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You are here: MacNN Forums > Hardware - Troubleshooting and Discussion > Mac Notebooks > Freescale officially announced new MPC7448 !

Freescale officially announced new MPC7448 !
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Simon
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Sep 28, 2004, 11:53 AM
 
In this press release Freescale/Moto finally officially announce the MPC7448 which is a pin-compatible successor to the 74xx chips.

It's not a dual-core CPU, but part of the e600 family which also sports a dual-core chip. The 7448 is supposed to run on a 200MHz FSB finally passing the previous 167MHz MaxBus limit. Its clock speed should be >1.5GHz and consumption at 1.4GHz is 10W!

Now, will this chip be in the next PowerBook? And when will it be announced and ship? How about these answers: yes & intro in October, shipping in November.
     
Pierre B.
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Sep 28, 2004, 12:28 PM
 
Originally posted by Simon:
Now, will this chip be in the next PowerBook? And when will it be announced and ship? How about these answers: yes & intro in October, shipping in November.
According to The Register, sampling is scheduled for H1 2005. So, if Apple is ever going to use this processor in a Powerbook or iBook, this would not be before next summer.
     
machan
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Sep 28, 2004, 12:38 PM
 
i haven't kept up on processor announcements and their relation to actual ship dates, but it seems like a pretty huge gap to announce specs today and then wait to do anything about them until next spring, doesn't it?

i seem to recall times when motorola and/or ibm wouldn't even announce a processor and it would show up in a mac of some sort. didn't that happen with the last update to the xserve or something?
     
Pierre B.
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Sep 28, 2004, 12:54 PM
 
Originally posted by machan:
i haven't kept up on processor announcements and their relation to actual ship dates, but it seems like a pretty huge gap to announce specs today and then wait to do anything about them until next spring, doesn't it?
Usually, as far as major architectural advancements are concerned, the announcement and the shipping product are separated by a 9 month interval, or more.
     
cszar2001
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Sep 28, 2004, 02:18 PM
 
This pushes the G5 PB`s even farther into the future.
"Microsoft is a cross between the Borg and the Ferengi. Unfortunately, they use Borg to do their marketing and Ferengi to do their programming." Simon Slavin

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moodymonster
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Sep 28, 2004, 02:43 PM
 
I'm not techy but it seems as though there are two main types of processor.

1 7448 - can basically replace the G4s currently used in PBs, seems designed to just drop in - 200Mhz FSB

2 8641 (single) & 8641D (dual) - seem to have gigbit ethernet, memory controllers etc on the chip - so it could be said that the PB would only need to be designed to work with the new chips and leave the other stuff to the processor(s) - 667Mhz FSB

Given the lagging speed on the PBs FSB (167mhz) compared to the G5s (600-1250Mhz!), it looks good - we may not get G5 PBs in the near future but these chips look good, also from a power consumption POV.

Here's hoping
     
freakboy2
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Sep 28, 2004, 04:47 PM
 
yeah these procs have the potential to really kick up the performance and power managment of the powerbooks.

lets hope they come out sooner rather than later.
     
rambo47
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Sep 28, 2004, 08:58 PM
 
The 7448 at 10W power consumption is definitely a Centrino competitor, something I've been whining about for the better part of a year. Seems like the focus for laptops is moving away from MHz and towards battery life and DVD-RW speed. This is a welcome shift in priorities as far as I'm concerned.
     
iomatic
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Sep 28, 2004, 11:37 PM
 
Well, I hope these end up in the iBooks. Because we would then count on having a PowerBook G5. I would wait of course until the next revision...

US$.02
     
anamexis
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Sep 29, 2004, 12:49 AM
 
Originally posted by iomatic:
Well, I hope these end up in the iBooks. Because we would then count on having a PowerBook G5. I would wait of course until the next revision...

US$.02
Actually, that brings up an interesting theory, that the 7448s are for the iBooks and the 8641s are for the next rev. of PowerBook.
     
Pierre B.
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Sep 29, 2004, 03:56 AM
 
Originally posted by rambo47:
The 7448 at 10W power consumption is definitely a Centrino competitor, something I've been whining about for the better part of a year.
Only that the Centrino is in the market nearly for one year and a half now (with a substantially more efficient version at this moment, the Dothan) and the 7448 is not expected before the summer 2005 (if Freescale don't run into problems with the 90 nm process or something else). So, a 2 year delay? In this market? Not very good.


Seems like the focus for laptops is moving away from MHz and towards battery life and DVD-RW speed. This is a welcome shift in priorities as far as I'm concerned.
It is becoming more and more difficult today to push the performance in laptops with the current processor technology. To keep up with the competition, this leads to other, very welcome indeed, improvements.
     
