[Uncle Skeleton]

Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE 

What was I just saying about their ALWAYS being an excuse? ALWAYS!

Oh please. If someone works from home, they use more energy at home. If you want to be analogous to that, you'd have to include the energy use of the white house in Bush's figure. And why would I make apologies for Gore anyway? Did you ever notice I've been arguing against the global warming parade?

You want to explain what an "eGore" is supposed to be now? Is it like Eeyore? I like Eeyore; I drew him on my wall once. Maybe ogre? Or maybe the people who type it just have clumsy typing, like when they write "their" when they mean to say "there" ...? I'm just curious.

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton 

Oh please. If someone works from home, they use more energy at home. If you want to be analogous to that, you'd have to include the energy use of the white house in Bush's figure. And why would I make apologies for Gore anyway? Did you ever notice I've been arguing against the global warming parade?

Nonsense. Millions of people work from their homes and don't use anywhere near the energy eGore uses- and on top of it, most of them don't make a hypocritical living berating others about their energy use.

I have no idea why you would make apologies for Gore, but that's exactly what you're doing.

The level of insane, inflammatory rhetoric that Gore uses constantly goes way beyond most others of his stripe- he labels his beliefs a moral issue, and constantly lectures everyone to do as he says (not as he does) lest the sky fall.

He exaggerates wildly, presents out-and-out falsehoods as fact, and stands up before congress with his decrees about what everyone else must do. He declares all debate over, and seeks to silence those that disagree.

For that level of blowhard to turn around and not practice what he crams down everyone else's throat as mandatory (he should do so even MORE than the average person, let alone much less than the average person) and then make up idiotic excuses for it, is the absolute height of hypocrisy. But then, that trait is basically the hallmark of the Global Warming crowd.

Just ranting is all eGore types ever assign themselves to do, while they use excessive amounts of energy and pretty much ignore virtually everything they espouse for others.(And then float ENDLESS excuses why it's okay, and why they're always excluded from being the cause of their own doomsday beliefs).

Personally, I could care less how much energy the guy uses, just don't give me all this bullcrap and endless list of excuses why he can't be called out for being the shameless hypocrite that he is.

You want to explain what an "eGore" is supposed to be now?

Really, does it matter all that much? It's to offset the carbon emissions that typing out enviroreligiousnut-Gore every time would use up.

[tie]

Ah, I thought it was like an email or ebook. Internet-inventor iGore (the fat mouth).

But while you're good at making up names, you aren't good at coming up with arguments. If Gore is carbon-neutral, his energy usage doesn't matter for global warming.

[Buckaroo]

Originally Posted by tie 

Ah, I thought it was like an email or ebook. Internet-inventor iGore (the fat mouth).

But while you're good at making up names, you aren't good at coming up with arguments. If Gore is carbon-neutral, his energy usage doesn't matter for global warming.

Al Gore is NOT carbon neutal. Carbon Neutral is all a scam. Until he consumes less energy than the average person, it's all a BS.

CARBON NEUTRAL IS BS. It does NOT exist. It's a lie. If he consumes energy, then that energy no longer exists.

[Uncle Skeleton]

Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE 

Nonsense. Millions of people work from their homes and don't use anywhere near the energy eGore uses

But most of those people are just pulling down a paycheck, or running a business of a few people. Gore is running a large campaign of thousands of people. If you were really looking at comparable energy uses, you would divide the cost by the number of people working there. Each of those people would be using energy at whatever job they did.

I have no idea why you would make apologies for Gore, but that's exactly what you're doing.

I don't give a crap about Gore, I'm just letting you know your argument makes no sense.

The level of insane, inflammatory rhetoric that Gore uses constantly goes way beyond most others of his stripe- he labels his beliefs a moral issue, and constantly lectures everyone to do as he says (not as he does) lest the sky fall.

I don't think that's out of character at all for others of his stripe. You might recall a recent thumbsup you gave in another thread where I outlined how Gore's message is almost identical to the majority of warmongering neoconservative activists. Unless you're trying to paint Gore in a different stripe from all other political figures, I don't think there's any way for you to make the case in that statement.

For that level of blowhard to turn around and not practice what he crams down everyone else's throat

You seem to be forgetting that no matter what you personally think about "carbon credits," he believes them. If everyone else did the same carbon credit thing he does, which you consider a scam, he would still be happy. That's why he's not a hypocrite.

Originally Posted by Buckaroo 

Until he consumes less energy than the average person, it's all a BS.

That's quite an arbitrary and inconstant line.

If he consumes energy, then that energy no longer exists.

It's not about energy availability, it's about emissions.

[besson3c]

Let's just cut to the chase here:

- Nobody here really knows what is going on with our environment, with the exception of those who have done in depth environmental study and have devoted a significant portion of their lives to conducting and peer reviewing research. Gut feelings don't cut it, sorry.

- For all of us that don't really know what's going on (myself included), we can make choices about what theories we find to be the most persuasive. For some of us, it will be pro global warming, some will be anti. I choose to agree with the overall educated consensus, which is pro global warming

- Whether you like or dislike Al Gore, think he's a hypocrite, whatever, it does not matter... There are many others saying what he is saying, the fact that he is also saying this stuff does not make what he is saying wrong

[Uncle Skeleton]

But Al Gore is one of those people familiar with the scientific evidence (as far as we know), and if anyone in the world would be swayed to the cause, he would. That's why it's relevant to find out if he's not really swayed by it after all.

