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Gamoe · May 17, 2006, 07:42 AM

Originally Posted by Icruise

More complex than what? Earlier versions? In any case, the MacBooks should blow all previous Apple portables (not including the MacBook Pros) out of the water when it comes to performance. They'll handle just about anything you can throw at them.

Thing is I'm coming from a desktop. I have a G3 iBook, but it's not my main machine, and I wouldn't even bother trying to run iMovie in it. Still, my desktop is a hopefully soon to be replaced 1Ghz G4 eMac, so it's nowhere near high-end.

The MacBook has impressed me so that I'm actually considering it as a desktop replacement, instead of the current two-Mac setup I follow now. But, I'm just a little concerned with integrated graphics, simply because I've always used Macs with dedicated graphics (PM 6100 notwithstanding). Otherwise, for my needs, it would seem the new MacBook is near perfect for me as a portable AND desktop Mac.

icruise · May 17, 2006, 07:45 AM

I really think that the average user is only going to see a major difference with the integrated graphics when playing games. And even at playing games, the MacBook should soundly beat something like an eMac.

Simon · May 17, 2006, 07:59 AM

Originally Posted by harrisjamieh

Just got my delivery estimate - 23rd May to be dispatched, 2 JUNE TO BE DElIVERED!! thats crap! Unfortunatly, for some unknown reason, over here in the UK you can't pay extra for speedy delivery, so you are stuck with the standard 3-7 day service which is utter rubbish.

It's the same for entire Europe as far as I know. There's no option to speed up shipping and standard shipping takes 3-7 business days! It really sucks.

harrisjamieh · May 17, 2006, 09:36 AM

Just a heads up, the manual for the MBs is up on Apple's support section, so for anything you think 'ooo, does the MB do/have this', check it out

Heavy · May 17, 2006, 10:05 AM

It's been a long time comin'. Man I almost caved and bought a Dell laptop several times.
I bit the bullet and ordered a black one. It's ridiculous that Apple charges $150 more just for black. Heck I don't even need a DVD burner! But the bright white looks cheap to me. At least if they made it silver or something. I like the MBP's color. Now the specs on these look great. I hope this is an easy switch coming from a Dell!

AssassyN · May 17, 2006, 11:22 AM

Originally Posted by Heavy

I hope this is an easy switch coming from a Dell!

SHould be fairly easy considering you can buy a retail copy of Windows XP and install it as your backup/secondary operating system.

That's such a nice feature.

hldan · 11:52 AM

Originally Posted by Heavy

It's been a long time comin'. Man I almost caved and bought a Dell laptop several times.
I bit the bullet and ordered a black one. It's ridiculous that Apple charges $150 more just for black. Heck I don't even need a DVD burner! But the bright white looks cheap to me. At least if they made it silver or something. I like the MBP's color. Now the specs on these look great. I hope this is an easy switch coming from a Dell!

Where do you see the price difference being $150 from the white one to the black one? I only see
$200.00 U.S. Are you shopping from a different country on the Apple online store?

harrisjamieh · May 17, 2006, 11:45 AM

They are subtracting $50 for the HD upgrade, meaning the remaining $150 is for the colour alone

cal-ov-whe · May 17, 2006, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by Heavy

But the bright white looks cheap to me.

I don't think the bright white looks cheap, but I think it looks really flamboyant - which is why I like it. It's cute and stands out.

Star-Fire · May 17, 2006, 12:01 PM

I have to agree the white looks nice and stands out against all the dull colored PCs, the black from the pics I've seen looks actaully like some cheap electronics, if only they made it glossy, then I'd be all over it.

Spirit_VW · May 17, 2006, 12:45 PM

Originally Posted by Gabriel Morales

Thing is I'm coming from a desktop. I have a G3 iBook, but it's not my main machine, and I wouldn't even bother trying to run iMovie in it. Still, my desktop is a hopefully soon to be replaced 1Ghz G4 eMac, so it's nowhere near high-end.

The MacBook has impressed me so that I'm actually considering it as a desktop replacement, instead of the current two-Mac setup I follow now. But, I'm just a little concerned with integrated graphics, simply because I've always used Macs with dedicated graphics (PM 6100 notwithstanding). Otherwise, for my needs, it would seem the new MacBook is near perfect for me as a portable AND desktop Mac.

