[simonjames]

When most of the world writes their dates in dd-mm-yyyy format and the ISO format is yyyy-mm-dd why do Americans use mm-dd-yyyy?

To my knowledge the latest Excel won't acccept dates in any other format except the American format - this is so damned annoying

[denim]

Yes, it is annoying. I prefer YYYYMMDD or DD-MMM-YYYY, myself.

[jholmes]

I think the proper date format is a good dinner followed by a movie or stage play, topped off by a coffee or >drinks<.

A better date format ends up with breakfast. Other than that DD/MM/YYYY

>edit - The thought police won't accept the word c*cktail? <
------------------

`Everybody is ignorant. Only on different subjects.' -- Will Rogers

[This message has been edited by jholmes (edited 12-07-2000).]

[rupee68]

I prefer something off the wall, not the typical date. So, I might go some place really weird, go to a nice restaurant that nobody's heard of, then go outside, like skiing or something

Speakoing of whihci. I 've ALWYAS wanted... ok, you konw how the typical Aspen lodge had a big polar bear rug enxt to the fireplace???!

I wanna hvae sex on the polar bear rug, witht eh fire crackleing. That woudl be cool.




Ca$h

[Cipher13]

Its just something typical American.
I mean, they couldn't possibly do something that makes any SENSE.
Like changing the spelling of all their damned words...
And what sense is there in MM-DD-YYYY anyway?
I mean, DD-MM-YYYY is so much more logical - smaller units to larger units
Damned yanks.
EDIT: Blah, blah... I don't mean any offense to any Americans reading this, contrary to what it seems. I am right though. I'm just playing upon the image of the American that every other coutry in the world has of you lot. Most Americans I have talked to I liked, so that makes it ok. I know its a blatent and untrue generalisation. Don't take it personally.

Cipher13

[This message has been edited by Cipher13 (edited 12-08-2000).]

[residentEvil]

i guess it is written similar to how we speak the date? is it not December 8th today? Granted some would say the 8th of December, but not many. to be honest, other than reading books of old or hearing/seeing an english play of yesterday, i can't think of the last time i heard anyone say the '8th of december' most cases we say the month first, then day. MM/DD/YYYY

[Misha]

While I agree that the US should conform to what are otherwise standards, I think MM-DD-YYYY makes sense. If you're scanning for a general date (i.e. month), it's the first thing you see. It only makes sense to sort a list by the first character(s), which is also another vote for MM-DD-YYYY, since that's chronologically correct.

[denim]

Originally posted by residentEvil:
i guess it is written similar to how we speak the date? is it not December 8th today?

It generally depends on what you're used to. Having worked in computers for a while and done some Y2K work, I definitely have preferences in this area. I'd say it's the 8th of December 2000. Or, if I was sorting, I'd say it's 20001208. Nothing else makes sense to me. IMHO, the really strange one is the UNIX date format: MMDDhhmmCCYY.ss! Who the heck figured that made sense??

I also use a 24-hour clock in normal conversation, and have never been in the military. I understand that the 24-hour notation is the standard in some countries, but I've never been out of North America so I've not seen it.

[3gg3]

Originally posted by jholmes:


>edit - The thought police won't accept the word c*cktail? <

Mods: this should be moved over to the "separating words" topic � where the real subject is "building words". The logical conclusion of this build might be "ticklec*cktailsmoke".

Which is another great sounding date format!

[shmerek]

The US should get off it's butt and start using the metric system

------------------
"Away put your weapon I mean you no harm"

-Yoda

[babble]

Originally posted by denim:
I understand that the 24-hour notation is the standard in some countries, but I've never been out of North America so I've not seen it.

It's standard in French speaking contries (like here in Qu�bec) Wow, an accent on a word... God, you guys must be really lost now... But, it doesn't sound Military at all when WE say it. You Americans seem, when you say it, to be giving orders or to be doing something really important... Let's meet at 16 hours 30 minutes! But, when we say it, we only say let's meet at 16-30. Less anoying.

And, yes I agree with Cypher, that the date format of MMDDYYYY is a stupid American policy that the rest of world has to endure...


[This message has been edited by babble (edited 12-08-2000).]

Does anyone know how to change the default format in Date and Time control? I hate discovering it's reverted to mm-dd-yy!

[Arty50]

So in French speaking countries are analog watches made with 12 or 24 hour faces?

[simonjames]

when you manually add, subtract, multiply etc numbers which side do you start on? When you go from one day to the next isn't it more logical to add '1' to the right most digit? Isn't a date a number?

Also - people do say 8th of December - they used to even say the eighth day of December in the year two thousand.

