[k2director]

Yes, it syncs *calendar* appointments, and you'd think that it would sync To Dos as well (as just about every other phone does)....

BUT....

There have been so many opportunities for Apple to mention To Dos in any of its iPhone communications, and it never has!

* Jobs never mentioned To Dos at the keynote in January
* The demo movies on Apple's iPhone pages don't mention To Dos
* The Calendar screen for the iPhone doesn't have a To Do button
* And now, Apple's "Get Ready for the iPhone" email specifically mentions synching calendar items, but not To Dos.

I really hope I'm wrong, but can't understand why To Do support wouldn't be mentioned by now, if it indeed existed. And yet, how hard could it be to support? Every phone I've owned in the last 4 years (including a few cheapies) has handled To Dos in one form or another.

Anyway, it will be a bitter disappointment if I can't sync To Dos from iCal to the phone. Bitter, bitter, bitter....

[icruise]

Well, there are a few possibilities. One is simply that they didn't think to mention it because it's an obvious feature. Kind of like how they've never (to my knowledge) mentioned that the iPhone has a vibrate setting, even though the training documents that were recently unearthed confirm that it does.

Another possibility is that it isn't supported in the very first version of the software. That would kind of suck, as it seems like basic functionality, but if you look back at the iPod, it was missing some pretty basic stuff in its very first software version. Stuff like being able to skip to a particular part of a song without holding down the fast-forward button for minutes at a time. And the iPod was much much simpler in terms of its UI and features than the iPhone.

In either case, it seems inconceivable that a feature like this would be missing for long, if it indeed didn't make it in time for release.

[analogika]

If the thing is running OS X, and it's running a custom version of iCal, and it can sync with iCal on the Mac, I find it almost impossible to believe that it shouldn't support iCal's feature set.

[icruise]

I'm not sure that it actually is running a version of iCal. The program it runs is called "Calendar" for one thing, while "Safari" is actually "Safari." It may be a separate program that happens to be able to sync with iCal data.

[kman42]

Perhaps they are waiting for the release of Leopard as it will contain a whole new To Do syncing paradigm that includes a central To Do database accessible by all programs, including Mail and iCal. Just a thought.

kman

[k2director]

Maybe they're waiting for Leopard, but I don't see why they would have to (and that doesn't address To Dos from Entourage or Outlook on the PC).

I'll just try to stay optimistic, and assume that it hasn't been mentioned because it's an obvious feature. Man, I hope so....

[peeb]

For sure it will. Don't be so silly.

[kman42]

Since we're on the topic, it sort of annoys me that we won't get realtime over-the-air syncing of To Dos and Calendar events with our computers. It's such a 1995 Palm mentality to force us to connect our mobile devices to our computers to sync them. I can understand not allowing music/photo sync over-the-air, but To Dos and events should be sync'd instantly. Didn't RIM change the syncing paradigm for the better a number of years ago? Apple seems behind the times on this one.

I'm guessing it's because it would have required a lot of work on the Windows side as they already have the infrastructure in .Mac to do it on the Mac side. Ignoring Windows for a moment, what I desire is to have all my events and ToDos sync'd between my iPhone, all of my computers, and my web presence (.Mac), instantly, just like my email is. That doesn't seem like too much to ask.

It's 2007, why should my calendars ever be out of sync?

kman

[::maroma::]

Was it ever confirmed that we wont be able to sync contacts, calendars and bookmarks over Bluetooth? I know I read that you can't do music and movies over Bluetooth, but I don't think I've read a confirmation that you can't do the other stuff over Bluetooth. Anyone got a link?

[icruise]

For that matter, what does the iPhone use Bluetooth for, period? I can't think of any features right at this moment that make use of it. Is it only used for the headset thing?

[kman42]

Originally Posted by ::maroma:: 

Was it ever confirmed that we wont be able to sync contacts, calendars and bookmarks over Bluetooth? I know I read that you can't do music and movies over Bluetooth, but I don't think I've read a confirmation that you can't do the other stuff over Bluetooth. Anyone got a link?

