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You are here: MacNN Forums > Community > MacNN Lounge > WTF is it with people paying to file their taxes?

WTF is it with people paying to file their taxes?
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shifuimam
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Jan 30, 2009, 10:50 AM
 
No, really.

And yes, this is US-centric. Sorry. I don't know how other countries deal with taxes.

I mean, in the state of Indiana, e-filing is free for everyone. Federal e-filing has been free if you make less than $55,000 gross adjusted (filing as a single; I think the limit for joint filing is higher), and this year, federal e-filing is free for everyone.

You can then keep a PDF copy of your filing.

So why are people still shelling out money for TurboTax and paying to do their state returns?

(And, yes - I realize that if you run a home business or have a complicated return, it MIGHT be marginally easier to use software. I'm talking about people who just do a normal plain ol' 1040-EZ.)
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Doofy
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Jan 30, 2009, 10:55 AM
 
You realise that if you ask an IRS bloke to point out to you where it states in the lawbooks that you have to pay income tax he won't be able to, don't you?
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osiris
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Jan 30, 2009, 11:05 AM
 
Originally Posted by shifuimam View Post
No, really.

And yes, this is US-centric. Sorry. I don't know how other countries deal with taxes.

I mean, in the state of Indiana, e-filing is free for everyone. Federal e-filing has been free if you make less than $55,000 gross adjusted (filing as a single; I think the limit for joint filing is higher), and this year, federal e-filing is free for everyone.

You can then keep a PDF copy of your filing.

So why are people still shelling out money for TurboTax and paying to do their state returns?

(And, yes - I realize that if you run a home business or have a complicated return, it MIGHT be marginally easier to use software. I'm talking about people who just do a normal plain ol' 1040-EZ.)
A CPA can work wonders, and if you're using an EZ form you're a fool. Software may be somewhat more thorough than an EZ form, but nothing compares to a cpa ready to do battle for you.
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Maflynn
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Jan 30, 2009, 11:05 AM
 
Originally Posted by shifuimam View Post
So why are people still shelling out money for TurboTax and paying to do their state returns?
Because I have

If you don't qualify for the 1040-EZ AFAIK, you cannot use the free federal e-filing option. I have no choice, either do it by hand, or buy Turbo-Tax. Its just not running a home business, its owning a home, or wanting to itemize your deduction. Free doesn't always equal better
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ort888
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Jan 30, 2009, 11:31 AM
 
Because most of us have more complicated taxes then a single woman in her mid-20s?

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starman
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Jan 30, 2009, 11:33 AM
 
You do realize it's vastly easier for someone like you with no mortgage, kids, etc. to do their taxes, right?

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shifuimam  (op)
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Jan 30, 2009, 11:38 AM
 
That's kind of who I'm talking about - broke college kids and people in their 20s who don't have a lot of income and definitely don't itemize.

I totally understand that when you have dependents, mortgages, and other assets that require itemization, it can be much easier to use an app. However, when all you have is a part-time job, no itemized deductions, and no real assets, it seems ridiculous to shell out money to file your taxes when you can do it for free online.
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Laminar
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Jan 30, 2009, 11:40 AM
 
Originally Posted by starman View Post
You do realize it's vastly easier for someone like you with no mortgage, kids, etc. to do their taxes, right?
You're only saying that because you're a Mac Fanboy. Logic and reason would dictate that you're wrong.
     
Dakar V
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Jan 30, 2009, 11:40 AM
 
Obviously this is just another facet of the Mac/PC divide.
     
Dakar V
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Jan 30, 2009, 11:41 AM
 
Holy ****, Laminar.
     
starman
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Jan 30, 2009, 11:46 AM
 
Originally Posted by Laminar View Post
You're only saying that because you're a Mac Fanboy. Logic and reason would dictate that you're wrong.
No, no, you have it backwards. Not Mac Fanboy, anti-Linux. Get it straight.

EDIT: for the record, I have no idea wtf Lam is talking about.
( Last edited by starman; Jan 30, 2009 at 11:55 AM. )

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osiris
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Jan 30, 2009, 11:49 AM
 
Originally Posted by Dakar V View Post
Obviously this is just another facet of the Mac/PC divide.
Obviously.
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Laminar
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Jan 30, 2009, 12:01 PM
 
Originally Posted by Dakar V View Post
Holy ****, Laminar.
Yeah. Well done.
     
SpaceMonkey
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Jan 30, 2009, 12:02 PM
 
I thought the simplest TurboTax option (for people exactly like you describe who just need a 1040-EZ) was free?

