[- - e r i k - -]

Yep. That is one feature I'd really love. Especially with a 40 GB iPod coming my way in the near future. Hopefully it will be included in a minor update soon.

[sanity assassin]

Yeah, me too, I'm sure it's one of those things that is there, but just not ready for prime time.

[Hash]

Originally posted by sanity assassin:
Not to be picky, but why are they advertising features that aren't there? Seems a tad unfair.

because maybe build85 is not GM after all..

[sanity assassin]

Originally posted by Hash:
because maybe build85 is not GM after all..

lol, now wouldn't that be ironic. Mind you, the screenshot looks old, from an earlier build, who knows though, be a nice feature.

[cSurfr]

Originally posted by e-cyras:
here is a picture of the feature; on apples site!!! :



i'm now 100% sure that 7b85 isn't golden master!

In case you didn't notice, the lock in the bottom left corner is different than in B85 as well.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by e-cyras:
but apples pr image looks better then 7b85!!

And then this (from macrumors.com):

Pulled Panther Feature? 'Home on iPod'
One reader (johnpg) notes a previously unadvertised feature of Panther which was detailed on Apple's Mac OS X mobility page called "Home on iPod". (the description has since been removed[....]

so - 7b85 isn't the real golden master! apple is not so bad...! who cares; only wait 2 weeks and then we can go get it...

How do you explain, then, that the System Preferences on the page you linked to include a "Security" button, which was in the WWDC preview but has been missing since about 7B5X or so?

[Edit: just noticed that it is still, in fact, in 7b85. I was at work. Sorry. Remainder of my post below still stands though.]

And the old (Jaguar) security lock button?

Don't you think it's a *lot* more likely that those images are just really old - I mean, they've been up on that site for months now, you know.

-s*

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by tikki:
Before someone starts doubting me, I will just post this.

Um...Justin, I don't know what you're looking at, but comparing with the images posted earlier:

[B]From Apple's pr images:


7B85

your image is quite obviously NOT of the build used in Apple's pr images (looky Applications icon).

?

-s*

[Peabo]

Originally posted by e-cyras:
here is a picture of the feature; on apples site!!! :



i'm now 100% sure that 7b85 isn't golden master!

Hmm...'desktop' ? Not 'Desktop & Screensaver' ?

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by z0ne81:
Hmm...'desktop' ? Not 'Desktop & Screensaver' ?

Yes. It *used to be* separate preference panes in the WWDC Panther preview.

They were consolidated some time after that.

Face it, folks, there is no conspiracy: those PR images are simply OLD and OUTDATED. (in details small enough not to matter, PR-wise)

-s*

[piracy]

Originally posted by e-cyras:
i'm now 100% sure that 7b85 isn't golden master!

Then prepare to be 100% disappointed when 7B85 is exactly what you get on the 24th.

You do realize that work on Panther continues, and it's not as if you'll be stuck at 7B85 forever...

[piracy]

Originally posted by Hash:
because maybe build85 is not GM after all..

Except that it is. "" (wtf?)

It's more amusing than anything, really. A study in the psychology of conspiracy theories. I look forward to repeating this for Mac OS X 10.4.

[Agasthya]

After upgrading from B80 to B85 I've noticed that nothing in the energy saver control panel works. The display no longer goes to sleep, the computer doesn't wake up from sleep when its supposed to (automated).

Anyone else having this problem? I'm going to do an archive and install of B85 this afternoon and see if the problem disappears.

[Bubba Jones]

ok, can i veer a tad of the subject. i thought i saw this discussed before but i can't locate it.

regardless of what recent build b80 b85 etc., will an istalled b85 (even if it's actually not GM) be updateable(word?) through software update whenever 10.3.1 comes? or will this only work if piracy and others are correct and 85 is GM?

[piracy]

Originally posted by Agasthya:
After upgrading from B80 to B85 I've noticed that nothing in the energy saver control panel works. The display no longer goes to sleep, the computer doesn't wake up from sleep when its supposed to (automated).

Anyone else having this problem? I'm going to do an archive and install of B85 this afternoon and see if the problem disappears.

