[dzp111]

Umm...

Why not...?

[turtle777]

F***ing useless tradition.

Same as why the Brits still use separate faucets for hot and cold water.

-t

[smacintush]

Because that American people are both lazy and blindly resistant to change.

[SpaceMonkey]

"The metric system is the tool of the devil! My car gets forty rods to the hogshead and that's the way I likes it!"

[dzp111]

Originally Posted by smacintush 

Because that American people are both lazy and blindly resistant to change.

I'm thinking it's because thete are TOO MANY Americans. (Or, America's too big..)

Case and point:

It took us more than a decade for us Canadians to grasp the metrics' simplicity. Actually, 25 years later, I myself still think inches, feet and yards.

Slow but sure I'm getting it.

Say, the purpose of having the driver's wheel on our left and on their right? What's up with that?


: )

[Jawbone54]

If we switched over today, I'd still be trying to get it right the day I die.

Trust me, we're not switching.

[Face Ache]

Americans can't go metric because they can't spell metre.

They'd have to go meteric.

[Timo]

The construction industry is firm entrenched in imperial units.

And it suits them: base 12 divides nicely in half, thirds and quarters. Base 10, not so much.

[EndlessMac]

Originally Posted by dzp111 

Umm...

Why not...?

It's the same reason why people don't use the Dvorak keyboard and why many PC users don't switch to Macs. People like using what they are used to. The key is to get people while they are young so they are used to it from the beginning.

I remember when they briefly taught me the metric system when I was in school. I thought it was much quicker and easier to use but of course I stopped using it because no one else was. They also didn't push the metric system much in school. It was more like they were telling us there was a different measuring system out there but they didn't really insist we started using it.

[torsoboy]

Originally Posted by Timo 

The construction industry is firm entrenched in imperial units.

And it suits them: base 12 divides nicely in half, thirds and quarters. Base 10, not so much.

Do they use imperial units in other countries for construction projects? It seems like they wouldn't, if they use the metric system for everything else.

[Shaddim]

When I walk into a pub I order a pint, not a half litre, or whatever. You metric people can go bugger off.

[Tiresias]

I totally agree with the OP.

In the age of nanotechnology, any system whose smallest unit of measurement is the inch is, frankly, laughable.

[ctt1wbw]

Originally Posted by toothpick_charlie 

I totally agree with the OP.

In the age of nanotechnology, any system whose smallest unit of measurement is the inch is, frankly, laughable.

Huh? Why can't the rest of the world switch over? Maybe they suffer from a mass delusion or something.

[Tiresias]

The metric is an improvement on the imperial, obviously.

But of course you jest.

[angelmb]

My signature says it so.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by ctt1wbw 

Huh? Why can't the rest of the world switch over?

After having gone through all the trouble of switching over to metric in the past 150 years?

Heck, I'm sure NASA can just keep shooting probes at Mars - what's one more or less?

[ghporter]

I can handle Metric measurements without much problem, but it's taken me a concentrated effort over literally decades to be able to get it right. Long distances are still a chore-I would rather think of car trips in how many hours on the road than to think of them in either miles or kilometers. But having the ability to USE SI units does not mean that people GRASP them. If you were brought up with inches and ounces, learning different units is difficult for a number of reasons, some of them related to the same process that makes it hard for an adult to learn a new language.

On the other hand, there's a new steak restaurant near here with a cool logo: "℥". I have to wonder how many people just think it's some cool, abstract doodle... (The symbol MEANS the name of the restaurant...)

[Hg2491]

The metric system is so much simpler to change from mili- to kilo-, etc. Something that I really like is the naming pattern it has.

[Laminar]

My car and all of my motorcycles are all metric, which means most of my specialty tools are also metric. And that whenever I go to the hardware store to get nuts and bolts I have to skip the general aisle and go to the tiny little corner for metric parts. Home Depot and Lowe's don't even carry metric stuff.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by ghporter 

I can handle Metric measurements without much problem, but it's taken me a concentrated effort over literally decades to be able to get it right. Long distances are still a chore-I would rather think of car trips in how many hours on the road than to think of them in either miles or kilometers. But having the ability to USE SI units does not mean that people GRASP them. If you were brought up with inches and ounces, learning different units is difficult for a number of reasons, some of them related to the same process that makes it hard for an adult to learn a new language.