I don't want to sync over bluetooth either as it's really not any different from plugging it in. I want it to sync properly, over the air, like a blackberry. If I make a change on any computer, my iPhone or my .Mac account, it should automatically be pushed to the other devices. Why should I have to go through an extra step of syncing just to make sure my calendar looks the same on my computer and my iPhone? It should be done automatically. You don't have to sync your computer when you log in to make sure your calendars are the same, .Mac just takes care of it for you.

kman

[peeb]

Originally Posted by kman42 

It's 2007, why should my calendars ever be out of sync?

And where the hell is my flying car!?

[kman42]

Originally Posted by peeb 

And where the hell is my flying car!?

Not exactly a fair analogy, considering RIM has been providing this service for years.

However, someone here in CA is working on your flying car. Last I heard, it didn't really fly and cost several million dollars: http://www.moller.com/



kman

[JLL]

Originally Posted by kman42 

Since we're on the topic, it sort of annoys me that we won't get realtime over-the-air syncing of To Dos and Calendar events with our computers.

If you have your calendars on a server - iCal Server perhaps - it shouldn't be that hard to have the iPhone sync automatically when it's online.

Syncing with local calendars is more problematic since it would need access to your computer which would have to run some kind of server.

[analogika]

Originally Posted by icruise 

For that matter, what does the iPhone use Bluetooth for, period? I can't think of any features right at this moment that make use of it. Is it only used for the headset thing?

Headset.

Syncing.

Quick and simple data transfer to other devices/phones LOCALLY, without the need for $$$ MMS or $$$ e-mail-through-data-plan.

Bluetooth car stereos (there are a few, and getting more).

[icruise]

Bluetooth can be used for all of those things, but do we have any indication that the *iPhone* can use Bluetooth to do that?

[analogika]

That's a rather silly question, at least in regard to Bluetooth data transfer and the headset.

Omitting the former would be so far beyond stupid that not even Samsung would do it.

Omitting the latter would mean that their previously announced neat-o design Bluetooth hands-free earpiece wouldn't work and is just a pretty little piece of plastic.

[kman42]

Originally Posted by JLL 

If you have your calendars on a server - iCal Server perhaps - it shouldn't be that hard to have the iPhone sync automatically when it's online.

Syncing with local calendars is more problematic since it would need access to your computer which would have to run some kind of server.

.Mac

Personally, I think Apple should just include .Mac with Leopard for free, but even if they don't, they should include this feature for those that subscribe. Keeping computers in sync is what .Mac is for. Since the iPhone has a data connection, there is no reason it shouldn't be included.

[ghporter]

Originally Posted by peeb 

And where the hell is my flying car!?

I second that, but for other reasons.

I think this comes down to how much stuff you want in the iPhone. Do you want it to be EVERYTHING? Why have a Mac at home then? Seriously, if it wipes your nose but doesn't remind you to wear a raincoat, is that "horrible?" And if you have a calendar, can't you just remember to look at it now and then? Are people THAT dependent on reminders that they can't keep the next hour's appointments in their minds?

I may sound harsh, but this is one of the reasons I am NOT getting an iPhone. I like separate devices for separate missions. I have TWO iPods because one has a huge capacity, and the other has less but it's solid state so I can run with it. I have a cell phone for making phone calls (and though it has a calendar program, I don't use it because I can keep my day pretty straight most of the time without having my phone nag me). I also don't like the idea of having everything in one box because if that one box fails in some way, all my data could be lost.

I don't think I'm being old fashioned, but maybe conservative is a good term for it.

[icruise]

Originally Posted by analogika 

That's a rather silly question, at least in regard to Bluetooth data transfer and the headset.

Omitting the former would be so far beyond stupid that not even Samsung would do it.

Omitting the latter would mean that their previously announced neat-o design Bluetooth hands-free earpiece wouldn't work and is just a pretty little piece of plastic.

Of course the headset works. I said so myself earlier. But with regard to the other features, it seems like you're just assuming that they'll work. I personally think it's very unlikely that bluetooth syncing will be enabled, and Bluetooth car stereos? No chance.

