And when ever you called the head office and pressed 2 for English the phone system was programmed to hang up lol

Pitney Bowls head office is in Quebec and its hell dealing with them. Same goes for our Telus reps

Yeah, I think that's the more fanatical french ones. Most seem like the english, watch english TV, etc.

I know we had one of those fanatics where I work. He was a team leader and would only pick french people to work in his team. He accidentally picked an english person once, because her last name was french.

The hilarious thing was, he didn't even live on the Quebec side, he actually lived in southern Ottawa. Hypocrite.

He had quite the temper too. He would go on tyrades, until he harassed the wrong person. Another french person, who wasn't going to take it.

[Athens]

The Help Desk was also based at the Montreal office and every time I sent in a request for something I would get a call back and the person would start speaking french because my last name is French lol

[Ω]

Originally Posted by Athens 

The Help Desk was also based at the Montreal office and every time I sent in a request for something I would get a call back and the person would start speaking french because my last name is French lol

Your name is Athens French?

[Kees]

How Britons view Canada?
who cares what the British think of anything anymore. Just leave the self-centered bastards to rot on their little island.

[Chongo]

[Waragainstsleep]

Originally Posted by Kees 

How Britons view Canada?
who cares what the British think of anything anymore. Just leave the self-centered bastards to rot on their little island.

Do you work for Google by any chance?

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Kees 

How Britons view Canada?
who cares what the British think of anything anymore. Just leave the self-centered bastards to rot on their little island.

Oooo. Sounds like a mainlander whose government gave his democracy away to Merkel and her pet gnome getting a little uppity that we didn't do the same.

[Waragainstsleep]

Has no-one else seen this?

Type "how to define an english person" into Google and see what comes top.

[Eug]

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep 

Has no-one else seen this?

Type "how to define an english person" into Google and see what comes top.

LOLers.

P.S. Urban Dictionary: canadian

1. canadian 1771 up, 757 down

Somebody from the country north of the United States, which has:
Maple Syrup; Hockey; Universal Healthcare; Peace; Low Crime/Violence Rates; Excellent Donuts and Coffee (AKA Tim Horton's); Better, Cheaper Beer; Lovely Women; Nicer People;
Better Winter Sports; Cultural/Tolerance; Good/Cheap Education; Superior Genetalia.

Person 1: So I got smashed on good brew this weekend and had some great sex.
Person 2: Oh yeah, eh? Me too!
Person 3: (Jealously) Damn canadians.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Waragainstsleep 

Has no-one else seen this?

Type "how to define an english person" into Google and see what comes top.

Hmmm. Wonder if I could get money out of Google for that. I'll have to hit the law books.

[ghporter]

They'll (correctly) point out that the search phrase is ambiguous and that the default search is "all words" rather than searching for the exact phrase... But this may reveal enough about their weighting algorithm that they may offer you something to just forget about it.

[Kees]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

Oooo. Sounds like a mainlander whose government gave his democracy away to Merkel and her pet gnome getting a little uppity that we didn't do the same.

Yeah well, if you Brits had any real balls, you'd leave the Euro zone altogether. You can't reap the benefits and not take any responsibility. There's a lingering world-wide economic crisis being fueled be the problems in all of Europe. UK's refusal to be part of the solution, despite London City being a huge part of the original problem, means the UK damages not only Europe's economy, but also that of the rest of the world.
But don't worry, all of us will just shift our monetary focus to Frankfurt and Paris, leave you lot to it.

[ghporter]

Huh? The EU is specifically NOT the Eurozone. The Eurozone is defined as a subset of the EU members using the common Euro currency. Do you perhaps mean the UK should leave the EU?

[Kees]

Originally Posted by ghporter 

Huh? The EU is specifically NOT the Eurozone. The Eurozone is defined as a subset of the EU members using the common Euro currency. Do you perhaps mean the UK should leave the EU?

ja.

[Wiskedjak]

Originally Posted by ghporter 

My wife first visited Canada on a drive up to Windsor from Detroit.

Except, Windsor is down from Detroit
[/pedantic]

[lpkmckenna]

People in Windsor love to joke about going up north. Except visiting Detroit isn't a joking matter.

[Athens]

Originally Posted by Ω 

Your name is Athens French?

what.. huh?

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Kees 

You can't reap the benefits and not take any responsibility.

I'm still trying to figure out what benefits you refer to? Us paying for Spain's new road network? Us giving Brussels £14bn a year to be in your little club?