[Cipher13]

I say "eighth of December", not "December 8"...
Someone asks "whats the date today", you answer "eighth" first. They don't care what month it is, they oughta know!
Saying December then eighth or whatever means it takes longer for you to get across the piece of information useful to them.
Normally when using dates you are being specific - otherwise you'd say "in a few months", not "around March/April".
And being specific means you use the number of the day, normally in order to signify when an event is going to take place or whatever.

Cipher13

[CaseCom]

If someone asks me what day it is, you're right, I say "the eighth."

If I need to ask for a day off from work next month, I say "I'd like to be off January sixth." Not "the sixth of January," and not "January six."

When someone asks me what day my birthday is, I say "August 12th."

The exception is our Independence Day holiday, which is often called "the Fourth of July," although it's also called "July Fourth" or just "the Fourth."

If it's efficiency you're after, "the eighth of December" seems like a lot of extra syllables to me.

[Cipher13]

Hm... for my birthday I'd say "2nd March", not "March 2nd"...
As for Fourth of July...
Thats how I'd say it. Now check this. The song Yankee Doodle Dandy, is like one of those ultra pro American things right? Or at least American right?
Or something.
I always relate that song to the whole America, Uncle Sam kinda image.
And the song states "Born on the Fourth of July", does it not?
Hm... anyway I'm sure you get my point there right??
I know its cause it rhymes, but thats besides the point. Even the song says it our way!!!

Cipher13

[ThinkInsane]

Having been in the military, I can tell you that no one says '16 hours 30 minutes'. It's 'sixtenn thirty'. If it's 4:00 pm, it's just 'sixteen hundred'. If it's 4:00 am, it's 'oh four hundred'. Ya dig?

Why do we do the date the way we do? Why do we not conform to the metric system? For the very simple reason that you can't make us!

P.S. Quebec sucks

[simonjames]

"you can't make us" - ha

one day, we will

all empires fall - look at history

[Cipher13]

...and the bigger they are, the harder they fall.

Cipher13

[shmerek]

Originally posted by ThinkInsane:

P.S. Quebec sucks

Yes some of it sucks but Montreal is one of the best cities it is cheap, cultured and the women are absolutely gorgeous

------------------
"Away put your weapon I mean you no harm"

-Yoda

[DBursey]

Quebec rocks; TI sucks, n'est pas?

[ThinkInsane]

Oh no! The Aussies are c-c-c-coming to k-k-kill us!

I get sick of all this America bashing that goes on here lately. I think it is stupid and pointless. This country has its problems and downfalls just like any other. So what is it about this place that people hate so much? What makes our culture a "junk culture" when compared to the far superior culture of India? These same people that bash us time and time again don't hesitate to ask for a hand when things don't go their way. Kind of hypocritical, don't you think? If Quebec gets it's independence, how long before the start asking the U.S. for aid? A week, two maybe? Or if, say Canada decides they don't want it separate, and takes it back by force, do you really think they wouldn't be asking us for assistance? Or if it was Australia that was invaded and seized, you mean to tell me you wouldn't want to see the 82nd Airborne dropping from the sky and U.S. Marines on the beach? I wasn't born here, but this is my home. If you don't want me to be defensive, stop being offensive. Simple as that.

[bizzare]

What's wrong with this sentence:

"You should paint the centre a different colour."

------------------

[zappy]

Misha wrote:

While I agree that the US should conform to what are otherwise standards, I think MM-DD-YYYY makes sense. If you're scanning for a general date (i.e. month), it's the first thing you see. It only makes sense to sort a list by the first character(s), which is also another vote for MM-DD-YYYY, since that's chronologically correct.

A chronologically correct format would be YYYY-MM-DD. This is the only format that makes sense to me and is a official standard (at least in germany). But still almost everyone uses DD-MM-YYYY in germany.

Regards

[Cipher13]

How is that the ONLY one that makes sense?
Sure the numbers switch from far right to left, but who cares?
Not everything has to conform to something like that.
DD-MM-YYYY shifts the number on the far left first. That is the number you read first, the one you WANT to see generally.
Then the month is in the middle...
What is wrong with that?
Think: lay off.
You're taking this too damned personally. I'm sure the US would help in a war, but given their history, probably not until it was just about over
Come in at the last minute, and take all the glory...
The US isn't the only country in the world, you know - and its not the only strong country in the world.
Its got muscles to flex, but could still get its ass kicked.

Cipher13

[simonjames]

Think - your first comment about the Aussies coming to kill you (you should get your stutter fixed) is just typical of the US attitude that the rest of the World hates. And what really was the purpose of the stutter? Why did you put it in?