Also "there are many others saying what he is saying" is an appeal to an unnamed authority fallacy.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton 

But Al Gore is one of those people familiar with the scientific evidence (as far as we know), and if anyone in the world would be swayed to the cause, he would. That's why it's relevant to find out if he's not really swayed by it after all.

Also "there are many others saying what he is saying" is an appeal to an unnamed authority fallacy.

I don't know the actual names of the scientists that were present at the UN environmental summit thing, sorry!

Why does it matter whether Gore is swayed by it or not? There are many variables to account for including his personal profit motivation, his political interests, etc. We'll never really be able to peer into his sole, so why bother with all of the gossipy speculation?

[Buckaroo]

Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton 

But Al Gore is one of those people familiar with the scientific evidence (as far as we know), and if anyone in the world would be swayed to the cause, he would. That's why it's relevant to find out if he's not really swayed by it after all.

Also "there are many others saying what he is saying" is an appeal to an unnamed authority fallacy.

If he's familiar with anything it's BS. EVERYTHING HE SAID was LIES.

He claimed Carbon Dioxide caused increases in heat. But his data that he presented said that Inceases in heat caused increases in Carbon Dioxide. He LIED, he's STUPID and/or full of BULLSHIT.

It's like he's pointing at a solid wall painted red and says it's blue. Maybe because he's color blind or because he is a LIAR. That does not make the wall blue. It's a red wall, and all you Y3K wakos only see the color Gore tells you.

What color is this?

[Uncle Skeleton]

Originally Posted by besson3c

Why does it matter whether Gore is swayed by it or not?

Because if anyone in the world would be swayed to the cause, he would. Is anyone else getting deja vu here?

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Buckaroo 

If he's familiar with anything it's BS. EVERYTHING HE SAID was LIES.

He claimed Carbon Dioxide caused increases in heat. But his data that he presented said that Inceases in heat caused increases in Carbon Dioxide. He LIED, he's STUPID and/or full of BULLSHIT.

It's like he's pointing at a solid wall painted red and says it's blue. Maybe because he's color blind or because he is a LIAR. That does not make the wall blue. It's a red wall, and all you Y3K wakos only see the color Gore tells you.

What color is this?

Who cares? Does this really matter?

[Buckaroo]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

Who cares? Does this really matter?

What matters is Al Gore wants to kill off the human race, and all with lies.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Buckaroo 

What matters is Al Gore wants to kill off the human race, and all with lies.

Heh...

He's a guy with an ideological bent, like so many others in our history. That is it. You are really emotional about this stuff, aren't you?

[OldManMac]

Originally Posted by Buckaroo 

What matters is Al Gore wants to kill off the human race, and all with lies.

[tie]

Originally Posted by Buckaroo 

Al Gore is NOT carbon neutal. Carbon Neutral is all a scam. Until he consumes less energy than the average person, it's all a BS.

CARBON NEUTRAL IS BS. It does NOT exist. It's a lie. If he consumes energy, then that energy no longer exists.

Buckaroo, I guess you have personal reasons for hating Gore, but this is nonsense. Carbon neutral means that your net carbon emissions are zero. I don't know if this is true for Gore or not -- I wouldn't be surprised if not, but there hasn't been any evidence given for it.

Calling something BS, a lie, a scam, saying it doesn't exist -- doesn't help your argument. Iraq is a BS, a lie, a scam, doesn't exist -- there, did that convince you we should withdraw?

What matters is Al Gore wants to kill off the human race, and all with lies.

You forgot to say "fat mouth eGore"; now Crash is going to have to correct you.

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton 

But most of those people are just pulling down a paycheck, or running a business of a few people. Gore is running a large campaign of thousands of people. If you were really looking at comparable energy uses, you would divide the cost by the number of people working there. Each of those people would be using energy at whatever job they did.

Oh come off it. Even Gore himself hasn't used any such excuse, that there are "thousands of people" working at his private residence full time, day in, day out. That's utter nonsense. His own excuse is the whole carbon offset line of baloney.

I don't think that's out of character at all for others of his stripe. You might recall a recent thumbsup you gave in another thread where I outlined how Gore's message is almost identical to the majority of warmongering neoconservative activists. Unless you're trying to paint Gore in a different stripe from all other political figures, I don't think there's any way for you to make the case in that statement.

Not sure we're talking about the same things here.

In the other thread yours was a very good argument, pointing out something that I've noticed also: that the charge of "playing on their fears" that Gore's ilk constantly accuse others of about terrorism, is EXACTLY, word for word true about the Global Warming crowd itself. I didn't agree 100% with all of your post, but just was commending you for making your case very convincingly.

As for Gore, I'm not even really so much getting into the fact that he's simply wrong with his Global Warming fear mongering (IE: he fudges his own data and outright lies about critical details), just pointing out his hypocrisy. I'd say the same of someone who actively supported terrorists, then went and made a living as an 'anti-terrorist' alarmist.

You seem to be forgetting that no matter what you personally think about "carbon credits," he believes them. If everyone else did the same carbon credit thing he does, which you consider a scam, he would still be happy. That's why he's not a hypocrite.

I'm sorry, but that logic is 100% bassakwards.

The 'if everyone did what he does' test would work exactly in reverse of what you're saying. If everyone used 30 times the amount of energy they average now, and just shuffled it off with a bunch of stupid excuses, it would IN REALITY mean only one thing: there'd be 30 times as much energy being used and 30 times as much pollution being generated! There's no buying your way out of that fact, or "offsetting it"! Just spouting on and on about what everyone else needs to do and/or claiming that you need an army of people to help your spew your spiel wouldn't change anything either.