You can't "upgrade" from any previous beta to 7B85...and you have just witnessed one of many reasons precisely why. The install *has* be be clean (format, Archive and Install, etc.)

[piracy]

Originally posted by Bubba Jones:
ok, can i veer a tad of the subject. i thought i saw this discussed before but i can't locate it.

regardless of what recent build b80 b85 etc., will an istalled b85 (even if it's actually not GM) be updateable(word?) through software update whenever 10.3.1 comes? or will this only work if piracy and others are correct and 85 is GM?

Non-GM builds will not be updateable via future software updates.

Note: things like 10.3.1 may install, but you'll have a completely unsupported system in an unpredicatble state.

7B85 will be updateable via Software Update, since it is, in fact, Mac OS X 10.3.

Of course, none of this should worry you since you will be installing a legitmately licensed copy of Mac OS X 10.3. Correct?

[Agasthya]

Originally posted by piracy:
You can't "upgrade" from any previous beta to 7B85...and you have just witnessed one of many reasons precisely why. The install *has* be be clean (format, Archive and Install, etc.)

Yeah I figured something like that would be the problem. I'm pretty sure the problem will be rectified when I do a fresh install since it worked flawlessly in B80.

[sanity assassin]

Anyway, to stop the squabbling, and change the subject a little, why the hell are Apple using PR images with features that aren't in the product, even advertising them beforehand? That's annoying, and I don't care about build numbers, or whatever, but things like that bug me. The pics look crap, they look even older than the ones they had up for months there, there's no excuse for that, sorry.

P.s. for those of us that didn't install the numerous betas, I would assume as a buyer that what is advertised on Apple's site, is what I would get.

[piracy]

Originally posted by sanity assassin:
Anyway, to stop the squabbling, and change the subject a little, why the hell are Apple using PR images with features that aren't in the product, even advertising them beforehand? That's annoying, and I don't care about build numbers, or whatever, but things like that bug me. The pics look crap, they look even older than the ones they had up for months there, there's no excuse for that, sorry.

P.s. for those of us that didn't install the numerous betas, I would assume as a buyer that what is advertised on Apple's site, is what I would get.

Normal, sane people don't care that the "Pictures" icon in the sidebar, or the lock symbol in System Preferences in old PR images on the web site aren't identical to what is in the shipping product.

They care about more important things, like, oh, say, actual features and functionality.

[sanity assassin]

Originally posted by piracy:
Normal, sane people don't care that the "Pictures" icon in the sidebar, or the lock symbol in System Preferences in old PR images on the web site aren't identical to what is in the shipping product.

They care about more important things, like, oh, say, actual features and functionality.

Which would be the syncing home folder on the iPOD feature? Call me crazy, but isn't that a major feature for lots of us?
Shoddy on Apple's part, plus the other bogus features that have vanished. hmm

Normal sane people couldn't give a toss about build numbers, and who got their first with knowing about it, go figure.

[Disgruntled Head of C-3PO]

Originally posted by piracy:
It's more amusing than anything, really. A study in the psychology of conspiracy theories. I look forward to repeating this for Mac OS X 10.4.

That is the scary part. You really need a girlfriend dude.

[sanity assassin]

Originally posted by Disgruntled Head of C-3PO:
That is the scary part. You really need a girlfriend dude.

Probably, and a psychotic one at that, just to keep him busy

What is wrong with plain observations these days, these forums are full of people mocking XP for its GUI, and when I see Apple to not only show us mis-leading crappy pics, but pics with features that aren't there!. I think that's worthy of 5 mins. of discussion.

Piracy, this is not about build numbers anymore.

[piracy]

Originally posted by sanity assassin:
Probably, and a psychotic one at that, just to keep him busy

What is wrong with plain observations these days, these forums are full of people mocking XP for its GUI, and when I see Apple to not only show us mis-leading crappy pics, but pics with features that aren't there!. I think that's worthy of 5 mins. of discussion.

Piracy, this is not about build numbers anymore.

You may not be concerned about build numbers, and may be trying to have a discussion about the non-local home directory feature. That's fine.

But others are using it as "proof" that 7B85 must not be GM "for sure". I'm simply reiterating that's not the case.