Being a country with not many people, Australia often gets treated poorly in world events such as the World Trade Organisation - I don't suppose you heard what the US government applies in the way of a tarrif on imports of Australian lamb or Australian leather? And if we disagree? We're informed that any objections raised with the WTO will jeopardise any sales of military hardware.

At the end of the Sydney Olympics I read in some US newspapers that 'Australia should never have the Olympics again - not because they didn't do a good job but because the time zone was wrong for USA viewers'. What sort of attitude is that? I find it 'offensive' just as I find it offensive that companies like Apple & Micro$oft force us to use the American spellings and date formats.

And yes, I'd love to see the US help us out if we were invaded but as we don't have much in the way of oil so I can't see the help arriving too quickly.

Finally Think - I used to live in America (Chicago)- I've travelled there 12 times and visited nearly every state - I know the people. These fora are opened to everyone wanting to express their opinion without the fear of personal attacks and so I believe I can voice my opinion and ideas without being labelled 'stupid' and 'pointless'.

[ThinkInsane]

Ok, a couple of points to make here.

1. I was drunk when I made the post. I meant what I said, but I am sure that things would have been put a little more diplomatically if I was sober.
2. The stutter is from "A Fish Called Wanda", one of my favorite movies. "Oh no, K-K-K-Ken is c-c-c-coming to k-k-k-kill me".
3. I do not see ANY point in bashing someone elses home. We all have things to be proud of, and things that need fixing. I have traveled quite a bit, and have heard many people in many countries that bad mouth the U.S. with out ever having been here. They judge us by what they see in movies, not on facts. You've been here. Great. Does that make you an expert on the United States? I've been to Australia, but consider myself more a tourist than an expert.
4. When I made a comment, "Quebec sucks", Canadians got defensive. If I get defensive, I'm being an arrogant American. Go figure... Do I think Quebec sucks? Not really. I kind of like it there. Montreal's a very nice city. I go as often as I can manage. I have friends there. I will be there Sunday to attend a Christmas party hosted by them.
5. If you were to meet me in person, you would not know I was an American, because I still have a heavy Irish brogue. I have lived more than half of my life OUTSIDE of the United States.
6. There is a lot wrong with this country. I'll be the first to admit it. Can you all tell me that your countries are perfect? I wish I new of one, because I would be applying for my visa right now.

In closing, I would just like people to tell me WHY they say the things that they do. If you are going to say something offensive about 250 million people, at least tell me why you are saying. State your case. Maybe when put in context, it won't sound so offensive. Thank you for your time.

[nana2]

If you don't send the airborne divisions when Indonesia decides we've got too much free land then we are screwed for sure

God Bless America

[denim]

Originally posted by ThinkInsane:
Oh no! The Aussies are c-c-c-coming to k-k-kill us!

"Let's kill us some goddam Australians!"
"I think we're fighting Canadians."

[Kaglan]

On dates:

(I am American):

I usually use dates like 13 December 2000 or 13 Dec. 2000. This looks normal, is unambiguous, and splits up the numbers with a word, thus making them easier to read. I rarely use the number/number/number format, but when I do, I obviously need to match my audience. But I really think 13 Dec. 2000 is the best for short dates, or 13 December 2000 for long dates.

On the metric system:

I'm in training to be a physicist. I would much prefer America switch to metric. There might be hope in pulling that off in a few years, if they tried again. Most everybody around these days has at least been exposed to metric in school.

It would take a while to adjust of course. Even though I use metric for science, I don't have a "feel" for some metric measurments. I can visualize meters/cm pretty well, liters to a lesser degree, mass I have no idea, temperature I need to think about.

Other random topic:

Internet address move from specific to general, with the computer name first. If we did street addresses like this:
hoeingreshall.uofr.rochester.newyork.usa
But the file hierarchy is the otherway around
Applications/Productivity/Excel/....

Isn't odd we mix the two styles in our internet addresses?

Why not

edu.Rochester.www/living/....
big to small.....
?


------------
aluminum. (a loo' men um)

(I do tend to spell color as colour, and gray as grey. But then if I spell anything the same way twice in a paper I consider myself lucky.)

[macmad]

Whats the big deal? The metric system is sooooo easy, even I can do the math in my head! 16 of them, and 14 of these, bakers dozen, 12 somethings to a stone, 28 something elses to a fathom, 16 whatevers to a chain, I can't even remember it all. Lets just work in base 10/100/1000! The UK is really screwed up in mixing metric and imperial: you buy a 6ft length of 22mm coper pipe, or a 2 meter length of 4x2 (lumber). We really should standardize on this stuff.
Plus, IMHO, today is 13.12.00 - not 12.13.00!! And is 2241, if anyones looking at the clock. Thankyou, and goodnight.