And of course the real issue is, most people (including MOST small business owners by the way) couldn't afford to buy their way out of being gross energy hogs even IF that silly ponzi scheme of an idea actually did count for anything. Most people keep their own personal energy consumption as low as they can for one very practical reason- they can't afford not to.

It adds to Gore's hypocrisy in that he can afford to clean up his act, but like the typical "Do as I say, not as I do" busybody liberal that he is, he doesn't feel he has to bother, and then floats endless excuses for it. He talks a lot of talk, but doesn't walk his own walk. Yes, that makes him a hypocrite. Sorry if pointing it out gets under some folks skin, but so be it. It's not on me to polish the turds other people make into their idols.

[greenamp]

Add to this Gore's some $20,000 in royalties he made last year from letting his Carthage property be strip mined for Zinc.

What a champion of the environment. Rock on al.

[Uncle Skeleton]

Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE 

Oh come off it. Even Gore himself hasn't used any such excuse, that there are "thousands of people" working at his private residence full time, day in, day out. That's utter nonsense. His own excuse is the whole carbon offset line of baloney.

I don't know why he hasn't, but I can think of one good reason for it: he doesn't want everyone to employ thousands of people in their homes, but he does want people to buy carbon offsets. So it makes perfect sense that he would emphasize the offsets over the explanations.

I didn't say "day in, day out," and I don't know if you realize this but the whole accusation in the first place was based off one flat per-year figure. That doesn't mean day in day out either. If he hosts 1000 people, 10 times in one year, that could easily account for the "20 times the national average" figure given.

As for Gore, I'm not even really so much getting into the fact that he's simply wrong with his Global Warming fear mongering (IE: he fudges his own data and outright lies about critical details), just pointing out his hypocrisy. I'd say the same of someone who actively supported terrorists, then went and made a living as an 'anti-terrorist' alarmist.

But you'd be wrong if that person truly believed that whatever it is he's doing wasn't supporting terrorists after all. Then he wouldn't be a hypocrite, he'd just be mistaken.

Gore is doing exactly what he's telling other people to do: live a "carbon neutral" lifestyle. There are plenty of nits for you to pick over his implementation of that, but hypocrisy isn't one of them.

it would IN REALITY mean only one thing: there'd be 30 times as much energy being used and 30 times as much pollution being generated!

Hypocrisy isn't about outcomes in reality, it's about belief:

hy·poc·ri·sy
Etymology: from Greek hypokrisis act of playing a part on the stage
1 : a feigning to be what one is not or to believe what one does not

In reality, the Iraq war has created more terrorists than it defeated. Does that mean that Bush et al were hypocrites for starting the war for the purpose of fighting terrorism? No, of course not. They believed that what they were doing would have the effect of lessening terrorism. They weren't hypocritical about that, they were just mistaken. Do you see the difference?

If you want to bring "lies" into it, there are plenty of accusations of outright lying about both Gore and Bush. But none of them are "lies" that would contribute to hypocrisy. If you embellish the truth to support your side, that's only hypocrisy if you don't believe your own side. It's not hypocrisy if the side you believe turns out to be incorrect, in reality.

There's no buying your way out of that fact, or "offsetting it"!

This is a little off topic, but the main thrust of "offsets" is to produce plants (or some other means) to take carbon back out of the atmosphere. It's entirely reasonable to think that we can continue to increase our carbon fuel usage and still be able to "offset" all of it by increasing our tree-planting at an even greater rate. There are other "offsets" that use a technological strategy to target reductions or higher efficiency energy sources (and I don't agree that they should count as offsets), but you and Gore are both lumping all "offsets" into one group, so the methodology really isn't relevant.

And of course the real issue is, most people (including MOST small business owners by the way) couldn't afford to buy their way out of being gross energy hogs even IF that silly ponzi scheme of an idea actually did count for anything. Most people keep their own personal energy consumption as low as they can for one very practical reason- they can't afford not to.

Can you think about those two sentences together for a moment? 1, people can't afford to offset their emissions because they use too much energy (debatable), and 2, people can't afford to raise their energy bills to what Gore is using in his massive campaign. Don't you think those people would like to have lower energy bills? Don't you think they would be eager to try more efficient technologies that used less energy to perform the same function? Wow, if only those technologies were being developed by the companies selling carbon credits to Al Gore...wait they are, but you called it a scam. Can you see now why Gore believes this stuff? It may or may not turn out to actually work (in reality), but it's certainly plausible. It's as plausible as the whole invasion of Iraq was to the "war on terror."

It adds to Gore's hypocrisy in that he can afford to clean up his act, but like the typical "Do as I say, not as I do" busybody liberal that he is

I think this is really what you want to harp on (the slogans), but it's not applicable. He's telling people to use carbon offsets, and that's what he's doing. That's not hypocritical.

[besson3c]

When you guys have sorted this out, I'd REALLLLYYY appreciate it if somebody could tell me why this matters.

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton 

I didn't say "day in, day out," and I don't know if you realize this but the whole accusation in the first place was based off one flat per-year figure. That doesn't mean day in day out either. If he hosts 1000 people, 10 times in one year, that could easily account for the "20 times the national average" figure given.

Again, you're just making a list of excuses. Al Gore "believes" that the world is coming to an end due to excessive energy use. Yet he himself uses excessive energy. He's doing the very thing he "believes" is going to make the sky fall.

So you can make excuses ALL DAY LONG about why he uses the excessive energy- whether its he just likes to sit around all day with the lights and AC full tilt, or host 1,000 people at his house and burn two or three lights for each one of them. It's all just what I said- excuses. He "believes" one thing, but practices something else.

