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KellyHogan · Jun 17, 2002, 02:09 PM

As mentioned before, the new Apple ad campaign is off to a rocky start because Apple couldn't have picked worse people to stick in their ads (I mean it).

"Too bad the execution isn't so hot � They're kind of like watching Gap ads written and directed by a BF-trolling platform zealot. And here's to hoping that Apple will never again stoop to desecrating the image of a great advocate for the poor like Cesar Chavez in order to hawk shiny plastic computers to an almost solely upscale demographic."

<a href="http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/35/25750.html" target="_blank">http://www.theregister.co.uk/content/35/25750.html</a>

Hash · Jun 17, 2002, 03:03 PM

Hey, not everyone is movie star, president of US, Beckham or even Dell. There are ordinary people and they may dont look pretty like Britney Spears but they are real and their problems are real. People would believe real people, not some Unix gurus (who dont need conversion at all) speaking uncomprehensible computer jargon.

Well, Appl always promoted itself as a computer for elite - intellectual, artist, whatever - from 1984 and going with Think Different - and leaving simple street guys for Dell+Microsoft.

The turn to real people and mass consumer is correct and right way to increase that 4% share.. Good start, go on, show us REAL people and what they can do with macs!

00101001 · Jun 17, 2002, 03:16 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Hash:
Good start, go on, show us REAL people and what they can do with macs!<hr /></blockquote>Yes! Show us real people and what they can do with Macs -- not what they CAN'T do with PC's. I completely agree with the Register's article. Apple needs to sohw off the INCREDIBLY COOL STUFF YOU CAN DO WITH THE MACINTOSH, not this boring sh*t. In a nutshell, the Macintosh is an easy to use powerhouse of a machine.... show it off. Make PC users jealous that they don't have one (don't make them feel smart because the can use their PC).

KellyHogan · Jun 17, 2002, 03:18 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Hash:
Hey, not everyone is movie star, president of US, Beckham or even Dell. There are ordinary people and they may dont look pretty like Britney Spears but they are real and their problems are real. People would believe real people, not some Unix gurus (who dont need conversion at all) speaking uncomprehensible computer jargon.

Well, Appl always promoted itself as a computer for elite - intellectual, artist, whatever - from 1984 and going with Think Different - and leaving simple street guys for Dell+Microsoft.

The turn to real people and mass consumer is correct and right way to increase that 4% share.. Good start, go on, show us REAL people and what they can do with macs!<hr /></blockquote>I disagree. I think there will be many people rolling over and dying of laughter from watching how stupid these adds are. They make Mac users look a cult for the dumb, like Scientology or something. We have Liz complaining about 'stupid puny speakers' so she instead of buying decent speakers she buys an iBook which has stupid puny speakers. Then there is dominatrix Sarah who complains that she didn't know how to move or open a file on Windows. This one really takes the biscuit. Next we get someone who has made his computer a member of his family. Ahem. It's too much. Most people will be watching those adds and thinking 'How sad.'.

Sadder than Goldblum and his three steps to the internet. Apparently he was fortunate enough not to have to install or set up the Mac OS from the disks when he bought his Mac, didn't have to personalise his system and didn't have an ISP to choose from and manually configure.

KellyHogan · Jun 17, 2002, 03:22 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by 00101001:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Hash:
Good start, go on, show us REAL people and what they can do with macs!<hr /></blockquote>Yes! Show us real people and what they can do with Macs -- not what they CAN'T do with PC's. I completely agree with the Register's article. Apple needs to sohw off the INCREDIBLY COOL STUFF YOU CAN DO WITH THE MACINTOSH, not this boring sh*t. In a nutshell, the Macintosh is an easy to use powerhouse of a machine.... show it off. Make PC users jealous that they don't have one (don't make them feel smart because the can use their PC).<hr /></blockquote>If Macs really are powerhouses then I'd agree. But hardware is not going to catch up, the business model simply doesn't allow it, and until Jaguar the GUI is still to slow. I mean, I have to watch text catch up with my typing. This isn't 1979.

McKenna · Jun 17, 2002, 03:45 PM

Just another breeze of hot air...

If only his mother would have paid more attention to him as a child...

Sometimes it snows in April.