Edit: Oh, I see, they don't include state filing.

Meh. It's just a convenience tax, then, so they don't have to go through another website. People make these kinds of decisions all the time on other issues, and I don't see why tax preparation would be any different.

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ThinkInsane
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Jan 30, 2009, 12:05 PM
 
Originally Posted by SpaceMonkey View Post
I thought the simplest TurboTax option (for people exactly like you describe who just need a 1040-EZ) was free?

Edit: Oh, I see, they don't include state filing.

Meh. It's just a convenience tax, then. People make these kinds of decisions all the time on other issues, and I don't see why tax preparation would be any different.
The online version is. I think she's wondering why people are going out and purchasing software when it's not needed.
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kmkkid
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Jan 30, 2009, 01:43 PM
 
I go to H&R Block for my taxes simply because I want my cheque on the spot. If I knew I owed I'd send it in by mail . Oh. And for. Convenience.
     
mduell
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Jan 30, 2009, 01:57 PM
 
Not everyone lives at the poverty line and files a single state as a resident.

My taxes are complex enough to justify TurboTax, but not complex enough to justify a CPA (tried it for a few years, was a net loss).
     
shifuimam  (op)
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Jan 30, 2009, 02:11 PM
 
Oh, jeez. You guys are pathetic.

And WRT what ThinkInsane said - yes. I don't get why people are paying for software when, in many cases, it's entirely unnecessary. It just seems like a waste of money.
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Maflynn
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Jan 30, 2009, 02:17 PM
 
Originally Posted by shifuimam View Post
Oh, jeez. You guys are pathetic.

And WRT what ThinkInsane said - yes. I don't get why people are paying for software when, in many cases, it's entirely unnecessary. It just seems like a waste of money.
The free online stuff will not handle the taxes for anyone who needs to file a 1040 or itemize their deductions or make a certain amount of money. You cannot make such sweeping generalizations when it comes to people's tax returns
( Last edited by Maflynn; Jan 30, 2009 at 02:37 PM. Reason: overly harsh)
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Art Vandelay
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Jan 30, 2009, 02:40 PM
 
Originally Posted by kmkkid View Post
I go to H&R Block for my taxes simply because I want my cheque on the spot. If I knew I owed I'd send it in by mail . Oh. And for. Convenience.
You're that impatient that you're willing to pay the associated fees and get less money?
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Jan 30, 2009, 02:48 PM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
You realise that if you ask an IRS bloke to point out to you where it states in the lawbooks that you have to pay income tax he won't be able to, don't you?
I doubt there's anyone who actually understands everything in the tax code. I also realize that won't stop the IRS bloke from coming around with his four large friends and various sports equipment if I don't pay.
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ort888
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Jan 30, 2009, 02:53 PM
 
Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
You're that impatient that you're willing to pay the associated fees and get less money?
Everything we do in life is a question of convenience. It's always time vs. money. How much is your time worth?

You mean you go to the store to buy your tomatoes? I grow my own in my backyard, you lazy sod. I also sew my own clothes and built my own car from scrapyard parts.

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Doofy
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Jan 30, 2009, 03:01 PM
 
Originally Posted by Chuckit View Post
I doubt there's anyone who actually understands everything in the tax code.
Well, I can say that there's nobody who'll point you at that bit of information - because it doesn't exist. Yep, that's right - there's no law which states you have to pay fed income taxes. You just do it because...

Originally Posted by Chuckit View Post
I also realize that won't stop the IRS bloke from coming around with his four large friends and various sports equipment if I don't pay.
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Big Mac
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Jan 30, 2009, 03:11 PM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
Well, I can say that there's nobody who'll point you at that bit of information - because it doesn't exist. Yep, that's right - there's no law which states you have to pay fed income taxes. You just do it because...
The threat of force from the federal government exists and has been upheld by the courts whether or not said force is strictly legal under the laws of the United States.
( Last edited by Big Mac; Jan 30, 2009 at 04:53 PM. )

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Art Vandelay
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Jan 30, 2009, 03:45 PM
 
Originally Posted by ort888 View Post
Everything we do in life is a question of convenience. It's always time vs. money. How much is your time worth?

You mean you go to the store to buy your tomatoes? I grow my own in my backyard, you lazy sod. I also sew my own clothes and built my own car from scrapyard parts.
Not quite the same. I'm not getting a loan to get my tomato from the store. Getting your refund right away is a loan from H&R Block. Last I read, the terms are very unfavorable, not much different than payday loans. Seems to be a very pricey tradeoff to get your money only 1-2 weeks sooner.
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ShortcutToMoncton
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Jan 30, 2009, 04:32 PM
 
I pay to get my taxes done at H&R Block.