Pierre B.
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Sep 29, 2004, 04:00 AM
 
Originally posted by anamexis:
Actually, that brings up an interesting theory, that the 7448s are for the iBooks and the 8641s are for the next rev. of PowerBook.
The problem with this theory is that the 8641s are not going into sampling sooner than a year from now (so expect production somewhere in 2006, if things go as scheduled). They are sure not for the next Powerbook update. Unless Apple abandon the Powerbooks until... 2006.
     
wtmcgee
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Sep 29, 2004, 10:42 AM
 
I'd say this announcement makes it even more apparent we'll see a powerbook update by the end of October. If all they are going to do is offer an incremental update, it's about that time.... and just in time for me.
     
iREZ
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Sep 29, 2004, 11:21 AM
 
This is great news, but sucks because Freescale is kicking the crap out of IBM when it comes to the Apple 'book lines. I sure hope IBM gets their act together soon and we see some G5's soon.
NOW YOU SEE ME! 2.4 MBP and 2.0 MBP (running ubuntu)
     
iPoder
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Sep 29, 2004, 11:59 AM
 
Originally posted by iREZ:
This is great news, but sucks because Freescale is kicking the crap out of IBM when it comes to the Apple 'book lines. I sure hope IBM gets their act together soon and we see some G5's soon.
Physics rules, so I don't think that IBM is the one to be blamed. The whole semiconductor industry struggles to advance clock speed recently. Think how long for Intel to advance the chip speed from 3 GHz to 4 GHz, and you are lucky to find a 4 GHz chip (Prescott) any time soon, if you find it at all.

That's why every one (AMD, IBM, Freescale, Intel) is moving to multi-core processor design to advance the performance without increasing the clock speed.

Personally, I think the cooling technology is the one to watch in the next few years.
     
babywriter2
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Sep 29, 2004, 12:50 PM
 
Actually, I'm intrigued about what the dual-core e600-based chips might be able to do for Apple in opening up, perhaps, a whole new product category.

These chips, with their "system-on-a-chip" design, might allow Apple to extend to areas never before thought of. I would think that potential form factor of a product would be noticeably smaller (in every dimension) than current offerings...and most likely cheaper, too - because the support circuitry is largely built in already, which reduces component and assembly costs.

The long-rumored Apple tablet, for example, comes to mind - or a slick, powerful set-top box with DVR/stereo/AirPort Express integration - or maybe even a micro-book along the lines of the Sony Vaio subnotes that are so popular in Japan.

Me, I'd love a powerful Newton replacement running a sleek subset of OS X, with a low-mHz e600 chip directing the show - priced at about $400. But I'm a dreamer.

- b
     
SierraDragon
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Sep 29, 2004, 04:30 PM
 
It is interesting to see folks' widely different wants. Some say they could care less about throughput but want DVD speed and battery life. Personally as an SLR digital photographer and doing graphic design I could care less about DVD speed or battery life but desperately need throughput; current G4s are not really enough. An iMac G5 in laptop form factor with 20 minute battery life (to cope with power anomalies in the field) would suit me fine! And I will pay as necessary for an appropriately configured work tool.

It would seem that Apple could address these divergent needs by bumping up the 17" (or even larger!) end of the PB line. All that real estate gives more room to cope with heat, and the smaller PBs could have lower prices, fast DVDs, and long battery lives.
     
iREZ
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Sep 29, 2004, 05:10 PM
 
All I'm sayin is that Moto was to blame when the G4 wasn't getting updated for long periods of time (ie. TiBook 1Ghz, 12" Rev B, and 15" Rev A were all the same clock speed). Now Freescale seems to be coming up with better stuff while IBM is falling to what seems to be the same state as Moto.
NOW YOU SEE ME! 2.4 MBP and 2.0 MBP (running ubuntu)
     
iPoder
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Sep 29, 2004, 07:35 PM
 
Betting on one vendor is never a good idea !!!

Let the competition begin, and the winner reigns supreme.
     
avaughs
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Sep 29, 2004, 11:56 PM
 
Here's my two cents on the future of powerbooks in the next 12 months.

(1) No G5 equiped PowerBook until April 05 the earliest
(2) New 7447A equiped iBooks at current PowerBook speeds in '05
(3) New 7448 eqiuiped 12,15 and 17 inch PowerBooks in '04
(4) New 8641D equiped 15 and 17 inch PowerBooks in '05 (12 inch discontinued)

Steve will say some thing like "We are the only computer company in the industry with dual processors accross its entire Pro product line!" at the MWSF05 introduction.

Oh of course, you'll be able to order the 8641D PowerBooks right after the Keynote, however, they wont ship until April!
     
anamexis
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Sep 30, 2004, 12:22 AM
 
Originally posted by avaughs:

(1) No G5 equiped PowerBook until April 05 the earliest
(2) New 7447A equiped iBooks at current PowerBook speeds in '05
(3) New 7448 eqiuiped 12,15 and 17 inch PowerBooks in '04
(4) New 8641D equiped 15 and 17 inch PowerBooks in '05 (12 inch discontinued)
12 inch discontinued?!?
     
macaddict0001
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Sep 30, 2004, 12:27 AM
 
Originally posted by anamexis:
12 inch discontinued?!?
yeah I know avaughs has alway's been crazy in all of his one post.
     
wuzup101
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Sep 30, 2004, 12:28 AM
 
I really don't see them dropping the 12" as they are too popular. I do however agree that they might not see the G5 as soon as the 15" and 17" models.
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SEkker
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Sep 30, 2004, 07:17 PM
 
They could convert the iBook to a PB12 machine.