Originally Posted by Kees 

But don't worry, all of us will just shift our monetary focus to Frankfurt and Paris, leave you lot to it.

Good luck with that, hippie. The Euro is going down. If Merkel and her gnome think that the population of Greece is suddenly going to vacate the beach and get back to work, they're delusional. You're in for huge riots all over the continent as soon as people realise exactly what your leaders let you all in for this week.

[Athens]

Doofy if Europe goes down the UK is ruined too. Not that I agree with the dutch dude there, but Europe matters for the UK.

[Athens]

Does any one think that a war could break out in a Euro collapse?

[Spheric Harlot]

No.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Athens 

Doofy if Europe goes down the UK is ruined too. Not that I agree with the dutch dude there, but Europe matters for the UK.

No. That's all scaremongering BS invented by those who're worried that their little currency project will fail. We'll buy our shit from China in Pounds Sterling after the EU collapses just the same as we buy our shit from China in Pounds Sterling now.

Originally Posted by Athens

Does any one think that a war could break out in a Euro collapse?

I don't know about war, but widespread civil unrest and riots, for sure. Absolutely certain. ...and they'll start before the Euro fully collapses, accelerating it.

What our continental friend up there doesn't realise is that Camoron had to walk out - if he'd have signed up he'd have had to go for a referendum, and there's no way he would have got a yes vote. We like the continentals (mostly), but just because you like someone it doesn't mean you give them free access to your bank account.

Of course, it now means that those who don't understand the difference between the Eurozone and the EU are all now moaning that somehow the UK caused Germany to lend money to Greece to buy German exports.
The fiscal rules in this new treaty were mostly already in place. First countries that broke them back in the early 2000s? Germany and France.
It's hilarious.

[ghporter]

Originally Posted by Wiskedjak 

Except, Windsor is down from Detroit
[/pedantic]

You are correct, but in a limited context. Strictly speaking, the Ambassador Bridge does indeed go North-South from Detroit into Windsor. However, we were staying with my parents in the Downriver area (southern Wayne County, Michigan), so we drove up to Detroit to drive down to Windsor.

Nice catch, though, as my wording was in error.

[Athens]

" but widespread civil unrest and riots, for sure. Absolutely certain"

And this is when governments fall and radicalism occurs. A happy feed prosperous population is tame. A deprived population is dangerous. How much civil unrest and hardship can occur before European cultures resort to isolationism and blame. And how long does it take for radicals to fill the power vacuum or seize opportunity. I think Europe can easily revert back to its former self if the conditions are right.

[Tiresias]

It's very simple.

Britons view Canada the way they view all post colonial countries.

Down their noses.

[Kees]

Originally Posted by Doofy 

No. That's all scaremongering BS invented by those who're worried that their little currency project will fail. We'll buy our shit from China in Pounds Sterling after the EU collapses just the same as we buy our shit from China in Pounds Sterling now.

lol, yes, because we all now the UK's economy is doing brilliantly right now...You need to earn money to buy shit Limey.

[Doofy]

Originally Posted by Kees 

lol, yes, because we all now the UK's economy is doing brilliantly right now...You need to earn money to buy shit Limey.

Right, so we'd better stop sending our billions in subs to the EU if we need it then.

What ya gonna do? Kick us out?

[ghporter]

Do we need to move this to the PWL so someone or other can sling poo? I would prefer that we got back to the original social discussion, rather than nastily political turn some people are taking it. There is nothing stopping any member from starting a new thread to discuss the rant material...

[Salty]

Winnipeg's murder rate is a bit of a misnomer. Most of them aren't just people walking down the street getting murdered so much as spouses, brothers and sisters, etc. It's all people who already know the people they're killing or otherwise hurting. And one of the biggest reasons why we rate higher is simply because we have the highest number of aboriginal people per capita compared with any other city.

That and the entire native population tends to be centred just north of downtown. So yes if you walk in a small portion of the upper middle part of the city that plainly looks unsafe and ghetto like when you're there, there's a good chance that you could be the victim of a violent crime. If you go pretty well anywhere else you're fine.

[Eug]

And the can of worms has now been officially opened. Right after ghporter's suggestion to get back on topic, no less.

I guess we may be heading to the PWL after all.

[Doofy]

Not entirely sure how exactly Salty's post fits into anything, let alone the thread topic.

And not entirely sure how the thread isn't already done, since you've already had responses to the question from everyone who's in a position to tell you the answer.