[::maroma::]

Originally Posted by icruise 

Of course the headset works. I said so myself earlier. But with regard to the other features, it seems like you're just assuming that they'll work. I personally think it's very unlikely that bluetooth syncing will be enabled, and Bluetooth car stereos? No chance.

Well, we're all assuming things here. Some are assuming things will be included, others are assuming they wont. No one knows except Apple (and a few select lucky people). We got 2 weeks left, and only then will we know for sure.

[analogika]

Originally Posted by icruise 

Of course the headset works. I said so myself earlier. But with regard to the other features, it seems like you're just assuming that they'll work. I personally think it's very unlikely that bluetooth syncing will be enabled, and Bluetooth car stereos? No chance.

No idea. Apple might offer Bluetooth headphones, so the car stereo thing might work.

And notice I mentioned Bluetooth data transfer, which I actually use quite often to pass stuff on to others.

[k2director]

Well, Apple's "Guided Tour" video for iPhone lasts 24 minutes, 39 seconds, and once again, no mention of To Dos. In fact, I don't remember a mention, much less a demo, of the Calendar app. So now we're regressing!

[MattJeff]

the iphone has no buttons and can be updated very very easily

[kman42]

It does seem odd that they never showed the calendar app or the notes app.

[eggman]

Syncing the phone by plugging it in is less convenient than syncing wirelessly, but at least you can sync it... and I don't know about whether to-do's are supported... but the feature that I've been waiting to hear something about (and I'm still waiting) is hand's free dialing.

I've got a Motorola phone that's years old (and isn't running OS X, which has supported voice commands for years) that allows me to dial without looking at a contact list at all: "Call [my wife's name] at home" or "Call [a client's name] mobile".

New laws are going into effect in NY, California, NJ, CT and DC mandating hands-free devices when using your phone while driving. I don't place a lot of calls when driving... but I do so rarely. It looks like with the iPhone I may not be able to do so at all?

It's odd that this feature might exist without any mention in any of the ads, keynotes, website or promo video - but, then again, I wondered whether the iPhone had a vibrate ringer for quite a long while.

It seems like this soon before the product goes on sale all these questions should have been answered.

[Krusty]

Apple - iPhone - Get Ready Scroll down to where they talk about calendar. I'm in agreement with other posters who say that this is really an assumed feature. There are so many new and actual groundbreaking features of the iPhone I don't think they are going to bother mentioning what is assumed functionality.

Also, did you notice in the movie where the guy talked about the iPhone being able to open word and excel attachments? There is a whole crew of whiners in other forums talking about how the iPhone won't be attractive to business users .... blah de blah de blah .... I'd be willing to bet that the iPhone will be the number 1 business phone device in a year (I'm not saying it will have a majority of the smartphone market share, but I bet it has the single largest slice of any individual device).

[JKT]

Originally Posted by icruise 

For that matter, what does the iPhone use Bluetooth for, period? I can't think of any features right at this moment that make use of it. Is it only used for the headset thing?

Remote control of your Mac, perhaps (I certainly hope so).

[ixus_123]

Originally Posted by icruise 

For that matter, what does the iPhone use Bluetooth for, period? I can't think of any features right at this moment that make use of it. Is it only used for the headset thing?

Bluetooth is pretty cool.

Think using a headset or if you turn bluetooth on in address book app on your desktop phone calls & SMS messages will appear on screen and can be logged & replied to from your desktop.

There are applescripts floating around on the web that use bluetooth as a proximity sensor. Walk out of range (5 or so meters) from your mac and the screen saver comes on passord protected to lock the screeen. Come back in range, and the applescript will disable password on screensaver app, then disable screen saver - all pretty cool.

just being able to sms / make recieve calls from the desktop without having to take your phone out of your bag / pocket it a great feature of bluetooth. All of this has been possible since Jaguar at least although Apple seems to have forgotted Address Book.app of late - to get it recognise your phone you may need to edit an xml file within the application directory - use vi, nano, or smoultron tect editor to do this

[icruise]

I don't mean to harp on this, but I know what Bluetooth is capable of as a technology, or in other cell phones/PDAs. But so far we have no indication of what the iPhone in particular uses Bluetooth for, aside from the headset. True, one would expect Apple to support things like the Address Book features, but we haven't seen specific mention of it.