The big problem Apple has is marketing -- even if a G4* machine is faster than a G5 Powerbook, everyone will somehow covet the G5.
     
avaughs
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Oct 1, 2004, 03:20 AM
 
Just a WAGuess about the fate of the 12 Inch PowerBook. The current 12 inch is, in my opinion, a 12 inch Aluminum iBook with monitor spanning enabled on a sub-par video card. Apple ought to up the screen resolution on the 12 inch PowerBook and put in a faster video card! They also should throw in a PC-Card slot for good measure. When I fly for business or leisure, I fly coach and a 15" is too big for the tray tables but the 12 is just perfect. However, the paltry 1024 by 768 is woefully inadequate for any serious work. While I'm nit picking the 12 Inch PB, how about back lighting the keyboard. So maybe Apple will discontinue the 12 inch in its current form and release refreshed and upgraded version with all the "right stuff"!

Though I would very much like to see a dual cpu PowerBook, I don't believe the Freescale 8641D will be the path to this beast. Here are three reasons why.

[1] The pin outs on the 8641/8641D are different from the 7448 and 7447A. Apple would have to either design a new MLB to accommodate the 8641's or modify the existing one. That could require a lot of R&D investment for a product with a life span of a year or less (assuming the G5 for laptop applications becomes available before end of '05). Not a frugal financial investment.

[2] Using the 7448's in the current designs probably wont require a major redesign (ie low R&D costs). This expense could be justified on a product with only a year life cycle. A more frugal financial investment. iBooks would get the 7447A line.

[3] Lastly, If the 8641D is "so good", why wouldn't Apple switch from the 74xx single core family to the 8641 single core? I suspect there is about the nature of the 8641 which makes it unsuitable as a General Purpose CPU like the 7447A and 7448.

So assuming Apple just goes with the 7448 version of the G4 I'll bet that the top speed will always be less than or equal to the slowest shipping PowerMac G5 (1.8 GHz at present).

Hey I'm just guessing and putting my two 1 cents (US) together.
     
macaddict0001
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Oct 1, 2004, 12:48 PM
 
Originally posted by avaughs:
Just a WAGuess about the fate of the 12 Inch PowerBook. The current 12 inch is, in my opinion, a 12 inch Aluminum iBook with monitor spanning enabled on a sub-par video card. Apple ought to up the screen resolution on the 12 inch PowerBook and put in a faster video card! They also should throw in a PC-Card slot for good measure. When I fly for business or leisure, I fly coach and a 15" is too big for the tray tables but the 12 is just perfect. However, the paltry 1024 by 768 is woefully inadequate for any serious work. While I'm nit picking the 12 Inch PB, how about back lighting the keyboard. So maybe Apple will discontinue the 12 inch in its current form and release refreshed and upgraded version with all the "right stuff"!

Though I would very much like to see a dual cpu PowerBook, I don't believe the Freescale 8641D will be the path to this beast. Here are three reasons why.

[1] The pin outs on the 8641/8641D are different from the 7448 and 7447A. Apple would have to either design a new MLB to accommodate the 8641's or modify the existing one. That could require a lot of R&D investment for a product with a life span of a year or less (assuming the G5 for laptop applications becomes available before end of '05). Not a frugal financial investment.

[2] Using the 7448's in the current designs probably wont require a major redesign (ie low R&D costs). This expense could be justified on a product with only a year life cycle. A more frugal financial investment. iBooks would get the 7447A line.

[3] Lastly, If the 8641D is "so good", why wouldn't Apple switch from the 74xx single core family to the 8641 single core? I suspect there is about the nature of the 8641 which makes it unsuitable as a General Purpose CPU like the 7447A and 7448.

So assuming Apple just goes with the 7448 version of the G4 I'll bet that the top speed will always be less than or equal to the slowest shipping PowerMac G5 (1.8 GHz at present).

Hey I'm just guessing and putting my two 1 cents (US) together.
seems unlikely that they would upgrade it at all before the g5 but this post is mostly about your opinion listed in the top so here goes...
1024x 768 is a great resolution for a 12.1 inch screen it has a high pixel density higher the other powerbooks. A pc card slot would use way too much space on a 12 inch powerbook. Dual cpu is in my opinion out of the question because it would use way too much battery power. Nope its going straight to g5.
     
Lancer409
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Oct 3, 2004, 04:49 PM
 
hell .. i love my book .. and will have it for a good two years minimum .. maybe three =P ... apple has guaranteed business with me. my next notebook will definately be another apple (probly powerbook). I am waiting for a revision b dual core, or a revision b g5. maybe revision c

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