Gore is doing exactly what he's telling other people to do: live a "carbon neutral" lifestyle. There are plenty of nits for you to pick over his implementation of that, but hypocrisy isn't one of them.

Sorry, but this is just nonsense. I can claim to "believe" that killing people is "offset" by me fathering more kids left and right to replace the ones I kill- then go around and preach that murder is wrong- oh, unless I "offset it" as I'm doing . That's my "belief", so therefore no one can call me a hypocrite for being a murderer. BULLCHIT. Other people aren't under any obligation to labor under someone else's warped belief system.

Hypocrisy is hypocrisy- in REALITY, not because Gore and his apologists can hide behind the cover of a stupid belief system.

hy·poc·ri·sy
Etymology: from Greek hypokrisis act of playing a part on the stage
1 : a feigning to be what one is not

Methinks you didn't pay enough attention to the part that came before the 'OR'. This part is not about belief, it's about reality. A murderer IS a murderer whether he believes he is or not. (In fact, most don't believe they are). Likewise, Gore doesn't live up to his hype of polluting less and using less energy, whether he's fooled himself about it or not.

In reality, the Iraq war has created more terrorists than it defeated. Does that mean that Bush et al were hypocrites for starting the war for the purpose of fighting terrorism?

This sure doesn't help your argument. A dead terrorist or captured terrorist is an undisputed fact. Cutting off a terrorist's supply of money, destroying his assets, and deposing a regime that supported terrorists, is an undisputed fact.

The idea that you "create" a terrorist out of someone who otherwise would have been a model citizen and perfect angel merely by doing something you disagree with, is just your supposition.

There were people who said you make communism stronger by fighting it, so let's just give up and be nice. They were proven wrong. There were probably people that thought you "create" more Kamikazes out of Japanese people by dropping two nukes on their cities. That of course didn't happen. Now the myth de jour is that you "create" terrorists by ousting brutal regimes in Iraq and Afghanistan. It just doesn't wash.

Can you think about those two sentences together for a moment? 1, people can't afford to offset their emissions because they use too much energy (debatable), and 2, people can't afford to raise their energy bills to what Gore is using in his massive campaign. Don't you think those people would like to have lower energy bills?

Most people achieve lower energy bills the old fashioned way- they don't use more of it than they can afford. People don't like paying higher bills. My point is no more than that. If Gore subsided on the same income of the average American, despite all his "grand message" nonsense, he too would get by using less energy. Virtually anyone else would be stopped dead in their tracks if they received Gore's energy bills for a single month. They'd be horrified, and immediately take drastic steps to lower the costs and stop being so wasteful. Gee whiz, if that included cutting out the "let's have 1,000 people over and run the AC" or whatever other nonsense they were attempting as an EXCUSE, then so be it.

Gore is the energy hog he is, simply because he can afford to be, and believes it's all those "lower class" nobodies that need to conserve energy, not him.

[Uncle Skeleton]

Originally Posted by besson3c 

When you guys have sorted this out, I'd REALLLLYYY appreciate it if somebody could tell me why this matters.

Because if anyone in the world would be swayed to the cause, he would. Is anyone else getting deja vu here?

[Uncle Skeleton]

Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE 

Again, you're just making a list of excuses. Al Gore "believes" that the world is coming to an end due to excessive energy use.

No he doesn't. He's worried about emissions. Do you know the difference between energy use and emissions?

Sorry, but this is just nonsense. I can claim to "believe" that killing people is "offset" by me fathering more kids left and right to replace the ones I kill- then go around and preach that murder is wrong- oh, unless I "offset it" as I'm doing . That's my "belief", so therefore no one can call me a hypocrite for being a murderer. BULLCHIT. Other people aren't under any obligation to labor under someone else's warped belief system.

You'd be wrong and incorrect but you wouldn't be a hypocrite. Murderers aren't punished for being hypocritical.

Methinks you didn't pay enough attention to the part that came before the 'OR'. This part is not about belief, it's about reality. A murderer IS a murderer whether he believes he is or not.

He may be a murderer, but that doesn't mean he's a hypocrite.

There were people who said you make communism stronger by fighting it, so let's just give up and be nice. They were proven wrong. There were probably people that thought you "create" more Kamikazes out of Japanese people by dropping two nukes on their cities. That of course didn't happen.

Those people were proven wrong, but that doesn't make them hypocrites. It just makes them wrong.

Most people achieve lower energy bills the old fashioned way- they don't use more of it than they can afford.

And Gore's message is that the old fashioned way hasn't turned out to be enough, and that we have to also invest in research to replace old technologies with better ones. If these new technologies do come about, they would mean lower power bills. So what are you complaining about?

While we're talking about costs, and who can afford what under carbon credits, why don't you go to Gore's website and calculate how much it would cost you personally if you were going to "buy in" to this sceme:
An Inconvenient Truth > Carbon Calculator
For me it wants to charge $43 a year. That's hardly much of a burden. How much would it be for you, and how much would it be for the average small business owner (since you brought it up)?

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton 

No he doesn't. He's worried about emissions. Do you know the difference between energy use and emissions?

Oh knock it off. Emissions are created to produce energy. Now you're going in circles. eGore wouldn't need his "carbon offset" excuse if his energy use wasn't an issue. That's just the problem here, folks can't seem to keep up with the excuses!
It's offset, oh by wait, he couldn't get solar panels, oh but wait, he hosts a lot of 1,000 people parties so it's okay, oh but wait the dog ate his homework, oh but wait blah de blah.

