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Robster1958 · Nov 19, 2002, 12:23 PM

like the previous long thread, i too love the form factor of the iBook.
<i'm in a starbucks right now through the t-mobile hotspot...its great!)

i got a great deal on mine (see config below), but was wondering about switching to the 12" 800mhz model.

specifically:
game performance.

any real experience/reviews yet with MOH:AA, Max Payne, etc?

xyber233 · Nov 19, 2002, 02:24 PM

I also would like to know. And how is Warcraft III performance in X?

-Q- · Nov 19, 2002, 02:39 PM

I just picked up WCIII so I'll let you know tonight. I've only tried Otto Matic (came with the iBook) so far, but it ran very smoothly. No MOH but it's a start.

A buddy has Max Payne. I'll have him load it and see what happens...

Red Wolf · Nov 19, 2002, 03:54 PM

I have run Starcraft for OS X, Unreal Tournament for OS X, and Jedi Knight II demo on my new iBook G3/800. I previously owned a iBook G3/500.

Starcraft ran just as well as usual during a network game with some PCs.

On my old system I could get UT to run in OS X without lag in a bot game after turing all of the video settings to the lowest setting. On the new iBook the game purred on the defaults settings. I haven't gone in to see how high I can get the video settings without lag.

I was looking at getting Jedi Knight II but since they advertised it needs 3D acceleration and the iBooks weren't listed as having 3D acceleration I tried out the demo to see how well the game play was. Again on the default settings in OS X the game played well. Even at the hardest level with a dozen Stormtroopers blasting away at my lightsaber there was no noticeable lag. Since the iBook just qualifies for the system requirements with the video card I would probably drop the settings a notch for network gaming but otherwise I'm planning on buying the full game.

While a desktop will always be a prefered gaming system I feel that the iBook has gone from a somewhat crappy gaming system to a good gaming system (but not great).

appledude83 · Nov 19, 2002, 06:06 PM

Well that's good to know that the iBook can handle some games. I'm not really going to be using mine for much gaming but I'm glad that I can if I decide to, at least decently.

katchow · Nov 20, 2002, 01:13 PM

well, got my ibook 800 yesterday.

tried loading a demo of Giants Citen Kubato on my machine and was a little underwhelmed...

i had every graphics setting set to the max including:
Model Detail,
Enhanced Water Effects,
Shadow Detail,
Texture Quality,
Sun Flare Effect,
View Distance.

everything was running real smooth...though i noticed that when i changed the texture quality it didn't make any changes to the appearance of the game. Low and High appeared exactly the same. I wonder, does the game automatically scale back the texture if your computer can't handle it? So even though high texture was selected it wouldn't make any difference. I still want to see how good this games graphics can be, even if it means really low frame rates...hmmm...

here's the other thing, there were a few more options in the graphics setting that were greyed-out and completely unvailable:

Object Bumpmapping,
Landscape Bumpmapping,
Environment Mapping.

i have max ram and 32 mb vram and i can't even set these options on their lowest setting? this is crazy...has anyone played this game? is it that demanding? this makes me afraid to buy any games for my iBook. i mean, yeah they'll run but will they look like crap?

forgive me if my post sounds ignorant...this is my first experience with a newer game...i used to have a beige g3...

katchow

oh i tried changing resolutions to low settings too...this made no difference...

diamondsw · Nov 20, 2002, 01:25 PM

Originally posted by katchow:
here's the other thing, there were a few more options in the graphics setting that were greyed-out and completely unvailable:

Object Bumpmapping,
Landscape Bumpmapping,
Environment Mapping.

i have max ram and 32 mb vram and i can't even set these options on their lowest setting? this is crazy...has anyone played this game? is it that demanding? this makes me afraid to buy any games for my iBook. i mean, yeah they'll run but will they look like crap?

forgive me if my post sounds ignorant...this is my first experience with a newer game...i used to have a beige g3...

katchow

oh i tried changing resolutions to low settings too...this made no difference...

Well, I'm no expert, but I'd wager those features might require features only found on the latest high-end cards. Similarly, you won't see FSAA (full screen anti aliasing) as an option, since it would only be available on a much higher video card.

Nevertheless, I am *really* looking forward to picking up my iBook. It already arrived, but I sent it to where I'll be for Thanksgiving next week - D'oh!

TrazPFloyd · Nov 21, 2002, 01:08 AM

Hey Q did you get a chance to try Warcraft III?? I need to hear, I'm seriously considering the iBook soon...

Thanks

claughery · Nov 21, 2002, 10:25 AM

Trust me: WC3 will be great on the ibook 800!!! There will be nothing wrong with maxed out settings.
WC3 isn't that intensive! The 7500 will handle it perfectly!