I was in very nearly the same situation as you - I had an iBook G3 800, and an eMac 1.42 GHz. Bought a MacBook Pro, and it absolutely wipes the floor with both of the old machines in every way. I would imagine the MacBook wouldn't be all that far behind. As has been said, the biggest difference between the MacBook and the MBP will be in gaming.

Gamoe · May 17, 2006, 01:34 PM

Well, I ventured out into the local Apple Store and saw them-- one white, and one black. Let me share my impressions with you:

The black seemed to compliment the 'book when it was playing a movie. The black finish blends in with the movie and makes the 'book itself rather inconspicuous relatively speaking.

The white on the other hand, stood out even while playing the movie. That is, it was more obvious. Of course, this was just a few minutes long clip I was watching. Perhaps after half an hour you wouldn't notice the 'book anymore.

(Hopefully the above makes sense to somebody.)

However, I found "use" and "wear" marks much more evident on the black MacBook than on the white, which I found disconcerting. I mean, that's just two days of wear. How will that thing look in a month, or a year? Call em crazy, but I found have preferred the "grainy" finish of the PowerBooks of old (like my past PB 1400), which seldom showed any kind of mark, unlike this black 'book.

All things considered, specially for the price, I'd take a white one over the black. Even price difference notwithstanding, I'd probably still take the white, primarily due to the visibility of use and wear marks.

As for the glossy screens: There was plenty of light at the store, but I didn't find this to be a problem really. I could see the overhead lights in the reflection, as well as the face of the guy next to me (and myself, of course-- I'm no vampire), but it didn't strike me as a problem, or take away fro the experience.

I thought the two finger right click would be cumbersome and impractical for me, but I found it to be quite simple and practical. Nice and useful feature.

I typed a few sentences in TextEdit on the 'book. I didn't find the keyboard difficult to use at all, though I admit it might take a little getting used to. Still, I didn't find this to be problematic at all- just a little bit different. Oh the speakers are definitely on the bottom half of the 'book, at the sides, "reflecting" towards the screen. I did notice that it wasn't very loud even at maximum volume, though.

Originally Posted by Spirit_VW

I was in very nearly the same situation as you - I had an iBook G3 800, and an eMac 1.42 GHz. Bought a MacBook Pro, and it absolutely wipes the floor with both of the old machines in every way. I would imagine the MacBook wouldn't be all that far behind. As has been said, the biggest difference between the MacBook and the MBP will be in gaming.

I went to a Core Duo Mac mini with a large (at least 20") screen attached to it and played with iMovie a little bit and it seemed fine to me. That's probably the most demanding thing, graphics-wise, that I would want to do occasionally. So, so far it looks pretty good. Still, I'll wait and see what other issues (specially performance issues) come up.

ajprice · May 17, 2006, 03:27 PM

I've read a lot and seen pictures of the black MacBook, but what is the finish of it like? the only black plastic thing I've got near me is a PSP, and I think a whole laptop made of the texture of the back of a PSP would look crap.

I have a G4 867MHz Quicksilver, 1152Mb RAM, GeForce2 64Mb graphics card. I use it mainly for the Intarweb®, iLife stuff, and some Photoshop/design stuff. How would a MacBook compare to what I've got now?

b11051973 · May 17, 2006, 03:30 PM

Just got back from the Apple Store at the Mall of America with my new MacBook!!

I had ordered the 1.83 system yesterday with an 80 gig drive. After reading last night on AI that the hdd is easily upgradeable, I decided I could do it myself. So, I didn't need to get a BTO one anymore. Went to the store and they matched the online price for 1 gig of memory. I did that and got a USB modem. I also changed my mind and went with the 2.0 GHz version.

I'm really happy with this. I wanted to get the 120 gig hdd, but $250 was crazy. I'll probably start shopping around on price for bigger hdds in a couple months. I'll wait until others do the upgrade. Plus, I think perpendicular drives up around 160 gigs are out now or coming soon. That would be a sweet upgrade.

As to the keyboard and screen. I was perfectly happy with both. I typed a paragraph and had no issues with it. I forgot about the screen thing and finally remember after looking at it for a couple minutes. So, to me, nothing bad jumps out at you. I moved the screen around and had no big glare problems.