You'd be wrong and incorrect but you wouldn't be a hypocrite. Murderers aren't punished for being hypocritical.

You're just splitting hairs. The hypocritical part would be going around sanctimoniously preaching that murder is wrong, as if that wasn't what you were doing simply because you've fooled yourself into believing that fathering more people "offsets" it.

Those people were proven wrong, but that doesn't make them hypocrites. It just makes them wrong.

True, but then I wasn't saying they were in this case.

And Gore's message is that the old fashioned way hasn't turned out to be enough, and that we have to also invest in research to replace old technologies with better ones. If these new technologies do come about, they would mean lower power bills. So what are you complaining about?

Who's arguing about this? We're talking about eGore's excessive energy use, right now, and his hypocrisy in not practicing what he preaches, right now, TODAY. You're spinning in crazy circles.

While we're talking about costs, and who can afford what under carbon credits, why don't you go to Gore's website and calculate how much it would cost you personally if you were going to "buy in" to this sceme:
An Inconvenient Truth > Carbon Calculator
For me it wants to charge $43 a year. That's hardly much of a burden. How much would it be for you, and how much would it be for the average small business owner (since you brought it up)?

I'm sorry, but this is just such a joke! This kind of crap is just PERFECT for the entire "do as I do not as I say" Global Warming crowd. "Hey, we don't have to Do any of that crap we spiel! That's for everyone else! That just stuff we cram down other people's throats. We can just go to some website. calculate some mythical amount that we can pay into some crackpot ponzi scheme where someone else offsets our own wasteful lifestyles, and then voila! We go right on doing what eGore says is ruining the planet, only we "gave at the office" and now don't have to do squat!

Seriously, for do-nothing liberals, that is just PERFECT!

AlGore must be part of an exercise program that works the same way. Every time he Hoovers down another Twinkie and his jowls grow that much bigger, he goes online and calculates how much someone else needs to get on a treadmill and work the fat off their ass! The eGore diet!

I said it before at the start of this thread- no wonder eGore is the leader of such a silly "movement" as this.

(I guess you probably haven't figured out by now that, no, I don't believe you can just buy you way out of actually having to conserve in the real world, and especially not if you really subscribe to the idea that the world is coming to an end. It's a bunch of complete nonsense.)

But hey, by all means, people can buy their "carbon offsets" and feel good about themselves for doing absolute JACK SQUAT if that's what works for them. Like I've said from the start, just leave me out of such nonsense, and don't preach about what I or anyone else must do, when you're unwilling to do it yourself. I gave at the office.

[Uncle Skeleton]

Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE 

Emissions are created to produce energy.

You didn't realize there could be energy without emissions? No wonder you were so confused.

It's offset, oh by wait, he couldn't get solar panels, oh but wait, he hosts a lot of 1,000 people parties so it's okay, oh but wait the dog ate his homework, oh but wait blah de blah.

I don't know if you realize it, but this issue is not a back-and-forth. Your side is the only one that cares about this "hypocrisy" (primarily because it's not hypocrisy). Meanwhile Gore is going about his business, testifying before congress and whatnot. I'd be surprised if he thought about this "scandal" more than once, if at all.

True, but then I wasn't saying they were in this case.

But they're the perfect analogy to your complaints about Gore.

I'm sorry, but this is just such a joke! This kind of crap is just PERFECT for the entire "do as I do not as I say" Global Warming crowd. "Hey, we don't have to actually change anything! That's for everyone else! We can go to some website. calculate some mythical amount that we can pay into some crackpot ponzi scheme, and then voila! We go right on doing what eGore says is ruining the planet, only we "gave at the office" and now don't have to do squat!

Seriously, for do-nothing liberals, that is just PERFECT!

Yes, it is perfect for them. It is completely consistent with their message.

Hey, you know what I just noticed? Being consistent with one's message is the antithesis of being hypocritical.

(I guess you probably haven't figured out by now that, no, I don't believe you can just buy you way out of actually having to conserve in the real world, and especially not if you really subscribe to the idea that the world is coming to an end. It's a bunch of complete nonsense.)

I don't believe it either, that's why I still have $43 in my pocket instead of on that website. But you know what? My disbelief doesn't make Gore a hypocrite.

Like I've said from the start, just leave me out of such nonsense, and don't preach about what I or anyone else must do, when you're unwilling to do it yourself. I gave at the office.

Um, then what are you doing in this thread? If you want to be left out, who told you to post in it?

[CRASH HARDDRIVE]

Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton 

I don't know if you realize it, but this issue is not a back-and-forth. Your side is the only one that cares about this "hypocrisy" (primarily because it's not hypocrisy). Meanwhile Gore is going about his business, testifying before congress and whatnot. I'd be surprised if he thought about this "scandal" more than once, if at all.

I don't think you've actually followed the thread. The first excuse that was floated was "Oh yeah, well I bet he does better than Bush!" Then when that was proven incorrect, it shifted to one excuse after another, up to your "he hosts a lot of people" excuse.

Suffice it to say, I think your definition of hypocrisy is misguided. I would say MOST hypocrites don't actually believe they are hypocrites. The term describes acting in a hypocritcal way. OF COURSE the person has used some level of self-denial to and a warped 'belief' system to justify their hypocrisy, but that doesn't mean they aren't hypocrites.

Um, then what are you doing in this thread? If you want to be left out, who told you to post in it?

Geesh that was lame. Oh, excuse me. I wasn't aware that this thread was up before Congress, preaching its gloom and doom and nattering on about what everyone must do. I wasn't aware this thread made propaganda movies with glaring fear-mongering in them, and part of a larger movement to use that fear-mongering to affect government policies.