Over and out
Tom

00101001 · Jun 17, 2002, 03:48 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by KellyHogan:
If Macs really are powerhouses then I'd agree. But hardware is not going to catch up, the business model simply doesn't allow it, and until Jaguar the GUI is still to slow. I mean, I have to watch text catch up with my typing. This isn't 1979.<hr /></blockquote>I'm not going to disagree, I have little hope that the Mac processor is going to catch up to that of a PC - but I have two points. First of all, Jaguar is pretty darn fast..... But anyway, second of all, by "powerhouse" I did not mean "raw speed". I can do things on my Mac that are IMPOSSIBLE to do on a PC. And even things that are possible to accomplish on both machines I can do faster and better with my Mac. I used linux before os x, and the fusion of the mac intuitiveness with the power of bsd is incredible. The point is, Apple's got to make people WANT these things. People WANT things by seeing the cool stuff they can do. The "Real People" ad campaign does not explain to anyone how COOL the mac is.

Richard Clark · Jun 17, 2002, 04:10 PM

I agree with you guys that it should be a "Show" how it works instead of thin explanations leaving Windoze.

BUT at least Apple FINALLY did something to show regular people using a Mac. They still don't get it but at least it's a start.

This is a company(Apple) mind you that finally went to an optical mouse two years ago and is currently using contextual menus without a second button mouse. My point, wait five years and maybe when they don't have any kind of significant user base before they make the right kind of advertisement.

Sad.......

Big Mac · Jun 17, 2002, 04:18 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by KellyHogan:
[SNIP] Sadder than Goldblum and his three steps to the internet. Apparently he was fortunate enough not to have to install or set up the Mac OS from the disks when he bought his Mac, didn't have to personalise his system and didn't have an ISP to choose from and manually configure.<hr /></blockquote>The Macs you have didn't have their OSs installed by the factory? I know it's probably beyond your capacity to follow the first boot setup assistant, but normal people can deal with it. I think you're approaching your idiocy quota for the day - you better lay off the post button.

[ 06-17-2002, 04:19 PM: Message edited by: Big Mac ]

Adam Betts · Jun 17, 2002, 04:21 PM

<img src="http://homepage.mac.com/adambetts/MacNN/Roll-Eye.gif" alt=" - " />

Don't reply to KellieHogan. He won't listen to you so please don't waste your time.

If another thread with similar title and different poster, I'll reply for sure because it ain't from KellieHogan.

::maroma:: · Jun 17, 2002, 04:36 PM

It's kinda funny how KH starts out criticizing the new Apple ads, and not 1 post later, he's off on a tangent with his "issues" with Apple hardware and software. Try to stay on topic when you start a thread KH, it makes for better conversation.

--back on topic--

I kinda indifferent on the new ads. They don't tickle me and they don't really get on my nerves either. I agree that they could be a little more 'power user-ish' (for lack of a better term). I see these as a beginning of a chain of progressively better and more focused ads. When X really hits the big time, I think we'll start seeing some really good 'user commercials'. And by this time next year, Apple should be showing the G5 and 10.x to the fullest.

Here's to hoping...

KellyHogan · Jun 17, 2002, 04:52 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by ::maroma:::
It's kinda funny how KH starts out criticizing the new Apple ads, and not 1 post later, he's off on a tangent with his "issues" with Apple hardware and software. Try to stay on topic when you start a thread KH, it makes for better conversation.

--back on topic--

I.<hr /></blockquote>I am on topic - misleading and silly Apple ads.

IronPen · Jun 17, 2002, 06:12 PM

The least they could have done is put a few flashy screenshots of the OS and Apple apps in there. Being a pc to Mac convert, I have to say, if not for the chance to use on a Mac at work, I would have been reluctant to buy a Mac. I want the hands-on experience before I drop over $1000 on a computer, or anything for that matter. But give people a taste of what it's like, and they might become curious. OS X is pretty, and it is so easy to use...Apple hasn't been effective in communicating that to the masses. PC to Mac converts can talk to me until I'm blue in the face and I'm not going to visit their site. People are sold on how things look...cars, clothes, appliances, televisions...and yes, computers. Let them see the damned thing, Apple. Geesh!

Mac007 · Jun 17, 2002, 10:25 PM

Hey if you've got a better idea why not contact the ad agency that makes the ads. You might drop Apple a line also and let them know what you think.