True.

I'm very thankful our ancestors were smart enough to have taken care of the transition so many decades ago.

They spared the last handful of generations a lot of headache.

[HenryMelton]

The problem is that we have too few fingers. Metric is designed for engineers. Base 12 works so much nicer for ordinary life, dividing portions, making halves, thirds, quarters, etc. Metric was an enormous fad back during the French Revolution when they wanted to do away with the old systems of -everything-. We almost had decimal seconds, but it never caught on. I was in favor of metric back a few decades ago, but why make ordinary life harder just to make engineering easier, especially now that computers can do the conversions effortlessly. There's no remaining philosophical justification for metric. The only reason is practical--getting metric parts for your metric-designed motorcycles.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by HenryMelton 

There's no remaining philosophical justification for metric. The only reason is practical--getting metric parts for your metric-designed motorcycles.

Not true.

Certain things (i.e. nanotechnology) can only be dealt with in a metric system. So you can not juts pick one and stick with it, whichever you like better.

Fact is, metric covers ALL possible uses, base 12 / imperial does NOT.

-t

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally Posted by HenryMelton 

The problem is that we have too few fingers. Metric is designed for engineers. Base 12 works so much nicer for ordinary life, dividing portions, making halves, thirds, quarters, etc. Metric was an enormous fad back during the French Revolution when they wanted to do away with the old systems of -everything-. We almost had decimal seconds, but it never caught on. I was in favor of metric back a few decades ago, but why make ordinary life harder just to make engineering easier, especially now that computers can do the conversions effortlessly. There's no remaining philosophical justification for metric. The only reason is practical--getting metric parts for your metric-designed motorcycles.

Yep, and creationism is a science.

...

[zipperzap]

What does youse mean "the rest of the world!??"

... there's a REST OF THE WORLD???

[Railroader]

I could care less. It could go either way. Don't care.

[EndlessMac]

Originally Posted by HenryMelton 

but why make ordinary life harder just to make engineering easier

So apparently you haven't observed the average American trying to add and subtract fractions in order to get exact measurements when things fall between whole inches. The metric system is so much quicker to go from millimeters to centimeters to meters, etc and makes adding and subtracting measurements so much quicker too. Most people should be able to do the metric calculations in their heads without paper and pen or calculator.

[HenryMelton]

Originally Posted by turtle777 

Not true.

Certain things (i.e. nanotechnology) can only be dealt with in a metric system. So you can not juts pick one and stick with it, whichever you like better.

Fact is, metric covers ALL possible uses, base 12 / imperial does NOT.

-t

I'm a little curious about this assertion. What difference is there in dealing with items of nanoscale regardless of the base unit? Neither mm nor inches are in sync with atomic scale processes. Not that I care. I just don't see a preference in nature for the metric. Do metric users not realize that you can have decimal inches?

[HenryMelton]

Originally Posted by EndlessMac 

So apparently you haven't observed the average American trying to add and subtract fractions in order to get exact measurements when things fall between whole inches. The metric system is so much quicker to go from millimeters to centimeters to meters, etc and makes adding and subtracting measurements so much quicker too. Most people should be able to do the metric calculations in their heads without paper and pen or calculator.

I have noticed one peculiar thing. In spite of the purity of the metric philosophy, only a few prefixes get used. Only human-scale measurements are popular. We measure down to atomic scales in fractions of mm, and we measure solar system distances in km. Back in the 70's, I had a science fiction story in Analog that used gigameters in travel distances, which was a natural unit for the events that happened in my tale, but in the decades since then, I've never seen anyone attempt that. It's always km in the solar system and then we throw out metric altogether for longer distances and go lightyears or parsecs.

I had expected metric to take over, but it didn't, and the longer I waited, the less difference it made in real life.

[CharlesS]

Originally Posted by HenryMelton 

I have noticed one peculiar thing. In spite of the purity of the metric philosophy, only a few prefixes get used. Only human-scale measurements are popular. We measure down to atomic scales in fractions of mm

What? μm, nm, and pm get used all the time. Nanometers in particular are so often used that people have coined words for "nanotechnology" for dealing with really small things. Not to mention that the prefix "nano" is sufficiently entrenched in the public consciousness to make the name "iPod nano" effective from a marketing standpoint.