[kman42]

The activation video only talks about events, not To Dos.

[kman42]

And it appears that calendar syncing will suck too. In the video it shows that you have to select a specific calendar to which events input on the phone are added. It doesn't allow one to add events to separate calendars (work, home, etc).

It seems they really neglected the calendar/To Dos on the iPhone. I'm wondering if they are just waiting for Leopard to add in some real calendaring functions or if trying to make it work the same on Windows forced them to cripple it. Stupid Windows.

[::maroma::]

Originally Posted by kman42 

And it appears that calendar syncing will suck too. In the video it shows that you have to select a specific calendar to which events input on the phone are added. It doesn't allow one to add events to separate calendars (work, home, etc).

It seems they really neglected the calendar/To Dos on the iPhone. I'm wondering if they are just waiting for Leopard to add in some real calendaring functions or if trying to make it work the same on Windows forced them to cripple it. Stupid Windows.

Based on the lack of info we've had on Calendars, I think they have some work left to do on it, and will update it through software updates in the near future. I have a feeling they had to leave something for last, and maybe this is it?

[icruise]

Originally Posted by kman42 

And it appears that calendar syncing will suck too. In the video it shows that you have to select a specific calendar to which events input on the phone are added. It doesn't allow one to add events to separate calendars (work, home, etc). .

That's how the calendar syncing on other mobile phones works as well.

[kman42]

Originally Posted by icruise 

That's how the calendar syncing on other mobile phones works as well.

Uhhh...not on my treo. Granted I use a third party application, but I can sync all my calendars individually and add events to any one of them on the device.

It's just lame that you can't do it, especially since the underlying technology is there since I can sync my calendars on different computers with .Mac.

[icruise]

Originally Posted by kman42 

Uhhh...not on my treo. Granted I use a third party application, but I can sync all my calendars individually and add events to any one of them on the device.

It's just lame that you can't do it, especially since the underlying technology is there since I can sync my calendars on different computers with .Mac.

Uhh... I'm talking about iSync, and yes that is how it works.

[kman42]

Originally Posted by icruise 

Uhh... I'm talking about iSync, and yes that is how it works.

Fair enough: that's how iSync works. It's still lame when compared to how other systems function: treos, blackberries (I think).

[k2director]

Great. I wait *years* for an Apple phone, just *knowing* that an Apple phone will finally sync with my iApps perfectly, and instead, I get no To Dos, and phone-created calendar events that have to go to only one designated calendar.

Stupid, stupid, stupid. How hard could this functionality really be? Answer: not hard. It SHOULD have been in the launch product. What a dumb, totally unnecessary and avoidable oversight. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

[::maroma::]

Originally Posted by k2director 

Great. I wait *years* for an Apple phone, just *knowing* that an Apple phone will finally sync with my iApps perfectly, and instead, I get no To Dos, and phone-created calendar events that have to go to only one designated calendar.

Stupid, stupid, stupid. How hard could this functionality really be? Answer: not hard. It SHOULD have been in the launch product. What a dumb, totally unnecessary and avoidable oversight. Stupid, stupid, stupid.

One of the many beautiful things about the iPhone, is that something like this can be added extremely easily by Apple. For free. Through iTunes.

I have a feeling that when Leopard ships (or even before) we'll get a highly updated Calendar app and some To Do's. Be patient young one. It will come.

[k2director]

Originally Posted by ::maroma:: 

One of the many beautiful things about the iPhone, is that something like this can be added extremely easily by Apple. For free. Through iTunes.

I have a feeling that when Leopard ships (or even before) we'll get a highly updated Calendar app and some To Do's. Be patient young one. It will come.