[eevyl]

About the PR images, I just think they did (or started doing) the Panther website and marketing stuff way before 7B85 was ready to be declared GM, and thus there are inconsistencies and mistery features. The "Home on iPod" feature was likely dropped from the main 10.3.0 development tree because it was found to have too bugs to be fixed in time for the expected release.

I bet we will not see "Home on iPod" implemented in Panther before the end of the year, and that is why it is not in 7B85.

[sanity assassin]

Originally posted by piracy:
You may not be concerned about build numbers, and may be trying to have a discussion about the non-local home directory feature. That's fine.

But others are using it as "proof" that 7B85 must not be GM "for sure". I'm simply reiterating that's not the case.

Granted, and I haven't doubted what build the final version will be, I'm none too bothered, but i can understand if you're getting annoyed with the same repetitive remarks.

[barbarian]

One thing I just noticed in panther that I really really like, menu dividers are back instead of those blank spaces there are nice very one pixel grey lines.... Might not seem like a big deal to many but those spaces have been annoying me for years!

[vision619]

Wow. I came here to find out if b85 was going to be the Master build for 10.3. I had no idea that this subject would be the source for so much debate.

Well I've read this entire thread (don't ask me why) and all I can assume at this point is that no one will TRULY know until October 24th.

You have all had valid arguments though. However I will mention one thing I have noticed that strikes me as a little ironic. Several members have made comments in reference to people needing to "get a life" for posting seemingly remedial questions, when in fact they seem to have found time in their "assumed" extremely busy schedule to not only read that persons post, but actually write a reply as well. Just thought that was funny. (no offense was meant by that comment)

[sanity assassin]

Originally posted by vision619:
However I will mention one thing I have noticed that strikes me as a little ironic. Several members have made comments in reference to people needing to "get a life" for posting seemingly remedial questions, when in fact they seem to have found time in their "assumed" extremely busy schedule to not only read that persons post, but actually write a reply as well. Just thought that was funny. (no offense was meant by that comment)

Nah, we don't read through the whole thing, that would madness, madness I say. We just look for willing targets then pick on them.

Kidding.

Actually, I'm on holiday just now, so can spend my time online a bit more.

[kcmac]

This is all about revenue stream. Apple can't wait till the end of the year to get the funds that Panther will generate.

Would the missing features shown earlier make Panther more valuable? Sure, but it would still cost $129. And Apple will most likely add these features in the incremental upgrades of 10.3.xx which will surely be free to Panther users. And until the 24th, we really won't know what if anything is "missing" anyway.

Hasn't it been 13+ months since Jaguar? I am guessing that Apple would like to keep these yearly upgrades to more of a yearly type schedule.

[Spliff]

Anyone noticing excessive CPU consumption by Safari 1.1 (that's installed with Panther GM) when composing a post in the MacNN forums?

I only occurs when I scroll down and the Instant Smilies are visible in the browser pane while composing a message.

Weird.

Why would the animated "Instant Smilies" use so much CPU in Safari?

[mikemako]

Originally posted by Hash:
because maybe build85 is not GM after all..

I hope not.. this fella is BUGGY! I've received a few BSOD's (when trying to log in, the screen just goes blue and stays that way, not possible to get out of it, must hard-boot)..

Fast user switching sucks on Windows and makes it get all sluggish and buggy after a day or so. I figured Apple would do it better, and they have, but it's far from right!

If I stay logged into Safari in one account & switch to another, Safari won't work right: It's not possible to "middle click" to open new tabs for some reason. Also the dock will not respond to the mouse (app names will not appear when the cursor is moved over their icons). Menus won't work properly, also.

I think the above is caused either by leaving iTunes running while switching to different users, or by the "Kensington Mouseworks" drivers.

[vision619]

I just heard from a fairly reliable source that the "Gold Master" build for the Panther release will be 7C02. The shift from 7B to 7C likely reflects the completion of 10.3 and 7C builds
would presumably be rolled into the next interim update - 10.3.1.

But then again, I would assume most Apple employees don't even know (and I'm not talking about just retail store employees). When you think about it though, it won't really matter in two weeks anyway. Lets just hope the final doesn't contain some or any of the bugs listed in this string.

