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I feel that Apple should better explain QE mechanics so people wont get confused. I feel that the silence from Apple on ALL issues discussed on this forum for the past year led to enormous losses of time for the participants. For example, not even mentioning QE, which is still new technology, I dont remember any clear explanation from Apple on why the old Quarz was so slow as hell. They were able to sidestep the explanation by releasing faster hardware which managed to make Quarz faster by sheer force - but I remember how much was Quarz slowness debated here, and no clear conclusion was derived. Now its beginning again.

I understand that Apple releases cool hardware with awesome software, which also costs a lot. Isnt it natural that consumers who pay thousands bucks for Quicksilvers, Indigos, TiBooks, IceBooks and all other Apple ***** (put your definition here) would still like to hear why the OS is so slow, Quarz is slow, Finder sucks on CURRENT hardware? Now we are forced to buy even the latest and greatest (not from MS!) from Apple, again costing a lot, to have a decent speed of Finder!

Heck, and why the previous latest and greatest OS sucked so much? Where are clear explanations? Where is guarantee the new great Super Fast Extreme Cool Rocket-Speed-Exceeding Quarz- the ******** will run at decent speed on the hardware Apple says or is it going to explain after selling a lot of new hardware that QE will be really suppported only on G5, G6 and etc? No, there is not such guarantee. But consumers already feel they have been deceived by Apple on many issues of supported and required hardware-software combination (for example, the problem of older "supported" hardware for OSX, resulting in lawsuit) and etc.

I think such steps lead to increasing loss of credibitlity for Apple. Company releases hardware which can not support its own software..or software not supporting its hardware. No one can buy now Apple's hardware and being assured that it will run the OS in few next months!

Well, let me tell all those, who will rant that hardware sold now, does not have to support software, which will be released in 6 months from now. First, no one buys computers and expects to use them only for 6 months, especially Macs, which USED to have longer life than PCs, but its no longer true. People use computers, even PCs, for 1.5-3 years, and Macs used to have 3-5 year cycle. But now..

Apple devalues its own hardware with increasing speed now. iBooks sold now are already too old; such were recent TiBooks. Yet, hardware prices are still too high compared with PC side. How Apple can expect consumers to invest thousands bucks into its hardware, which can be made obsolete by Apple itself any second immediately after purchase? Its plain stupid. Yeah, we need great Qarrtz for 21 century but at the same time, ask consumers, what they want? Do they want overpriced fancy shadow-dropping requiring maybe 64 and 128 MB VRAM cards for optimal performance JUST for decent FInder, window resizing and wordprocessing?..Its crazy.

[snerdini]

first of all, osx runs wonderfully on my new 933 g4 w/ 512 megs of ram. could it be faster? sure. it could always be faster. but it definitely runs as fast as i need it to (photoshop, maya, dreamweaver, fireworks, etc.)

second of all, mac users seem to want the impossible. they want dual processor g5's to cost the same as the new pentiums, and still have a longer lifespan than pc's. sorry, folks, but that's just not how the new world of technology works.

plus you have to consider that osx is a major jump in technology. no one else out there is even doing anything close right now. alot of people don't seem to appreciate the direction apple is going - they either lack vision, or these new changes lack appeal to them. either way, i don't agree. i feel mac users are in the best position they have been in years, but alot of them are too stubborn to realize this.

i, like everyone else, want to see improvements in jaguar. and from what i've seen and heard so far, most, if not all my complaints about osx are currently being addressed. it doesn't mean that apple is perfect. far from it. but consider your options, and suddenly osx is looking pretty damn good.

[snerdini]

oh, and i have mixed feelings about the shroud of secrecy that apple works under. i have to admit, i like good surprises, and i think keeping their long term plan hidden from competitors could be good, but i think sometimes apple shoots themselves in the foot by keeping things secret up until the last minute.

[kulverse]

Ths is just the way that I understand it. I'm no expert and could be completely wrong. So read completely before making any conclusions about my intelligence

Quartz is actually fast in comparison to QuickDraw. The reason that Quartz is slow in comparison, is because its unaccelerated. Now...when I boot into OS 9.2 on my Duel 450 G4, 768Mb, and turn off my Radeons 2D acceleration, QuickDraw is unbearably slow. the interface, especially scrolling, is dog slow. This is why I'm impressed with Quartz. Quartz has all the glitz and glamour and is just as fast, or i think, even faster than an unacclerated QuickDraw. That said...I do hope they get this Quartz Extream thing down. You see, while impressed with Quartz, I'm not happy with it yet. I would like a fast interface, like i get in OS 9.2, or at least close.

Why Apple doesn't explain this stuff to it's consumers, is possibly because it's admitting there is a problem, before they have a solution. Once they have a solution, they tend to admit that there are speed issues. Like when they previewed 10.1 last year, and as I'm sure they will do when they officially preview Quartz Extream. Apple will get OS X right. Its an incredible system. I'm finally able to work on my 100Mb + PhotoShop files without bringing the system down (although I have crashed photoShop itself twice)

I have not touched this Jaguar Build, and I won't till it's released. So I have not tested QE yet. But I'm looking forward to it. OS X Rules! (imho)

Edit: One of the major factors in the super fast Quartz you seek, is new Hardware. Apple has to maintain a balance of looking to the future and supporting current hardware. its a tough to innovate that way. I see some people here complaining that their 3 - 4 year old G3 isnt supported fully. I think thats asking a lot to a company that is trying to make a better system than anyone else. innovation needs new technologies. now if only they could get their hardware to spec Looking forward to MWNY

[ 05-12-2002: Message edited by: kulverse ]