P.S. What do you all think of Gateway's latest commercial. I had a real laugh when they ran an Apple commercial right after it. Maybe Apple could get Pamala Lee Anderson to sell their stuff. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

ratlater · Jun 17, 2002, 10:36 PM

At this time I would like to point everyone to unfaded's sig.

That is all.

-matt

V0ID · Jun 17, 2002, 10:37 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by KellyHogan:
If Macs really are powerhouses then I'd agree. But hardware is not going to catch up, the business model simply doesn't allow it, and until Jaguar the GUI is still to slow. I mean, I have to watch text catch up with my typing. This isn't 1979.<hr /></blockquote>Dude, there is something wrong with your computer. Even my 400mhz G3 doesn't suffer like that.

mrtew · Jun 17, 2002, 10:46 PM

Really nice subject line! (Get a clue dude).

ReggieX · Jun 17, 2002, 11:37 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by KellyHogan:
I am on topic - misleading and silly Apple ads.<hr /></blockquote>XP makes people fly?
Intel chips "make the internet better?"

Did you see this?
<blockquote>quote:<hr /> Second, use descriptive titles so people know what the thread is about <hr /></blockquote>

tinrib · Jun 17, 2002, 11:43 PM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by ratlater:
At this time I would like to point everyone to unfaded's sig.

That is all.

-matt<hr /></blockquote>well point then... where?

Gee-Man · Jun 18, 2002, 12:39 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />I am on topic - misleading and silly Apple ads.<hr /></blockquote>Right, like those Intel ads with little CGI aliens placing Pentiums into their UFOs are far more realistic.

But back on the subject at hand, I find the ads effective precisely because they run counter to the kind of criticism that the Register is making. I am tired of my fellow "computer people" referring to anyone who isn't computer-savvy as a "loser" - I think that this kind of attitude is what is holding back the entire industry, and why computers get away with being so unreliable. Computers and computer software get away with an astonishing amount of poor design and defective quality that would be completely unacceptable with other products. People get told so often that when something is wrong with their computer, it's not the computer's fault, it's THEM. So they get an inferiority complex - the machine is perfect, I'm the problem, etc. The entire Windows IT universe seems to be built on this premise (why is "Nick Burns, Your Company's Computer Guy" so funny? Because it's true...)

Apple's ads don't reflect the attitudes of those kind of people, people who feel that somehow knowing how to "troubleshoot" all the built-in problems of computers makes them better people than everybody else. Believe it or not, there are many highly intelligent, real people out there that do not know much at all about how their computers work, and frankly don't care. All they want is to get things done, everything else is a distraction.

I think some of these ads appeal to these often-ignored users, even though some of the so-called "computer elite" might consider them "losers". BS! I say it's about time - the people in the ads say what's on their mind without being condescending or elitist. They may not reflect the experience of everybody, but at least they are representing a lot of people who haven't had much of a voice before, and for that reason alone they're refreshing. I have already had several "non-computer" and Windows-using friends of mine, who have never had strong opinions about OS platforms (they could care less, in fact) ask me about the ads knowing I have a Macintosh, and wondering if they might get the same experience if they switched to the Mac.

That's all the evidence I need to say that the ads are working, even after only a week.

KellyHogan · Jun 18, 2002, 03:53 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Gee-Man:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />I am on topic - misleading and silly Apple ads.<hr /></blockquote>Right, like those Intel ads with little CGI aliens placing Pentiums into their UFOs are far more realistic.

.<hr /></blockquote>Even though the sheer majority of people know that I and others are platform agnostic, there continues to be people like you, OS worshipping fanatics, that seem to be under the impression that any criticism of Apple means that the critic is a Windows/Wintel fanatic/troll. Yes, the alien Pentum ads are stupid, the colorful spacesuit engineers are really stupid, and the XP flying man is really dumb. BUT Apple's ads can be even more stupid and this new ad campaign is dumber than all of the Wintel ads put together. I mean, it looks exactly like what that link says it looks like. A bunch of losers who can't move a file in Windows (when OSX lacks a CUT command in the Finder), buy an iBook because they don't know how to upgrade 'stupid puny' speakers and generally look like Apple's Singles Club.

People are laughing at these guys. Apple should do what their best ads do, just show their products in action.