[danengel]

and all I can assume at this point is that no one will TRULY know until October 24th.

We could ask Steve... anybody knows his phone number?

[xmacintosh]

Originally posted by z0ne81:
Hmm...'desktop' ? Not 'Desktop & Screensaver' ?

There is some inconsistent images from System Prefs. on Apple Site. Look at this image. The "Desktop & ScreenSaver" label is there!!!

HERE

[diamondsw]

Originally posted by Hash:
because maybe build85 is not GM after all..

Just STFU already. I really don't give a , but give it a rest!

[piracy]

Originally posted by vision619:
I just heard from a fairly reliable source that the "Gold Master" build for the Panther release will be 7C02.

Pretty unreliable source, then...

[vision619]

Originally posted by piracy:
Pretty unreliable source, then...

Perhaps you should read the second paragraph of that post. Your responses seem very selective, almost as if your browsing these boards "looking" to establish some type of dominance. Like you have something to prove? Maybe everyone here that is inclined to disagree with you, really is wrong, and you are always right. But like I said in the second paragraph,

"But then again, I would assume most Apple employees don't even know".

[malvolio]

Originally posted by vision619:
Your responses seem very selective, almost as if your browsing these boards "looking" to establish some type of dominance. Like you have something to prove?

Actually, piracy has already proved that he is knowledgeable by being correct about every single release of OS X from 10.0 to the present.
Pretty good track record, IMHO.

[vision619]

Originally posted by malvolio:
Actually, piracy has already proved that he is knowledgeable by being correct about every single release of OS X from 10.0 to the present.
Pretty good track record, IMHO.

Ah. I see. So it's not a lack of knowledge, simply a need to establish dominance. Piracy does seem rather knowledgeable on the subject.

However my original post did not require a response of that nature. That's why I made it clear that my fairly reliable source could always be wrong as could any of us. Not a big deal though.

[iDriveX]

Originally posted by vision619:
Ah. I see. So it's not a lack of knowledge, simply a need to establish dominance. Piracy does seem rather knowledgeable on the subject.

However my original post did not require a response of that nature. That's why I made it clear that my fairly reliable source could always be wrong as could any of us. Not a big deal though.

You must be new around here. Get used to it. You won't survive if you don't have a tough skin, now let me take you to some threads that were written about me, or some posts in response to things I have said... Come now child, don't be afraid...It will build character...

[Eug Wanker]

Load up Preview with a multipage PDF, quickly turn on Expose, and this is what you get.

[nforcer]

Originally posted by Eug Wanker:
Load up Preview with a multipage PDF, quickly turn on Expose, and this is what you get.

Neat. What build does that happen with?

[Disgruntled Head of C-3PO]

Originally posted by nforcer:
Neat. What build does that happen with?

he is using 7B85

[nforcer]

While everyone was pointing out the color and brightness image differences in the Pictures icon and such in the 2 images that z0ne81 posted [link], I don't think anyone pointed out the differences of the position and size of items in the toolbars and otherwise. Here are the toolbars from the pictures he posted just so you don't have to go back to see them. (Note: I refer to the actual names of the images that z0ne81 linked to. gm.jpg is what z0ne81 titled "Apple's PR image" and 7b85.jpg is what z0ne81 titled "7B85")



Position and Size Differences:[list=1][*]In the 7b85 image, the left and right toolbar items are indented somewhat from the left and right sides. This is not the case in the GM image.[*]In the GM image, the spacing between the toolbar items is smaller, and it seems to be more consistent. In the 7b85 image, the spacing is farther apart and the space between the path and action toolbar buttons [*]In the GM image, the hide/show toolbar items widget is about 2 pixels wider when compared to the hide/show toolbar items widget in the 7b85 image.[*]The toolbar close/minimize/maximize widgets in the GM image seem to be bigger and glossier than those in the 7b85 image, and they appear to be more than a touchup or compression issue might account for. (It also looks like the maximize widget in the GM image is darker than the others)[*]Although harder to notice since I did not post the full images, the gap between the left and right panes in the GM image is a couple pixels smaller than the gap between the left and right panes in the 7b85 image.[*]Finally, in the GM image all toolbar items are closer to the window titlebar and close/minimize/maximize widgets than the toolbar items in the 7b85 image.[/list=1]

I can see how some people can contribute the extra glossiness in toolbar widgets in the GM image to a touchup. And perhaps the extra brightness noticed at the center of the GM metal window, and the noticeable shadow in the search toolbar control to being saved under less lossy circumstances. But how do we account for the other changes?