It's definitely bigger than my 12" PowerBook, but not by much. I'll happily take the slight increase in screen real estate. I also like the magnetic latch. I could never get the latch on my PB to close the first time. I pick up my PB in a corner with one hand all the time. I did the same with the MB and it felt very solid. A coworker has an iBook and I thought it felt cheap and lumpy. The new MacBook is very nice to feel and see.

I can't wait till I can leave work and go home and play.

fhoubi · May 17, 2006, 04:14 PM

Originally Posted by Macola

Can anyone confirm that the HD is user-upgradeable (i.e., doing so wouldn't void the warranty)? I'll have to wait until after May 23 to find out for sure, but I'm trying to plan ahead...

Cools pics and instructions here.

amazing · May 17, 2006, 04:20 PM

I'd really appreciate if everyone with an MB could address the following questions:

1. Airport range. As good as the iBook?
2. Glossy screen: bothersome or not, reflections, eye fatigue, what's it like outside, e.g. at café sipping an espresso? Playing games--framerates? Reading lots of text?
3. Keyboard, likes and dislikes.
4. Heat.
5. Noise.
6. Battery life.

slugslugslug · May 17, 2006, 04:22 PM

Originally Posted by b11051973

I'm really happy with this. I wanted to get the 120 gig hdd, but $250 was crazy. I'll probably start shopping around on price for bigger hdds in a couple months. I'll wait until others do the upgrade. Plus, I think perpendicular drives up around 160 gigs are out now or coming soon. That would be a sweet upgrade.

I thought I remember hearing that the perpendicular 160-GB drives were going to run around $270. In which case buying one of those would be a far better deal assuming you can find somebody to buy your 80, or get an enclosure for it and use it for backup..

Hi I'm Ben · May 17, 2006, 04:26 PM

Well I picked up my Black MacBook today. I was concerned at first about the finish,but when I got to the apple store I was pleased to see it was Matte black all the way around. I didn't want it to end up looking like my old black nano with crappy scratches all over it.

Since I'm at the office I haven't had a chance to play with it much. I did notice the speakers were in the same place as the 12inch Powerbook ones. So hopefully it sounds, like the 12 inch powerbook.

The screen is beautiful. I don't care about the glossyness. I opened it up in my cube here with the crappy lights overhead and the window beaming light, no big deal. It's much nicer than the ol' iBook which now reminds me of some old faded t-shirts I need to throw away.

I'm very excited about this purchase, not so excited I had to pay $200 more for a black iBook (macBOOK whatever). Oh well.

Gee4orce · 04:47 PM

My mini review (typed on my new White 2.0GHz MacBook) should answer most of Amazing's questions:

Size - it's a whopper, compared to my old 12"-er. Weight - felt heavy at first, but because it's wider psychologically the weight seems less. Not a problem in any case.

Keyboard - the jury is definitely out on this one still ! but the 12" had one of the all time great keyboard IMO. Certainly a big improvement if you're coming from in iBook.

Heat - warm, but not hot. About as warm as I'd like a laptop to be, really.

Sound - what sound ? This is spookily quiet. It's by far and away the quietest computer I"ve ever used (so far - no sign of the fan kicking in yet). Actually, I heard it "moo" a couple of times - I think that's the fan starting up then stopping again straight away. No HD noise at all - amazing. I might have to install a menu bar utility to show HD activity !

Screen - bright. Glossy. Not sure about the gloss yet. There's quite a colour shift though - it's pretty sensitive to angle. The iSight could do to be angled down a bit more, IMO - when you're in the middle of the frame, the screen is at a non-optimal angle for colours. Not a biggie, just a niggle.

Airport - full bars from where I'm sitting, whereas my 12" Powerbook generally got 1/4 to 1/2 bars (and sometimes none !) The networking speed is a noticeably better !

Battery - too early to tell; I haven't run it down yet, so it's not calibrated.

Speed - well, in theory it's a huge step up from an 867MHz G4. But...the combination of only 500MB or RAM, and certain apps running in Rosetta means it feels a good bit slower than optimal. No worries, 2GB of RAM in the post, and I shall purge any non-univeral apps that I find

!!

amazing · May 17, 2006, 05:25 PM

Thanks, Gee4orce! Covers everything--but I expect you're still planning on doing the extended espresso testing of wireless range at an outdoor café? In good company?