[Uncle Skeleton]

Originally Posted by CRASH HARDDRIVE 

I don't think you've actually followed the thread. The first excuse that was floated was "Oh yeah, well I bet he does better than Bush!"

Yeah, the whole "issue" is speculation. One person thinks he probably did one thing, and one person thinks he probably did another thing, no one ever bothering to investigate. But I'm telling you I personally know someone who went to Gore's house to attend a seminar with 1000 other people, on how to give his Gore-talk around the country. That alone provides a perfectly reasonable explanation for why he's using so much power. I'm not sure you're familiar with Occam's Razor, but I bet you can look it up if you're not.

and part of a larger movement to use that fear-mongering to affect government policies.

You can't really complain about the use of fear-mongering in government policies when you help contribute to the terrorism boogeyman hysteria. Fear-mongering is the only currency of politics nowadays, and it's the repubs that made it that way. Speaking of eating your own dogfood...

[Macrobat]

Speculation, my left buttcheek.

What the whole thread is boils down to this:

People pointing out the unmitigated FACT that the Gore-On is a COMPLETE hypocrite and apologists making excuses for him, you CHIEF among them.

Gore goes right on, creating more and more pollution (do NOT think that ANY of us have missed all you apologists IGNORING the zinc mine on his property COMPLETELTY - you know, the #1 polluter - by far in the entire state of Tennessee) while preaching to others that they need to subsist at virtually a poverty level because of "Global Warming."

[tie]

What does this zinc have to do with global warming? I guess the zinc is vaporized and then reflects heat back to the earth? Hm.

[ShortcutToMoncton]

Originally Posted by Macrobat 

they need to subsist at virtually a poverty level because of "Global Warming."

Link please.

greg

[Buckaroo]

If Gore was truely serious and truely believed the garbage coming out of his mouth, he would propose rationing. But rationing would affect him, and he can't have that.

[ShortcutToMoncton]

Originally Posted by Buckaroo 

If Gore was truely serious and truely believed the garbage coming out of his mouth, he would propose rationing.

Rationing what?

Your idiotic statements are getting tiresome.

greg

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by Macrobat 

Speculation, my left buttcheek.

What the whole thread is boils down to this:

People pointing out the unmitigated FACT that the Gore-On is a COMPLETE hypocrite and apologists making excuses for him, you CHIEF among them.

Gore goes right on, creating more and more pollution (do NOT think that ANY of us have missed all you apologists IGNORING the zinc mine on his property COMPLETELTY - you know, the #1 polluter - by far in the entire state of Tennessee) while preaching to others that they need to subsist at virtually a poverty level because of "Global Warming."

Not to sound like a broken record, but the thread boils down to this:

people bickering about stuff which really doesn't matter.

[Face Ache]

I haven't read this thread. I assume it's mostly noisy Bush-supporting (hahaha) right-wingers being wrong about everything, as per their modus operandi for the last seven years.

Am I wrong?

[tie]

Originally Posted by Buckaroo 

If Gore was truely [sic] serious and truely [sic] believed the garbage coming out of his mouth, he would propose rationing. But rationing would affect him, and he can't have that.

Why would he propose rationing when we all know his secret plan is total genocide -- he wants to wipe out all humanity?

What matters is Al Gore wants to kill off the human race, and all with lies.

I love that quote. I'd like to make it my signature, but that would be too obnoxious.

[Macrobat]

Originally Posted by tie 

What does this zinc have to do with global warming? I guess the zinc is vaporized and then reflects heat back to the earth? Hm.

Gee, al;l the pollution - all the heavy equipment needed to mine it, etc. ad nauseum.

Whatsa matter - kneejerk need to defend the Goreacle no matter what?

Are you now saying that every - and any - other kind of pollution is perfectly okay now?

And Greg, have you been asleep for 3 years? Every anti-GW link in existence will suffice.

[swarmofkillermonkeys]

Oh you guys just shut up! Really!
Al Gore is so totally serial about manbearpig and all you mean people just won't believe him! He's totally serial!!

Teehee. I don't mind a few harmless dittoheads, but man... don't get on the wrong side of those South Park boys -- they're vicious!

"Why would he propose rationing when we all know his secret plan is total genocide -- he wants to wipe out all humanity?" Geez, tie, that is soo obvious. Because Gorstadamus wants all the energy for himself for AFTER the genocide. Oh and your children's eyeballs. He'll need those too. Didn't we tell you? Gore's real super-secret other plan is to summon the antichrist with your children's eyeballs, leftover energy, and the telephone pole setup from the Back to the Future set! Duh, like, everyone knows that!

"Not to sound like a broken record, but the thread boils down to this: people bickering about stuff which really doesn't matter." Ooo! Ooo! Besson, lemme answer that one! And I can even tie this deformed monstrosity of a fake topic of a thread back into Apple! OK, here goes, this thread REALLY boils down to ..... Apple's. Secret. Plan. No wait! Hold on, just hear me out...

If you search through and find all of the lame, paid, neocon rambling talking-points and read the message BEHIND the messages... what does it read?!

"One resolve. One cause. Our enemies shall talk themselves to death. And we will bury them with their own confusion"

AHHHH HA! No. No wait I was early on that. Going on... Now, who else said that? Apple in their famous ad! Yeah, their ad FROM 1984! You know who else said that? Gorge Orwell in a book CALLED "1984"! Yeah, like even you moon-bat liberals can even call THAT a coincidence! 1984 and 1984, like... just... wow! It blows your mind, right? Well, strap on some protection, 'cuz I'm about to blow it even harder!