Possible conclusions:[list=1][*]7B85 is not the GM, but rather a release candidate that someone down the line confused with GM.[*]Apple's PR materials are severely outdated or modified[*]z0ne81 mislabeled the images[*]Some kind of theme or customization was applied to the Finder in one of the images.[/list=1]

[Luca Rescigno]

That happened to me with Mail - the drawer separated and wouldn't go back to normal! Weird.

[smogscythe]

wait -- nforcer: your post above with the images? the top one (7B85) is good, OK. Then the bottom one (GM - Apple's PR Image) look at the scrollbars, yes the blue scrollbars. isn't that window inactive? why is it blue? or do the scrollbars stay blue when the windows are inactive?
well, whatever.

[sanity assassin]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Eug Wanker:
[B]

Edit: deleted cause someone already posted it appeared in mail too.

[Hash]

Originally posted by piracy:
Except that it is. (wtf?)

Man, you really should relax and consult your doctor, before they put you into a locked hospital room, screaming loudly and incessantly *85 is GM, 85 is GM, 85 ISSSSS GMMMMMMMMMM*

[JKT]

Originally posted by nforcer:
Position and Size Differences:[list=1][*]In the 7b85 image, the left and right toolbar items are indented somewhat from the left and right sides. This is not the case in the GM image.[*]In the GM image, the spacing between the toolbar items is smaller, and it seems to be more consistent. In the 7b85 image, the spacing is farther apart and the space between the path and action toolbar buttons [*]In the GM image, the hide/show toolbar items widget is about 2 pixels wider when compared to the hide/show toolbar items widget in the 7b85 image.[*]The toolbar close/minimize/maximize widgets in the GM image seem to be bigger and glossier than those in the 7b85 image, and they appear to be more than a touchup or compression issue might account for. (It also looks like the maximize widget in the GM image is darker than the others)[*]Although harder to notice since I did not post the full images, the gap between the left and right panes in the GM image is a couple pixels smaller than the gap between the left and right panes in the 7b85 image.[*]Finally, in the GM image all toolbar items are closer to the window titlebar and close/minimize/maximize widgets than the toolbar items in the 7b85 image.[/list=1]

Possible further explanation (although personally, I think it is just a case of photoshopped PR images not bearing resemblance to reality):

the toolbar displays are different because in the top one, the toolbar icons (*for files etc, if they were present) are displayed as small size icons with no text label; in the bottom, toolbar icons (if they were present) are displayed as text only.

* that is, the icons that you get in the current Jag finder toolbar.

And, honestly, just who does give a flying fsck what is and what isn't the GM build?

[sanity assassin]

Let's put aside the whole GM issue, I personally don't know what is and what isn't, but I do trust iDrive, and piracy on this one. Now, talking purely about aesthetics here, the PR image of the finder looks kinda cool, the actual metal window is more recessed than the other one, and the edges are a little more tighter, I like it. It fits in with the new Quicktime, iTunes, and other iApps.

[Spheric Harlot]

Originally posted by mikemako:
I hope not.. this fella is BUGGY! I've received a few BSOD's (when trying to log in, the screen just goes blue and stays that way, not possible to get out of it, must hard-boot)..

Fast user switching sucks on Windows and makes it get all sluggish and buggy after a day or so. I figured Apple would do it better, and they have, but it's far from right!

If I stay logged into Safari in one account & switch to another, Safari won't work right: It's not possible to "middle click" to open new tabs for some reason. Also the dock will not respond to the mouse (app names will not appear when the cursor is moved over their icons). Menus won't work properly, also.

I think the above is caused either by leaving iTunes running while switching to different users, or by the "Kensington Mouseworks" drivers.

I've not had a single BSOD yet, despite leaving iTunes running with multiple users. Throw out the Mouseworks and report back.

-s*