Keep the feedback coming with the MacBooks! Just remember the airport-keyboard-heat-battery-screen-noise criteria, and everybody will really be thanking you!

megasad · May 17, 2006, 07:02 PM

Originally Posted by harrisjamieh

Just got my delivery estimate - 23rd May to be dispatched, 2 JUNE TO BE DElIVERED!! thats crap! Unfortunatly, for some unknown reason, over here in the UK you can't pay extra for speedy delivery, so you are stuck with the standard 3-7 day service which is utter rubbish.

Speaking of the UK, does anyone know if the Regent Street store in London has any MacBooks in stock?

harrisjamieh · May 18, 2006, 01:37 AM

I spoke to the bluewater store, and they said they had no idea when they were getting them, and to call at the end of the week, so you could try calling them and see if they have any yet

Simon · May 18, 2006, 03:17 AM

Am I getting the wrong impression from the pics or is the white MB only glossy on the lid but matte around the ports and the keyboard?

analogika · May 18, 2006, 03:38 AM

Same as the old iBooks, it looks like.

Grayish matte white on the inside surfaces, glossy white on the shell.

Simon · May 18, 2006, 03:56 AM

Originally Posted by analogika

Same as the old iBooks, it looks like.

Grayish matte white on the inside surfaces, glossy white on the shell.

Glossy white on the entire shell? Or just the top case? The area around the ports looked pretty matte to me.

OzCam · May 18, 2006, 04:32 AM

Originally Posted by Simon

Especially because you can't have 1GB in a single DIMM version. So basically most will buy RAM cheaper some place else and throw away a perfectly new 512MB stick.

Having 2 * 512MB or 2 * 1GB has something to do with the video subsystem- two same capacity RAM sticks provide better bandwidth from what I understand.

Gee4orce · May 18, 2006, 05:09 AM

Finish: the outer case is glossy - everything on the inside is matt. Looks very nice - very Star Wars (or is it Space 1999 ?)

UK availability: you'll notice I'm in the UK. I ordered from the online store straight after they were available, then yesterday I phoned the Apple Store in the Bullring. They had a limited number of White (only) MacBooks. I reserved one over the phone, and picked it up yesterday evening. Try phoning the stores near you, you might get lucky. They only had one on display when I called in - and all the iBooks had vanished.

mgl · May 18, 2006, 07:14 AM

Originally Posted by mgl

Estimated ship date: May 23, 2006.

I was pleasantly surprised to receive a shipment notification this morning, 5 days earlier than Apple forecast. This is for a custom config (extra RAM and a larger HD base model) ordered a few hours after they were announced.

harrisjamieh · May 18, 2006, 07:27 AM

Am I right in saying about the upgradeable HD thing; any 2.5" SATA hard drive will fit? Apple hasn't used some funny shaped drive to get it to be able to slide in and out of the slot have they?

Eug Wanker · 08:02 AM

Originally Posted by mgl

I was pleasantly surprised to receive a shipment notification this morning, 5 days earlier than Apple forecast. This is for a custom config (extra RAM and a larger HD base model) ordered a few hours after they were announced.

Lucky you...

Mine was shipped yesterday... Or not. They shipped the video adapters only.

I didn't expect any different though since I changed my order on the actual MacBook again yesterday (one day after release), which means I lost my priority. Now it says: "Estimated Shipped By: May 24, 2006". The salesperson was shocked the estimated ship date only changed by one day. I guess even Apple employees are used to their shipping delays.

P.S. My video adapters were shipped by one day courier and are supposed to be delivered today... despite the fact I did not pay for the fast shipping. I guess it's because the adapters are coming from a local location. Dunno if that's gonna be true for the MacBook itself.

From where is your MacBook being shipped?

Originally Posted by harrisjamieh

Am I right in saying about the upgradeable HD thing; any 2.5" SATA hard drive will fit? Apple hasn't used some funny shaped drive to get it to be able to slide in and out of the slot have they?

Be careful. Some drives are 9 mm and some are 12.5 mm, IIRC. I don't know what the MacBook uses, but I'd guess the thinner ones (which is probably most of them).