What's 1984+1984? 3968, right? And how many letters are in Gorge? Well, I'll guess six (should be close enough for the calculations). What is 3968/6? That's RIGHT! 661 and a third! And finally... everyone knows that Steve Jobs has THREE testicles. So what -- now hold your applause -- WHAT is 661 and 1/3 -3?


[long dramatic pause]

That's right, gentlemen. We only have 658 years (plus or minus a third of a testicle) before Apple, Al Gore, the neocons, AND the liberal movement completely their plan for world dominion using your children's eyeballs, leftover energy, the telephone pole setup from the Back to the Future, and one MILLION gallons of Dr. Bronner's wonderful peppermint soap.

[slowly surveys the audience with a glower and one arched eyebrow]

I. rest. my. case.

PS. Oh yeah: AHHHH HA!

[tie]

Originally Posted by Macrobat 

Gee, al;l the pollution - all the heavy equipment needed to mine it, etc. ad nauseum.

Whatsa matter - kneejerk need to defend the Goreacle no matter what?

Are you now saying that every - and any - other kind of pollution is perfectly okay now?

What, we aren't supposed to mine any more? We should shut down all our industries? I don't get it. You are really stretching it, trying to dig up something against Gore.

You call Gore a hypocrite for caring about global warming, but supposedly not about localized pollution from a zinc mine. Equally you should call yourself a hypocrite for caring about the local pollution, but not about human-caused global climate change.

I'm not saying that every or any other kind of pollution is okay. But I am saying that it is perfectly fine to concentrate on some issues over others. These are different problems on vastly different scales. Gore is concentrating on one of them -- and fortunately, other people are concentrating on other kinds of pollution. There are a million different environmental problems, and no I don't expect Gore to have a position on them all. I certainly don't.

For a completely different example, many here (I'd guess including you) supported invading Iraq to stop them from deploying hydrogen weather balloons ("mobile biological weapons laboratories"). But you don't support attacking N. Korea to stop its development of nuclear weapons. Hypocrite? -- Or just the fact that these are different issues? I think the latter.

[Face Ache]

I believe the term is "muddying the waters".

"OMG! Al Gore's farts create greenhouse gases, therefore he is a hypocrite!"

As long as he is breathing in oxygen and releasing carbon dioxide, you will not win an argument with these people.

[besson3c]

Originally Posted by swarmofkillermonkeys 

Oh you guys just shut up! Really!
Al Gore is so totally serial about manbearpig and all you mean people just won't believe him! He's totally serial!!

Teehee. I don't mind a few harmless dittoheads, but man... don't get on the wrong side of those South Park boys -- they're vicious!

"Why would he propose rationing when we all know his secret plan is total genocide -- he wants to wipe out all humanity?" Geez, tie, that is soo obvious. Because Gorstadamus wants all the energy for himself for AFTER the genocide. Oh and your children's eyeballs. He'll need those too. Didn't we tell you? Gore's real super-secret other plan is to summon the antichrist with your children's eyeballs, leftover energy, and the telephone pole setup from the Back to the Future set! Duh, like, everyone knows that!

"Not to sound like a broken record, but the thread boils down to this: people bickering about stuff which really doesn't matter." Ooo! Ooo! Besson, lemme answer that one! And I can even tie this deformed monstrosity of a fake topic of a thread back into Apple! OK, here goes, this thread REALLY boils down to ..... Apple's. Secret. Plan. No wait! Hold on, just hear me out...

If you search through and find all of the lame, paid, neocon rambling talking-points and read the message BEHIND the messages... what does it read?!

"One resolve. One cause. Our enemies shall talk themselves to death. And we will bury them with their own confusion"

AHHHH HA! No. No wait I was early on that. Going on... Now, who else said that? Apple in their famous ad! Yeah, their ad FROM 1984! You know who else said that? Gorge Orwell in a book CALLED "1984"! Yeah, like even you moon-bat liberals can even call THAT a coincidence! 1984 and 1984, like... just... wow! It blows your mind, right? Well, strap on some protection, 'cuz I'm about to blow it even harder!

What's 1984+1984? 3968, right? And how many letters are in Gorge? Well, I'll guess six (should be close enough for the calculations). What is 3968/6? That's RIGHT! 661 and a third! And finally... everyone knows that Steve Jobs has THREE testicles. So what -- now hold your applause -- WHAT is 661 and 1/3 -3?


[long dramatic pause]

That's right, gentlemen. We only have 658 years (plus or minus a third of a testicle) before Apple, Al Gore, the neocons, AND the liberal movement completely their plan for world dominion using your children's eyeballs, leftover energy, the telephone pole setup from the Back to the Future, and one MILLION gallons of Dr. Bronner's wonderful peppermint soap.

[slowly surveys the audience with a glower and one arched eyebrow]

I. rest. my. case.

PS. Oh yeah: AHHHH HA!

I like the cut of your jib!

Do you think you could post something like this in my Obama's Malcolm X pork thread? It needs a dash of crazy, and I haven't perfected this sort of crazy yet. I'm working on it though!

[Macrobat]

Originally Posted by tie 

What, we aren't supposed to mine any more? We should shut down all our industries? I don't get it. You are really stretching it, trying to dig up something against Gore.

You call Gore a hypocrite for caring about global warming, but supposedly not about localized pollution from a zinc mine. Equally you should call yourself a hypocrite for caring about the local pollution, but not about human-caused global climate change.