, and we measure solar system distances in km. Back in the 70's, I had a science fiction story in Analog that used gigameters in travel distances, which was a natural unit for the events that happened in my tale, but in the decades since then, I've never seen anyone attempt that. It's always km in the solar system and then we throw out metric altogether for longer distances and go lightyears or parsecs.

Lightyears and parsecs are not really that far removed from the SI philosophy - they're based on natural phenomena. A meter is defined as the distance that light travels in a vacuum in 1/299,792,458 of a second. A light year is the distance that light travels in a year. So you can pretty easily define a light year in terms of a meter - it's 299,792,458 * 31,556,926 meters.

The imperial foot, on the other hand, is just some arbitrarily chosen length, probably originally derived from the length of some English monarch's actual foot. Actually, at some point the foot got redefined in terms of the meter - 0.3048m to be precise - so in some sense, even the imperial units are metric units now.

[HenryMelton]

CharlesS, were you arguing on my side by mistake?

But, it makes no difference. Both types of measurement were arbitrarily defined by a political process. I have nothing against metric, other than it's less optimal for the bulk of ordinary human activities. A universal measuring system would be better for international commerce. A decimal system all the way up and all the way down is better for engineering. Science will make up it's own units as new quirks of nature are revealed, but will favor the local common engineering system.

This has been fun. I never argue in public and this has been more polite than I've seen elsewhere. Later.

[dzp111]

I was about 16 when Canada imposed the metric system. I'm not sure why that happened, I'll have to Google it. But one thing's for sure it was a very costly transition. School books, every road sign, teacher training, speedometers, re-tooling, etc., all had to be placed in order.

Now in my fourties, my friends and I still talk miles, feet and inches though we have grasped the metric concept and use it when necessary. My son on the other hand (24) looks at me funny when I mention inches or feet.

As for the States, can you imagine the multi-billion price tag for converting to metric? I think that that is one of the main issues -cost. (correct me if I'm wrong)

[ShortcutToMoncton]

Originally Posted by HenryMelton 

A decimal system all the way up and all the way down is better for engineering. Science will make up it's own units as new quirks of nature are revealed, but will favor the local common engineering system.

Isn't this what the metric system does? I'm confused.

greg

[Oisín]

Originally Posted by HenryMelton 

I have nothing against metric, other than it's less optimal for the bulk of ordinary human activities.

Could you perhaps elaborate on how the metric system is less optimal for the bulk of ordinary human activities in a way that’s not completely and utterly based on a person’s own, individual experience and habits?

To me, the imperial system is absolutely hopeless to get my head around, and it’s damn near impossible for me to do any kind of ‘ordinary human activity’ in my head using imperial units. But that’s to be expected, since I grew up with metric units, and metric units alone.

From a completely impartial point of view, though, there are advantages and disadvantages to both systems. Imperial has the advantage that it’s easily dividable into halves, thirds, fourths, and sixths; metric has the advantage that it has the same base as our normal counting system (which is rather deeply encoded into our brains).

[CharlesS]

Originally Posted by HenryMelton 

But, it makes no difference. Both types of measurement were arbitrarily defined by a political process.

No, all of the SI units except for the kilogram are well defined in terms of natural phenomena. For example, a second is defined in terms of the period of a cesium-133 atom, the meter is defined in terms of the speed of light, etc. The imperial units, on the other hand, are simply arbitrary.

Originally Posted by Oisín 

Could you perhaps elaborate on how the metric system is less optimal for the bulk of ordinary human activities in a way that’s not completely and utterly based on a person’s own, individual experience and habits?

To me, the imperial system is absolutely hopeless to get my head around, and it’s damn near impossible for me to do any kind of ‘ordinary human activity’ in my head using imperial units. But that’s to be expected, since I grew up with metric units, and metric units alone.

I grew up with imperial units, and I still have trouble wrapping my head around many of them. For example, answer me quickly: how many teaspoons in a tablespoon? How many tablespoons in a cup? How many fluid ounces in a gallon? When you see a number of ounces on a can of something liquid, is it talking about fluid ounces or dry ounces? How many fluid ounces are in a cubic inch? Why is the number of feet in a mile something as arbitrary as 5,280?

I mean, most of the answers to these can be figured out without that much work, but it's not nearly as quick or as effortless as the equivalent conversions in the metric system.