I sit down, wait about 45 minutes as they go through my stuff, and then they cut me cheques and I walk out with money in hand.

For me it's definitely worth it!

greg
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ort888
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Jan 30, 2009, 04:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
Not quite the same. I'm not getting a loan to get my tomato from the store. Getting your refund right away is a loan from H&R Block. Last I read, the terms are very unfavorable, not much different than payday loans. Seems to be a very pricey tradeoff to get your money only 1-2 weeks sooner.
Yeah, you know what, you're right. If you are paying HR Block extra to get your money a few weeks early* then that is pretty silly...

*barring mafia goons coming to break your thumbs or something.

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turtle777
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Jan 30, 2009, 04:39 PM
 
Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
Getting your refund right away is a loan from H&R Block. Last I read, the terms are very unfavorable, not much different than payday loans.
Exactly right, this should be the outrage that shifu should be fuzzing about.

Most people do get their refunds in two weeks. If you want your refund on the spot, the National Consumer Law Center said the average person will pay a 187 percent annual interest rate.
WCCO-TV sent an intern to H&R Block. The interest quoted on the Rapid Refund was 154 percent.
http://wcco.com/specialreports/rapid....2.628679.html

What idiot forgoes that much just to get money 2 weeks early, after waiting for it a whole year ?

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ort888
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Jan 30, 2009, 04:59 PM
 
I've always just mailed mine in and as long as I do so before February, I always get my refund in 2-3 weeks.

I just put my refund in my savings account, so I've never been in a hurry.

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Jan 30, 2009, 05:00 PM
 
I use Turbo Tax for free. They have an affiliation with one of my credit card companies.
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Art Vandelay
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Jan 30, 2009, 05:29 PM
 
Originally Posted by turtle777 View Post
What idiot forgoes that much just to get money 2 weeks early, after waiting for it a whole year ?

-t
Plus, if your refund is a large enough amount that you're anxious to get it quickly, then your withholding is too much. Reduce your withholding so you get very little back or owe very little. Then you get to enjoy that money throughout the year instead of loaning it to the government for free and waiting to get it back at tax time.
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Art Vandelay
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Jan 30, 2009, 05:35 PM
 
Originally Posted by ShortcutToMoncton View Post
I pay to get my taxes done at H&R Block.

I sit down, wait about 45 minutes as they go through my stuff, and then they cut me cheques and I walk out with money in hand.

For me it's definitely worth it!

greg
Getting gouged on interest for what's effectively a loan to get your money immediately is worth it?

Having someone prepare your taxes is fine. It's the part about paying exorbitant fees to get money 1-2 weeks faster is silly to me.
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Jan 30, 2009, 06:41 PM
 
shifuimam: I agree with you, but I think the answer you are looking for is the same reason why many people shell out money for Mac GUI apps that do the same thing as free apps that are already installed: convenience (perceived - whether actual or not), marketing, packaging, and in some cases laziness.
     
Laminar
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Jan 30, 2009, 06:48 PM
 
Oh barf.
     
Shaddim
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Jan 30, 2009, 07:29 PM
 
I have accountants pay for it all...

Seriously, my accountant is a higher being, Daniel Jackson only wishes he could match this guy. He isn't cheap, by any stretch of the imagination, but I'm astounded by how much money he (legally) saves us each year. He's mind-numbingly boring, and I don't think he actually has a life, but he can quote all the tax codes from memory. When I was audited a few years back he showed up with his, exhaustively detailed, ledgers and notes. Within a couple hours he had the IRS agent running in fear.
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Jan 30, 2009, 07:56 PM
 
Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
Getting gouged on interest for what's effectively a loan to get your money immediately is worth it?

Having someone prepare your taxes is fine. It's the part about paying exorbitant fees to get money 1-2 weeks faster is silly to me.
Last year I only paid $60 on $600. 10% isn't that bad when I need to pay off bills that could result in twice (or more :o) the percentage on interest charges.
     
ShortcutToMoncton
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Jan 30, 2009, 08:02 PM
 
I usually pay from $40-$70 to walk out with my money immediately. Remember, H&R Block has student discounts.

For me it's definitely worth it, as I've never heard of anyone getting their refund in 1-2 weeks in Canada - at least none of my friends or family, anyway. More like a month, give or take. I have bills and rent to pay and expenses from winding up my school year, so I could always use the cash ASAP because I won't make money until the paychecks start rolling in a few weeks into the summer.