Commodus · Nov 21, 2002, 11:38 AM

katchow:

If the Mac port of Giants is anything like the Windows version, then the reason why those bump-mapping and environment-mapping features aren't available is because they want to talk to an nVidia GeForce 2 (probably including the MX model) or another GeForce board, in order to use the "nVidia shading rasterizer" which is - as you'd expect - unique to those boards.

I'm not sure if even a Mobility Radeon 9000 (or the desktop 9000 Pro) would be able to get that bump-mapping, so don't go running to exchange your iBook for a Powerbook just yet. I might be wrong about the reasons, as it is!

katchow · Nov 21, 2002, 01:49 PM

ahhh...thats interesing Commodus...i think i'll research that.

oh and btw, there's no way in hell i would trade this iBook in...i love this baby. a charleton heston quote comes to mind, but i wont say it cause i cant stand that guy...

i guess i was expecting this new video card to handle a bit more...i hope your right about that particular game. I almost didn't post my original post because that's the only game i've tried thus far...i guess its not really a fair assumption to think all games will play out the same. think i'll try the new Jedi game tonight...

another thing i noticed...in iTunes the highest frame rate i could achieve on the standard visuals full screen was about 30...but mostly it stayed in the low twenties sometimes dropping lower. this is with no other program running on my machine. as soon as another program was open (in the background, and not doing any tasks, that i could tell) the framerate dropped to 15 and below. i thought that was weird...again, i have 32mb vram and 640 ram.

Does this sound like what should be expected from this computer?

oh well, i'm still having a ball with this thing...

thanks for the responses guys

katchow

unfaded · Nov 21, 2002, 02:29 PM

Originally posted by katchow:
ahhh...thats interesing Commodus...i think i'll research that.

oh and btw, there's no way in hell i would trade this iBook in...i love this baby. a charleton heston quote comes to mind, but i wont say it cause i cant stand that guy...

i guess i was expecting this new video card to handle a bit more...i hope your right about that particular game. I almost didn't post my original post because that's the only game i've tried thus far...i guess its not really a fair assumption to think all games will play out the same. think i'll try the new Jedi game tonight...

another thing i noticed...in iTunes the highest frame rate i could achieve on the standard visuals full screen was about 30...but mostly it stayed in the low twenties sometimes dropping lower. this is with no other program running on my machine. as soon as another program was open (in the background, and not doing any tasks, that i could tell) the framerate dropped to 15 and below. i thought that was weird...again, i have 32mb vram and 640 ram.

Does this sound like what should be expected from this computer?

oh well, i'm still having a ball with this thing...

thanks for the responses guys

katchow

"You damn, dirty apes"? That's an AWFULLY strange quote to make about a laptop...

Just kidding ;o)

iamnid · Nov 21, 2002, 05:28 PM

those extra options are left over from the windows version -- they aren't currently supported by opengl. I guess when they ported the game they just left them in. I can't pick them with my Radeon 8500 nor can my friend with his Geforce 4Ti -- I guess until OpenGl adopts a standard for bumpmapping etc. we won't be able to turn it on.

dvd · Nov 21, 2002, 06:10 PM

i owned a 700mhz 384mb ram ibook and Jedi Knight was realy laggy in default settings. WC3 was very laggy too, reminded me of a 500mhz p3 with 32mb tnt that my roommate had.

tycheung · Nov 22, 2002, 02:12 AM

I'm less stringent about game perf in general - the most demanding game I've tried on a 700/Radeon 16 mb is Max Payne, which ran pretty smoothly until certain parts of the final level.

Jedi Knight demo ran without a hitch, as far as I can tell - maybe a few dropped frames in the battle with the Sith, is all.

Giants is a game that has been known to take DP G4's with GeForce 3's to their knees, so if it actually runs smooth on your iBook, that's saying a lot.

proux · Nov 22, 2002, 02:57 AM

Agreed, Giants is one of the most demanding game with SOFII and Ghost Recon. Even these should run with a few tweak compromises.

tycheung · Nov 22, 2002, 03:16 AM

I'm just got ghost recon, actually - it's not too bad. I didn't tweak any of the settings so it's on whatever default it's installed with. pretty smooth in general - certain slight slowdowns in some parts of the map. don't have any FPS figures, tho, unfortunately.

olli2 · Nov 22, 2002, 03:18 AM

Is there a good Rally simulator that runs smoothly on the new iBook?

I am hesitating between the iBook 2002 models, the cheaper 700 MHz with Radeon 7500 16 MB VRam and the 800 MHz Radeon 7500 32 MB VRam.