[dzp111]

According to USMA (U.S.Metric Association), only 2 other countries in the world do not use the metric system: Liberia (in western Africa) and Burma (also known as Myanmar, in Southeast Asia).

I can't understand the logistics of not wanting to comply sooner than later. But this USMA advocacy group tends to believe that it's just a matter of time.

[Kerrigan]

Who cares? The industries and applications for which the metric system is superior (engineering, medicine, the military, IT, etc) have already adopted metric system. The current system is fine for all other purposes.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by Kerrigan 

Who cares? The only applications in which the metric system is advantageous (engineering, medicine, the military, IT, etc) have already adopted metric system. For daily life, the old system is just fine.

So you think it's efficient two have two systems concurrently ?

-t

[ShortcutToMoncton]

You seem to suggest the two don't mix. That simply isn't true, in my experience. I find myself having to convert between metric and imperial every couple days. It also comes up a lot when reading online articles.

greg

[Kerrigan]

Things seem to be working out fine. I don't see how teaching everyone to weigh themselves in kg or to measure their butter in centimeters would be any more efficient than the current system. And that is the only sort of thing that would change if America "switched" to the metric system, because the metric system is already standard for areas where a more technical system is needed.

[dzp111]

Originally Posted by Kerrigan 

Things seem to be working out fine. I don't see how teaching everyone to weigh themselves in kg or to measure their butter in centimeters would be any more efficient than the current system. And that is the only sort of thing that would change if America "switched" to the metric system, because the metric system is already standard for areas where a more technical system is needed.

Well yes Kerrigan, I'm proof of that. To me, a litre looks like a quart; a metre's close to a yard, and so on. Although my driver's license says I'm 168 cm high, I know I'm 5'6'' 'ish. You're right about the tech part too, you've heard of GB, Kb, KB, 28 grams in an ounce, etc. -all metric.

So ya, I think you have a point. In fact I just read that here in Canada, we're still dealing with 2" nails and square footages.

[Cipher13]

Don't worry about it, your use of the Imperial system is the source of much amusement worldwide. Everything has its worth.

[dzp111]

Originally Posted by Cipher13 

Don't worry about it, your use of the Imperial system is the source of much amusement worldwide. Everything has its worth.

I'm not sure if that post was directed at me.. You do know that imperial system has nothing to do with metrics?

Mostly?

[shifuimam]

Yes, please. Powers of ten are a hell of a lot easier to convert than the BS system we use. Twelve inches in a foot, three feet in a yard, 5,280 feet in a mile...who the hell came up with that crap?

It'll never happen, though. Too big of a change for people to stomach.

[turtle777]

Originally Posted by Kerrigan 

measure their butter in centimeters

WTF ? Only in Amaraca do they measure butter (and other ingredients) in measurements of length.

-t

[moonmonkey]

Originally Posted by dzp111 

According to USMA (U.S.Metric Association), only 2 other countries in the world do not use the metric system: Liberia (in western Africa) and Burma (also known as Myanmar, in Southeast Asia).

I can't understand the logistics of not wanting to comply sooner than later. But this USMA advocacy group tends to believe that it's just a matter of time.

Hong Kong still uses it, although it depends how you define country.

[Kerrigan]

Apart from the amusement factor, I don't see why the rest of the world cares about this.

[Kerrigan]

Originally Posted by turtle777 

WTF ? Only in Amaraca do they measure butter (and other ingredients) in measurements of length.

-t

Yea, I'm sure that no other country on earth ever measures the length of bread or dough or noodles or slices of meat or chopped vegetables or slices of cheese or anything else. Only the retarded Americans!

[dzp111]

Originally Posted by Kerrigan 

Apart from the amusement factor, I don't see why the rest of the world cares about this.

I'm afraid you might be wrong about that. Apparently, some countries (main export partners) are beginning to refuse non-metric labeled imports. Hopefully, there'll be some consensus where measurements, particularly weight is concerned.

What's a kilo? Hah! Easy, if you have an iPhone.


: )

[SeSawaya]

Cubits and Spans are all I use, the rest of you can bug off with your mumbo jumbo witch craft measurements....

[dzp111]

Originally Posted by SeSawaya 

Cubits and Spans are all I use, the rest of you can bug off with your mumbo jumbo witch craft measurements....

: )

Don't forget 'scores' and many 'moons'.

: )