For students, it's a great way to go; we can always use cash ASAP! I'll have no reason to do it once I start working full-time however.

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Art Vandelay
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Jan 30, 2009, 08:23 PM
 
Originally Posted by kmkkid View Post
Last year I only paid $60 on $600. 10% isn't that bad when I need to pay off bills that could result in twice (or more :o) the percentage on interest charges.
Actually, that's an APR of 120% since you're paying $60 for about a one month loan of $600.
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Jan 30, 2009, 10:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by Art Vandelay View Post
Plus, if your refund is a large enough amount that you're anxious to get it quickly, then your withholding is too much. Reduce your withholding so you get very little back or owe very little. Then you get to enjoy that money throughout the year instead of loaning it to the government for free and waiting to get it back at tax time.
It is not always possible to predict a large refund.

I used to get $7000-8000 back every year, but that was because of donations and other deductions that were unpredictable. One year I got back $14,000.
     
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Jan 31, 2009, 12:47 AM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
You realise that if you ask an IRS bloke to point out to you where it states in the lawbooks that you have to pay income tax he won't be able to, don't you?
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
Well, I can say that there's nobody who'll point you at that bit of information - because it doesn't exist. Yep, that's right - there's no law which states you have to pay fed income taxes. You just do it because...
26 U.S.C. § 6151
     
Trygve
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Jan 31, 2009, 05:28 AM
 
I don't use TurboTax, let alone do things myself. I pay a professional to do it and it costs me over $1,000 a year. Of course I have a personal return, company (one US, one foreign) returns and a rather complicated situation... esp living overseas.
     
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Jan 31, 2009, 12:50 PM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
Well, I can say that there's nobody who'll point you at that bit of information - because it doesn't exist. Yep, that's right - there's no law which states you have to pay fed income taxes. You just do it because...
Aside from arguments against the legitimacy of it, there is the 16th amendment of the Constitution that states that congress has the power to collect tax on income.
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Jan 31, 2009, 01:11 PM
 
I have been using Turbo Tax for years for a number of reasons. I don't have to keep all the "what ifs" straight (for exampls, how much of my Goodwill donations do I claim and how much will make a difference?), they do the e-filing for me (included in the price of the software this year), and so on. And you can claim a deduction for the cost of tax preparation, so why NOT have someone do anything more direct than an EZ form?

As for going to places like H&R Block, that's a different thing. I used to work with a guy whose business is doing taxes for people. He'd worked for them at one point and struck out on his own for ethical as well as financial reasons. It seems that where he worked, H&R Block filed lots of extra forms for customers, not "just in case," but because they could charge by the form... Hmmmm...

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Jan 31, 2009, 03:43 PM
 
I agree most people could do their taxes in theory. But then again 49.99% of all people have below average intelligence and voted for George W. Bush.
     
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Jan 31, 2009, 10:01 PM
 
Take that idiocy to the Pol lounge, thanks.
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Feb 1, 2009, 09:08 AM
 
.
Originally Posted by mduell View Post
when a return of tax is required under this title or regulations, the person required to make such return shall...
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Feb 1, 2009, 11:56 AM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
Well, I can say that there's nobody who'll point you at that bit of information - because it doesn't exist. Yep, that's right - there's no law which states you have to pay fed income taxes. You just do it because...
This is silly.

It's like saying gravity doesn't exist, because one can't see it directly.

-t
     
macintologist
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Feb 1, 2009, 02:13 PM
 
If your tax situation is too complicated to do the form yourself then you need to trim the fat and make your financial situation less complicated.
     
mduell
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Feb 1, 2009, 03:44 PM
 
Originally Posted by Doofy View Post
Originally Posted by mduell
26 U.S.C. § 6151
when a return of tax is required under this title or regulations, the person required to make such return shall...
I was replying to your post "there's no law which states you have to pay fed income taxes." What I quoted says you have to pay. 26 U.S.C. § 6011 says you have to file the return.

Of course you're just trolling.
     
Doofy
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Feb 2, 2009, 08:04 AM
 
Originally Posted by mduell View Post
I was replying to your post "there's no law which states you have to pay fed income taxes." What I quoted says you have to pay.
No. What you quoted says that "a person who is required to make a tax return must make a tax return".

Originally Posted by mduell View Post
Of course you're just trolling.
Whatever dude. If you want to wheel out the "you're trolling" argument at everyone who disagrees with you, then feel free.
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