Leopard is shipping in October, which likely means late October. That's 4 months away. That's a long time, frankly. Plus, there's no guarantee that To Do functionality will be added by that time, or calendar synching improved. There have been plenty of times when Apple's fan base has been **sure** a new feature or new product was just around the corner, and yet it never materializes. Remember when everyone was waiting for the 15" Aluminum books, after the 12 and 17 models were announced? Surely, Apple wouldn't leave a 15" TiBook on the market for so many months....and yet it did. And how long has it been since Apple took the iSight off the market, and not replaced it with something else? A long time, which is just inexplicable.

I'm not as confident as you that Apple will move quickly to fix this. Who knows: maybe Jobs doesn't believe in To Dos, and that's why we don't see them supported. It's a mystery. The only thing that's certain is that Apple developed the iPhone for more than 2 years, and couldn't work something as basic and simple and everyday as To Dos into the product! Sheesh....

[icruise]

Well, we don't know for sure that they aren't supported yet. We'll just have to wait and see.

[krove]

There are bound to be some features that just didn't make the cut per the time constraints. It's easy to be an armchair quarterback/general and pronounce what you think ought to have been done, but keep in mind that there were very few software engineers assigned to the iPhone team pre-January 2007. Six months is very little time to solidify a product as new and different as the iPhone let alone add new features, test and bug fix them with an expanded team.

Echoing others, be patient. I'm sure greater Calendar functionality will emerge, especially in conjunction with Leopard's Calendar Server.

[k2director]

Originally Posted by krove 

There are bound to be some features that just didn't make the cut per the time constraints. It's easy to be an armchair quarterback/general and pronounce what you think ought to have been done, but keep in mind that there were very few software engineers assigned to the iPhone team pre-January 2007.....

This is essentially a smartphone/pda. Letting it sync To Dos (aka 'Tasks') is a basic, barebones feature for that genre of device.

Voice dialing? Sure, I can see that waiting. IM client? Fine. GPS? Not a necessity for a first generation device. But To Dos are basic bread and water fare. It's not armchair quarterbacking to expect them in a smartphone/pda.

Given their fundamental nature (and the fact that even lowly iPods synch them up), Apple should have done whatever was necessary to get them into the launch product. Where there's a will, there's a way.

Anyway, maybe this is all moot. Maybe Apple just lumps To Dos in with Calendar appointments, and none of the 4 or 5 reviews I've read so far bothered to mention them. But I think we'll know definitely by Wednesday, because David Pogue will be doing an iPhone Q&A in his Circuits column, and To Dos/Tasks are definitely on his request list.

We shall see. I'm still holding out hope....

[icruise]

Do iPods sync to-dos? (I'll admit I haven't really messed with the PIM functions of the iPod all that much). If that's the case, I would be very surprised if the iPhone didn't support them.

[::maroma::]

Originally Posted by icruise 

Do iPods sync to-dos? (I'll admit I haven't really messed with the PIM functions of the iPod all that much). If that's the case, I would be very surprised if the iPhone didn't support them.

Fixed(?)

[icruise]

Yeah, sorry. I'll fix the original post.

[krove]

And I'm not arguing that they shouldn't have considered it, but I'm bringing up the point that maybe they did and put it off until an update can be made available to take advantage of system-wide to-dos with iCal (which might be significantly different than current to-dos) in Leopard.

[k2director]

Well, David Pogue just answered my question in his iPhone Q&A column today:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/28/te...ref=technology

"Do To Do items show up on the iPhone? Do memos in the iPhone’s Notes program show up on the computer? No."

So much for that. My 2.5 year old iPod Mini syncs my To Dos, but not a $600, brand-new Apple iPhone.

I was so ready to buy. Now I have to actually think about it. Really, if you're going to sync calendar items from iCal, bloody sync the To Dos as well, Apple. It's not rocket science....

[icruise]

Lame.

[Krusty]

Very Lame. On the bright side, you can set to-dos on iCal on your mac that will shoot you an email alarm to your iPhone at the specified time. So, the notification portion of the to-do at least has an easy work around.