Spheric Harlot · Jun 18, 2002, 05:19 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by KellyHogan:
Then there is dominatrix Sarah who complains that she didn't know how to move or open a file on Windows. This one really takes the biscuit.<hr /></blockquote>I know this is hard to grasp, but really:
This is the rule, NOT the exception, among the Windows users I know.
Very few people at my place of work have any idea of how the file system is organized - the vast majority just hit return when prompted to save, but have no idea how to get at that file from the Explorer or their e-mail program if they need to work with it elsewhere.
This *is* different on the Mac - especially since OS X, Services, the Finder toolbar, etc.

-s*

KellyHogan · Jun 18, 2002, 05:39 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Spheric Harlot:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by KellyHogan:
Then there is dominatrix Sarah who complains that she didn't know how to move or open a file on Windows. This one really takes the biscuit.<hr /></blockquote>I know this is hard to grasp, but really:
This is the rule, NOT the exception, among the Windows users I know.
Very few people at my place of work have any idea of how the file system is organized - the vast majority just hit return when prompted to save, but have no idea how to get at that file from the Explorer or their e-mail program if they need to work with it elsewhere.
This *is* different on the Mac - especially since OS X, Services, the Finder toolbar, etc.

-s*<hr /></blockquote>Show me exactly how different it is to move or open a file with OSX. BTW, I doubt Sarah Whistler will ever notice Services.

Spheric Harlot · Jun 18, 2002, 06:07 AM

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by KellyHogan:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by Gee-Man:
 <blockquote>quote:<hr />I am on topic - misleading and silly Apple ads.<hr /></blockquote>Right, like those Intel ads with little CGI aliens placing Pentiums into their UFOs are far more realistic.

.<hr /></blockquote>Even though the sheer majority of people know that I and others are platform agnostic, there continues to be people like you, OS worshipping fanatics, that seem to be under the impression that any criticism of Apple means that the critic is a Windows/Wintel fanatic/troll.<hr /></blockquote>Aron,

You're embarrassing yourself. Stop it.
Or, at least read the rest of his post, which makes *quite* clear to the literate that the above he is most definitely NOT.

<blockquote>quote:<hr />Show me exactly how different it is to move or open a file with OSX.<hr /></blockquote>That is *exactly* the point of these ads. You *can't* show stuff on OS X in a 30-second ad that Microsoft couldn't show being done too. How *well* it can be done, or how easily, is something that you cannot *show* people without letting them actually use the machine. So you make them curious, which these ads do quite well, I think.

You have repeatedly claimed that there *is* no real difference. It is quite possible that this is the case for you - that's fine. Really.
But you must accept and live with the fact that for most of us here, there *is* a difference. It's why we use Macs. And if you dispute that, you're simply wrong. Full stop.

Fact is, my non-computer-savvy friend who bought a FP iMac a few months ago *understands* his user folder. He knows where stuff goes, because the folders are already there and programs default there. His Windows machine was a mess and a mystery to him. For this, and many other reasons, he loves the Mac. For reasons that you can't "show" anybody in a TV ad.

-s*

ls -al · Jun 18, 2002, 10:45 AM

Meh, I'll believe that these ads are off to a rocky start when I see solid metrics. Such as Nielsen ratings of these ads, increase in foot traffic in stores, increase in traffic at apple.com and hits from PC's at apple.com/switch. The effectiveness of an ad campaign is measured by the most important metric: percentage increase/decrease in sales.

Everything else is absolute bull. Including full page rants from two-bit e-zines masquerading as Marketing experts. And "expert" commentary from trolls like Kellyhogan.

Consider one thing, Apple is taking a play from the Pepsi ad-book from circa early 80's. When they successfully increased their market share. These ads are taking a time tested route of portraying ordinary people. Not hyperactive dudes or talking cows. The message of the ads is simple and succint: "S-W-I-T-C-H --others have and love it." Also, they seem to be going after the low hanging fruit. Even if this pulls off a 1-2% increase in market share it is a big success.

It is too early to comment if the campaign is having the desired effect. If it is not, Apple will notice it early and fine tune the campaign. Trust me on that. These guys are not amateurs.

[ 06-18-2002, 10:48 AM: Message edited by: ls -al ]

gorgonzola · Jun 18, 2002, 10:54 AM

Stop posting every single thread that pops into your head in the OS X forum. This is why there's a Lounge.

Moving.