TiDual · May 18, 2006, 08:26 AM

Originally Posted by Eug Wanker

...
Be careful. Some drives are 9 mm and some are 12.5 mm, IIRC. I don't know what the MacBook uses, but I'd guess the thinner ones (which is probably most of them).

Mmmm. I also originally thought about ordering with the 80GB, then dropping in my own 160GB 2.5" ... but from the specs of the drives, it seems the 160s are a little thicker than the 80GB or 120GB, so the 160GB might not fit. I caved, and just ordered the 120GB BTO in the end.

That reminds me ... time to order 2GB Ram for my newly ordered BlackBook!

Eug Wanker · May 18, 2006, 09:25 AM

Yup. I just checked.

Most hard drives available are 9.5 mm high.
The über large capacitiy hard drives (like the 160 GB Fujitsu) are often 12.5 mm high.

I don't know for sure, but I suspect the 12.5 mm high drives won't fit in the MacBooks. Perhaps someone can confirm?

TiDual · May 18, 2006, 09:31 AM

Originally Posted by Eug Wanker

Yup. I just checked.

Most hard drives available are 9.5 mm high.
The über large capacitiy hard drives (like the 160 GB Fujitsu) are often 12.5 mm high.

I don't know for sure, but I suspect the 12.5 mm high drives won't fit in the MacBooks. Perhaps someone can confirm?

Yes, I'd like to hear ... note, I actually started another thread about this here:

http://forums.macnn.com/showthread.php?t=295900

I actually went for the 120GB upgrade anyway, but would still put in a 160GB in a heartbeat if it fits!

icruise · May 18, 2006, 09:50 AM

I don't think the 12.5mm drives even fit in the iBooks, so it seems pretty unlikely that they'd fit in the MacBook.

StiZeven · May 18, 2006, 10:17 AM

I am surprised Fujitsu has even started making 12.5mm hard drives again. That form factor is so dated! Even most (if not all current) PC notebooks will ONLY will accept (fit) 9.5mm hard drives.

This is an odd decision on their part since Seagate is now selling a 160GB drive (IDE for now) that is indeed 9.5mm - as will most others soon. Is Fujitsu not using the perpendicular technology to keep things slim?

Eug Wanker · May 18, 2006, 10:29 AM

Well, I got delivery today... of just my DVI and VGA adapters.

Here's hoping I get the MacBook by the end of next week, or at least by the end of the month.

My 2x1024 MB Samsung RAM (what Apple often uses) has already been ordered.

StiZeven · May 18, 2006, 10:32 AM

Where did you pick up the Samsung RAM? Seems to be a shortage of (good) 1GB DDR667 sticks out there (as well as a shortage of 120GB+ SATA HDs that are NOT Hitachi).

Eug Wanker · May 18, 2006, 10:42 AM

Originally Posted by StiZeven

Where did you pick up the Samsung RAM? Seems to be a shortage of (good) 1GB DDR667

I ordered off eBhey, from this store, but I can't yet vouch for them. It will be a while before I get the RAM. They do have a 99.9% positive rating though.

They charge $219 for 2 GB for the 13 MacBook, plus $7 shipping if you're in the US, or $11 shipping if you're in Canada.

Voch · May 18, 2006, 10:47 AM

The UPS truck is supposed to be here any minute with my 2GB of RAM of OWC. I can't wait to start doing more than one application at a time on my MacBook.

masugu · May 18, 2006, 01:25 PM

Originally Posted by Voch

The UPS truck is supposed to be here any minute with my 2GB of RAM of OWC. I can't wait to start doing more than one application at a time on my MacBook.

Tell us what you think of the keyboard. Please...

megasad · May 18, 2006, 01:36 PM

Originally Posted by Gee4orce

UK availability: you'll notice I'm in the UK. I ordered from the online store straight after they were available, then yesterday I phoned the Apple Store in the Bullring. They had a limited number of White (only) MacBooks. I reserved one over the phone, and picked it up yesterday evening. Try phoning the stores near you, you might get lucky. They only had one on display when I called in - and all the iBooks had vanished.

I called the Regent Street store this morning and they said they'd sold out completely but that they'd have more in tomorrow. I then called the Brent Cross store, and they had some left, so I asked them to put one aside for me. So long as they accept my university acceptance letter as student ID, I'm going to buy a 2GHz white one tomorrow afternoon. Hoo-hah!

