[Demonhood]

What would you like to see in the updated forums for MacNN?
New features, bug fixes, aesthetic tweaks, etc..

I'm not quite ready to post a screenshot, but here are some things that the new forums will have:

• working instant vb code buttons
• far more user options
• thread rating
• new look (though not too new)
• smarter calendar
• the return of 'last post in this thread by...' in the forum view
• quick reply box
• and more

There are a number of vb3 features that I've disabled (user reputation, attachments, etc..) so just because you see it in another forum running the software, don't expect it here. If you can make a good argument on why we should bring these back, let me know.

I'm always open to suggestions. So if you have replacement icons (edit post, the light bulbs, the page icons, red dots, etc..) I'll be more than happy to use them if they're good.

[Scifience]

Originally posted by Demonhood:

• new look (though not too new)

I'd try to make it match with whatever the new MacNN frontpage design is...hopefully effgee's.

There are a number of vb3 features that I've disabled (user reputation, attachments, etc..) so just because you see it in another forum running the software, don't expect it here. If you can make a good argument on why we should bring these back, let me know.

I'd enable picture uploads as it would be an easier way to post pictures and would also reduce the amount of moderation necessary to root out oversized images, as the forum software could automatically block/resize these images. It would also prevent the newbie posts about "how do I post images?"

I also think a subscription (using the vB3 subscription feature) allowing users to pay a yearly fee to have advertising removed from the forum while still supporting MacNN would be a good idea. A lot of people are annoyed by the ads, and the only current option is to use an ad blocker like PithHelmet, which results in MacNN not getting any money. I imagine there would be quite a few members (myself included) who would pay a reasonable yearly fee to disable ads on the forums while still supporting 'NN financially.

I'm always open to suggestions. So if you have replacement icons (edit post, the light bulbs, the page icons, red dots, etc..) I'll be more than happy to use them if they're good.

Again, make it fit in with the new frontpage design. Little glass red dots (like the kind used to indicate "away" status in iChat) would likely fit in well with effgee's design.

[E's Lil Theorem]

Not sure if these are included in your "and more," but off the top of my head:

- I posted this on Feedback forum thread:

Originally posted by E's Lil Theorem:
And navigation depth links at the bottom of the threads.

Like these: MacNN Forums > Community > Feedback > vBulletin 3.0.0 'Gold'

Currently you only see them at the very top of the thread.

- I think it was lil'babykitten that suggested a preview button when editing your own posts.

- Someone suggested that textfields be cleared when you click on them (the "Search This Forum (only)," field for example).

[Goldfinger]

Exciting ! new forums.

The only new feature I wanted is the quick reply box. Oh and the possibility to look at the last threads you posted in in your user control panel (automatic subscribing).

[ManOfSteal]

I'm waiting on effgee's replacement icons, and then I'll drool and say that those are implemented immediately. With that said Demonhood, what are the current icons that you are toying with? Do you have anything?

[ManOfSteal]

Also, I'm all for removing status tags and post counts...has that been given any thought? Or just having one, and not the other?

[Demonhood]

Originally posted by Scifience:
I'd try to make it match with whatever the new MacNN frontpage design is...hopefully effgee's.

i'll probably put it up before that is all finalized. we can always replace icons/graphics later.

Originally posted by Scifience:I'd enable picture uploads as it would be an easier way to post pictures and would also reduce the amount of moderation necessary to root out oversized images, as the forum software could automatically block/resize these images. It would also prevent the newbie posts about "how do I post images?"

at the same time it would increase the amount of disk space we were using by a huge amount. not to mention the extra bandwidth. i could just post a FAQ on how to acquire free image hosting instead.

Originally posted by Scifience:I also think a subscription (using the vB3 subscription feature) allowing users to pay a yearly fee to have advertising removed from the forum while still supporting MacNN would be a good idea.

this is pretty easy to do using vb3, so we might look into it.

[Demonhood]

Originally posted by E's Lil Theorem:
And navigation depth links at the bottom of the threads.

should be easy enough to add the breadcrumbs at the bottom.

- I posted this on Feedback forum thread:- I think it was lil'babykitten that suggested a preview button when editing your own posts.

already implemented.

- Someone suggested that textfields be cleared when you click on them (the "Search This Forum (only)," field for example).

vb3 uses dropdown menus for the search field so that text won't be there.