It seems to me that the 16 MB extra video memory can change a lot for the video performance of Quartz Extreme and a lot for games. Is that right? Because, I don't need the combo drive that's in the 800 Mhz model, and it makes more expensive, but I don't want a lagging machine.

katchow · Nov 22, 2002, 10:07 AM

wow, look at all the posts....cool

well, i feel much better now....played jedi knight last night and it was like butta'...almost all the settings were maxed out....sweet! that game is cool, even though i really suck at it...this is one of my first fps games, afterall. if that game had been around when i was ten i'd have never left the house...instead i was making do with empire strikes back and jedi arena on the 2600. oh the horror...

it may just be me...i wasn't all that impressed with Giants. It may be because i didn't get far enough into it, but the polygony desert backdrop seemed a little mundane...maybe i'll try it again some time.
thanks for the info guys, i'm relieved to see my iBook is better than previously thought...onward to MOH!

olli2, having used both iBooks new and old, i have noticed a difference in speed. Its not a huge difference until you are doing some pretty intensive work, even then its neglible. Though there is a difference with the games i've tried...thats for sure. If you have the cash, it would seem the 12" 800 is the best value. More Vram, Mhz, 10 extra gb, and the ability to watch DVD's...uh, different paint finish...

katchow

villalobos · Nov 22, 2002, 01:37 PM

Originally posted by claughery:

WC3 isn't that intensive! The 7500 will handle it perfectly!

then you have never played a network game. WC3 is NOT playable, i repeat not playable, on a G4 533 with a radeon 8500 when 2 armies of moderate size fight. It lags to the point where there is no way of controlling the mouse. WC3 is a very bad port. I doubt that the 7500 card of the ibook is gonna help here.

Villa

cruise · Nov 22, 2002, 02:31 PM

Originally posted by katchow:
ahhh...thats interesing Commodus...i think i'll research that.

oh and btw, there's no way in hell i would trade this iBook in...i love this baby. a charleton heston quote comes to mind, but i wont say it cause i cant stand that guy...

i guess i was expecting this new video card to handle a bit more...i hope your right about that particular game. I almost didn't post my original post because that's the only game i've tried thus far...i guess its not really a fair assumption to think all games will play out the same. think i'll try the new Jedi game tonight...

another thing i noticed...in iTunes the highest frame rate i could achieve on the standard visuals full screen was about 30...but mostly it stayed in the low twenties sometimes dropping lower. this is with no other program running on my machine. as soon as another program was open (in the background, and not doing any tasks, that i could tell) the framerate dropped to 15 and below. i thought that was weird...again, i have 32mb vram and 640 ram.

Does this sound like what should be expected from this computer?

oh well, i'm still having a ball with this thing...

thanks for the responses guys

katchow

Those are much better framerates than I was getting with my 700 MHz iBook (384MB RAM, 16MB Radeon Mobility). A definite improvement - I think I was usually getting around 10-15 FPS, sometimes lower. One of the reasons I just sold my iBook was due to the underwhelming video performance. Now I've got a 1 GHz Titanium G4 on the way...

tycheung · Nov 22, 2002, 03:17 PM

Originally posted by villalobos:

then you have never played a network game. WC3 is NOT playable, i repeat not playable, on a G4 533 with a radeon 8500 when 2 armies of moderate size fight. It lags to the point where there is no way of controlling the mouse. WC3 is a very bad port. I doubt that the 7500 card of the ibook is gonna help here.

Villa

you sure it isn't the slower CPU of the G4 choking on the multiple unit AI's? What's the benchmarks for, say, an iMac 700 playing this game?

villalobos · Nov 22, 2002, 05:54 PM

Originally posted by cruise:

Those are much better framerates than I was getting with my 700 MHz iBook (384MB RAM, 16MB Radeon Mobility). A definite improvement - I think I was usually getting around 10-15 FPS, sometimes lower. One of the reasons I just sold my iBook was due to the underwhelming video performance. Now I've got a 1 GHz Titanium G4 on the way...

Are these Altivec accelerated, because that is what I get on my G4 533 with the 8500.

Villa

villalobos · Nov 22, 2002, 05:57 PM

Originally posted by tycheung:

you sure it isn't the slower CPU of the G4 choking on the multiple unit AI's? What's the benchmarks for, say, an iMac 700 playing this game?

Well there is certainly no Altivec involved in WC3, but the 8500 is more powerful than the 7500, and It has 64 Mb of memory.
The processor speed certainly makes a dfference, and also most games are CPU-bound on the mac. I still highly doubt that WC3 is gonna work well on a Ibook 800MHz. It would be intersting to ask somebady who actually has this computer and this game.

And I know for a fact that the previous 700 MHz ibook was choking nicely.

Villa

xyber233 · Nov 22, 2002, 10:08 PM

Trust me: WC3 will be great on the ibook 800!!! There will be nothing wrong with maxed out settings.
WC3 isn't that intensive! The 7500 will handle it perfectly!

I can't run WC3 on my 700mHz LCD iMac w/384mb RAM in os x even at 640x480. In runs fine in 9. I don' like booting into 9. Thats why I am interested to know what performance is like on the iBook.