I'm not saying that every or any other kind of pollution is okay. But I am saying that it is perfectly fine to concentrate on some issues over others. These are different problems on vastly different scales. Gore is concentrating on one of them -- and fortunately, other people are concentrating on other kinds of pollution. There are a million different environmental problems, and no I don't expect Gore to have a position on them all. I certainly don't.

For a completely different example, many here (I'd guess including you) supported invading Iraq to stop them from deploying hydrogen weather balloons ("mobile biological weapons laboratories"). But you don't support attacking N. Korea to stop its development of nuclear weapons. Hypocrite? -- Or just the fact that these are different issues? I think the latter.

No, brainiac, we call Gore a hypocrite for telling everyone on Earth to live a certain way then hypocritically NOT practicing what he preaches. In other words, all he does is run around yelling "the sky is falling," then doing exactly jack and shite of what he tells us everyone MUST do - is he not included in "everyone?" Not only does he not, he is a gross abuser of the environment.

Get you backed into a corner and come out swinging with every single talking point you can lay your hands on, dontcha? Too bad you're about as dangerous as a half-stuffed teddy bear, huh?

Gore isn't concentrating on one damned thing except making Gore more money - plain and simple. That is the very definition of hypocrisy. He criticizes everyone on the planet for doing less than 3% of what he himself is guilty.

You know simple, I can tell, intimately.

You bring up North Korea - yeah, let's attack a country that shares its northern border with China - you know, just like we did in the 1950s. Get out much?

[tie]

You're flailing, and as with Crash this gives you the tendency of calling people names.

Try to come up with something from a reliable source.

[Uncle Skeleton]

Originally Posted by tie 

this gives you the tendency of calling people names.

The half-stuffed teddy bear? I thought that was supposed to be a compliment

[besson3c]

Anybody care to humor me?

[ShortcutToMoncton]

Originally Posted by Macrobat 

And Greg, have you been asleep for 3 years? Every anti-GW link in existence will suffice.

You mean the ones which say "doing anything about global warming will require us to subsist at the poverty level!" but don't actually say how this will come about?

That wasn't what you said. You said

Gore goes right on, creating more and more pollution...while preaching to others that they need to subsist at virtually a poverty level because of "Global Warming."

which means that Al Gore is telling people that they need to subsist at the poverty level.

That's exactly what you said. So, like I said...link please. Show me where Al Gore is "preaching" that people need to subsist at the poverty level.

(I know you can't do it, and you'll go off on some other unrelated tangent about Gore and people defending him...I'm just pointing out how easily your arguments are dismantled, as usual.)

greg

[Macrobat]

Gore ascribes to the Kyoto Protocol, which is a PROVEN economic pitfall.

See how easily YOUR "arguments' are dismantled - as usual?

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton 

You mean the ones which say "doing anything about global warming will require us to subsist at the poverty level!" but don't actually say how this will come about?

That wasn't what you said. You said which means that Al Gore is telling people that they need to subsist at the poverty level.

That's exactly what you said. So, like I said...link please. Show me where Al Gore is "preaching" that people need to subsist at the poverty level.

(I know you can't do it, and you'll go off on some other unrelated tangent about Gore and people defending him...I'm just pointing out how easily your arguments are dismantled, as usual.)

greg

Greg,....maybe you could clarify a few things first as it would help establish a base line to reduce emissions world wide. Do you believe the world can sustain the current population of the earth at the minimum standard of living set in United States?
We have minumum standards set here in the Untited States. Should an Environmental Treaty set a minimum standard of living? Should living standards be set higher for the United States than China or India or Canada?

[tie]

Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton 

The half-stuffed teddy bear? I thought that was supposed to be a compliment

Oh, my bad. Sorry, Macrobat, for jumping to conclusions.

Originally Posted by Macrobat

Gore ascribes to the Kyoto Protocol, which is a PROVEN economic pitfall.

Proven? I can understand you thinking human-caused global warming is not proven -- you'd have a very high standard of proof -- but then I don't see how you can argue that this is? If you search the literature for the economic effects of Kyoto, you'll find a few papers on both sides -- whereas there is a huge consensus on global warming.

And Shortcut is right; this no more supports your claim that Gore "[preaches] to others that they need to subsist at virtually a poverty level because of 'Global Warming'" than Buckaroo can support his claim that Gore is bent on total genocide.

Admit it, you guys just have an irrational hatred of Gore, and can hardly support any of the assertions you've made in this entire thread.

[Orion27]

Tie:

And Shortcut is right; this no more supports your claim that Gore "[preaches] to others that they need to subsist at virtually a poverty level because of 'Global Warming'" than Buckaroo can support his claim that Gore is bent on total genocide.

Admit it, you guys just have an irrational hatred of Gore, and can hardly support any of the assertions you've made in this entire thread.

Why don't you answer the questions I asked Shortcut?

....maybe you could clarify a few things first as it would help establish a base line to reduce emissions world wide. Do you believe the world can sustain the current population of the earth at the minimum standard of living set in United States?
We have minumum standards set here in the Untited States. Should an Environmental Treaty set a minimum standard of living? Should living standards be set higher for the United States than China or India or Canada?

[Uncle Skeleton]

Originally Posted by Orion27 

Why don't you answer the questions I asked Shortcut?

I think I know why. You questions don't make any sense, gramatically or conceptually. Why don't you try making them clearer?

[Orion27]

Originally Posted by Uncle Skeleton 

I think I know why. You questions don't make any sense, gramatically or conceptually. Why don't you try making them clearer?

Thanks. Hope that's clearer.