Originally posted by ManOfSteal:
With that said Demonhood, what are the current icons that you are toying with? Do you have anything?

i'm currently using the old smilies and the old 'edit' & 'reply' buttons on each post (PM, email,etc.. are now located elsewhere). i've got new 'post reply', 'post new thread', main logo, and replacements for the forum lightbulbs. i don't have any paper thread replacements yet (orange, red, yellow, white thread icons).

Also, I'm all for removing status tags and post counts...has that been given any thought? Or just having one, and not the other?

post counts will be hidden. user status and stars (well, star replacements) will still be shown. there will be several new levels.

[ManOfSteal]

Originally posted by Demonhood:
post counts will be hidden. user status and stars (well, star replacements) will still be shown. there will be several new levels.

Sounds good. Will the "star replacements" be a user defined preference from a particular list of icons that are defined by the 'NN? I want those baseball status circles!

[Demonhood]

hehe, maybe.

here are a few of the temp graphics i'm using:

[ManOfSteal]

Nice! I see things are going to be heavy in the "blue" colors again...

Also, why isn't this a sticky in all sections of the forums instead of just the Lounge?

[Demonhood]

because an announcement can't be replied to.
i may put another one in gui and OS X tho, just to get a diversity of responses.

i went with the dark blue because...well, that's what we've always had
but the checkmark stamp looks pretty cool in red.


oh, and the forums will support transparent PNGs for everyone. even Win IE users.

[Goldfinger]

omg no postcount !!!ononeo111!!!1!!!



EDIT: these blue and red things. Are they the size that they will be implemented ? That's a bit big no ?

[Xeo]

This look needs a huge revamp. It's old, out-dated, and ugly. I used to like it. I enjoy the clean colors of black on white/grey, but the overall look needs a change. It needs to be more modern.

It's not terrible. I wouldn't cry if it stayed mostly the same. But I'd jump for joy if it changed drastically for the better.

Oh, and for the unveiling of the new look, I'd like to have tiny Michael Jackson noses as my stars.

[Demonhood]

Originally posted by Goldfinger:
these blue and red things. Are they the size that they will be implemented ? That's a bit big no ?

they're replacing these: which take up about the same space (since you have to accommodate the forum descriptions).

[ManOfSteal]

[paging] Adam Betts, please come to the Lounge...Adam Betts, please come to the Lounge...your skillz are wanted! [/paging]

[nredman]

Originally posted by ManOfSteal:
[paging] Adam Betts, please come to the Lounge...Adam Betts, please come to the Lounge...your skillz are wanted! [/paging]

indeed

[rjenkinson]

if you search for new posts since your last visit, clicking a thread from the search results should take you to the first unread post in the thread, not the first page. it would be nice to be able to go directly to the unread posts.

-r.

[demograph68]

Originally posted by ManOfSteal:
Sounds good. Will the "star replacements" be a user defined preference from a particular list of icons that are defined by the 'NN? I want those baseball status circles!

I have dibs on the skulls!

[im_noahselby]

Originally posted by Demonhood:
here are a few of the temp graphics i'm using:

Lookin Good. My vote goes for the blue.

I also like the old smiley's a lot and hope that you keep them around or at the very least, don't change them too much.

Questions:

1) What is "user reputation"? and why has this been disabled?

2) Why have you removed the post count? Was this done to avoid clutter, or is there another reason for ommiting it? I personally, like to see this, not sure how the majority feels about this though.

3) Will all the members post counts, etc, be retained after the new forum transition is complete?

4) Can you give us an example of the new levels and how many posts are required to reach each one?

Keep up the hard work!

Noah

[Xeo]

Not speaking for DH here, but I can answer a few of these.

Originally posted by im_noahselby:
1) What is "user reputation"? and why has this been disabled?

It's a karma-like system where users can add reputation to each other per post, or take it away. This doesn't work well on a casual board like ours, IMO. I frequent the DevShed PHP boards and that is a forum where Rep goes a l long way. It is almost a 100% support site. Knowing who is knowledgeable because they've given lots of good answers before is a nice thing. It also allows people to agree with other posts so that a particular solution gets noticed more than others if it's better than the rest.

2) Why have you removed the post count? Was this done to avoid clutter, or is there another reason for ommiting it? I personally, like to see this, not sure how the majority feels about this though.

Probably because it's something people quibble over all the time. Who has the higher post count, who is reaching 10000 posts and going to retire, etc. It's foolish and childish. Just a title that changes will be good. There should also be titles that correspond to how long you've been a member. Some people have been around forever but don't gab every chance they get.