Voch · May 18, 2006, 01:43 PM

Originally Posted by masugu

Tell us what you think of the keyboard. Please...

I really like the keyboard. The keys are stiffer than the old iBook and my TiBook. There's a more spacing in between them but I've already gotten used to that. Sometimes the down-arrow key doesn't fire if I don't press it hard enough but that's something I need to get used to (the one on my TiBook was particularly mushy so I can't specifically blame the MacBook's keyboard yet).

My 2GB of RAM has just arrived from OWC and I've installed it already. This machine freakin' flies. No whining when running from battery or with AC power. The screen has a smaller viewing angle than my TiBook's but the contrast is improved (whites are whiter, grays are actually gray, I can see the yellow of the Eclipse "hilighter" function).

I've transferred my Java project and Eclipse stuff to my MacBook and am doing actual work now. No more sitting at my company's Dell desktop PC in my den (I Windows Remote Desktop to it when I need to check some Windows-specific stuff with my Java project). This is definately my dream Java development machine.

I haven't had the courage to pull the hard drive but it looks easy. I hate those little screws...

Voch

Tarcat · May 18, 2006, 02:51 PM

I went to see them today. The keyboard works fine. I didn't have any problems but wasn't surprised in that because Apple has always done notebook keyboards well. As for the screen, I think anyone who is whining about the glossy screen has yet to see the laptop in action. Is there more glare? Yes. But the brightness and quality of the picture more than make up for it. I've never seen a better laptop screen. Even in the harsh and reflective lights of the apple store it blew me away. Miles better than the quality of the screen on my old iBook and noticably nicer than those on the 12 inch powerbook and the 15.4 inch MacBook Pro that were next to it. I plan on buying one now. Amazing little machine.

Gee4orce · May 18, 2006, 03:25 PM

Just installed my 2GB upgrade - wow, now this thing screams ! Apple are not doing themselves any favours shipping 512 as standard. I was getting corrupted video, and crashes and hangs with the base memory install. If you're getting a MacBook, definitely get at least 1 GB of memory.

Speaking of upgrading the memory, you really have to ram the chips in the slots - push way harder than you think is good. At first I thought they were seated, and the MacBook wouldn't fire up. I re-opened her, and realised that if I pushed even harder that there was a slight click as it seated. Worth bearing in mind.

harrisjamieh · May 19, 2006, 06:16 AM

Woo, mine has now been dispatched

, 4 days early, and whilst delivery estimate is still 29th May, past experiences (my iMac, my iBook) tell me I should have it way before then. Can't wait !

icruise · May 19, 2006, 06:57 AM

Originally Posted by Gee4orce

Just installed my 2GB upgrade - wow, now this thing screams ! Apple are not doing themselves any favours shipping 512 as standard. I was getting corrupted video, and crashes and hangs with the base memory install. If you're getting a MacBook, definitely get at least 1 GB of memory.

Not having enough memory should affect the speed of the machine, but it should never result in the symptoms you describe. Maybe one of the chips you replaced was defective.

Gee4orce · May 19, 2006, 10:20 AM

Quite so - maybe it wasn't seated properly (inserting them is quite hard).

In any case, this laptop now totally puts my Dual G5 1.8 to shame ! I just opened every application I have available - PPC and Universal, and it just soldiered on with nary a slowdown. Stunning. The Universal apps especially are impressive - most open in one or two bounces max.

masugu · May 19, 2006, 11:55 AM

So the difference in price on going to 2 gig comparing Apple's price to mail order is $500 - 219 = $281 ???

Nutz! And I am hearing it is easy to swap the ram?

Voch · May 19, 2006, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by masugu

Nutz! And I am hearing it is easy to swap the ram?

It's easy. The only tough spots are inserting the new RAM (there's some resistance) and ensuring that the soft RAM slot protectors on the L-shaped metal plate are tucked back into the RAM slots (I used a credit card to tuck 'em in before I tightened the screws).

Voch

masugu · May 19, 2006, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by Voch

It's easy. The only tough spots are inserting the new RAM (there's some resistance) and ensuring that the soft RAM slot protectors on the L-shaped metal plate are tucked back into the RAM slots (I used a credit card to tuck 'em in before I tightened the screws).

Voch

Thx

has anyone posted pics of this operation ??