3) Will all the members post counts, etc, be retained after the new forum transition is complete?

Oh no doubt the system itself will continue to keep track of this stuff. Hell, a simple SQL query could give you the number any one person has even if the count isn't stored in the database in it's own column. So this idea gets a from me.

[anthonyvthc]

I'd like to see, without clicking on a topic, when the topic was created. Sometimes I'll be gone for a few days, come back, and there will be a thread that's like three pages long. If it's new, chances are I'll read it, but if it's old and someone just replied to something that's two years old, I probably won't have that much interest in it. If you could put the "Topic started" date right next to the subject on each forums' main page, that would be great.

[paul w]

Originally posted by Demonhood:
hehe, maybe.

here are a few of the temp graphics i'm using:

I'd love it if you guys worked on the logo. Something along the lines of effgee/Nick's idea.

Or there's my sillyness:

[dcmacdaddy]

Originally posted by anthonyvthc:
I'd like to see, without clicking on a topic, when the topic was created. Sometimes I'll be gone for a few days, come back, and there will be a thread that's like three pages long. If it's new, chances are I'll read it, but if it's old and someone just replied to something that's two years old, I probably won't have that much interest in it. If you could put the "Topic started" date right next to the subject on each forums' main page, that would be great.

Good idea. I come and go from the forums as well and it would be nice to know by who AND when a particular thread was started.

[im_noahselby]

Originally posted by Demonhood:
here are a few of the temp graphics i'm using:

I actually like this logo a lot. It's clear and feels somwhat familiar to me. I don't think they want to do something drastically different, but I could be wrong.

Noah

[ReggieX]

1) vlinks MUST BE A DIFFERENT COLOUR.

2) it's not hard at all to write a regexp for the reply script that automagically changes a quoted image's IMG link to URL, so even if people quote an image, it gets turned to a link. SomethingAwful does this and it's a beautiful thing.

3) Say no to image attachments, there are enough free picture hosts out there like Imageshack that make the vB code for you. Maybe link to a few instead in the FAQ.

4) No quick reply box, it only encourages people to post without thinking. Not that that stops people now, but at least the effort of clicking "Reply" pauses the itchy fingers.

[ManOfSteal]

Originally posted by ReggieX:
4) No quick reply box, it only encourages people to post without thinking. Not that that stops people now, but at least the effort of clicking "Reply" pauses the itchy fingers.

This feature is going to be nice, definitely leave it in! Currently, if a thread has a whole bunch of pictures and you go to reply, it opens a new reply page and reloads all those pictures again...the "Quick Reply" box will eliminate that need (since it does not call up a new page) and make things much faster IMHO.

[ReggieX]

Originally posted by ManOfSteal:
Currently, if a thread has a whole bunch of pictures and you go to reply, it opens a new reply page and reloads all those pictures again...

Good point. We need more JPEG orgies around here anyway.

[ManOfSteal]

Can then new "Lock" icon be a Trodgor?

[Xeo]

Originally posted by ReggieX:
1) vlinks MUST BE A DIFFERENT COLOUR.

2) it's not hard at all to write a regexp for the reply script that automagically changes a quoted image's IMG link to URL, so even if people quote an image, it gets turned to a link. SomethingAwful does this and it's a beautiful thing.

3) Say no to image attachments, there are enough free picture hosts out there like Imageshack that make the vB code for you. Maybe link to a few instead in the FAQ.

4) No quick reply box, it only encourages people to post without thinking. Not that that stops people now, but at least the effort of clicking "Reply" pauses the itchy fingers.

1) Agree. Although there are images which serve this purpose already.
2) Agree! Great idea.
3) Agree. Don't need to waste server bandwidth for pics.
4) Disagree. On the forums that implement this, I love it.

[AKcrab]

Originally posted by ManOfSteal:
Can then new "Lock" icon be a Trodgor?

(I thought this was your job.)

[ManOfSteal]

Originally posted by AKcrab:
(I thought this was your job.)

[CharlesS]

This thread is horribly off topic and should be moved to the Feedback forum where it belongs!

[paul w]

Originally posted by im_noahselby:
I actually like this logo a lot. It's clear and feels somwhat familiar to me. I don't think they want to do something drastically different, but I could be wrong.

Noah

Probably not, but it always irks me that the magnifying glass DOESN'T MAGNIFY!

The new rectangular one is actually INFERIOR to the current one IMHO. If you're going to mess with the logo at all, go NUTS with a bunch of different designs, then whittle them down to two or three.

Then let US vote.

[Superchicken]

Tomorrow I'll be home... I think I might do a few mock up graphics... please can we get something brighter than this awful what is it 001133? Need more saturation!

[sideus]

Not go down at 0430 every morning.

[RAILhead]

Let us scale images, but put a file size cap (like Fark does) so people don't get too carried away with bandwidth waste.

Of course, VBB may not be able to scale pics for all I know...

Maury

[jebjeb]

Originally posted by sideus:
Not go down at 0430 every morning.

Ha! It goes down at 0930 here in the UK. I guess it means at least I get some work done in the morning!

On a similar note, not sure if this would be part of the "more user options" area but can we have an option for low colour/simple graphics? The current setup is quite good for browsing at work but it could still be a bit... simpler. As suggested above, I would happily pay for the privilege of no ads but along with that I would like the option to show the forums in a fairly non-flashy way (similar to the current setup). It attracts less attention at work.

Before any of you call me lazy , a lot of my work involves running complex calculations and reports so I have many a 2 or 3 minute space where I can browse the forums here. Being a little less conspicuous would be nice though.

[CharlesS]

Originally posted by RAILhead:
Let us scale images, but put a file size cap (like Fark does) so people don't get too carried away with bandwidth waste.

Of course, VBB may not be able to scale pics for all I know...

Maury

Agreed, except that if you do this, there should be a "Picture Thread" check box or something that the thread starter could check which would allow this to be overridden, because some threads actually require large images to be able to be posted.

What would be really nice, although I have no idea if it would be possible with vBulletin or not, would be if there were a way to have wide images not widen the whole thread, but instead just that one post.

[starman]

Two things:

Thread rating - bad idea. This gets abused to death on other forums. Same with user ratings. It's just asking for trouble.

Removal of post count - Either way you look at it, I still think it's rather fun. Yeah, yeah, we all see the +1 (which won't go away if you're still doing titles) but it's actually quite interesting to see people's numbers go up. Who cares if someone wants to rant about getting 10,000 posts? We're supposed to be a community, no? I say keep the post counts. In the grand scheme of things, this is hardly a serious issue.

Mike

[starman]

Originally posted by ReggieX:
1) vlinks MUST BE A DIFFERENT COLOUR.

2) it's not hard at all to write a regexp for the reply script that automagically changes a quoted image's IMG link to URL, so even if people quote an image, it gets turned to a link. SomethingAwful does this and it's a beautiful thing.

3) Say no to image attachments, there are enough free picture hosts out there like Imageshack that make the vB code for you. Maybe link to a few instead in the FAQ.

4) No quick reply box, it only encourages people to post without thinking. Not that that stops people now, but at least the effort of clicking "Reply" pauses the itchy fingers.

Agree on all except #4 simply because sometimes it takes a while to L-O-A-D the reply page and then L-O-A-D the forum again. Quick Reply takes out of the long load times.

Mike

[Demonhood]

Originally posted by paul w:
Probably not, but it always irks me that the magnifying glass DOESN'T MAGNIFY!

picky picky.

The new rectangular one is actually INFERIOR to the current one IMHO. If you're going to mess with the logo at all, go NUTS with a bunch of different designs, then whittle them down to two or three.

well, i'm not as fond of my old one. it's using the old Apple Garamond (i think, it's been awhile) font that isn't used by Apple any longer. the new one uses Myriad and is a hell of a lot cleaner. it's also a small revision, not a "go nuts" redesign. i've retained the color scheme, the mag glass and the tagline.

Originally posted by RAILhead:
Let us scale images, but put a file size cap (like Fark does) so people don't get too carried away with bandwidth waste.

this is only possible if we allow attachments, which we aren't going to.
i suppose it may be possible if the server was setup to download each image, determine the dimensions, and then resize/restrict them. but that would kill the server.

Originally posted by jebjeb:
On a similar note, not sure if this would be part of the "more user options" area but can we have an option for low colour/simple graphics?

i could always make a 'simple' theme and have that be an option down the road. i'll consider it.

[Demonhood]

Originally posted by ReggieX:
1) vlinks MUST BE A DIFFERENT COLOUR.
2) it's not hard at all to write a regexp for the reply script that automagically changes a quoted image's IMG link to URL, so even if people quote an image, it gets turned to a link. SomethingAwful does this and it's a beautiful thing.
3) Say no to image attachments, there are enough free picture hosts out there like Imageshack that make the vB code for you. Maybe link to a few instead in the FAQ.
4) No quick reply box, it only encourages people to post without thinking. Not that that stops people now, but at least the effort of clicking "Reply" pauses the itchy fingers. [/B]

1 - sure
2 - good idea, i'll look into it
3 - agreed
4 - sorry, quick replies stay. they're far too convenient.

[effgee]

Originally posted by starman:
Thread rating - bad idea. This gets abused to death on other forums. Same with user ratings. It's just asking for trouble. ...

Eleventy Billion % (*) agreement on that one. Isn't there enough bickering going on already? Imagine the usual scenario:

• A posts a thread about a topic of which he knows (in advance) that it will blow B's fuse. A posts, B stops by and flames A for flame-baiting B. In the meantime, D and G agree with B and bitch-fest is in full bloom - until the dude with the "lock" stops by

To this you may now add the extra-explosive bitch-topic of "You bastard rated my post with 0 (or whatever) - I'll show you". From there on you will see cliques of simple- no, uhm I meant similar-minded folks on the hunt for topics posted by people who they generally disagree with - and the spiral begins.

Downward, that is.

My suggestion would be this: Implement a rating system where it makes sense - the tech forums, so they can serve their intended purpose but for God's sake please customize(**) the templates for the Lounge so that no ratings are shown in any of its threads(***).

Please.

(*) - I thought this is one case where MoS's "Eleventy Billion" fits especially well.
(**) - If vBulletin's templates are anything like those used in phpBB (which I'm sure they are) that should be a trivial matter - hell, I'd even volunteer to take care of that. And yeah, I have implemented a forum solution (phpBB) before - to the point where it actually looked good.



(***) - Come to think of it, I'd probably leave the rating system implemented for the PoliLounge - sounds like evil fun

[selowitch]

I'd like a button that, when pressed, would send a PM request to delete the current post. The request would go to either a randomly selected administrator who is currently online or to the first administrator to log on after the request is sent.

Can you see the usefulness of this proposed feature?

[selowitch]

Originally posted by ReggieX:
it's not hard at all to write a regexp for the reply script that automagically changes a quoted image's IMG link to URL, so even if people quote an image, it gets turned to a link. SomethingAwful does this and it's a beautiful thing.

Fantastic, excellent suggestion! Hear, hear!

[effgee]

Uh yeah - what I'd like to see in a reworked forum ...

A new page layout. A clean and user-friendly one that:

• doesn't have the visual appeal of an Excel spreadsheet (I'm talking about the gazillions of 1px lines in the current layout)
• keeps the extreme contrast between the dark blue and the light page background in check - a contrast like that is fine for a page header but it doesn't have to appear multiple times on a single page (a lighter shade of blue and/or a darker shade of gray would do just fine). I do like the basic color scheme with shades of gray, etc.
• groups navigational items in a more logical manner - as far as that's concerned, the current layout looks like it suffers from a rather severe case of the measels - every couple hundred pixels, there's a couple of links - that don't always have to show up at that particular point. Also, I'd remove the many duplicate links - duplication at the top and the bottom of long pages is a good thing but having the same links show up twice in some page footers (once as text as well as a second time in a menu) makes no sense.

that's it for round one ...

[MindFad]

I like the check marks, 'Hooder. The blue would go better with the color scheme of the site, I'm thinking, though, but it would be cool if the blue one was as nicely anti-aliased as the red one.

Are you aiming for the blue and red tags being the new and unchanged graphics? Like red as a forum with a new post? Keeping with the old light bulb idea, some faded grey and the blue one as "updated" might look nice.



I also took a stab at the logo again. I think I did once a long time ago, but I can't find anything. Definitely a to going with Myriad. Good font, clean, easy to read. Basically went with what you were doing, only really including the "reader forums" text inside the box. Magnifying glass is a bit more bold, but it's an idea.



As for the quick reply box, I like the idea. Keep it! I also like the idea for replies to turn the inline images into links. That would be a nice touch.

[CharlesS]

I agree that getting rid of post counts is a good idea.

I also agree that user ratings / karma would only be a workable idea if only the mods were able to assign ratings.

[paul w]

Originally posted by MindFad:
I also took a stab at the logo again. I think I did once a long time ago, but I can't find anything. Definitely a to going with Myriad. Good font, clean, easy to read. Basically went with what you were doing, only really including the "reader forums" text inside the box. Magnifying glass is a bit more bold, but it's an idea.

Yay! A magnifying glass that actually works! I think it's a bit cramped though.